Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

Happydays2020

faceman wrote: »

Don’t be preposterous. An airport test is not a waste of time

Agree. It is about managing risk. Greece went down that route and they managed to not only save their tourist season (to a degree) but are now also one of the few green zones in Europe.

Plus they instigated sensible risk based measures during the season.

faceman

For this planning on hitting Spain here’s a break down of the curfew rules per region

https://english.elpais.com/society/2020-10-26/spains-new-state-of-alarm-what-restrictions-have-been-introduced-in-each-region.html

Tazz T

Government will use €180 tests to keep Amber countries too costly for travel and render the EU guidelines pointless. Don't be surprised if they demand it both departure and arrival. Back to the greenlist.

Even less people will travel than do now.

Tazz T

global23214124 wrote: »

Anyone planning on flying at the end of the week or early next week? My trip is up soon and dont want to go back to level 5 ****e for a month so wondering where restrictions arent too bad. Italy is tightening up. Perhaps Greece?

Regionally, Crete is still theoretically greenlist. UK have added it back as a corridor as they're working by region instead of country, but as people move back indoors as the weather declines it looks like cases will rise. Restrictions are increasing in areas on the mainland/Athens.

I've seen some accommodation providers offer workcation deals for people wanting to WFH in Crete.

faceman

Tazz T wrote: »

Government will use €180 tests to keep Amber countries too costly for travel and render the EU guidelines pointless. Don't be surprised if they demand it both departure and arrival. Back to the greenlist.

Even less people will travel than do now.

It will only result in people opting for restricting their movements and flouting the rules, especially if there is no follow up. The longer the restrictions on travel last the harder it will be to keep the public onboard. Societal support for this lockdown has dropped compared to last time. If there’s another in jan/feb as predicted then support will be even less. Jump forward to summer 2021 and people will want to travel and it will be hard to keep people onside if the rest of Europe is travelling without us

faceman

faceman wrote: »

For this planning on hitting Spain here’s a break down of the curfew rules per region

https://english.elpais.com/society/2020-10-26/spains-new-state-of-alarm-what-restrictions-have-been-introduced-in-each-region.html

Going back to lockdown it seems.

faceman

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Going back to lockdown it seems.

Quite the opposite. The purpose of all this is to avoid lockdowns. Lockdowns only happen at local level. Part of the issues in Catalonia and Madrid have been political, resulting in delays to implementing restrictions as required. The state of alarm once signed will remove the political barriers and allow for speedier addressing of problems. Valencia region is a good example of how it should work. There was no political or court issues in this region hence why is it’s the best performing region on mainland Spain

RobitTV

Canary Islands:
7 day incidence rate has dropped to - 40.03
14 day incidence rate has dropped to - 75.56 (Both the lowest in Spain)

ShineOn7

RobitTV wrote: »

Canary Islands:
7 day incidence rate has dropped to - 40.03
14 day incidence rate has dropped to - 75.56 (Both the lowest in Spain)

Sorry to be pessimistic, I'm trying to realistically research possibly working remotely in Spain from mid December at latest, but these trends in the country don't look good to do it safely

Surely it's only a matter of time before the Canary Islands is riddled with it too? I mean, this is how this thing works right? It spreads via travel

How did the Canaries do in Wave 1? I can't remember

Perhaps that's a better indicator to see if they'll dodge the Wave 2 bullet

RobitTV

ShineOn7 wrote: »

Sorry to be pessimistic, I'm trying to realistically research possibly working remotely in Spain from mid December at latest, but these trends in the country don't look good to do it safely

Surely it's only a matter of time before the Canary Islands is riddled with it too? I mean, this is how this thing works right? It spreads via travel

How did the Canaries do in Wave 1? I can't remember

Perhaps that's a better indicator to see if they'll dodge the Wave 2 bullet

The good news about the Canary Islands is that the second wave seemed to have peaked in September. The incidence rate rose from around 5.0 in June to nearly 200.0 in September and the islands introduced new restrictions.

The 14 day incidence rate has been declining since September from close to 200.0 at its peak to around 75-80 this week. It seems to be stabilising around 70-80 at the moment, but hopefully it may decrease even more.

The islands seemed to have come through the second wave pretty fast up to now. BUT the tourism markets are now coming back online from the UK and Germany and this may very well lead to rising cases again. So we could see rising cases and the incidence rate going upwards.

I think they've done great so far, but it's all hanging by a thread at the moment in the run up to Christmas. I can only hope the incidence rate stays low.

boris1234

Anyone know if there's patrols on Irish rail to check where people are travelling

embraer170

I returned to Germany after my two weeks of home quarantine in Ireland (now defined as a risk zone).

Drove to the local testing centre: all 4 of us got tested in less than 20 minutes between parking the car and driving off again (no pre-registration and no charge). Test done at 7pm on Sunday evening, result available in the national COVID app "Corona Warn" at 7am Monday morning. Had I known it would be so quick, we all could have been back at work and school today.

I know this isn't everyone's experience, but I must say it impressed me.

RobitTV

Update: The Canary Islands government have just announced they will introduce to the local parliament this week a law requiring all international visitors to have a PCR or negative antigen test done a maximum of 72 hours before checking into their accommodation.

Once the law is passed the Canarian Government will give a period of a few days, but no more than 15, for this regulation to reach all of Europe.

ShineOn7

RobitTV wrote: »

Update: The Canary Islands government have just announced they will introduce to the local parliament this week a law requiring all international visitors to have a PCR or negative antigen test done a maximum of 72 hours before checking into their accommodation.

Once the law is passed the Canarian Government will give a period of a few days, but no more than 15, for this regulation to reach all of Europe.

Wow, that's a big development

Are the Canaries ruled by a separate government from the mainland?

RobitTV

ShineOn7 wrote: »

Wow, that's a big development

Are the Canaries ruled by a separate government from the mainland?

In Spain the regions have local governments that have quite a good bit of power to enforce laws.

The Canary Islands are able to create this law themselves and now I don't know if I will be able to go there because the test is 180 euro in Ireland and i cannot find anywhere near me that does the private Covid test as I don't live in Dublin or Cork

ShineOn7

RobitTV wrote: »

I don't know if I will be able to go there because the test is 180 euro in Ireland and i cannot find anywhere near me that does the private Covid test as I don't live in Dublin or Cork

I've seen a few online mention a workaround for countries needing a clean test:

You tell your GP you have symptoms and they get you the free test. The trick though is getting the test and results all done within 72 hours

It sounds like a very tight time window to do it in the public system

RobitTV

ShineOn7 wrote: »

I've seen a few online mention a workaround for countries needing a clean test:

You tell your GP you have symptoms and they get you the free test. The trick though is getting the test and results all done within 72 hours

It sounds like a very tight time window to do it in the public system

Will they give you a certificate to say you are negative? because the hotels in the Canaries now require one before you check in to the hotel.

This is all such a very short timeframe, I think this decision will backfire because families cannot afford these prices.

A family of four travelling and with a cost of 180 euro per test, it will end up costing 720 euro for the family.

I agree with testing but this isn't the way forward.

ShineOn7

RobitTV wrote: »

Will they give you a certificate to say you are negative? because the hotels in the Canaries now require one before you check in to the hotel.

That's something you'd have to check with your GP as I'm not sure

It's a risky strategy and leaves very little room for any delays at all

Have you considered the Valencia region?

RobitTV

ShineOn7 wrote: »

That's something you'd have to check with your GP as I'm not sure

It's a risky strategy and leaves very little room for any delays at all

Have you considered the Valencia region?

I wouldn't mind travelling to Valencia but sadly I have already booked Tenerife and its so typical they make this decision after everything is booked haha.

Been such a long year and I have been really looking forward to this break. But it's now likely i will be cancelling my hotel and flights if this becomes law very soon.

acequion

RobitTV wrote: »

I wouldn't mind travelling to Valencia but sadly I have already booked Tenerife and its so typical they make this decision after everything is booked haha.

Been such a long year and I have been really looking forward to this break. But it's now likely i will be cancelling my hotel and flights if this becomes law very soon.

Jesus that sounds like tourism suicide by the Canaries!

I completely sympathise and hope something works out. This horrible situation keeps getting worse and constant new measures and uturns make planning impossible. When will a time come again that we'll be able to book holidays and look forward to them like in the old days!

faceman

faceman wrote: »

Quite the opposite. The purpose of all this is to avoid lockdowns. Lockdowns only happen at local level. Part of the issues in Catalonia and Madrid have been political, resulting in delays to implementing restrictions as required. The state of alarm once signed will remove the political barriers and allow for speedier addressing of problems. Valencia region is a good example of how it should work. There was no political or court issues in this region hence why is it’s the best performing region on mainland Spain

Asturias sent an the kids home with their books and materials today. Expecting the schools to close again.

Curfew between 12 noon and 6pm and only essential travel allowed which must be confirmed in writing.

Not sure how much more is needed before you call it a lockdown

normanoffside

RobitTV wrote: »

Update: The Canary Islands government have just announced they will introduce to the local parliament this week a law requiring all international visitors to have a PCR or negative antigen test done a maximum of 72 hours before checking into their accommodation.

Once the law is passed the Canarian Government will give a period of a few days, but no more than 15, for this regulation to reach all of Europe.

That’s a big development. Antigen tests are very fast and cheap. About €50 with 24hr turnaround.

acequion

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Asturias sent an the kids home with their books and materials today. Expecting the schools to close again.

Curfew between 12 noon and 6pm and only essential travel allowed which must be confirmed in writing.

Not sure how much more is needed before you call it a lockdown

Spain has 17 autonomous regions of which Asturias is just one.

Hardly a national lockdown like zealous Ireland.:rolleyes:

acequion

normanoffside wrote: »

That’s a big development. Antigen tests are very fast and cheap. About €50 with 24hr turnaround.

But if a family of four you're talking €200

Spain doesn't generally attract the solo traveller or just couples. It attracts families. Such costs on top of travel and accommodation in a depressed market for the foreseeable? Looks like tourism suicide.

Test costs have to be affordable otherwise as much a non runner for most as 14 day quarantine.

acequion

acequion wrote: »

Spain has 17 autonomous regions of which Asturias is just one.

Hardly a national lockdown like zealous Ireland.:rolleyes:

It's also ten times the size. So what.

A region is going into lockdown. If you don't consider the rest of Spain as entering a lockdown then Ireland was never in one considering we never had the police issuing fines to people for walking their dogs and there's no covid testing needed for travel

faceman

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Asturias sent an the kids home with their books and materials today. Expecting the schools to close again.

Curfew between 12 noon and 6pm and only essential travel allowed which must be confirmed in writing.

Not sure how much more is needed before you call it a lockdown

Yeah they have a high rate of cases there. There’s no daytime curfew though, you must mean midnight to 6

faceman

faceman wrote: »

Yeah they have a high rate of cases there. There’s no daytime curfew though, you must mean midnight to 6

That makes more sense alright.

acequion

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

It's also ten times the size. So what.

A region is going into lockdown. If you don't consider the rest of Spain as entering a lockdown then Ireland was never in one considering we never had the police issuing fines to people for walking their dogs and there's no covid testing needed for travel

Are you hell bent on trying to make Spain seem stricter than Ireland? Because the facts on the ground don't back it up. Yes they had a much stricter lockdown at the start than we had and crudely speaking they might look like a tougher crowd. But after their strict lockdown they opened up. They allowed free inward tourism and they allowed pretty much unfettered commercial activity albeit with restrictions.

Whereas Ireland did a lockdown light, did their euphemistically termed "policing by consent" and then never fully opened up. And are now back in lockdown light mode, albeit with a now policing with a tougher hand, we'll see what that means.

Spain have opted to manage by region rather than nationally and with their sensible curfew system, are trying to avoid the economic suicide of national lockdown.

I know Spain well and it's no well run utopia, but I'll take their approach any day over that of nanny state Ireland.

440Hertz

The Spanish first lockdown was horrendous. I've good Spanish friends in Madrid and they weren't even allowed to go out and exercise with kids and they live in an apartment. They nearly lost their minds and there have been low level restrictions ever since too. You had to literally fill in a form to walk the dog!

It opened up, but so did Ireland (other than one type of bar, which they don't really have to the same degree in Spain anyway). I had plenty of pints and evenings out in bars serving food here after the lockdown and great evenings out dining outside too.

There was on-going low level stuff in Spain since the lockdown in various regions too.

The 'only in Ireland' .. 'woe, is me' thing that goes on here is sometimes a bit much.

acequion

acequion wrote: »

Are you hell bent on trying to make Spain seem stricter than Ireland? Because the facts on the ground don't back it up. Yes they had a much stricter lockdown at the start than we had and crudely speaking they might look like a tougher crowd. But after their strict lockdown they opened up. They allowed free inward tourism and they allowed pretty much unfettered commercial activity albeit with restrictions.

Whereas Ireland did a lockdown light, did their euphemistically termed "policing by consent" and then never fully opened up. And are now back in lockdown light mode, albeit with a now policing with a tougher hand, we'll see what that means.

Spain have opted to manage by region rather than nationally and with their sensible curfew system, are trying to avoid the economic suicide of national lockdown.

I know Spain well and it's no well run utopia, but I'll take their approach any day over that of nanny state Ireland.

They had legally enforced lockdowns. The place closed, people were locked in apartments with fines for venturing out. My children spent 4 months inside a two bedroom apartment with their mother and I was stuck in this very very tame version waiting until I was allowed travel there

The police had the power to demand ID (as always) and issue fines, make you go home and arrest you. You could not enter areas including what Ireland deems as 'essential'. While in Ireland you could meander about outside and any old excuse ticked the 'carry on boss' box

When I did travel I drove straight to Dublin airport, walked onto a plane and flew there. NO checks and no restrictions in Dublin. On arrival I filled in a form and had my temperature taken. If I refused, no entry. ON return I again filled in a form and that was it. Even if you refused to fill in the form you weren't turned back and kicked out of the country.

Theres now a curfew in the area where I and my family actually live (well, Im split between here and there). My children have been sent home from school.

Im pretty sure I can claim to know Spain very well too considering Im a citizen through marriage with born and raised Spanish children. I have integrated into society and held down jobs both North and South of the country. (The North is far superior in all ways to those nasty Valencians )

I never claimed its utopia or a hell hole or anything else extreme. I obviously like the place. Im not sure why but you seem hellbent on confrontation with me over this