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Should Ireland and the rest of Europe take in more migrants based in Turkey?

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    #272
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    alastair wrote: »
    Asylum provision is a legal obligation that the State agreed to sign up to. There’s nothing charitable in meeting those obligations. Just like social welfare isn’t charity. Just like education provision isn’t charity. If someone claims asylum here, their claim is assessed and if there’s sufficient evidence, they’ll be granted asylum.

    Then in present circumstances which the asylum provision laws were lax till now need to be reviewed and tightened immensely. Would you agree.


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    #273
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Abraham Happy Oaf wrote: »
    Yet people still refer to the ah shure what about the Irish going to 'merica like.

    Plenty seem to differentiate between undocumented Irish in the States and undocumented migrants here.


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    #274
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Then in present circumstances which the asylum provision laws were lax till now need to be reviewed and righted immensely. Would you agree.

    No. I wouldn’t.


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    #275
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    alastair wrote: »
    No. I wouldn’t.

    Good answer. So massive influx does not require severe processing. No offence Iv read most your posts. Massively biased. Ya need to step back.


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    #276
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Good answer. So massive influx does not require severe processing. No offence Iv read most your posts. Massively biased. Ya need to step back.

    The law remains the same. It was drafted to account for massive refugee volumes.


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    #277
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    alastair wrote: »
    Plenty seem to differentiate between undocumented Irish in the States and undocumented migrants here.

    Both get returned (ideally), met a lad at DUB Airport the other year, had been in Chicago 7yrs on overstayed visas, was thrown out sharpish, heading back on Bus to the country.

    He agreed it was a fair cop, expected to be removed, and was removed.

    We can't always say that for our bogus economic migrants on the back of bogus claims, after giving wrong addresses for voloutary removal orders to be posted to while enjoying the tax-free black market.


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    #278
    Blueshoe
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Blueshoe


    Turkey have said that they will increase the numbers being sent to the Greek border exponentially because the EU didn't stick to the agreement of paying them.
    They are bussing people to the border and forcing refugees to congregate at the fence. The Turkish military are actively trying to pull down fences and are harassing greek coastguard in an attempt to get boats through.

    Europe must not allow Turkey to continue. Greece is under siege. Locals on Lesbos are now attacking NGOs .


    Europe must stay strong and not be bullied. The poor souls in the middle are being used as pawns.


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    #279
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Abraham Happy Oaf wrote: »
    Both get returned (ideally), met a lad at DUB Airport the other year, had been in Chicago 7yrs on overstayed visas, was thrown out sharpish, heading back on Bus to the country.

    He agreed it was a fair cop, expected to be removed, and was removed.

    We can't always say that for our bogus economic migrants on the back of bogus claims, after giving wrong addresses for voloutary removal orders to be posted to while enjoying the tax-free black market.

    I seem to recall an Irish lad fighting his deportation from the States in only the last few months.


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    #280
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    Abraham Happy Oaf wrote: »
    Both get returned (ideally), met a lad at DUB Airport the other year, had been in Chicago 7yrs on overstayed visas, was thrown out sharpish, heading back on Bus to the country.

    He agreed it was a fair cop, expected to be removed, and was removed.

    We can't always say that for our bogus economic migrants on the back of bogus claims, after giving wrong addresses for voloutary removal orders to be posted to while enjoying the tax-free black market.

    If I'm bogus Irish in America. How much financial support do I get from the us of a?


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    #281
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    Blueshoe wrote: »
    Turkey have said that they will increase the numbers being sent to the Greek border exponentially because the EU didn't stick to the agreement of paying them.
    They are bussing people to the border and forcing refugees to congregate at the fence. The Turkish military are actively trying to pull down fences and are harassing greek coastguard in an attempt to get boats through.

    Europe must not allow Turkey to continue. Greece is under siege. Locals on Lesbos are now attacking NGOs .


    Europe must stay strong and not be bullied. The poor souls in the middle are being used as pawns.

    Was it not too long ago they were considering turkey to join eu?


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    #282
    Blueshoe
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Blueshoe


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Was it not too long ago they were considering turkey to join eu?

    That is one thing that will never ever happen now. Thankfully


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    #283
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    If I'm bogus Irish in America. How much financial support do I get from the us of a?

    Same as here - none.


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    #284
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    alastair wrote: »
    Same as here - none.

    Lax lax lax. And not the airport. Oh wait the lesson has being learned the hard way.


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    #285
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    Blueshoe wrote: »
    That is one thing that will never ever happen now. Thankfully

    Proves one thing thou. Does Brussels know wtf they are doing? Big fooking question mark there.


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    #286
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Lax lax lax. And not the airport. Oh wait the lesson has being learned the hard way.

    In English please?


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    #287
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Proves one thing thou. Does Brussels know wtf they are doing? Big fooking question mark there.

    About what? Turkey, like any European country, can apply for membership of the EU. It doesn’t mean that they qualify, or that anyone in Brussels did anything wrong. Turkey has been a candidate for 35 years, and still isn’t anywhere near the criteria for consideration.


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    #288
    Blueshoe
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Blueshoe


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Proves one thing thou. Does Brussels know wtf they are doing? Big fooking question mark there.

    There are tons of videos on twitter showing the Turkish military bringing migrants to the border and forcing them to try cross. There is one particular video where Turkish operatives are telling refugees if they do not get off the bus they will be shot. The guy is carrying a pistol and the refugees are clearly terrified.

    Video of man threatening to shoot refugees if they don't head for the border :



    The media are only showing refugees in need of help and are ignoring the bigger story. The last thing they want is the common person to become aware of the full story as it may turn people against refugees .

    The Turks are dangerous and are treating the refugees as a weapon. This will continue to escalate. Everyone in Europe should be supporting Greece and condemning Turkey. The US won't help this time. The EU has to stand strong.


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    #289
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    alastair wrote: »
    In English please?

    Lax immigration controls due to bleeding hearts or people who do not want to offend people of varying colour or creed. Ring a bell?


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    #290
    Lefty Bicek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,625 ✭✭✭Lefty Bicek


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Lax immigration controls due to bleeding hearts or people who do not want to offend people of varying colour or creed. Ring a bell?

    Or whose income derives from the professional sympathy industry.


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    #291
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Lax immigration controls due to bleeding hearts or people who do not want to offend people of varying colour or creed. Ring a bell?

    I’m sure you’re trying to make some sort of a point - but I fail to see what it has to do with the absence of state financial support for the undocumented here or the US.


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    #292
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Lefty Bicek wrote: »
    Or whose income derives from the professional sympathy industry.

    Immigration status is determined by the State - not any industry - sympathetic or otherwise.


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    #293
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Proves one thing thou. Does Brussels know wtf they are doing? Big fooking question mark there.

    I think they got caught up in the idea of the European Federation being a strong powerful entity.. a bit like Ireland was during the boom years. Nothing was too good or too expensive for them to implement, because everything would be "grand". The EU fell for the public impressiveness of virtue signalling.

    By taking in all refugees, migrants, asylum seekers, and pushing all member states to do the same, they showed everyone just how high their moral pedestal was. That the EU was better than the individual member states by being so magnanimous, and that the members should give up their petty objections..

    Now, it's the case of not wanting to show how big a mistake that was. They've invested so much in promoting multiculturalism, and they're afraid that backing down will make them look weak.. at a time, when the EU does look weak. So, they're pretty paralyzed by their past rulings.. making token gestures to move away from it. At least until someone who actually cares about Europe's future gets into power.. The problem with the EU is that they're still politicians, playing the games of power.. rather than people with direct investment in what happens.

    So the migration will continue until they're toppled, or the EU fractures. Can't really see them backing down on multiculturalism, and their grand gestures towards being charitable...

    And yes, letting asylum seekers or economic migrants into Europe, skipping the normal migration policies due to some special status, is charity. Misplaced charity.


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    #294
    Mr. teddywinkles
    Registered Users Posts: 2,209 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    alastair wrote: »
    Immigration status is determined by the State - not any industry - sympathetic or otherwise.

    Yep politics so reliable. Impartial and as ignorant to social issues as being proving with recent election. Not to talk of recent western countries election results.


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    #295
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I think they got caught up in the idea of the European Federation being a strong powerful entity.. a bit like Ireland was during the boom years. Nothing was too good or too expensive for them to implement, because everything would be "grand". The EU fell for the public impressiveness of virtue signalling.

    By taking in all refugees, migrants, asylum seekers, and pushing all member states to do the same, they showed everyone just how high their moral pedestal was. That the EU was better than the individual member states by being so magnanimous, and that the members should give up their petty objections..

    Now, it's the case of not wanting to show how big a mistake that was. They've invested so much in promoting multiculturalism, and they're afraid that backing down will make them look weak.. at a time, when the EU does look weak. So, they're pretty paralyzed by their past rulings.. making token gestures to move away from it. At least until someone who actually cares about Europe's future gets into power.. The problem with the EU is that they're still politicians, playing the games of power.. rather than people with direct investment in what happens.

    So the migration will continue until they're toppled, or the EU fractures. Can't really see them backing down on multiculturalism, and their grand gestures towards being charitable...

    And yes, letting asylum seekers or economic migrants into Europe, skipping the normal migration policies due to some special status, is charity. Misplaced charity.

    The E.U. has never ‘taken in all refugees, migrants, asylum seekers’. Germany for a time had a national policy of accepting Syrian refugees that had entered the E.U., but that was a national decision, not an EU one. They didn’t consider that charity either, btw. They still assessed asylum claims and deported those who were not successful.


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    #296
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »
    Yep politics so reliable. Impartial and as ignorant to social issues as being proving with recent election

    Again - English please.


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    #297
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Blueshoe wrote: »
    When you have comments like this from the Turkish interior minister you realise the scum Europe is dealing with

    https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/6667348/migrant-influx-just-the-beginning-turkey/?cs=14232

    Time for heavy economic sanctions on Turkey from the EU.


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    #298
    Lefty Bicek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,625 ✭✭✭Lefty Bicek


    alastair wrote: »
    The E.U. has never ‘taken in all refugees, migrants, asylum seekers’. Germany for a time had a national policy of accepting Syrian refugees that had entered the E.U., but that was a national decision, not an EU one. They didn’t consider that charity either, btw. They still assessed asylum claims and deported those who were not successful.

    They considered it 'The September Fairytale', if memory serves.
    If we start to apologize for showing a friendly face in an emergency, then that’s not my country.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/merkel-changed-her-mind-migration-crisis-eu-schengen-border-control/

    - Angela Merkel

    Even more imbecilic than misplaced charity.


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    #299
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,173 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    A bit of diversity wouldn't kill us. Also, since net emigration has returned and there's an aging population here it would be in our interests to take in some young families capable of contributing to the coffers.


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    #300
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    alastair wrote: »
    The E.U. has never ‘taken in all refugees, migrants, asylum seekers’. Germany for a time had a national policy of accepting Syrian refugees that had entered the E.U., but that was a national decision, not an EU one. They didn’t consider that charity either, btw. They still assessed asylum claims and deported those who were not successful.

    They severely relaxed the restrictions placed on what constituted a valid asylum seeker/refugee.. thereby increasing the numbers/range of those who could enter.

    Many are, indeed, refused. Many are allowed to stay, while being processed. Many others are accepted and allowed entry.

    The majority, however, should have been rejected. Not because they weren't genuine asylum seekers (it's immaterial at this stage whether they were or were not), but because Europe should not be the go-to destination for everyone running from trouble.


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    #301
    ArchXStanton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭ArchXStanton


    Blueshoe wrote: »
    Turkey have said that they will increase the numbers being sent to the Greek border exponentially because the EU didn't stick to the agreement of paying them.
    They are bussing people to the border and forcing refugees to congregate at the fence. The Turkish military are actively trying to pull down fences and are harassing greek coastguard in an attempt to get boats through.

    Europe must not allow Turkey to continue. Greece is under siege. Locals on Lesbos are now attacking NGOs .


    Europe must stay strong and not be bullied. The poor souls in the middle are being used as pawns.

    Would you blame the locals on Lesbos, the migrants vandalised a church maurading there way through


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