Importing from the UK - definitive guide (Q and A)

Casati

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

Surely that could be challenged. EU VAT has already been paid on the car when it was new so charging VAT again means VAT has been paid twice on the same vehicle in the EU....and then add VRT which has been deemed illegal by the EU and you have 3 effective VAT charges on the one car in its lifetime. It might not succeed in the courts here but surely would have a very good chance of succeeding in European courts?



I seriously don't think that will happen here. People are not suddenly going to go from their A4/A6/520d sized used imports to new Astra/Focus sized cars just because theyre the same price as what they would have paid for an import...its simply not going to happen, at least not in the next 2 or 3 years. Revenue is going to go through the floor due to the loss in VRT. I know numerous people who bought imports in the last couple of years who plan to just hold on to them for the foreseeable.

My brother in law is the manager in one of the busiest dealerships here in Donegal and sales for January 2021 are down 10/15% on last year and he doesn't expect them to pick up.

There will be no new car sales explosion.

Sorry maybe I wasn’t clear, sales this year will be through the floor again as we are still very much in a pandemic and indeed I’m not sure you can even visit a sales showroom if you want to. I am hopeful that we will be out of the woods by the end of the year with vaccines and pent up demand will see huge car sales next year imo.

Equally you don’t have to drive a Focus - Vat qualifying cars will be imported by the truckload and sales of new cars here increasing will help to replace some of the loss of supply of cheaper UK cars

Ogham

myshirt wrote: »

So, getting down to brass tacks here, do we have to pay VAT on a second hand import?

Will totally kill the deal won't it.

The VRT was bad enough.

From the UK - YES

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/vehicles/cars/vat-buying-selling-cars/index_en.htm#buying-non-EU-1

Isambard

Ogham wrote: »

??? Where does it say that ???

post 2379 which you quoted in 2380.

A used car registered in the UK is free from duty irrespective of whether it was built in Swindon or Korea (eg)

Ogham

Isambard wrote: »

post 2379 which you quoted in 2380.

A used car registered in the UK is free from duty irrespective of whether it was built in Swindon or Korea (eg)

Sorry - but I give up.
I have pointed out why that is wrong . I can do no more .
Good Luck

I've been looking at a used car in a dealership in Northern Ireland. It was bought from auction by the dealership in Nov 2020 but still has its English Reg.

Very hard to tell if this would attract the import and VAT charge. Getting it wrong could add €6000 or so to the cost.

Isambard

Ogham wrote: »

Sorry - but I give up.
I have pointed out why that is wrong . I can do no more .
Good Luck

i think you're confused. A UK import attracts no duty, just VAT. A used car from Japan for instance attracts 10% excise duty plus VAT. I can't see how you think that's wrong.It doesn't matter where it's built, it's where it's imported from.

myshirt

Ogham wrote: »

From the UK - YES

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/vehicles/cars/vat-buying-selling-cars/index_en.htm#buying-non-EU-1

Totally kills the deal then. The car I was looking at was 60 grand. Nearly new. 5,000 miles. 7 months old.

I'm not paying another 12 grand on top of the VRT.

reubenreuben

Can someone provide official information and links to gov sites for whether we pay duty on uk cars are not. The above posters are saying completely opposite . I just want the real facts.

reubenreuben

myshirt wrote: »

Totally kills the deal then. The car I was looking at was 60 grand. Nearly new. 5,000 miles. 7 months old.

I'm not paying another 12 grand on top of the VRT.

If that's true we are screwed.

Maybe we should start driving on the right and import lhd cars from france/germany

deezell

myshirt wrote: »

Totally kills the deal then. The car I was looking at was 60 grand. Nearly new. 5,000 miles. 7 months old.

I'm not paying another 12 grand on top of the VRT.

Did you ask was it a vat qualifying car? Did the dealer get a VAT invoice when he imported?. If so, then he can remove the UK vat, 20%, one sixth of the invoice price to you, and you just pay the 21% Irish VAT on import.

Isambard

reubenreuben wrote: »

Can someone provide official information and links to gov sites for whether we pay duty on uk cars are not. The above posters are saying completely opposite . I just want the real facts.

I've posted this multiple times so far....

https://www.revenue.ie/en/importing-vehicles-duty-free-allowances/guide-to-vrt/registration-of-imported-used-vehicles/vehicles-imported-from-gb-and-ni.aspx?fbclid=IwAR2U_Ah6sNtEljZp1NeD0R8Wncj5Vqa8lZY93FVTycutPhCHvkPTQqq8kH4

scroll down and there's a chart which shows no excise duty from the UK, just VAT and of course VRT

trellheim

It looks as if in order to benefit from the zero duty you must make a customs declaration to prove that it is a UK origin motor. I cannot see any guidance on that but I presume the V5 might suffice - no idea.

I presume that the duty would be payable otherwise. I think the EU guidance quoted above is for other countries than the UK.

On the vat side adding 21% to the price of the motor will wreck this channel unless you are looking for a very specific thing or its ex-fleet or ex-hire or something like that

How to register a GB Mainland vehicle in Northern Ireland

Moving a vehicle from GB to NI

If you are moving your vehicle from GB to NI, you will need to fill in the change of address section on your V5C. If you have a valid tax disc for the vehicle please also send this along with a completed vehicle licence application form to any DVA Local Office, or post to DVA, County Hall, Coleraine BT51 3TA.

If your vehicle needs to be re-licensed, you will also need to include a completed vehicle licensing application form, valid Insurance Certificate, Vehicle Test Certificate (if applicable) and payment with your application or else declare Statutory Off Road Notification (SORN) using form V15(NI)/V890.

Please Note: If you do not have a V5C(NI)/V5C you will need to complete a V34(NI)/V62, Vehicle Registration Certificate Application form (a fee of £25 is applicable for the issue of a Duplicate Vehicle Registration Certificate) along with a V55/5 (Application for a First Licence form) and provide the appropriate ID documents along with either a valid insurance Certificate, Vehicle Test Certificate (if applicable) and payment or declare Statutory Off Road Notification (SORN) using form V15(NI)/V890.

V34 NI is the Nothern Ireland equilventy to V62 GB mainland form for duplicate V5C Vehicle Registration Document

User1998

The amount of people coming on here demanding answers.

No one knows what the story is yet.

Can you’s not just wait a couple of weeks?

Ogham

Isambard wrote: »

I've posted this multiple times so far....

https://www.revenue.ie/en/importing-vehicles-duty-free-allowances/guide-to-vrt/registration-of-imported-used-vehicles/vehicles-imported-from-gb-and-ni.aspx?fbclid=IwAR2U_Ah6sNtEljZp1NeD0R8Wncj5Vqa8lZY93FVTycutPhCHvkPTQqq8kH4

scroll down and there's a chart which shows no excise duty from the UK, just VAT and of course VRT

That chart on it's own is a bit misleading -
The section above it says -
"The zero tariff and zero quota provisions apply to all goods that comply with the appropriate rules of origin. "

Now those rules of origin are the things that complicate the situation andcmight mean that a car sold from the UK is not classed for export/customs purposes as having the UK as it's "country of origin".

For example - a car that was made in Japan , registered in UK and used for 3 years then sold to Ireland. The country of origin if that car is still Japan , nothing has changed that . So why could it be classed as a car of UK origin just because it's now second hand. ?
Unless someone knows if there are specific rules on second hand goods ? I hav elooked and can't see any.

It could even be worse than that.
The rules on country of origin for cars say that even if a car is manufactured in the UK , if more than 45% of the materials used to make it were from outside UK or EU - then the car may not classed as of UK origin .
So if 46% of a cars parts were from Japan it might be classed as of Japanese origin.
(The Rules on EV/Hybrids is phasing in over a few years - and starts off that 60% of parts can be non UK/EU)


Links below to back this up
https://cdn.ymaws.com/www.export.org.uk/resource/resmgr/docs/webinar_slides/UK-EU_trade_deal_-_what_you_.pdf

https://www.northeastautomotivealliance.com/news/1c522b78-3550-eb11-8fed-28187897f6da/

https://www.revenue.ie/en/customs-traders-and-agents/importing-and-exporting/origin/preferential-and-nonpreferential-origin/index.aspx


https://www.ft.com/content/481528e0-ee8b-4504-9652-69c19f9cb38b

https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/sites/taxation/files/2021-brexit-top-50-faq.pdf specifically mentions second hand cars from UK



I Hope that is the end of any doubts about the possibility of import duty on some cars coming from the UK ?

Ogham

User1998 wrote: »

The amount of people coming on here demanding answers.

No one knows what the story is yet.

Can you’s not just wait a couple of weeks?

It looks like some people in UK government and the UK car industry don't even know what's going on !

myshirt

Surely it's not possible to import the car to the North, and then import to the South, in order to avoid VAT.

If it's possible a lot of UK sellers will do it. There are about 100,000 used cars to be sold to those of us in the South. It's a large amount. Yes, small in the greater scheme of things, but a large enough market to create an opportunity for some sellers.

reubenreuben

Excuse the formatting

So according to revenue.
Origin of Vehicle Customs Duty Payable VAT Payable
UK 0% 21%

Third Country
such as the USA
or Japan 10% 21%


EU such as
German or French 10% 21%

By the wording 'origin' I read this as all cars that have a UK reg(either GB or NI) will just have vat payable. But is that on cars that have already had the UK Vat paid on it? As if you import a 2nd hand car, what happens there?

And customs on a EU car. I assume they mean cars that still have European registration plates on them?

Brewster

As I see it the changes to the VRT regime alone will make it prohibitively expensive to bring in a 3 or 4 year old diesel car. There will still be savings on some high end hybrids, PHEV, that are less than 6 months or less than 6k km. For many buyers, I would forget about the U.K. and start to get to know your local dealers better. This comes from someone who bought his last 4 cars in the U.K, which were all diesel.

reubenreuben

reubenreuben wrote: »

Excuse the formatting

So according to revenue.
Origin of Vehicle Customs Duty Payable VAT Payable
UK 0% 21%

Third Country
such as the USA
or Japan 10% 21%


EU such as
German or French 10% 21%

By the wording 'origin' I read this as all cars that have a UK reg(either GB or NI) will just have vat payable. But is that on cars that have already had the UK Vat paid on it? As if you import a 2nd hand car, what happens there?

And customs on a EU car. I assume they mean cars that still have European registration plates on them?

So 10% import on an EU German or French reg car but 0% from UK. Crazy.

Casati

reubenreuben wrote: »

Excuse the formatting

So according to revenue.
Origin of Vehicle Customs Duty Payable VAT Payable
UK 0% 21%

Third Country
such as the USA
or Japan 10% 21%


EU such as
German or French 10% 21%

By the wording 'origin' I read this as all cars that have a UK reg(either GB or NI) will just have vat payable. But is that on cars that have already had the UK Vat paid on it? As if you import a 2nd hand car, what happens there?

And customs on a EU car. I assume they mean cars that still have European registration plates on them?

That 10% duty payable for importing EU cars inc French and German cannot be correct??

Brewster

Casati wrote: »

That 10% duty payable for importing EU cars inc French and German cannot be correct??

I thought this was incorrect. But this seems to be what revenue is saying. I was sure French and German cars would be excluded from duty.

Brewster

I see revenue updated that circular today. I could have swore I read it yesterday and that the customs duty was only on third country imports, Japan or US and that EU and U.K. were 0% for customs. Must have been seeing things.

Brewster

https://www.moneyguideireland.com/imports-of-used-cars-in-ireland.html

This is where I read it I think. It says no customs on EU made cars, which would make sense?

mgn

Brewster wrote: »

I see revenue updated that circular today. I could have swore I read it yesterday and that the customs duty was only on third country imports, Japan or US and that EU and U.K. were 0% for customs. Must have been seeing things.

I don't think you were seen things, I'm 99% sure it was 0% before today.

Casati

mgn wrote: »

I don't think you were seen things, I'm 99% sure it was 0% before today.

Hopefully somebody reads boards as it’s not correct unless the Brexit deal rewrote the whole EU agreement between member states

LS8409

Once the car goes through vrt, how soon until the reg is recognised for insurance/motor tax?

L-M

LS8409 wrote: »

Once the car goes through vrt, how soon until the reg is recognised for insurance/motor tax?

Usually once the clock ticks 12 for taxing, longer for insurance

reubenreuben

Brewster wrote: »

I thought this was incorrect. But this seems to be what revenue is saying. I was sure French and German cars would be excluded from duty.

That's what i would have thought as importing same car from france/germany directly would have no duty as it is importing from EU.

Brewster

reubenreuben wrote: »

That's what i would have thought as importing same car from france/germany directly would have no duty as it is importing from EU.

Must be a mistake?