Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

HalloweenJack

HalloweenJack wrote: »

You can't enter supermarkets without a mask and washing your hands with gel or wearing gloves. This is enforced quite strictly. Lines pointing out distances everywhere. The gym is similar.

Bars/restaurants won't go beyond capacity. Any that do are quickly shut down or fined heftily. A lot of businesses have 'mask only' service.

The campaign here has been co-operation and shared responsibility and its worked wonders. I had my doubts about how Spaniards would take to being told what to do but I reckon how serious it got has convinced them.

The wearing of masks and using hand gel is done by the vast majority. Social distancing is harder as Spaniards are very touchy-feely but there is a noticeable and unfamiliar 'coldness' when greeting Spaniards now.

It's going to be very different in resort area for sure. I'm think that it would probably ruin the experience for me, to the point that I wouldn't go.

What I want to take advantage of is the quietness of places that would normally be jammed. I've flights booked to Rome, which I think will be wonderful without the hordes of tourists (and a beautiful boutique hotel is amazingly cheap), and will take in a trip to Paris for the same reason. I was in London not long ago for an essential visit, and took a trip into the city. Being in an empty Trafalgar square, and sitting having a beer on the steps of St Pauls in the evening with hardly anyone around was pretty special.

Those kind of opportunistic trips appeal to me more than the beach, before they start getting busy again in a few months

HalloweenJack

My wife's family have a place in Fuengirola so we're going down this weekend. I'm not terribly optimistic, tbf.

We were down a few weeks ago and the resident foreigners were following the rules but that was before Spain was open for business. I'm most concerned about those coming over on holidays from countries with a ****ty attitude and implementation (i.e. England) and how they are going to behave.

acequion

HalloweenJack wrote: »

My wife's family have a place in Fuengirola so we're going down this weekend. I'm not terribly optimistic, tbf.

We were down a few weeks ago and the resident foreigners were following the rules but that was before Spain was open for business. I'm most concerned about those coming over on holidays from countries with a ****ty attitude and implementation (i.e. England) and how they are going to behave.

They'll have to behave because the cops over there are very proactive and take no nonsense.

Some poster was saying that they were wondering how the Spaniards would adapt to all the rules. Spain have a military past and still a strong military police in the Guardia Civil and have much less reservations than we would about accepting military style orders.Anyone with any experience of anything institutionalised over there, if only the electricity company, will know how regimented they can be. Now I'm personally not a fan of such a regimented style and prefer our more subtle approach to many things, but I would prefer their zero tolerance in this instance and am also confident that I'll feel safe there when I go over on July 10th.

deckie66

snotboogie wrote: »

If it was a roll on roll off within a few hours ferry it would likely greatly reduce risk however all of the ferries to mainland Europe take 15 hours+ and have people leaving their cars to mull around onboard like its a cruise ship.

Brittany Ferrries Cork-Roscoff back in service this saturday

faceman

UPDATE: Ryanair said "no"

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2020/07/01/update-ryanair-refuse-to-aquies-to-the-welsh-governents-request-not-to-fly-to-malaga-from-cardiff/#.XvyMyC2ZNMA



The Welsh government has ordered Ryanair to cancel flights to Faro and Malaga scheduled for this Friday.

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2020/07/01/ryanair-ordered-to-cancel-flights-to-faro-and-malaga-from-cardiff-airport-on-friday/#.XvyMBi2ZNMA

TheDriver

faceman wrote: »

UPDATE: Ryanair said "no"

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2020/07/01/update-ryanair-refuse-to-aquies-to-the-welsh-governents-request-not-to-fly-to-malaga-from-cardiff/#.XvyMyC2ZNMA



The Welsh government has ordered Ryanair to cancel flights to Faro and Malaga scheduled for this Friday.

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2020/07/01/ryanair-ordered-to-cancel-flights-to-faro-and-malaga-from-cardiff-airport-on-friday/#.XvyMBi2ZNMA

As if the Welsh Govt was expecting a different answer. It's all just playing politics and who can look best.

bladespin

faceman wrote: »

UPDATE: Ryanair said "no"

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2020/07/01/update-ryanair-refuse-to-aquies-to-the-welsh-governents-request-not-to-fly-to-malaga-from-cardiff/#.XvyMyC2ZNMA



The Welsh government has ordered Ryanair to cancel flights to Faro and Malaga scheduled for this Friday.

https://www.euroweeklynews.com/2020/07/01/ryanair-ordered-to-cancel-flights-to-faro-and-malaga-from-cardiff-airport-on-friday/#.XvyMBi2ZNMA

They wrote to Ryanair and asked them to postpone the flights (another govt copping out), no orders so they're basically passing the buck.

ZX7R

bladespin wrote: »

They wrote to Ryanair and asked them to postpone the flights (another govt copping out), no orders so they're basically passing the buck.

What the article does not contain is Ryanair requested financial aid to cover the cost of lost revenue.
The request was declined

Nijmegen

ZX7R wrote: »

What the article does not contain is Ryanair requested financial aid to cover the cost of lost revenue.
The request was declined

This is the crux of the back and forth on governments explicitly banning travel. If they ban it, they'll have to pay for it and will get charged like every flight on the schedule was going to run at 100% occupancy to boot.

faceman

Ryanair had a go at Holohan and Harris in Twitter today. Click on it to see all the tweets

https://twitter.com/ryanairpress/status/1278265421251125252?s=21

josip

While I agree with the content of their tweet, they are in the glasshouse when you consider how they've treated their customers who are entitled to refunds.

acequion

A remark on the news about the possibility of reinforcing the 14 day quarantine.

Legally how much further could they go with that?

Damiencm

Eddie Wilson was on Matt Cooper this evening.

Whilst he is clearly going to put Ryanairs interest above all else, he did make some points that are difficult to disagree with.

1. Europe is by in large now open with free movement of people. Therefore the idea of so called air corridor's is effectively redundant. i.e. there is no point in having an air corridor to Portugal but not to Spain as you can fly into one and then travel to the other. The same would be true of people coming into Ireland. Spain and Portugal are just an example, pick any country with shared borders.

2. Covid is not going away as we all now accept for the foreseeable future therefore saying that we should make 2020 the year of the staycation is silly. Will every year be the year of the staycation until a vaccine is found? 2021, 2022, 2023... One of the leading vacines is expected to provide immunity for no more than 12 months.

3. If the answer is yes and we are to effectively seal our borders what about inward tourism? Tourism accounts for c.10% of Irish GDP I believe. Given that Irish GDP is very much inflated by the presence of multinationals, it would be fair to suggest tourism accounts for even more than 1/10 of the economy in real terms. What about those hundreds of thousands of jobs that are at risk? We can staycation to our hearts content but there are simple nowhere near enough people in the country to make up for the loss of inward tourism.

4. We are an island, as has been shown in New Zealand we can (rightly) be proud to have brought deaths to a very low level indeed. But as has been shown by New Zealand, unless borders are sealed indefinitely ( which clearly they can't be) the virus can and will come back.

There is heaps of bashing by all sides on this topic which serves no one.

I just personally feel that what all courses of action have to be thought through to their logical conclusions, not just for 2020 but beyond.

Infection will be imported back into the country no matter what. On that basis I believe the government, the CMO et al, employers and indeed us as individuals need to cop on a bit. There is a huge swaith of the population that has decided to not take responsibility. Nominal numbers of people are wearing masks in shopping centres and public transport, shop staff are not wearing masks, restaurant wait staff are not wearing masks.

In many European countries all of the above is happening.

This is the real story IMO

SimonTemplar

Dr. Holohan has advised time and time again to wear masks in shops and on public transport. Anyone who isn't doing that doesn't have the right to complain about people travelling abroad.

faceman

SimonTemplar wrote: »

Dr. Holohan has advised time and time again to wear masks in shops and on public transport. Anyone who isn't doing that doesn't have the right to complain about people travelling abroad.

Um. For some time during the crisis he said there was no need for the general public to wear masks. His messaging since changed.

FWIW I agree that mask wearing should be mandatory.

Damiencm

SimonTemplar wrote:

Dr. Holohan has advised time and time again to wear masks in shops and on public transport. Anyone who isn't doing that doesn't have the right to complain about people travelling abroad.

Yes though I think he too has only come out strong on this in the last couple of weeks.

That's a bit late when people are seeing new cases falling and the economy reopening. People wrongly assume therefore that there is no needs for masks

Tenzor07

SimonTemplar wrote: »

Dr. Holohan has advised time and time again to wear masks in shops and on public transport. Anyone who isn't doing that doesn't have the right to complain about people travelling abroad.

Yeap, he sure did:

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1248683715733131264

Dobloman

Can anybody tell me the score with Turkey.Can I travel to it without locking myself up for 2 weeks when I come back.Suppose to be flying out july 18th

Tenzor07

Damiencm wrote: »

We are an island, as has been shown in New Zealand we can (rightly) be proud to have brought deaths to a very low level indeed. But as has been shown by New Zealand, unless borders are sealed indefinitely ( which clearly they can't be) the virus can and will come back

What people also forget about NZ is that unlike Ireland, they're not a member of a border less union of 26 other states, and they don't share a border with another jurisdiction with differing laws and healthcare.
Also that they have a very resilient economy and low levels of government debt, whereas we're still paying off the bank debt from the last time, Fianna Fail were in power... welcome back FF! :rolleyes:
Also that they print their own currency and aren't part of a shared currency, they can do what they like with the NZ dollar to make exports/overseas trade cheaper.

They can afford to hunker down for the next year if they like and still maintain their economy and keep citizens from the worst impacts of the crisis.

TheDriver

And Bus Eireann has said they will not be policing mask wearing on buses. Bit like the lads smoking at the back of a double decker, no one stopping them.

Damiencm

TheDriver wrote:

And Bus Eireann has said they will not be policing mask wearing on buses. Bit like the lads smoking at the back of a double decker, no one stopping them.

Daft IMO. It should be pretty simple, no mask = no entry. Someone has an issue with the driver saying this then let the driver call the guards.

How else can the law be effective, a guard on every bus in the country?

TheDriver

Damiencm wrote: »

Daft IMO. It should be pretty simple, no mask = no entry. Someone has an issue with the driver saying this then let the driver call the guards.

How else can the law be effective, a guard on every bus in the country?

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=113902666&postcount=1067

Crazy stuff. I was in Cork yesterday and loads getting on buses with no masks, drivers obviously not stopping them. And cops on the street but having nothing to do with it.

tonysopprano

Please supply reference to legislation or to bus eireann/dublinbus/ianrodeireann byelaws that require masks?. Same as requiring 14 self-isolation when flying into Ireland- only request and NOT obliged by law.

How do you think the Iraqi FAKEUGEES from Sligo were able to infect half the town

acequion

acequion wrote: »

A remark on the news about the possibility of reinforcing the 14 day quarantine.

Legally how much further could they go with that?

Probably like in the UK. If you’re suspected of not self isolating then you’ll be checked on by the police and fined £1000. The reality is that they’ll check on holiday makers and people who are felt likely to be spending time away from where they said they will be. Not for residents who are at home and who might go out occasionally. As far as I understand it is very much a risk based approach to enforcement. But the legislation to check up on and fine offenders is there

snotboogie

Damiencm wrote: »

2. Covid is not going away as we all now accept for the foreseeable future therefore saying that we should make 2020 the year of the staycation is silly. Will every year be the year of the staycation until a vaccine is found? 2021, 2022, 2023... One of the leading vacines is expected to provide immunity for no more than 12 months.

Current consensus seems to be that a vaccine will be ready by the end of the year. No guarantee of course but its not correct to say "covid isn't going away and we all accept it"

ZX7R

TheDriver wrote: »

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=113902666&postcount=1067

Crazy stuff. I was in Cork yesterday and loads getting on buses with no masks, drivers obviously not stopping them. And cops on the street but having nothing to do with it.

It basically down to the time wasted trying to enforce it by the driver you would have feck all bus's running on time

bladespin

snotboogie wrote: »

Current consensus seems to be that a vaccine will be ready by the end of the year. No guarantee of course but its not correct to say "covid isn't going away and we all accept it"

Actually it is, until a vaccine is properly tested, approved and widely available there isn’t one in reality, anything could happen during trials, hopefully all is good but you can’t take it for granted.

Damiencm

tonysopprano wrote:

Please supply reference to legislation or to bus eireann/dublinbus/ianrodeireann byelaws that require masks?. Same as requiring 14 self-isolation when flying into Ireland- only request and NOT obliged by law.

tonysopprano wrote:

How do you think the Iraqi FAKEUGEES from Sligo were able to infect half the town

On the former point I think everyone knows the 14 day self isolation is a cop out and is just the government sitting on the ditch.

My understanding is that wearing of masks is now mandatory but do recall reading somewhere that the legislation was yet unsigned. Suggests another government fudge.

As bad as things are with the virus in the UK, it's still easy to invisage them reopening to mass air travel faster than us given the snails pace we are moving at.

If / when that happens our common travel area and land bridge with the north will make a mockery of any restrictions we have (real or imaginary). The lads from Iraq showing what will happen.

P.s. I'm pretty sure half the town of Sligo was not infected. Outside of the boys themselves can you reference the source of actual local infections? Genuine question.

bladespin

[Deleted User] wrote: »

But the legislation to check up on and fine offenders is there

Honest question, where is it? I understand they can force isolation on positives not isolating but can they on someone who has traveled? The wording on travel is very vague to say the least, not sure how you can prosecute for not obeying a ‘recommendation’.

Damiencm

snotboogie wrote:

Current consensus seems to be that a vaccine will be ready by the end of the year. No guarantee of course but its not correct to say "covid isn't going away and we all accept it"

Hopefully a vaccine of sorts will be ready. I think we would all like to get on board with that.

But me thinks it's gonna take a while to vaccinate the planet or at least enough of it to provide herd immunity long enough for the virus to die out.

Im guessing the western world will have pretty quick access to a new drug but what % uptake will there be?

How long will imunity last? If it begins to ware off before poorer nations have received the drug, could the whole thing kick off again.

If I said it wasn't going away what I meant was it is not looking like it is going away in the foreseeable future 2,3, 4 years maybe.

Hopefully I am way wrong and come Summer 2021 we will all be jetting off here there and everywhere without a care in the world... but that just does not seem likely.