Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

Tenzor07

caveat emptor wrote: »

I'm definitely against unnecessary travel but what legal basis do they have for this given it's the EU?
As far as I know (AFAIK) every EU passport holder has a current right to reside in the country.
Open to correction.

I believe it's down to each country being able to bring in any additional rules under emergency health regulations, so would supersede EU laws.

Tenzor07

faceman wrote: »

Do they not have confidence with the lads manning the checkpoints? :pac:

I also heard it was the AP's and not the Gard's, or maybe a mix of both..

caveat emptor

faceman wrote: »

They’ve stopped travel from Portugal and the U.K. too. It’s due to the new strain. EU countries are allowed to do that if the measur if justified. Germany is riddled at the moment and they border 9 countries so they’re naturally concerned.

If everyone blocking everyone else we may swell move toward eradication and get on with it. Everyone taking different measures just serves to keep it swirling around.

(I know this may not be possible but what's the alternative)

Gael23

When the 5km restriction is removed it’s going to be very hard to enforce the airport fine I believe

Gael23

Gael23 wrote: »

When the 5km restriction is removed it’s going to be very hard to enforce the airport fine I believe

Why? When that only applies to exercise

Tenzor07

Tenzor07 wrote: »

I believe it's down to each country being able to bring in any additional rules under emergency health regulations, so would supersede EU laws.

In addition to that. Each EU nation can control its own border. The right to free movement does not apply to holidays. Its relates to the right to move and work in any EU nation and even then it carries limits and restrictions before you are legally entitled to obtain a PPS number (and similar abroad, NEI in Spain and so on....)

Ireland also isnt within Shengen so we never had fully open borders beyond the north which is not an EU agreement

Tenzor07

Tenzor07 wrote: »

I also heard it was the AP's and not the Gard's, or maybe a mix of both..

AP have no powers under covid regulations and arent on any checkpoints so whoever told you its AP is an idiot

Gael23

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Why? When that only applies to exercise

Because there’s no restrictions travelling within the country so by driving to the airport you haven’t done anything wrong

Tenzor07

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

AP have no powers under covid regulations and arent on any checkpoints so whoever told you its AP is an idiot

yea didn't' see for myself, i'd imagine the AP's are "assisting" the Gards...it's as you go towards the boarding pass scan..

ninebeanrows

Strange German decision on travel here considering our rate will probably be lower than there within a week.

Seems a totally delayed decision, fair enough if they did it on 1 January but now?

Sure the UK variant is rife already and travel from here is negligible.

Seems the EU and loads of countries have panicked just when the finish line is in sight.

Donald Trump

normanoffside wrote: »

Back in October, Ryanair took the government to the supreme court over it's mandate against non-essential foreign travel.
The government argued it was an advisory, not a law, and won the case (much to jubilation from Ryanair which was trolling all along).

So if there was no legal basis to advice against travelling abroad for non-essential purposes last October, has something changed now or am I missing something?

https://www.irishlegal.com/article/high-court-ryanair-loses-covid-19-guidelines-challenge

Yes, they did not explicitly ban travel. However they did make it illegal for you to leave your place of residence without a reasonable excuse.


If you were to be brought to court, you would not be charged with flying/travelling. You would charged with breaking the restrictions. That you were on your way to the airport is inconsequential to the actual charge (aside from maybe your defence/excuse for leaving your house)

Donald Trump

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Strange German decision on travel here considering our rate will probably be lower than there within a week.

Seems a totally delayed decision, fair enough if they did it on 1 January but now?

Sure the UK variant is rife already and travel from here is negligible.

Seems the EU and loads of countries have panicked just when the finish line is in sight.

Two possibilities off the top of my head, and maybe related.


1) The need to make sure people don't lose the run of themselves if they think a vaccine is imminent for them (it may not be!)
2) They have access to more preliminary information so that they know something is coming next and need to crack down hard sooner rather than later. (I mean for example that the public health people here knew when surges were coming by detecting concentrations in waste water).

Tenzor07

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Strange German decision on travel here considering our rate will probably be lower than there within a week..

Off the top of my head i'd say Open border with the UK...

faceman

Gael23 wrote: »

When the 5km restriction is removed it’s going to be very hard to enforce the airport fine I believe

Not so sure. Even under level 3 international travel is prohibited. No reason why they can’t have a Garda presence at the airport.

Guarantee that despite all the fuss over travel at present, if and when rates come down and things start to open, if other EU countries are travelling no one will be supporting the travel ban

But as Leo said it’s hard for remove these things once you set them up. Watch this space

dan786

What if you have dual citizenship? Can they fine you if you are just going back home, its technically not a holiday?

theguzman

Family reunification is also surely an essential travel, as a result of the travel restrictions I am forced to leave Ireland, I would prefer to stay here but I will have to go abroad until then end of April or May or whenever either the UK or Ireland reopens.

faceman

dan786 wrote: »

What if you have dual citizenship? Can they fine you if you are just going back home, its technically not a holiday?

Dual citizenship doesn’t matter from their perspective. It’s the purpose of your trip that does.

Thelonious Monk

I saw photos of the Garda interrogating people in cars outside the airport. Will I be ok to collect my folks from there on Monday? I live exactly 10km from airport. I'm sure it'll be fine but I can't keep up with the restrictions.

dartboardio

So has anyone flown or visited the airport in the last couple of days?

What’s this crack about guards or AP waiting at the security boarding pass area? There’s always people in high vis vests standing there anyway?

Mr. Karate

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Varadkar was asked that question on "The Tonight show" during the week, he didn't give a full answer, he kicked that question down the line a bit.. basically all that can happen to you now is that the Garda can fine you €100... and when the new legislation comes in then €500 if they consider your travel non-essential..
But for now you can't be legally prevented from leaving the country.

Shows you we have no business being locked down at this stage. They can't even justify their own bull**** anymore.

Mr. Karate

faceman wrote: »

But as Leo said it’s hard for remove these things once you set them up. Watch this space

Just the way they want them.

caveat emptor

The timing of the German thing is suspect. I'm not a lawyer so open to correction but here's my interpretation of what's happened.

1. EU brings in rules to check / prevent export of vaccine to UK.
2. UK / Ireland protest the triggering of article 16 with regard the suspension of open trade between N.I and eire as it may constitute a back door (not in the china swab sense)
3. M.m an Boris both make protestations to Ursula using the word 'explosive'
4. EU pulls back from brink.
5. Next day flights from Ireland banned to Germany.

Call me paranoid by all means, is Germany doing this to any other EU countries?

In a steep escalation of the EU’s fight to secure vaccine supplies, Brussels had said it would trigger clauses in the Northern Irish Protocol in the EU-UK withdrawal agreement to control shots moving across the open Border between the State and the North. It said this plan aimed to prevent the movement of vaccines onwards into the rest of the UK via a Northern Ireland “backdoor”, while preserving the capacity to allow shipments into the North.

Wouldn't be the first time.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/eu-backs-down-on-plan-to-control-export-of-covid-19-vaccines-across-border-into-north-amid-outcry-1.4471366

dan786

faceman wrote: »

Dual citizenship doesn’t matter from their perspective. It’s the purpose of your trip that does.

The purpose is that you are going back home. Can they fine you for going home? I doubt it. Its same as an Irish national wanting to come back to Ireland.

Responder XY

Hard to stomach that we are going to fine people for travelling but we don't do the same for people who won't isolate when they are known cases/close contacts.

We should allow people to travel wherever they want but come down hard on those who don't follow the quarantine/isolation requirements or engage in unnecessary gatherings. Physical travel doesn't spread the virus, social engagement does. 
Would love to head on holiday in the next few weeks. Would be very easy to have a socially distant holiday, return and isolate for two weeks. No harm could come of that, but the internet mob have sadly made that impossible.

dartboardio

Responder XY wrote: »

Hard to stomach that we are going to fine people for travelling but we don't do the same for people who won't isolate when they are known cases/close contacts.

We should allow people to travel wherever they want but come down hard on those who don't follow the quarantine/isolation requirements or engage in unnecessary gatherings. Physical travel doesn't spread the virus, social engagement does. 
Would love to head on holiday in the next few weeks. Would be very easy to have a socially distant holiday, return and isolate for two weeks. No harm could come of that, but the internet mob have sadly made that impossible.

Yep unfortunately. But if you even mention travel to most people you're called an ignorant selfish pr*ck, despite the fact that you will be getting a test on the way out and the way back, yet they're the ones in supermarkets shoulder to shoulder with untested people :rolleyes: the hypocrisy is hilarious

Meanwhile, a year into the pandemic , we don't even have to wear masks in the streets in Ireland, and me going to Dubai until this lockdown is over, where masks are mandatory everywhere, is putting myself at risk LOL

beggars_bush

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Strange German decision on travel here considering our rate will probably be lower than there within a week.

Seems a totally delayed decision, fair enough if they did it on 1 January but now?

Sure the UK variant is rife already and travel from here is negligible.

Seems the EU and loads of countries have panicked just when the finish line is in sight.

UK strain and our land border

beggars_bush

Responder XY wrote: »

Hard to stomach that we are going to fine people for travelling but we don't do the same for people who won't isolate when they are known cases/close contacts.

We should allow people to travel wherever they want but come down hard on those who don't follow the quarantine/isolation requirements or engage in unnecessary gatherings. Physical travel doesn't spread the virus, social engagement does. 
Would love to head on holiday in the next few weeks. Would be very easy to have a socially distant holiday, return and isolate for two weeks. No harm could come of that, but the internet mob have sadly made that impossible.

The more people that go, the greater the chance of them bringing something home
And based on current behaviour, a lot of people who won't self isolate

Responder XY

beggars_bush wrote: »

The more people that go, the greater the chance of them bringing something home
And based on current behaviour, a lot of people who won't self isolate

I'd have no issue with punishing those who don't self isolate when required to. We should focus on that.

But I have a big issue with the rules that don't have a direct impact on reducing spread of virus.

faceman

faceman wrote: »

Dual citizenship doesn’t matter from their perspective. It’s the purpose of your trip that does.

People with both a British and an Irish passport will just be able to say to both the British and Irish police that they are going home, and flash the appropriate passport.

faceman

caveat emptor wrote: »

The timing of the German thing is suspect. I'm not a lawyer so open to correction but here's my interpretation of what's happened.

1. EU brings in rules to check / prevent export of vaccine to UK.
2. UK / Ireland protest the triggering of article 16 with regard the suspension of open trade between N.I and eire as it may constitute a back door (not in the china swab sense)
3. M.m an Boris both make protestations to Ursula using the word 'explosive'
4. EU pulls back from brink.
5. Next day flights from Ireland banned to Germany.

Call me paranoid by all means, is Germany doing this to any other EU countries?



Wouldn't be the first time.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/eu-backs-down-on-plan-to-control-export-of-covid-19-vaccines-across-border-into-north-amid-outcry-1.4471366

Portugal is banned too