Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

Plumbthedepths

tom1ie wrote: »

So will it be the governments fault if god forbid you catch c19 and then bring it back to Ireland?
Not wishing it on you in any way, but I mean you’ve taken a risk to travel abroad and that’s not the governments fault, so I don’t know why your saying they are incompetent. They certainly are Incompetent in letting USA tourists in (can’t do a lot about uk tourists) into the country, but I don’t see how you going away and potentially bringing it back, or you going away and bringing it with you, makes the government incompetent.

Would you say the same if he said he was on the beach in Ross's point Sligo. There was an a cluster there recently.
What makes the government incompetent is the behaviour to-date ie getting you and people like you to try and shame others into abandoning their travel plans instead of making a decisive decision such as banning outward and inward travel but then they would face serious questions from Brussels. Do you not feel just a little bit used?

maestroamado

Katgurl wrote: »

This thread makes me sick. I cannot believe the selfishness of posters thinking their desire for a sun holiday trumps other people's safety.

The virus is not gone. We have made good progress. This is down to the collective effort of the community.

The defence that other people are arriving from overseas does not justify you doing the same thing.

I agree with you but...
People who put out hard earned cash say €1000 for airline tickets if they decide not to travel will not get refund, this surely is not fair.

I think the Airlines should have stayed on the ground until end of July.
I expect the Government be in European court if they tried to stop flights.
I have said in the past that EU Government should have asked EU to open as a group but it was left to individual Countries.
I am not very informed on this thread as i was fallowing another thread but to my surprise it closed, i think Airline travel very relavent in coming weeks.

bladespin

Katgurl wrote: »

This thread makes me sick.

Suggest you isolate for a couple of weeks, might feel better then.

Harika

Was coughed on today by an American tourist, great we let obviously sick people from high risk countries in but won't be allowed to go ourselves into low risk countries.

RoryMac

bladespin wrote: »

Suggest you isolate for a couple of weeks, might feel better then.

Or have a €9.50 meal, that'll stop it

tom1ie

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Would you say the same if he said he was on the beach in Ross's point Sligo. There was an a cluster there recently.
What makes the government incompetent is the behaviour to-date ie getting you and people like you to try and shame others into abandoning their travel plans instead of making a decisive decision such as banning outward and inward travel but then they would face serious questions from Brussels. Do you not feel just a little bit used?

Well it’s just common sense to be honest. Travelling around the place during a pandemic isn’t the best idea.
Agreed though that the governments policy in allowing USA tourists to come here is nuts, but adding to that by travelling around is only going to exacerbate the situation.

Plumbthedepths

tom1ie wrote: »

Well it’s just common sense to be honest. Travelling around the place during a pandemic isn’t the best idea.
Agreed though that the governments policy in allowing USA tourists to come here is nuts, but adding to that by travelling around is only going to exacerbate the situation.

So would you say Professor J Lambert has no commonsense. I'm not trying to back you into a corner but it seems the only sense being acceptable is a particular opinion.


https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/republic-of-ireland/foreign-travel-is-safe-if-covid-19-precautions-are-taken-says-disease-expert-39330929.html

tom1ie

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

So would you say Professor J Lambert has no commonsense. I'm not trying to back you into a corner but it seems the only sense being acceptable is a particular opinion.


https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/republic-of-ireland/foreign-travel-is-safe-if-covid-19-precautions-are-taken-says-disease-expert-39330929.html

Well I suppose it depends what side of the argument you side with after researching yourself as there are so many experts disagreeing with other experts. I’d prefer to err on the side of caution.

normanoffside

According to 500+ of the world's leading epidemiologists, going on a plane carries about the same risk as going on a bus or eating in a restaurant.
It carries less risk than going to a bar or Church or shaking hands with someone.

Staying in a Hotel or going to a beach are much less risky than getting a haircut or using a public toilet.

Given the above I can't see how foreign holidays in themselves are in anyway dangerous.

acequion

Katgurl wrote: »

This thread makes me sick. I cannot believe the selfishness of posters thinking their desire for a sun holiday trumps other people's safety.

With your tantrum like attitude [thread makes you sick] you could be accused of a different type of selfishness and most certainly, naivety.

In fact it's the naivety that constantly amazes me. People like you seem unaware of the type of society in which we live. Which is a western consumer society which trumps individualism over collectivism. You seem to think we all live in some sort of close knit community utopia, some kind of old style Israeli Kibbutz where everybody looks out for each other. Now perhaps we'd all be better off if our society was more the latter than the former. But the fact is it's not. Far from it.

So expecting people to make big sacrifices for strangers is naive and actually selfish. Ok, people will do it in an emergency, there is still an innate nobility in human nature. But otherwise they won't. They'll look after themselves and their own.

I really am amazed that some people don't get that. Then you have the opportunistic, the politicians and media that peddle that utopian nonsense to suit their own ends.

facehugger99

Very easy to see how the Catholic Church prospered here for so long.

There's a significant proportion of the population that are both conditioned to be obedient of authority and very happy to sit in moral judgement of others.

acequion

facehugger99 wrote: »

Very easy to see how the Catholic Church prospered here for so long.

There's a significant proportion of the population that are both conditioned to be obedient of authority and very happy to sit in moral judgement of others.

100% agree. Am always saying exactly that and telling it to my foreign friends who can hardly believe it and think I'm exaggerating. It is very evident in middle class, middle Ireland, the same cohort of people who were in thrall to the church. I see it all around me, in my family, in my job, in my neighborhood. Nobody will stand up to authority. It's very worrying that we are such a subservient, easily brainwashed people because all you need is the wrong people in charge and then???

faceman

Snapshot photos this opening of one of my local beaches in Spain this morning. Note that this town is predominantly Spanish, there isn’t many Irish/U.K. visitors to it. I could go to one of those beaches but I prefer this one.

As you can see I’m surrounded by coronavirus and it’s going to consume me. :rolleyes:

There are 2 cops patrolling the beaches up and down and also the additional staff hired to patrol the beaches

(I’m not a beach person. You’ve know idea how much it pained me to go get this photo )

Harika

As I see it being outside poses little to no danger. Like on this beach I would feel perfectly save.
What worries me most is traveling on the plane, even as if everyone is wearing a mask it should be perfectly fine. Or in general confined spaces while people wear no face mask. Also keeping the kids to keep the masks on will be a challenge.

faceman

Harika wrote: »

As I see it being outside poses little to no danger. Like on this beach I would feel perfectly save.
What worries me most is traveling on the plane, even as if everyone is wearing a mask it should be perfectly fine. Or in general confined spaces while people wear no face mask. Also keeping the kids to keep the masks on will be a challenge.

Look at this way, if the Irish government consider it ok being in a confined space in a pub in Ireland with no masks or air filtration for a couple of hours, then being in a confined space in an airplane with a face mask, HEPA air filtration and higher hygiene standards is less risky

maestroamado

Dante7 wrote: »

I'm sitting by a pool with lots of German and Spanish. None of them worried about the tiny risk. But then again, they don't have incompetent governments trying to guilt shame them into not travelling.

I wonder where you are, i have friends booked for Spain next week.
They want to go and because they staying in family members house will be able to do whatever needed when there for week.
They are concerned that the neighbors may take a dim view if they travel and stay in the house.
I wonder if anyone has any advise...

theoldbreed

facehugger99 wrote: »

Very easy to see how the Catholic Church prospered here for so long.

There's a significant proportion of the population that are both conditioned to be obedient of authority and very happy to sit in moral judgement of others.

If I could like this 100 times I would! I actually didn't really realise how bad this shaming/judgement was until this. I found myself getting sucked it but enough!

54and56

acequion wrote: »

100% agree. Am always saying exactly that and telling it to my foreign friends who can hardly believe it and think I'm exaggerating. It is very evident in middle class, middle Ireland, the same cohort of people who were in thrall to the church. I see it all around me, in my family, in my job, in my neighborhood. Nobody will stand up to authority. It's very worrying that we are such a subservient, easily brainwashed people because all you need is the wrong people in charge and then???

Being subservient to an unelected religious leadership and following the advice / instructions of the politicians we the people have elected to provide us with leadership (which may be delivered via Govt departments etc) are absolutely NOT the same thing.

I completely rebel against unelected authority. Always have and always will.

I embrace democratically elected authority, it's what enables civil society.

If you think individual freedom works better than foregoing some of that freedom for the greater good have a look at how the US is doing not just in relation to Covid but in terms of societal breakdown.

Some here are understandably complaining and/or upset about losing a holiday they have booked and paid for, I'm in that category, but they are ultimately prepared to give up the holiday for the collective good as they trust the people we have elected to provide advice and guidance which is in the best interest of the country overall.

Others are going the personal freedom route, some making informed calculations of their own and travelling against the advice and some simply don't care what the advice is and are travelling, that's life.

In the US where personal freedom trumps everything they aren't debating something as weighty as whether or not they should go on foreign holidays (as a % not many of them do), they are completely polarised over the compulsory wearing of face masks where social distancing isn't practical.

The govt/governor/state/mayor tells me to wear a mask? This isn't communist China, the hell I'll wear a mask!! Much better to keep spreading the virus and risk my own and others lives than cede one inch of my personal freedom for the greater good!!

In my opinion there's a balance to be struck between personal freedom and collective responsibility. If a pandemic doesn't qualify for a bit more collective responsibility and a bit less personal freedom what does? A nuclear war?

bladespin

54and56 wrote: »

Being subservient to an unelected religious leadership and following the advice / instructions of the politicians we the people have elected to provide us with leadership (which may be delivered via Govt departments etc) are absolutely NOT the same thing.

I really don't think anyone is talking about government advice (or lack of action) here, more to do with all the Karens dropping in to try to guilt bomb anyone who thinks differently to them.

average_runner

Looks like much of Spain will make it compulsory to wear a mask in public. Can see the French following this soon also

faceman

An example of how serious C19 is taken here in Spain compared to Ireland. Was in the local Decathlon earlier. There was a lad (estimate in his 40’s) walking around with his face mask on wrong. It wasn’t covering his nose. Security guard asked him to put it on problem. He refused and in English told him he had a medical condition. Security wasn’t phased and formed up the rules then said something in Spanish that I couldn’t make out.

Suddenly the bloke’s medical condition magically went away and he put his mask on properly.

This is a reason why I feel much safer here than in Ireland.

copeyhagen

guy in the wifes job said to her on phone earleirt "i hope your staying home for your annual leave enxt week"

i went ****ing mental whern she told me, absolute gate keeper sheep. its people like him that are causing ehr not to want to go away next week "it feels wrong". .shes been shamed totally, its a joke.

bladespin

copeyhagen wrote: »

guy in the wifes job said to her on phone earleirt "i hope your staying home for your annual leave enxt week"

i went ****ing mental whern she told me, absolute gate keeper sheep. its people like him that are causing ehr not to want to go away next week "it feels wrong". .shes been shamed totally, its a joke.

I'd text him back suggesting he watch his but...

Yeah, have one like that here - though I'm luckily mainly road based and could work from home.

copeyhagen

she has been working from hoem since day1, and told that she can pretty much work from home indefinetly, but the company are still saying that she has to take 2 weeks annual leave if she has to quarentine.. i dont understand it.

im pretty sure she would have a strong union case there.

bladespin

copeyhagen wrote: »

she has been working from hoem since day1, and told that she can pretty much work from home indefinetly, but the company are still saying that she has to take 2 weeks annual leave if she has to quarentine.. i dont understand it.

im pretty sure she would have a strong union case there.

Has she formally informed them of plans to travel?

facehugger99

copeyhagen wrote: »

she has been working from hoem since day1, and told that she can pretty much work from home indefinetly, but the company are still saying that she has to take 2 weeks annual leave if she has to quarentine.. i dont understand it.

im pretty sure she would have a strong union case there.

Her company don't have any right to know her holiday plans.

spockety

copeyhagen wrote: »

she has been working from hoem since day1, and told that she can pretty much work from home indefinetly, but the company are still saying that she has to take 2 weeks annual leave if she has to quarentine.. i dont understand it.

im pretty sure she would have a strong union case there.

They want her to take annual leave for the 14 days even though she is working remote?

Makes no sense. Lawyer up.

stephenjmcd

Northern Ireland to relax quarantine for low and medium risk countries. Well there you go the approach in the Republic is now completely and utterly pointless when you can fly to Belfast

https://www.rte.ie/news/regional/2020/0709/1152303-northern-ireland-gym/

Tazz T

Five years of micky martin rubbing his hands on 6.01 and kicking the can down the road on every issue waiting for the fancy pension. I'm off to Greece on Wednesday before he gets there.

More chance of getting c-19 on the bus into town than a plane to Greece - head man at the Mater

And I'm going to an island that's had 22 cases most of which have recovered since March.

Seriously. Good luck in those crowded bars in Kerry with American/English tourists in two weeks time.

SusieBlue

If I a) get my job back/find another job and b) can take annual leave, I’ll be on the first flight out of here without a backwards glance.
Was looking up Rome, Krakow and Amsterdam earlier and there is excellent value to be had. It’ll be a much needed break after the last few miserable, stressful and depressing months.
I would like to visit Italy in particular as their tourism sector has been decimated and I’d like to show support, but at this stage I’ll go anywhere.
Also have a few weekend breaks planned around Ireland but can’t say I’m as excited at the prospect of them, mostly due to how expensive I know they’ll be.