Is an isolator needed for Electric Vehicle Chargepoint?

Felexicon

2011 wrote: »

So you agree that a suitably positioned commando socket can be used to charge an EV?

....and do you believe that every commando socket needs an isolator?

No

No

2011

Felexicon wrote: »

No

Incorrect, see link:

https://evonestop.co.uk/products/ev-charging-cable-type-2-to-32a-commando-7-2-kw-5-metre-mode-2

No

Correct these dumb sockets do not require an isolator, which is exactly my point.

Felexicon

2011 wrote: »

Incorrect, see link:

https://evonestop.co.uk/products/ev-charging-cable-type-2-to-32a-commando-7-2-kw-5-metre-mode-2



Correct these dumb sockets do not require an isolator, which is exactly my point.

But those dumb sockets are not EV Chargers.
The EV charger is a fixed appliance.
Plugging a cable in to a socket does not make it a fixed appliance so different rules apply.
You are comparing apples and oranges

2011

Felexicon wrote: »

But those dumb sockets are not EV Chargers.
The EV charger is a fixed appliance.

I agree.

I also agree fixed appliance should have a local isolator.

Plugging a cable in to a socket does not make it a fixed appliance so different rules apply.

Agree 100%.

If you read back you will see that I believe that dumb socket outlets do not require an isolator and fixed appliances do.

PosterX

If the car charger is supplied with a plug then logically you can't say it requires a socket with an isolator

Any socket may or may not have an isolator fitted

2011

PosterX wrote: »

If the car charger is supplied with a plug then logically you can't say it requires a socket with an isolator

I’m not really sure what you mean but i think we are both in agreement.

Any socket may or may not have an isolator fitted

Again I agree. This is consistent with what I have been saying all along i.e. a dumb socket does not require an isolator.

Gumbo

Alun wrote: »

True, and I have to admit I didn't know how it did that.

After some digging I found this thread on a Tesla forum ..

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/heres-how-to-charge-with-32a-commando-in-uk.163439/

It appears that some UMC's (Universal Mobile Cable - Tesla speak for their portable EVSE / granny cable) are even 32A capable with the right adapter, and looking at the photos of the connectors on the adapters (see post #27), it looks like there's probably some kind of signalling going on between the adapter and the UMC to indicate to it what the max charging current is. Also see post #46.

I’ve removed the EVSE from my home and fitted a blue commando socket in its place. The Tesla granny cable (UMC) is smart. It knows the difference between the 16a and 32a replaceable connections.

I only use the UMC to charge at 7kw at home.

2011

Gumbo wrote: »

The Tesla granny cable (UMC) is smart. It knows the difference between the 16a and 32a replaceable connections.

This is the point that I made back in post #66.

liveandnetural

t2 electrical safety committee voted at last months meeting to include wording into is10101 that the fitting of an isolator at all ev charge points be mandatory .If you are you are using a socket to feed a charger that's acceptable means of disconnection but a ev charger connected direct to the fuse board is not therefore it requires a local isolator within 2m of the ev charger

the chief inspector for sale electric has pushed this forward as a safety issue and the major trade associations and other technical experts supported and passed the vote. The point has been made that no other high current appliance can be connected directly to the fuse board without a form of isolation why should this one

the association of chief fire officers has requested clarity on the issue as well because when the show up to a ev fire (which they are quite a few) they are looking for a possible if accessible means of disconnection before tackling the fire

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4679416/Electric-car-left-charging-overnight-destroyed-fire.html

2011

That all seems correct to me.

liveandnetural wrote: »

The point has been made that no other high current appliance can be connected directly to the fuse board without a form of isolation why should this one

The key word there is “appliance” which is quite different to the standard 32A commando socket outlet described in Gumbo’s post above.

meercat

So safe electric recent newsletter states that it’s a requirement for an isolator
Focus on ev charging page 6/7

https://safeelectric.ie/contractors/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/03/MarchNewsletterSafeElecFinal-1.pdf

tweek84

as above