General British politics discussion thread

Sam Russell

The Tories refuse to implement a national ID card system.

It would make Gov administration much more efficient, identify non-citizens, identify those who are not permitted to be in the UK, smooth social security provision, give providers of services (like employers and landlords) definite proof of ID of those users of those services who currently are liable to prosecution if their services are provided to illegal immigrants.

Blair tried and failed to introduce one because it was made so complicated that its cost was astronomical. Presumable a deliberate attempt to make it so cumbersome, and so expensive, its implementation would be impossible.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119143036#Comment_119143036

Whats this supposed to mean?

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119142782#Comment_119142782

It won't be popular in any of the working class communities I lived in over there.

bob b

https://mobile.twitter.com/coldwarsteve/status/1532758369928454144

Quite a haunting image from the booing of BJ today.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119145390#Comment_119145390

So have I. The idea that working class people are obsessed with keeping out the brown people is just a way to pretend that they're all racist so that the racism is fine.

pixelburp

It's not especially on-charter, but I think we need to all enjoy experience Johnson getting booed by the crowd...

https://youtu.be/OKKA31V0kHI

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119156587#Comment_119156587

That was then. Now, the BBC are airing footage with the booing edited out and new blather from the announcers. There's prior art for them covering for the Government. Sky is apparently doing the same. I doubt it'll help though.

https://skwawkbox.org/2022/06/04/video-bbc-edits-out-boos-from-replay-of-johnsons-arrival-at-jubilee-event-not-the-first-time-theyve-covered-for-him/

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119158706#Comment_119158706

Jesus. Whoever made that decision clearly hasn't heard of social media, the idiot. Or indeed its power; and as is often the case in politics, the cover up will become more egregious than the incident itself. They've just guaranteed the booing has some more legs, while making Johnson look like a thin skinned clod.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119158727#Comment_119158727

Commonly known as the Streisand Effect.

Nody

Well we'll have an interesting evening tonight...

Boris Johnson will face a confidence vote in his leadership of the Conservative Party after enough MPs submitted letters calling for a contest.

It will take place between 6pm and 8pm this evening in the House of Commons and an announcement is expected about an hour after the vote closes.

He said he notified the PM on Sunday that the threshold had been reached and they agreed on timings for the vote together.

I think Boris will come out remaining PM but the question is how badly he'll be clipped based on the numbers voting against him and if he'll pivot around and call an election to "prove" that he still has a mandate purely from an ego perspective (and try to kick out some people who he feels did not support him).

rolling boh

Hopefully this is the beginning of the end for this barefaced liar his behaviour has been appalling and should be gone long ago .

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119163988#Comment_119163988

I Imagine he'll win this and limp onward. The degree of the vote against might narrow his future prospects and legitimacy but as before, the question becomes who on earth would be willing or wanting to take over the role?

Igotadose

A Rail Strike and a vote of no confidence in the PM. Just another day in UK politics. And it's Monday.

Nody

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119164035#Comment_119164035

I think there are plenty willing (Sunak, Truss, Gove etc.) but if they have the party behind them is a different matter let alone the public in general.

Itssoeasy

Well it’s nice that it’s happening on a bank holiday Monday. I mean even if he wins the vote he might not be long for 10 Downing Street if history is a guide.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119164178#Comment_119164178

I don't disagree, especially WRT Sunak, but presumably their appetite is tempered by the knowledge they still have to "get Brexit done" without totally sinking the UK economy and is a chalice that'll poison anyone with a even a half degree more decency than Johnson. Not to mention Northern Ireland and Scotland hanging around like bad smells.

Itssoeasy

And it should be remembered that this is a secret ballot so yes MPs can tweet all they like about how they are supporting Boris Johnson tonight but if they vote against him in secret then nobody would know.

Nody

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119164243#Comment_119164243

It's only a poised chalice only if you actually plan to resolve it; if you simply want to keep kicking the ball downfield (and being a member of the current government they would be) and be PM that's something they would drink. And all that is assuming they even realize it's an impossible puzzle to solve rather than a "Well I'll stomp my foot and it will be fixed because I'm smarter" attitude that prevails in general in the Tory party were reality is best left at the door as you enter. I think, as with Boris, that being PM is the only goal at any cost and any integrity or promises basically and they think "they'll deal with it once we get there". It's not going to be an question of having solutions but rather who's seen as winning the next election better than Boris (which is why I think Sunak would have an uphill battle while Truss would be seen favorable).

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119164321#Comment_119164321

But that's just it; Northern Ireland may yet force a PM to solve it (which is why the sudden chatter from some about re-joining the single market is so interesting), cos otherwise things could go sideways very quickly in NI and nobody wants to be the PM that broke the GFA. The problem just keeps getting larger. Meanwhile, north of the border in Edinburgh, they recently announced a £20 million war-chest for a 2023 referendum - with Yes still hovering around 50% despite the subject dropping off the map.

Depending on how the chips fall, there's a not entirely unrealistic scenario where the UK crumbles "overnight". Who wants to be that PM?

BlitzKrieg

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119164269#Comment_119164269

And Vice versa.

There are plenty of tory mps who probably support Boris Johnson but their constituents are up in arms (rightly) over his antics. So they are keeping them onside by feigning outrage and promising to re invent the tory party from the inside to ensure this sort of carry on doesnt happen again in the hope they hold their seats in future elections. Meanwhile they are slipping in a vote in support of Johnson and looking forward to his next boozy lunch.

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119165023#Comment_119165023

You are arguing that the duplicitous Tory MPs will be just as duplicitous in the secret voting to oust or not oust the bare faced liar of a PM that is damaging the public image of said Tories.

I see where you are coming from.

bazermc

Does the vote have to happen as soon as the magic number is reached with the 1922 crowd?

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119165207#Comment_119165207

If Johnson wants to wrong foot his opponents and before they gather any momentum and identify a possible leader, then yes - the sooner the better.

Nody

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119165207#Comment_119165207

From my understanding it has to be planned to be held shortly after it's reached in discussion with the leader on which day to hold it yes. It was reached on Sunday; the discussion was for today and the thought in press before it was known was that the number would be reached today with vote on Tuesday or Wednesday. So relatively quickly by the looks of things vs. when it was achieved.

Mr.Nice Guy

From an Irish perspective, there doesn't seem to be an optimum outcome. If Johnson stays, presumably he promises the ERG crowd that he will be even more hardline on the protocol issue. If Truss gets in, she'll promise the ERG the same. Is there a Tory that would be willing to dial down the rhetoric? I can't see it.

Tom Mann Centuria

Highly unlikely Johnson loses this vote, I expect they'll oust him before end of the year though.

I did love Dorries having a go at Hancock on Twitter saying he and his department were woefully underprepared for covid. Can't think what government he was part of, and who the PM was at the time........ Apart from absolute loyalty she offers nothing, she's a borderline moron but loyalty is all Johnson wants, talent is an irrelevance.

Edit: above paragraph is incorrect, she was having a go at Jeremy Hunt.

pixelburp

He won't lose, but a bit like in football and the "support of the boardroom" announcement damns with faint praise, a challenge to Johnson has people looking twice as hard now.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119165578#Comment_119165578

It's weird to see the Tory party tear itself apart like this. They were happy to wound the country economically but now they more resemble Labour with this sort of infighting. It's also noteworthy that the Tories scrapped a pandemic-preparedness office during the austerity years.

Dorries is there because she is loyal and benign. No other reason and certainly not talent.

Notmything

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119165578#Comment_119165578

Was that the same interview where she said the UK was at war with the Ukraine?

Tom Mann Centuria

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119165623#Comment_119165623

Actually I misread, half asleep from nights, to be fair to her she was having a go at Jeremy Hunt, so while he wasn't in a Johnson cabinet, it was still very much a Tory government.

So Nadine, in case you're reading an Irish board, apologies, but you're still not the sharpest tool in the box. Nor clearly am I for misquoting.