Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

Clonmel1000

Oranage2 wrote: »

They need to quarantine arrivals

It’s worth repeating this is not a travel related illness, travel does not aid transmission, this is completely behavioural related, if you follow the WHO advice: distancing, hygiene etc you are just as safe travelling as you would be in a shop or on a street

bladespin

Oranage2 wrote: »

Because Ireland is an island and we don't have a huge population, in reality we should have be sitting at close to zero cases in May /June. But decision made by individuals and also the government like not having a quarantine has allowed this virus to trickle all the way to August and even worsen, and likely in September we'll have another lockdown.

You are aware that travel accounts for less than 1 in 10 cases here and that the vast majority are workplace transmission and then on to their close contacts???

Solobally8

Oranage2 wrote: »

Because Ireland is an island and we don't have a huge population, in reality we should have be sitting at close to zero cases in May /June. But decision made by individuals and also the government like not having a quarantine has allowed this virus to trickle all the way to August and even worsen, and likely in September we'll have another lockdown.

I really can’t understand how people keep saying this. Where is the evidence? I’d love to read it. Where I am in Spain we wear masks everywhere (except in the water and eating of course) compliance is almost 100%. They have had 12 cases throughout all the pandemic. How can me traveling home from here be more dangerous than the people who are ‘staycationing’ and traveling from hotel to hotel all over Ireland not wearing masks or sanitizing when entering buildings. Even the playgrounds are open in Ireland.

Oranage2

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

It’s worth repeating this is not a travel related illness, travel does not aid transmission, this is completely behavioural related, if you follow the WHO advice: distancing, hygiene etc you are just as safe travelling as you would be in a shop or on a street

There you go, you answered your own question.

Not everyone is following the who's advice and other countries have more people, bigger populations, more people not following the rules, free travel for 1000s of miles.

Can you see how this would be risky? You might follow the rules but who's to say Johnny will?

Now if there's a quarantine it doesn't matter bwcause you'll be quarantine for a short time then you can both be reintroduced to society safely

bladespin

Oranage2 wrote: »

There you go, you answered your own question.

Not everyone is following the who's advice and other countries have more people, bigger populations, more people not following the rules, free travel for 1000s of miles.

Can you see how this would be risky? You might follow the rules but who's to say Johnny will?

Now if there's a quarantine it doesn't matter bwcause you'll be quarantine for a short time then you can both be reintroduced to society safely

Think you have that a bit arseways, it’s not those entering the country that are the problem.

otnomart

faceman wrote: »

Nope. This one. You’ll need to be able to read Spanish.

https://elpais.com/sociedad/2020-08-03/sanidad-da-datos-de-la-epidemia-sin-contar-los-casos-de-las-zonas-con-mas-contagios.html

Many thanks for this.
If I understand correctly: there were 968 cases recorded in Spain in one day.
However, this number does not include cases from some regions - which will be added tomorrow.

skyway

Flew Malaga to Cork today. 35 people on board. Malaga airport was pretty quiet. Cork airport was pretty much deserted. The car rental desk said that I was their only booking for today.

Nicetrustedcup

Myself I have my COVID test booked for my travel to a red country, 3 day turn around due to the lab and 200 euros charge, no issues paying for one to travel

I just don’t get the issues people have with travelling ? I was on a bus the other day travelling home, it was full with no air con for 90 mins, tell me what diff a plane would be for 3 hours with 45 people on it ? I will tell you this you would have more space then the bus ..... and less likely to have people on top of you.

Oranage2

Oranage2 wrote: »

There you go, you answered your own question.

Not everyone is following the who's advice and other countries have more people, bigger populations, more people not following the rules, free travel for 1000s of miles.

Can you see how this would be risky? You might follow the rules but who's to say Johnny will?

Now if there's a quarantine it doesn't matter bwcause you'll be quarantine for a short time then you can both be reintroduced to society safely

the rules are enforced legally in other countries and social awareness runs deeper in the likes of Spain.

Dont wear a mask and not only will people raise the issue with you but the cops will come along and fine you.

acequion

No point whatsoever arguing with the panic merchants, many of whom would blow up our ports and airports and seal the country in. And no point telling them that actually we're part of the EU so opted out of solo runs a very long time ago. And others either cannot or will not think it through for themselves and monitor how it's done in other European countries, they're so completely brainwashed by a hysterical media and hysterical Govt.

Not for the first time, today I wondered in dismay what kind of shower we voted in last Feb.:(

faceman

otnomart wrote: »

Many thanks for this.
If I understand correctly: there were 968 cases recorded in Spain in one day.
However, this number does not include cases from some regions - which will be added tomorrow.

I’ve been busy today and only caught a glance at Spanish news. Need to read deeper, seems figures are all over the place today and there is a lot of antibody tests in there again which further inflates numbers with closed cases

3 areas account for the numbers, 2 of which are stabilising

global23214124

Arrived back today via a non green list country and filled out the passenger locator form. Interested to see do the they check up on it in the coming days. I still have a flight booked for Aug 21st so might end up still taking that. I won't stick to my house for 14 days. I'll get out to get some exercise and grocery shop and stuff as I need to function somewhat but won't do anything excessive.

global23214124

global23214124 wrote: »

Arrived back today via a non green list country and filled out the passenger locator form. Interested to see do the they check up on it in the coming days. I still have a flight booked for Aug 21st so might end up still taking that. I won't stick to my house for 14 days. I'll get out to get some exercise and grocery shop and stuff as I need to function somewhat but won't do anything excessive.

I have flown twice and neither time have I received a call

acequion

I was back 14 days yesterday, no call.

This has nothing to do with public safety. It's all about control.

dartboardio

acequion wrote: »

I was back 14 days yesterday, no call.

This has nothing to do with public safety. It's all about control.

I agree.
Apparently something crazy like only 3% of people were contacted to ensure they were quarantining after returning from a non green list country.

I think people should wake up.

The whole world has reopened for travel, bars, restaurants, etc and ireland is last as per usual. It's being masked as a 'save lives' story but it's not that at all.

I am in Malaga at the moment. All very safe and organised plenty of French, German and Spanish tourists here. All bars, pubs and restaurants are open. And this is Spain we are talking about.

Other people ganging up on the ones that do travel, its hilarious, wake up people. Why is ireland restricting us when the rest of the world has reopened

acequion

dartboardio wrote: »

I agree.
Apparently something crazy like only 3% of people were contacted to ensure they were quarantining after returning from a non green list country.

I think people should wake up.

The whole world has reopened for travel, bars, restaurants, etc and ireland is last as per usual. It's being masked as a 'save lives' story but it's not that at all.

I am in Malaga at the moment. All very safe and organised plenty of French, German and Spanish tourists here. All bars, pubs and restaurants are open. And this is Spain we are talking about.

Other people ganging up on the ones that do travel, its hilarious, wake up people. Why is ireland restricting us when the rest of the world has reopened

Ireland had no divorce, no abortion, hell no contraception, when the rest of the world had and took those freedoms for granted

No doubt I'll be jumped on for that. People might pontificate that its irrelevant.

But it's very much not. Ireland has a history of repressing civil liberties and freedoms when such freedoms were the norm elsewhere nearby. All in the name of dubious causes. And I really would consider the current cause, that has a total of 14 people out of 5 million hospitalized,extremely dubious.

Oranage2

dartboardio wrote: »

I agree.
Apparently something crazy like only 3% of people were contacted to ensure they were quarantining after returning from a non green list country.

I think people should wake up.

The whole world has reopened for travel, bars, restaurants, etc and ireland is last as per usual. It's being masked as a 'save lives' story but it's not that at all.

I am in Malaga at the moment. All very safe and organised plenty of French, German and Spanish tourists here. All bars, pubs and restaurants are open. And this is Spain we are talking about.

Other people ganging up on the ones that do travel, its hilarious, wake up people. Why is ireland restricting us when the rest of the world has reopened

These countries in Europe are wide open, it's not realistic to have closed borders.

We're an island. It's so easy for us to contain the virus internally and stop it coming into the country externally. We should have had a phase 1 and a phase 2. Phase 1 complete lockdown with quarantine for anyone entering the country. And phase 2 completely open with SD and hand washing but with a quarantine for visitors. We'd have been back to normal by the end of May.

Instead we had this partial lockdown at 60-80% and it did basically nothing but keep the numbers low and allowing a trickle effect on infection rates, but guaranteed to flair up as the country opens. Look at the facts, any island country that controlled the borders have nearly eliminated the virus. I don't care what the WHO say, people aren't following their advice so it's pointless, cutting of external cases while containing it internally is the best way proven by many countries.

faceman

Oranage2 wrote: »

These countries in Europe are wide open, it's not realistic to have closed borders.

We're an island. It's so easy for us to contain the virus internally and stop it coming into the country externally. We should have had a phase 1 and a phase 2. Phase 1 complete lockdown with quarantine for anyone entering the country. And phase 2 completely open with SD and hand washing but with a quarantine for visitors. We'd have been back to normal by the end of May.

Instead we had this partial lockdown at 60-80% and it did basically nothing but keep the numbers low and allowing a trickle effect on infection rates, but guaranteed to flair up as the country opens. Look at the facts, any island country that controlled the borders have nearly eliminated the virus. I don't care what the WHO say, people aren't following their advice so it's pointless, cutting of external cases while containing it internally is the best way proven by many countries.

The virus has come back in every country even the ones that imposed strict lockdowns. Comparisons with New Zealand, which I assume you’re referring to, are short sighted

The virus has returned, the death rate hasn’t. Things have changed

smurfjed

Google is keeping a good eye on me, I’m sure that I shall finish the other 35% by the end of the year.

65% around the world this year
You've traveled a total of 25,953km so far in 2020

bladespin

Oranage2 wrote: »

We're an island. It's so easy for us to contain the virus internally and stop it coming into the country externally. We should have had a phase 1 and a phase 2. Phase 1 complete lockdown with quarantine for anyone entering the country. And phase 2 completely open with SD and hand washing but with a quarantine for visitors. We'd have been back to normal by the end of May.

We're not, simple, if NI has open borders then so do we, nothing you say will change that, different scenario if the UK had closed borders etc but they didn't.

fawlty682

dartboardio wrote: »

I agree.
Apparently something crazy like only 3% of people were contacted to ensure they were quarantining after returning from a non green list country.

I think people should wake up.

The whole world has reopened for travel, bars, restaurants, etc and ireland is last as per usual. It's being masked as a 'save lives' story but it's not that at all.

I am in Malaga at the moment. All very safe and organised plenty of French, German and Spanish tourists here. All bars, pubs and restaurants are open. And this is Spain we are talking about.

Other people ganging up on the ones that do travel, its hilarious, wake up people. Why is ireland restricting us when the rest of the world has jreopened

Donnelly is paralyzed in his new job. All his talk in opposition was just talk. We always blame the foreigner conveniently. Government have no strategy, partly effective measures and spreading fear. NPHET are running the show. Other countries make decisions and enforce. We suggest measures and hope. Apart from Dublin, Kildare , the virus is minuscule in the country.

deathbomber

faceman wrote: »

The virus has come back in every country even the ones that imposed strict lockdowns. Comparisons with New Zealand, which I assume you’re referring to, are short sighted

The virus has returned, the death rate hasn’t. Things have changed

Things have not changed, what we see is a result of the lockdown measures and awareness. We need to be on top of this by October, flu season is coming, an established menace for the vulnerable. As somebody who had the virus and has antibodies against it, yet unproven if beneficial to suppress it (i feel they are though), i would be uneasy getting the flu or a bad dose with covid 19. Hopefully a vaccine (somewhat rushed) will bring positive news, however we won't see anything here for the greater population until next summer at the earliest. If we don't follow the restrictions we will be in big trouble and that includes everybody not just the vulnerable. The measures announced yesterday are a good step in the right direction. My opinion is that non essential travel should be banned until next year.

bladespin

deathbomber wrote: »

Thinreness. We need to be on top of this by October, flu season is coming, an established menace for the vulnerable. As somebody who had the virus and has antibodies against it, yet unproven if beneficial to suppress it (i feel they are though), i would be uneasy getting the flu or a bad dose with covid 19. Hopefully a vaccine (somewhat rushed) will bring positive news, however we won't see anything here for the greater population until next summer at the earliest. If we don't follow the restrictions we will be in big trouble and that includes everybody not just the vulnerable.gs have not changed, what we see is a result of the lockdown measures and awa The measures announced yesterday are a good step in the right direction. My opinion is that non essential travel should be banned until next year.

And yet none of the new cases are linked in any way to travel, go figure!

deathbomber

bladespin wrote: »

And yet none of the new cases are linked in any way to travel, go figure!

You can't say that for sure,if you think that the new cases figure is accurate each day, your delusional, 3x it at the very least

bladespin

deathbomber wrote: »

You can't say that for sure,if you think that the new cases figure is accurate each day, your delusional, 3x it at the very least

Possibly but we can say for a fact where the reported cases are and where they're coming from - hint: it's not travel.

faceman

deathbomber wrote: »

Things have not changed, what we see is a result of the lockdown measures and awareness. We need to be on top of this by October, flu season is coming, an established menace for the vulnerable. As somebody who had the virus and has antibodies against it, yet unproven if beneficial to suppress it (i feel they are though), i would be uneasy getting the flu or a bad dose with covid 19. Hopefully a vaccine (somewhat rushed) will bring positive news, however we won't see anything here for the greater population until next summer at the earliest. If we don't follow the restrictions we will be in big trouble and that includes everybody not just the vulnerable. The measures announced yesterday are a good step in the right direction. My opinion is that non essential travel should be banned until next year.

Things have changed The evidence is in the numbers

Social distancing is normal
Masks are normal
Improved hygiene is normal

Ireland however has been incredible slow to enforce it

The virus was killing at higher levels. However as human behaviour changes, viral transmission staggers. Less people are dying now because more vulnerable groups have altered their behaviours. Younger people are the target group but it’s not fatal to younger generations, so bar a really infectious nasty flu, younger generations will weather the storm

I’m not so convinced that the flu this year will be as nasty as normal. Preliminary studies are showing that the change in hygiene habits, masks and social distancing are like to have a greater effect on the flu.

Straw poll, ask your friends and colleagues have many had any regularly seasonal illnesses over the past few months and you’ll probably find it’s less than normal.

bladespin

faceman wrote: »

I’m not so convinced that the flu this year will be as nasty as normal. Preliminary studies are showing that the change in hygiene habits, masks and social distancing are like to have a greater effect on the flu.

Straw poll, ask your friends and colleagues have many had any regularly seasonal illnesses over the past few months and you’ll probably find it’s less than normal.

Very much this, if the current measures can slow/stop C-19, which spreads just like the flu btw, then surely the same measures will have the same effect???

faceman

bladespin wrote: »

Very much this, if the current measures can slow/stop C-19, which spreads just like the flu btw, then surely the same measures will have the same effect???

I’ll see if I can find the article about it.

caveat emptor

Spain has 5 times the number of new cases on a per capita basis compared to Ireland. We are trending up but that's a big difference.

There's regional differences etc. There are no internal travel restrictions in Spain though. If there are cases in an area they are perfectly entitled to go to another area if on holiday etc.


https://www.mscbs.gob.es/profesionales/saludPublica/ccayes/alertasActual/nCov-China/documentos/Actualizacion_177_COVID-19.pdf

deathbomber

faceman wrote: »

Things have changed The evidence is in the numbers

Social distancing is normal
Masks are normal
Improved hygiene is normal

Ireland however has been incredible slow to enforce it

The virus was killing at higher levels. However as human behaviour changes, viral transmission staggers. Less people are dying now because more vulnerable groups have altered their behaviours. Younger people are the target group but it’s not fatal to younger generations, so bar a really infectious nasty flu, younger generations will weather the storm

I’m not so convinced that the flu this year will be as nasty as normal. Preliminary studies are showing that the change in hygiene habits, masks and social distancing are like to have a greater effect on the flu.

Straw poll, ask your friends and colleagues have many had any regularly seasonal illnesses over the past few months and you’ll probably find it’s less than normal.

i work in the field as does my wife, i agree our behaviour has changed, i referenced this, and it is a great thing. Ultimately we are on the right path but pubs and travelling will hinder it. Trust me a dose of anything other tban mild combined with covid 19 will be a battle and for young people too. I agree, mask and hygiene,sd and wfh will all help a lot. There will be still a significant rise if we ease off and many casualties and many will be young during oct - Jan