General British politics discussion thread

Peregrinus

If history is anything to go by, after the Tories are whipped to a puree at the next election the rump of the party will go through a period of recrimination, blame, backstabbing, etc before they settle down, accept that they brought this disaster on themselves, and work out to to rebuild themselves into a credible party of government. During this period they will cycle through several leaders fairly rapidy before the settle on a leader who isn't contaminated by too much involvement in the 2014-24 disaster or in the subsequent infighting, and who can take the party in a new (and almost certainly more centrist) direction, this being the only route back to power.

After they lost office in 1997, the Tories had a succession of leaders who were, in their turn, turfed and who never got to be PM — William Hague, Ian Duncan Smyth, Michael Howard. It was eight years before David Cameron became party leader.

It's highly likely that Sunak's successor will be someone from the right faction of the party, who believes — or professes to believe — that if only the party had been a little bit more cruel, a little bit more delusional, a little bit more filled with the spirit of Triumph of the Will, they would have implemented a triumphant Brexit and rode out the pandemic without woke lockdowns, and a grateful electorate would have returned them to power in 2024. That's a line that will appeal to Tory party members, which is why such a candidate will win the leadership election, but it will guarantee them a torrid time in the polls and before too long the parliamentary party will dump them. Rinse and repeat until the party is ready to face reality.

breezy1985

Another of those low level ministers gone but this one interestingly has been sacked.

Minister of state for Levelling Up Rachel MacLean has been sacked by Sunak.

He probably misheard someone and thought she was refusing to wear a poppy 🤣

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362536#Comment_121362536

True. I probably should have said coming back as PM.

ancapailldorcha

Apparently, this popped up in 2018:

https://twitter.com/BestForBritain/status/1724043304860336433

I honestly think I need a day or so to process this. It blows my mind that this country's government is so desperate that they have to resort to digging up a man mired in a lobbying scandal who's style of government was to choke the poor and gamble the constitution on referenda.

Edit: Image disappeared so pasting directly.

Itssoeasy

Well who saw David Cameron coming back to a UK cabinet post ? I didn’t and was confused when I saw it earlier. There must be no rule that says a cabinet minister has to be member of the commons or the lords then.

breezy1985

Coffey has resigned as Environment secretary. Didn't say much other than it being "the right time"

I did like the first sentence of her resignation " having been a minister since 2014 and having served all 5 Prime Ministers". I still get shocked everytime I see that they have had 5 PMs since Brexit.

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121360131#Comment_121360131

Added to that is the insistence that other nations should teach their children how awful their countries were in their pasts.

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362702#Comment_121362702

Cameron will be appointed to the Lords PDQ.

There is no legal rule that a minister must be a member of the Commons or the Lords, but it's a very strong convention that all Ministers should be in Parliament, and the PM, the Treasurer and most of the other Cabinet Ministers should be in the Commons.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362611#Comment_121362611

Reading the Daily Mail comments, lots of attacks on Cameron - definitely not a popular decision to bring him back with the 'base'.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362327#Comment_121362327

Vote Lettuce 2024!

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121361349#Comment_121361349

I knew plenty of people, some of whom were in the army during the war, who didn't wear the poppy long before gobshites started to co opt it as a nationalist symbol.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362740#Comment_121362740

The Lib Dems are claiming that it's an attempt to shore up the southern "blue wall" constituencies because they are worried about a Lib Dem surge.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362750#Comment_121362750

It's hard to believe he would be remotely popular with anyone these days. Neither former Remainers or Leavers would trust him....it's an odd appointment to say the least.

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362511#Comment_121362511

Most certainly.

A man who fucked up the entire country on a coin toss and then fled his position leaving someone else to weather the storm.

He's an absolute snake.

Nody

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362826#Comment_121362826

Sounds like prime Tory leadership material to me...

breezy1985

Another MP needing to step down because "local constituency work" is suddenly so important.

Jeremy Quin was the paymaster general, a minister in the Cabinet Office (couldn't tell you if it's an important role or not)

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362826#Comment_121362826

In fairness, his position was untenable. The referendum was his flagship policy so there's no way he could have stayed to negotiate Brexit. It'd have been mayhem.

Then again, in equal fairness, gambling the UK on a binary referendum was extraordinarily stupid. To do it twice is utterly contemptuous.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362864#Comment_121362864

It would be amazing to see the alternate universe where he had to step down after losing Scotland.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362611#Comment_121362611

And despite all that? Is he all that worse than the current lot? That's the crazy thing; normal parties put people like Cameron in the rear view. Here in bizarroworld he comes across positively adult compared with the charlatans and cicious vunts already witnessed.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362906#Comment_121362906

I'm inclined to think that he is comparable. Probably not worse. In such a classist country like this, a posh accent and a decent suit go far. Look at Jacob Rees-Mogg. He's Stephen Yaxley-Lennon in a suit with a posh accent and he's floated right to the top.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362864#Comment_121362864

The way he ran away was a disgrace though. His successor Theresa May couldn't get her Brexit deal through Parliament, meaning the subsequent Brexit shambles was 100% on the charlatan - he held a referendum when his country was in no position to implement a vote to Leave.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362988#Comment_121362988

What else was he going to do? He openly campaigned for remain. May couldn't be trusted to do so so the campaign sidelined her. That made her somewhat acceptable to the Brexiter rank and file within the parliamentary party.

Brussels Sprout

For the day that's in it:

https://twitter.com/G__Division/status/1724001250990055451

hotmail.com

Peter Mandleson was made a lord and returned to the Labour cabinet in 2009 in a very similar move. Similarly here members of the Seanad can be appointed to the cabinet, despite not being elected by the people.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121363003#Comment_121363003

I don't recall him ever saying he would resign on the morning after the referendum if the result went against him? He should have been pressed far more on this specific point by the media.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121363165#Comment_121363165

I never said he did. I honestly can't remember either way. I think he genuinely couldn't accept that in a 50:50 referendum, the wrong result might be delivered.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121363165#Comment_121363165

If he hadn't have resigned all he would have heard is "How can you stay on as Prime Minister having lost this seismic referendum that you needlessly called?" His authority was shot to pieces.

Resigning immediately was the absolute correct thing to do.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121363165#Comment_121363165

At the time it seemed to be pretty much expected of him to resign after losing such a monumental referendum.

He couldn't have stayed on to lead a Brexit he voted against. Don't forget at the time Brexit was going to "be easy" so the idea that he needed to clean up the mess he made went against all that Brexiters believed about the future.

political analyst

The Brexiteer Patrick O'Flynn said on X (formerly Twitter) he thinks many Tory MPs will attempt a coup against Sunak after Christmas and have a new PM installed and then have an early general election.

Do those Tory MPs not care about their party's chances in the next election?

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121363329#Comment_121363329

What can they do though? Like, who is there in the party who's skilled enough to govern so well as to reverse Labour's lead in the polls? They've governed for almost a decade and a half, including one year with three PMs. This is a trend that takes years to reverse.