General British politics discussion thread

Peregrinus

Peregrinus wrote: »

So, yeah, Johnson had "mild" symptoms of CV in the sense that an awful lot of people who are very sick indeed have "mild" symptoms of CV.

Many people had a "mild" version of this disease back in January (including my wife) but the doctor just said it was a bug that caused mild pneumonia!

So I am very much of the opinion that this is the second wave of the illness we're seeing now.

Tom Mann Centuria

Kendall, Streeting and Phillips all end up in the shadow cabinet.

Lemming

CrabRevolution wrote: »

That may be when a Doctor uses it, but the Downing Street spokespeople seemed to me to be using it to mean "the virus isn't affecting him much". They constantly downplayed his symptoms and said he'd be back in work any day now.

There was a young woman - mid thirties on BBC4 radio the other evening talking about what her experience of the hospital system was regards contracting the virus. Short synopsis, even after being released from ICU and back to a general ward the virus will have kicked the living sh1t out of you if your case was severe enough to warrant a trip to ICU at all right now with only the most severe cases being admitted. If Johnson was severe enough to warrant a spell in ICU, he wont be coming out of the ward for at least a few days still and it'll be a couple of weeks before he's fit enough to return to normal (such as it is).

That is if of course assuming that everything that we are being fed is correct. The current crop in government circles have set a depressingly low threshold for dishonesty.

Capt'n Midnight

Lemming wrote: »

The current crop in government circles have set a depressingly low threshold for dishonesty.

Home Secretary Priti Patel has repeatedly refused to appear in front of the Home Affairs select committee to discuss the coronavirus outbreak.

Ms Patel instead said she would only appear “towards the end of the month”.

This at a time when police have been given temporary powers to enforce the lockdown that's preventing thousands of deaths.

Headshot

A really smart move imo

https://news.sky.com/story/starmer-appoints-jess-phillips-to-shadow-cabinet-as-he-reveals-full-line-up-11971346


"Jess Phillips, the outspoken Labour backbencher who briefly stood for the party leadership, has been handed a key front bench post by Sir Keir Starmer.

She has been appointed shadow minister for domestic violence and safeguarding,"

A smart position to have her in

AllForIt

Headshot wrote: »

A really smart move imo

https://news.sky.com/story/starmer-appoints-jess-phillips-to-shadow-cabinet-as-he-reveals-full-line-up-11971346


"Jess Phillips, the outspoken Labour backbencher who briefly stood for the party leadership, has been handed a key front bench post by Sir Keir Starmer.

She has been appointed shadow minister for domestic violence and safeguarding,"

A smart position to have her in

Not really a front roll is it. It's keeping her in and keeping her out at the same time. That is a smart move. Purgatory!

CrabRevolution

AllForIt wrote: »

Not really a front roll is it. It's keeping her in and keeping her out at the same time. That is a smart move. Purgatory!

Not to downplay domestic violence but it must be the least priority role possible unless it also involves child protection/vulnerable care etc.

Leroy42

CrabRevolution wrote: »

Not to downplay domestic violence but it must be the least priority role possible unless it also involves child protection/vulnerable care etc.

It certainly has been treated as such in the past. Hopefully they are actually putting her there to make a difference rather than simply pawn her off.

fiveleavesleft

Interesting bit of stir in the Labour party over the weekend. Perhaps Starmer's first headache.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-antisemitism-investigation-will-not-be-sent-to-equality-commission-11972071

BonnieSituation

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Interesting bit of stir in the Labour party over the weekend. Perhaps Starmer's first headache.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-antisemitism-investigation-will-not-be-sent-to-equality-commission-11972071

First item on the agenda: The Split

beggars_bush

Johnson gets out of hospital, goes straight to his second residence

After visiting his first residence

One rule for the masses, another for the elite

kowloon

It's going to be pretty difficult to sell off any part of the NHS now without this coming back to bite him.

Joe_ Public

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Interesting bit of stir in the Labour party over the weekend. Perhaps Starmer's first headache.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-antisemitism-investigation-will-not-be-sent-to-equality-commission-11972071

Only one little piece i could offer Keir Starmer: stick to 2019 manifesto like glue. It wasnt what lost election. People liked it, they genuinely want most of those things. Just present it in a better way.

Otherwise, good luck steering a path through that murk.

ArmaniJeanss

beggars_bush wrote: »

Johnson gets out of hospital, goes straight to his second residence

After visiting his first residence

One rule for the masses, another for the elite

They voted him PM (I'd much prefer they hadn't). But given that they did, it doesn't seem unreasonable that he'd go to PM Residence One to pick up whatever he needs and then go to PM Residence Two to recuperate where he gets some privacy and space.
It surely falls comfortably within the 'travelling for essential work' rules anyway.

Tom Mann Centuria

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Interesting bit of stir in the Labour party over the weekend. Perhaps Starmer's first headache.
https://news.sky.com/story/labour-antisemitism-investigation-will-not-be-sent-to-equality-commission-11972071

And Starmer wants one of the people highlighted in the report, who actively campaigning against Corbyn and a Labour victory during the previous election to be the new General Secretary.

Plenty of MPs have made their opinions known, including Andy Burnham who is far from being a left wing MP.

fiveleavesleft

Tom Mann Centuria wrote: »

And Starmer wants one of the people highlighted in the report, who actively campaigning against Corbyn and a Labour victory during the previous election to be the new General Secretary.

Plenty of MPs have made their opinions known, including Andy Burnham who is far from being a left wing MP.

Yes & she comes across as a pretty vile woman. Starmer surely can't let her have the gig now. Have you read any of it? What a mad bunch.

One funny bit amongst the bile, they were relishing Corbyn getting smashed in 2017 to be replaced by Tom Watson, they called it "Operation Cupcake":D

Tom Mann Centuria

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Yes & she comes across as a pretty vile woman. Starmer surely can't let her have the gig now. Have you read any of it? What a mad bunch.

One funny bit amongst the bile, they were relishing Corbyn getting smashed in 2017 to be replaced by Tom Watson, they called it "Operation Cupcake":D

Well it'd be hard to imagine her getting the gig, especially when her husband Jon Ashworth shot down Dawn Butler's assertion than McNicol et al. had been hampering the AS inquiry. Turned out Butler was right.

BonnieSituation

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

So not only is the UK death rate per million is 2.5-3X of Ireland (Despite having NHS and Ireland not)

They are not counting people dying in old people homes
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52275823

Which here in Ireland has been about half of all the dead so far

UK Politics (specifically Tory policies) are directly responsible for a death rate 4-5X larger than Ireland

Am I glad I and my family and older relatives do not live in such a sh**hole country with these "politicians"

I can hear the shrill cries of "Britbasher!" from here.

Capt'n Midnight

Bigging up small stuff to make it look like a win.
55,000 gowns won't go far when there's twice that number of doctors and six times that number of nurses in the NHS, not to mention porters and cleaners, the other emergency services, carers and volunteers.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/uk/nhs-issues-new-ppe-guidance-due-to-shortage-of-surgical-gowns-1.4231836

Mr Hancock told the House of Commons health committee on Friday that surgical gowns were the “pressure point” in Britain’s shortage of PPE. “We have another 55,000 gowns arriving today, and we’re working on the acquisition internationally of more gowns, but it is a challenge.”

In other supply chain news
There is a ferry carrying food and medicine that's being delayed

The vessel carries food, medicine and other supplies between Liverpool and Dublin.

BBC News NI understands some of the freight is destined for Northern Ireland.

beggars_bush

P&O need to pay their bills

Tom Mann Centuria

Sunday Times have turned on Boris Johnson, that's a nice surprise that they've finally realised what a total disaster his management has been.

It's behind a paywall but headline gives a flavour

Coronavirus: 38 days when Britain sleepwalked into disaster
Boris Johnson skipped five Cobra meetings on the virus, calls to order protective gear were ignored and scientists’ warnings fell on deaf ears. Failings in February may have cost thousands of lives

Whether they press this home now is another thing, or just step back into line, the more likely option.

Edit: here's a link to the full article, no paywall

https://archive.is/20200418182037/https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/coronavirus-38-days-when-britain-sleepwalked-into-disaster-hq3b9tlgh

Roanmore

The narrative form some journalists / commentators on Twitter is that Murdoch wants Johnson out and replaced with Gove.
#WheresBoris was even trending on Twitter.

The problem is if they want Gove will he be any better, looking at this I'd say worse.

https://twitter.com/HastingsRyeLab/status/1251801878826037248

and this

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2020/apr/19/michael-gove-says-boris-johnson-didnt-miss-cobra-meetings-then-backtracks-in-same-day-video

Capt'n Midnight

PPE from Turkey delayed over "clearance and paperwork"

Turkey and the UK are both inside the EU customs union for goods so it's a very lame excuse.

And a bad predictor for future Brexit "clearance and paperwork"

ancapailldorcha

Please do not dump tweets here. A post has been deleted.

badabing106

I find it perculiar that Boris Johnson approval rating since the coronavirus keeps sky rocketing upwards

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/trackers/boris-johnson-approval-rating

He had positive approval rating of 40 % in November 2019, he currently has an approval rating of 66%. That's a massive upswing.

In November 2019, 30% thought he was doing a very bad job. Today that figure is only 7%

In March 2020, nearly 13% thought he was doing very good job. Today that figure is 30% Is that a sympathy vote because he was very ill?

Joe_ Public

Definitely partly a sympathy vote. And no matter how badly he performs, or how destructive his decisions, lots and lots of British voters will always forgive johnson simply because he makes them laugh. When he gets back and makes the first lifting of lockdown restrictions promise, watch his rating go up again.

Seth Brundle

I'm curious to know if IDS's comments are Tory policy...
Unmarried Men Are 'A Problem' For Society, Says Tory MP Iain Duncan Smith
'These boys' will go looking for 'the alternative on the internet' if they don't tie the knot, says IDS.

men out of wedlock were “released to do all the things they wouldn’t normally do” such as committing crimes, drinking too much, taking drugs and fathering multiple children
...
Duncan Smith said: “If something really matters to you in life, you commit to it. People join golf clubs and they sign up for the most absurd things that you have to do, wearing trousers, shoes, all sorts of things.

PommieBast

Seth Brundle wrote: »

I'm curious to know if IDS's comments are Tory policy...
Unmarried Men Are 'A Problem' For Society, Says Tory MP Iain Duncan Smith
'These boys' will go looking for 'the alternative on the internet' if they don't tie the knot, says IDS.

Probably not part policy but no doubt a popular idea among party members..

BonnieSituation

Seth Brundle wrote: »

I'm curious to know if IDS's comments are Tory policy...
Unmarried Men Are 'A Problem' For Society, Says Tory MP Iain Duncan Smith
'These boys' will go looking for 'the alternative on the internet' if they don't tie the knot, says IDS.

Fathering multiple children?

How dare they. And how dare they think they can become prime minister.

Gerry T

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Fathering multiple children?

How dare they. And how dare they think they can become prime minister.

Was he talking about Johnson, he seems to have a trail of children from multiple relationships, including his son today there were 4 from a previous wife and they say 2 from 2 different affairs. Probably some others also.

Lemming

badabing106 wrote: »

I find it perculiar that Boris Johnson approval rating since the coronavirus keeps sky rocketing upwards

It's the classic 'Rally around the flag'/patriotism mindset that people fall into in times of serious crisis; "We're all in this together", "Everyone has to do their part", "Support the government", etc. and rinse repeat with any one of a number of different slogans.

The government have been milking the sympathy vote as well, and now the baby card shall be trotted out as a distraction.

Professor Moriarty

Gerry T wrote: »

Was he talking about Johnson, he seems to have a trail of children from multiple relationships, including his son today there were 4 from a previous wife and they say 2 from 2 different affairs. Probably some others also.

His profile on his Wikipedia page says "Children: 5 or 6".

Gerry T

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

His profile on his Wikipedia page says "Children: 5 or 6".

I may be wrong, but was that updated with his recent child today.
In a court case the Judge did make reference to 2 affairs, that's going back yrs. I'll dig something up on it.

Professor Moriarty

Gerry T wrote: »

I may be wrong, but was that updated with his recent child today.
In a court case the Judge did make reference to 2 affairs, that's going back yrs. I'll dig something up on it.

It's been updated! it says "Children: At least 6"

Gerry T

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

It's been updated! it says "Children: At least 6"

Didn't take long,
I'm sure IDS was talking about him now. Not that Johnson has a great track record with comments about women or single mothers himself.

Lemming

Lemming wrote: »

It's the classic 'Rally around the flag'/patriotism mindset that people fall into in times of serious crisis; "We're all in this together", "Everyone has to do their part", "Support the government", etc. and rinse repeat with any one of a number of different slogans.

Ah yeah, they do love their wartime rhetoric in times like these over there

Roanmore

Today is the day the UK Govt have promised 100k C19 tests.
They haven't a hope of doing it but it will be interesting what way they spin it.
Matt Hancock has form here, remember the pledge about extra nurses which included the nurses that were already employed and they weren't going to lose?
Also, the 100m pieces of PPE included single gloves, 500k gloves instead of 250k pairs, fine if all the NHS staff were all one handed.

Batrachotox

Batrachotox wrote: »

Ah yeah, they do love their wartime rhetoric in times like these over there

Nothing to do with "wartime" rhetoric, it's simply a clear sign that nationalism is strong there, despite decades of anti-nationalism rhetoric from politicians, academics and others who wanted to promote multi-nationalism etc.

Peregrinus

Deleted User wrote: »

Nothing to do with "wartime" rhetoric, it's simply a clear sign that nationalism is strong there, despite decades of anti-nationalism rhetoric from politicians, academics and others who wanted to promote multi-nationalism etc.

Slogans like "we're all in this together" and "everybody has to do their part" have nothing to do with nationalism. Indeed, in the context of a global pandemic, they are pretty much the polar opposite of petty nationalism.

Peregrinus

Peregrinus wrote: »

Slogans like "we're all in this together" and "everybody has to do their part" have nothing to do with nationalism. Indeed, in the context of a global pandemic, they are pretty much the polar opposite of petty nationalism.

They have everything to do with nationalism, end of!

Peregrinus

In a global pandemic - there's a clue in the word "global" - these slogans are a protest against nationalism. Everybody doing their bit against CV-19 is going to be pretty useless if by "everybody" we actually mean "English people". By "everybody" we actually mean . . . well, everybody.

Joe_ Public

Roanmore wrote: »

Today is the day the UK Govt have promised 100k C19 tests.
They haven't a hope of doing it but it will be interesting what way they spin it.
Matt Hancock has form here, remember the pledge about extra nurses which included the nurses that were already employed and they weren't going to lose?
Also, the 100m pieces of PPE included single gloves, 500k gloves instead of 250k pairs, fine if all the NHS staff were all one handed.

"I am pleased to announce today that we have achieved our testing capacity target of 100,000".

"We want to test as many as possible but it has been an issue getting demand to meet our capacity. If enough people dont come forward there's nothing we can do."

"Ok, so we fell short of our target to do 100,000 tests a day but I'm not going to stand here and apologise for being ambitious, for wanting what's best for British people and what they deserve. I'd rather set an ambitious target and fail than set a low target - like people in the media and on opposition benches would do - and succeed and praise myself for doing so etc..."

Joe_ Public

For me anyway, the slogans dont signify anything at all, merely the empty and vacuous rhetoric that comes from the government. Everybody is most certainly not all in it together as the disproportionate toll on poorer and immigrant communities shows. It's a meaningless platitude, devoid of truth or any semblance of reassurance.

Roanmore

Joe_ Public wrote: »

"I am pleased to announce today that we have achieved our testing capacity target of 100,000".

"We want to test as many as possible but it has been an issue getting demand to meet our capacity. If enough people dont come forward there's nothing we can do."

"Ok, so we fell short of our target to do 100,000 tests a day but I'm not going to stand here and apologise for being ambitious, for wanting what's best for British people and what they deserve. I'd rather set an ambitious target and fail than set a low target - like people in the media and on opposition benches would do - and succeed and praise myself for doing so etc..."

Sounds about right.

PommieBast

Peregrinus wrote: »

Slogans like "we're all in this together" and "everybody has to do their part" have nothing to do with nationalism.

They are when they are rolled out on a regular basis.

Joe_ Public

Roanmore wrote: »

Sounds about right.

We'll see. Will be doing a bit of bingo later and fully expecting to land the full house.

Roanmore

So they exceeded the target of 100k, they got 122k. Some achievement.

What? Only 73k tests were actually done? The rest? The rest were posted out.

Yes sir, I paid my bill in full, I paid 70% of it and the rest is in the post 🙄

Ireland gets special treatment again.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-52594023
UK airlines say they have been told the government will bring in a 14-day quarantine for anyone arriving in the UK from any country apart from the Republic of Ireland in response to the coronavirus pandemic.

The new restriction is expected to take effect at the end of this month.

Industry body Airlines UK said the policy needed "a credible exit plan" and should be reviewed weekly.

People arriving in the UK would have to self-isolate at a private residence.

Infini

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Ireland gets special treatment again.

To be fair the reason for it is primarily the Border and the unionists for that as well as the CTA. On top of that the chance of someone coming from here with the infection is drastically lower than someone from the continent.

Capt'n Midnight

Infini wrote: »

To be fair the reason for it is primarily the Border and the unionists for that as well as the CTA. On top of that the chance of someone coming from here with the infection is drastically lower than someone from the continent.

Except they could come here and then cross over to the UK.

More joined up thinking from the UK.


Don't get started on their tracing app central storage vs everyone trusting Apple and Google* or on how they are still diverging from the EU on data rights.


*You handed Apple and Google all your data when you set your phone and neither will hand over any more data than they need to for selfish reasons.