Why is there a lack of media coverage of the Redress:Breaking the Silence Documentary

Acosta

freddiek wrote: »

I guess because they can't blame Sinn Fein for it..

It's a sick joke that in recent years with a straight face FG, FF and Labour of all people, aided by sections of the media used child abuse allegations as a stick to beat Sinn Fein with. And I'm no fan of Sinn Fein or their past.

stockshares

walshb wrote: »

It was 2009 that programme with Michael O’Brien.

Ok, thanks for correcting

anplaya27

The abuses didnt only happen in the institutional schools, laundries and mother and baby homes.

Let's not forget the special educational residential schools, such as the boys and girls school for the Deaf in Cabra which are named in both the Ryan and Murphy reports. And even at that, it is acknowledged that they didnt even address 90 pc of what occurred regarding oppression and abuse.

Deaf Irish Sign Language users are amongst the forgotten victims of state and church policies. Yet no one speaks of it.Wheres the Deaf communities apology ?

stockshares

anplaya27 wrote: »

The abuses didnt only happen in the institutional schools, laundries and mother and baby homes. Let's not forget the special educational residential schools, such as the boys and girls school for the Deaf in Cabra which are named in both the Ryan and Murphy reports. And even at that, it is acknowledged that they didnt even address 90 pc of what even went on. Irish Sign Language users are amongst the forgotten victims of state and church abuses. Wheres the Deaf communities apology ?

Thanks for making people aware.

I didn't know that these schools were affected as also. They were never mentioned on any programs or newspapers that Ive seen on church and state abuse.

It might be good to mention this on Twitter. I've never seen these schools get a mention on there either.

It's baffling how the political class protect these brutes. It can only be a cover up that protects powerful people.

anplaya27

stockshares wrote: »

Thanks for making people aware.

I didn't know that these schools were affected as also. They were never mentioned on any programs or newspapers that Ive seen on church and state abuse.

It might be good to mention this on Twitter. I've never seen these schools get a mention on there either.

It's baffling how the political class protect these brutes. It can only be a cover up that protects powerful people.

Most people don't. Those schools were all run by religious orders. Abuses were perpetrated by lay people there too.

Policies were introduced such as segregation and oralism ( linguistic suppression, Irish Sign Language was banned from use) on top of the different types of abuses that happened. How easy for it to happen if victims cant speak out. Watch a RTE documentary called If Those Walls Could Talk. It came out a few years ago. It's about some of the victims of abuse in the boys Deaf school in Cabra. One was abused for seven years. Seven years.. .ffs.

Ironically, after being banned for decades, Irish Sign Language is now recognised in legislation as the second native official language of Ireland. If that happened to the Deaf, who know what went on in other special educational places ?

walshb

There are/were evil and despicable people all over the country...

It wasn't that long ago that teachers were beating the daylights out of young children with whatever they had in their hands or on their feet.

I remember aged 5 or so, a fooking tiddler of a child, having a teacher ask me to put my hand out so she could wallop it with a wooden ruler....utterly depraved people...no other way to describe it. Imagine the thought process of an adult to think that the only way they can discipline a small child is by violently hurting them......it's sick. The actual thoughts of me even thinking of doing this to a child makes me ill.

1982 or so wasn't corporal punishment banned in schools? I didn't receive many wallops at all. Very few, actually. But I do remember that couple times by the same teacher. A female, too!!! Probably a mother at the time as well....god help us!

anplaya27

walshb wrote: »

There are/were evil and despicable people all over the country...

It wasn't that long ago that teachers were beating the daylights out of young children with whatever they had in their hands or on their feet.

I remember aged 5 or so, a fooking tiddler of a child, having a teacher ask me to put my hand out so she could wallop it with a wooden ruler....utterly depraved people...no other way to describe it. Imagine the thought process of an adult to think that the only way they can discipline a small child is by violently hurting them......it's sick. The actual thoughts of me even thinking of doing this to a child makes me ill.

1982 or so wasn't corporal punishment banned in schools? I didn't receive many wallops at all. Very few, actually. But I do remember that couple times by the same teacher. A female, too!!! Probably a mother at the time as well....god help us!

Was acknowledged in the Ryan report that corporal punishment was still happening in the boys school in Cabra 15 years after it was supposed to be 'banned'.

walshb

anplaya27 wrote: »

Was acknowledged in the Ryan report that corporal punishment was still happening in the boys school in Cabra 15 years later.

15 years post 1982?

Sorry....you were clear in your post there......

Clarence Boddiker

PressRun wrote: »

There are victims who are still alive who were affected by this abuse and who have never received proper justice. There are politicians who are still active in Irish politics who were involved in the cover up and actively prevented victims from receiving justice. One of them even wants to be Taoiseach. There are documents that certain people want sealed for 75 years.

This is the biggest scandal in the history of the state. Our version of concentration camps. Horrific violence against women and children on a mass scale that was aided and abetted by the state. And the victims suffer to this day because of a lack of accountability. There are still victims who aren't even accounted for. Children who disappeared without a trace. Children who died from "illness" and were buried in unmarked graves. People who have had to live with this trauma and have never seen justice.

This country hasn't even truly reckoned with the extent to which we have abused and discarded vulnerable people. The way we have consistently treated children appallingly over decades. We still have a shockingly dysfunctional social services system. TUSLA is a disgrace and more scandals will emerge from there in time.

That anyone would view this as something we should brush aside and forget about when we haven't even properly dealt with this and the legacy of it is still being felt is ridiculous.

Most of this atrocity has been written out of history. The blame has been conveniently laid at the door of the Catholic Church. I'm no supporter of the Church but they were in league with the State, Civil servants, Guards, Teachers, Social workers, Doctors etc...all of these groups were deeply involved in what occurred. The civil servant and political class especially. They've all gotten away with it.

stockshares

Clarence Boddiker wrote: »

Most of this atrocity has been written out of history. The blame has been conveniently laid at the door of the Catholic Church. I'm no supporter of the Church but they were in league with the State, Civil servants, Guards, Teachers, Social workers, Doctors etc...all of these groups were deeply involved in what occurred. The civil servant and political class especially. They've all gotten away with it.

Correct,

Special Branch actually helped facilitate the sale of children from St Patrick's Guild institution to the USA.

The Civil Servants all come from the same stock. Ultra Right wing Catholics who see themselves as superior. Most Ministers are incompetents who take their advice/orders from the Civil Servants.

stockshares

On the last 20-30mins of Today's Liveline was the worst case of abuse Ive heard. Truely horriffic.

Ray refused the Redress Board and took his abuser David Murray to court and won.

https://twitter.com/rteliveline/status/1235214796364156929?s=09

Snow Garden

I am surprised that the issue of removing the Roman church's influence from our schools isn't a major discussion point at election time.
Irish people seem to be very prone to Stockholm syndrome.

Snow Garden

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/ispcc-action-led-to-rays-cruel-nightmare-25992936.html

The bitter irony is not lost on the 45-year-old, who suffered years of unimaginable cruelty and sexual abuse at the hands of notorious housemaster David Murray.

Instead, he suffered gross sexual and physical abuse by Murray, who was later described by a trial judge as "an obsessive, compulsive, fixated paedophile with a deep-rooted, twisted sexuality".

Ray was one of 10 orphanage victims abused by Murray, who was jailed for 10 years in December 1997 for buggery, gross indecency and indecent assault of boys at St Joseph's in the 1970s and of his own two foster sons in the 1980s.

stockshares

Snow Garden wrote: »

I am surprised that the issue of removing the Roman church's influence from our schools isn't a major discussion point at election time.
Irish people seem to be very prone to Stockholm syndrome.

People still go to Mass knowing what the Priests did and that the Church covered it up. Imagine what it was like here in the 1900s.

People completely controlled by Church and State.

Hotblack Desiato

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Its not. Several people of importance in Ireland have made money off the church. The govt inc.

Ass-backwards. The church made a lot of money off the government, i.e. taxpayers - and still do.

The other night there was a man on the programme who was fostered out to a good family as a baby. At age ten he was brought before a court and sentenced to industrial school, he was accused of no crime but this way the church-run institution got paid by the state to look after him instead of his foster family (and paid more than they were.) Yet there is little evidence that the church spent much of this money on the kids, he described maggots coming out of the meagre food, and climbing over the wall in the hope of finding discarded crusts.

Tuam mother and baby home was the same, among many other places. The nuns were being paid by the local authority to look after these babies, yet the infant mortality rate was twice that of the worst slums in the country (unless, of course, many of the "deaths" were a cover-up for illegal baby-selling - but like child neglect that was a serious crime, too.)

A lot of health and social services are still provided by religious organisations at taxpayer expense, with no real oversight or control of where the money is going and whether the services are being abused to promote or force religion onto vulnerable people.

And the church wields a lot of power.

Most people are still too thick/ignorant/brainwashed to question why we still allow this corrupt abusive institution to run most schools in this country - despite the fact that the church pays nothing towards the running of "their" schools and didn't pay to build most of them, either, but does own them - a free gift from the taxpayer.

The fact that Ahern did this is simply par of the course and shows the dark character of the man.

An indelible stain on Martin as well, when Woods' paedophile bailout was brought to the cabinet he was a member of, he like the rest of them did not object. There was no Dail debate or vote, as this was done when the Dail was dissolved. Collective cabinet responsibility means collective guilt.

padd b1975

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Very very powerful stuff , extremely moving . Those people’s lives deeply affected if not destroyed , you could see it in every single face . Shameful

Slap bang in "Bart's People" territory from the off I thought.

Snow Garden

padd b1975 wrote: »

Slap bang in "Bart's People" territory from the off I thought.

I could put that comment down to a lack of empathy but I think I'll just file you away as an ignoramus.

jos28

I watched both episodes and like other posters I found them harrowing to watch. Michael O'Brien's powerful speech was as difficult to watch now as it was all those years ago. It's 20+ years since Mary Raftery's 'States of Fear' and those victims are no nearer to getting justice or retribution.
For many survivors the Redress Board was their chance to face their abusers, it wasn't about the money. It should have been the opportunity to face those ba***ards. Not a hint of remorse from the perpetrators or those who covered up for them.
Those innocent children are now mainly in the latter stages of life and are still being treated appallingly. The politicians who colluded with the religious orders and failed to support those who needed it should be forced to answer for their actions. I think the reason that some people may seem indifferent is more that they are overwhelmed. The scale of abuse in this stage is mind-blowing and most of us have no idea how to help the survivors.

They deserve every single support they have requested, whatever is needed should be given willingly and unconditionally. Nothing can erase their horrendous pasts but the survivors deserve respect. As an ordinary citizen I have no idea how to help but I would gladly do so. If anyone knows of anyway to lend support or help their voices to be heard please let me know.

stockshares

padd b1975 wrote: »

Slap bang in "Bart's People" territory from the off I thought.

Can you explain. I've no idea what you mean?

Acosta

Snow Garden wrote: »

I am surprised that the issue of removing the Roman church's influence from our schools isn't a major discussion point at election time.
Irish people seem to be very prone to Stockholm syndrome.

It's nuts. I hear many primary schools insist on background checks for parents if they're partaking in classroom activities while being run by an organisation that raped and beat kids for decades and haven't been brought to justice. Yet the vast majority of people still indoctrinate their children into the church knowing full well what they did to people and that they got away with it.

stockshares

On Caranua
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/mistreatment-of-survivors-of-institutional-abuse-a-greater-national-shame-1.3539372?mode=amp

Article in IT: What is in the Irish Character that compels us to secrecy?
https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/tv-radio-web/what-is-it-in-the-irish-character-that-compels-us-to-secrecy-1.4192547?mode=amp

Sean O Fearghail writes character ref for Peadophile.
https://www.leinsterleader.ie/news/home/521341/ceann-comhairle-sean-o-fearghail-called-to-resign-by-kildare-childhood-sex-abuse-survivor.html#.XlqmOnoyAdY.twitter

Please sign a petition for his resignation
https://www.change.org/p/ceann-comhairle-se%C3%A1n-%C3%B3-feargha%C3%ADl-speaker-of-leinster-house-ceann-comhairle-se%C3%A1n-%C3%B3-feargha%C3%ADl-s-resignation

jam83

The programme was heartbreaking the other nights but reading this thread there's something about the abuse of children in a deaf school that really affects me.
I didn't see every minute of the Redress programme but the Michael o Brien speech was inspiring and very moving. Noel Dempsey's reply to a question before it, the trigger for Michaels speech, showed how he didn't give a ****. And that's how the government felt about it. Dempsey has a serious pension now.
It'd horrible how so many of our politicians are mostly in it for the career, not to make a real difference in people's lives

FrancieBrady

2 major documentaries this week that feature Michael Martin's work and he breezes through an interview on SoR without a single question about it. He is allowed to waffle about another party's past though for as long as he wants.

RTE Bias? Go figure.

Acosta

FrancieBrady wrote: »

2 major documentaries this week that feature Michael Martin's work and he breezes through an interview on SoR without a single question about it. He is allowed to waffle about another party's past though for as long as he wants.

RTE Bias? Go figure.

There is some good people working in RTE and they have made some brilliant documentaries over the years. But that Sean O'Rourke interview with Micheal Martin is a good example of their own current affairs section not following up on their other colleagues important work. And what happens is these serious issues just fade away into the background and nothing happens, which is of course what the likes of Michael Martin, FF, FG, The Church, The Guards and plenty in the establishment media want to happen, because it makes them all look bad. And any vague hope that these brave survivors may have had for some sort of justice and accountability will be gone, probably forever.

Hotblack Desiato

Ah c'mon Francie, you know as well as everyone else that SF does not have clean hands on the issue of sexual abuse and covering it up and mistreating victims.

stockshares

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Ah c'mon Francie, you know as well as everyone else that SF does not have clean hands on the issue of sexual abuse and covering it up and mistreating victims.

None of the partys do.

Micheal Martin cover up of Bill Kennealys child abuse.
https://www.southeastradio.ie/2018/02/fianna-fail-leader-asked-about-waterford-child-abuse-case/

FrancieBrady

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Ah c'mon Francie, you know as well as everyone else that SF does not have clean hands on the issue of sexual abuse and covering it up and mistreating victims.

Why would asking him about the Redress docs have anything to do with SF?

SF have been asked about their past ad infinitum to the point of boring the electorate.

Not a single question for Michael over two current stories. That is the point.

byhookorbycrook

It’s still VERY pertinent _the last homes closed in the 90s. Many adopted people in their 40s and 50s spent part of their lives in such places .

stockshares

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Why would asking him about the Redress docs have anything to do with SF?

SF have been asked about their past ad infinitum to the point of boring the electorate.

Not a single question for Michael over two current stories. That is the point.

You can't pick and choose who you criticise on child abuse.

SF have Qs to answer too. Many Pedophiles existed within SF/IRA over the years and were answerable to nobody because of the power they held in their areas.

FrancieBrady

stockshares wrote: »

You can't pick and choose who you criticise on child abuse.

SF have Qs to answer too. Many Pedophiles existed within SF/IRA over the years and were answerable to nobody because of the power they held in their areas.

FFS...SF weren't in the fecking studio. Get SF out of the living space in your head for two minutes (send them to the shop or something)

SF have been questioned ad infinitum on their past...and so they should.

Was Michael asked about his past, after two documentaries this week and several media pieces and a twitter campaign by victims?