Woman killed by van in Raheny

Sleeper12

macwal wrote:

Would the traffic on the Howth/Dublin Road have been heavy at whatever time it happened? I have no idea what the traffic is like around there, but any chance he was trying to beat traffic all the way down to Causeway Road?

Not a hope in hell. Happened around 7:10pm and there is little or no traffic going in that direction at night. He was heading towards town and going against the heavy traffic

I'll say this one last time. Gardai have witnesses. Gardai know what his driving was like "before" he entered the cycle lane. His driving was erratic and dangerous on the Kilbarrack road before he got to the cycle track

Princess Calla

Effects wrote: »

This is what they always do in the movies and it never works. You need to go perpendicular to the vehicle.

Perpendicular is a 6 foot sloped drop the the sea or jumping the wall with a pram and two small kids. Not great options.

Anyways back on topic.

Atlantic Dawn

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Not a hope in hell. Happened around 7:10pm and there is little or no traffic going in that direction at night. He was heading towards town and going against the heavy traffic

I'll say this one last time. Gardai have witnesses. Gardai know what his driving was like "before" he entered the cycle lane. His driving was erratic and dangerous on the Kilbarrack road before he got to the cycle track

Exactly, it just doesn't add up as an accident. He would have had to entered the cycle track and then lost control of the van for over half a kilometre but in that time somehow managed to somehow keep the van from stalling and in between a sheer drop in to the sea on the left and a brick wall on the right for that distance while seeing multiple cyclists and walkers on the route.

Jinglejangle69

Wasn't there a video a few years ago of someone driving on this walkway along the coast road?

They widened it a few years ago of i remember correctly.

Jinglejangle69

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Wasn't there a video a few years ago of someone driving on this walkway along the coast road?

They widened it a few years ago of i remember correctly.

There's a picture on the cycling forum I think of a car driving in the cycle lane in Clontarf during heavy flooding. Maybe it was a video.

Sleeper12

Atlantic Dawn wrote:

Exactly, it just doesn't add up as an accident. He would have had to entered the cycle track and then lost control of the van for over half a kilometre but in that time somehow managed to somehow keep the van from stalling and in between a sheer drop in to the sea on the left and a brick wall on the right for that distance while seeing multiple cyclists and walkers on the route.

Maybe you missed my point. He was driving erratically before he entered the cycle lane. No one knows what happened but it has been reported that he has underlying health issues. There are plenty of health issues that can leave you in an extremely confused state. Low blood sugar or low insulin, parkinsons disease, seizures, Strokes or mini strokes & plenty of different medicine for example. Any of the above mentioned could explain what happened. You understand that he could have thought that he was on the road driving perfectly normal in a confused state? Have you ever driven behind someone driving buckled drunk? Swerving and clipping the footpath, clipping or almost clipping other cars for miles and miles. These drivers are in an alcohol induced state of confusion. There are many medical conditions that can come on quickly that can cause the same state of confusion. No one is suggesting that he was gripping his heart in pain and trying to stear his van.

The thing is no one knows. There are no reports of anyone being arrested at the scene so it's probably not alcohol.

Sleeper12

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Far more people are killed and injured in cars than on bikes.


If underlying health issues can result in this kind of driving, then the driver shouldn't be driving. Maybe we need regular medicals for all drivers to stop this happening.

You genuinely suggesting that no diabetic, anyone suffers from seizures, or anyone on anti depressants should never drive? You've ruled out half of the country

The same sources said the driver of the van had an acute health condition and had been fitted with a medical device to maintain stability in his day-to-day wellbeing. Gardaí were trying to establish if he may have suffered a serious health episode while behind the wheel.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/jogger-killed-when-hit-by-van-on-walkway-was-mother-of-four-1.4193893?mode=amp&fbclid=IwAR3I1H5cBfr7Q75egZ6Rae4CwGxm7jiTy4LEk4steBLgHXZ9SkJbHRmW1e8

walshb

Where exactly was the incident? Kilbarrack road heading to the coast? Or on the coast/Dublin road that leads to dollymount?

d51984

On the coast road, just after the turn for the Howth Rd. Basically half way between Kilbarrack Rd and Dollymount beach turn.

expectationlost

walshb wrote: »

Where exactly was the incident? Kilbarrack road heading to the coast? Or on the coast/Dublin road that leads to dollymount?

van stopped on coast road just after it splits into the howth road (towards the city)

walshb

d51984 wrote: »

On the coast road, just after the turn for the Howth Rd. Basically half way between Kilbarrack Rd and Dollymount beach turn.

Thanks...but I am still bloody lost..

Do you know the Dollymount House pub?

If you exit the pub, is it to your left towards Howth, or your right towards the city?

Sleeper12

walshb wrote: »

Where exactly was the incident? Kilbarrack road heading to the coast? Or on the coast/Dublin road that leads to dollymount?

Car drove down to the bottom of the Kilbarrack road, where it meets the coast rood. He turned right but not onto the roads as youd expect. He turned right onto the cycle lane. Accident happened after a few hundred yards & before the new apartments on this road. Van continued on for another few hundred yards before it stopped. It stopped at the palm trees facing the S bend. If you drive by you will see lots of flowers at the accident spot

walshb

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Car drove down to the bottom of the Kilbarrack road, where it meets the coast rood. He turned right but not onto the roads as youd expect. He turned right onto the cycle lane. Accident happened after a few hundred yards & before the new apartments on this road. Van continued on for another few hundred yards before it stopped. It stopped at the palm trees facing the S bend. If you drive by you will see lots of flowers at the accident spot

Got it. Thanks...I know the area well..tragic

Had the lady been named?

Sleeper12

walshb wrote: »

Thanks...but I am still bloody lost..

Do you know the Dollymount House pub?

If you exit the pub, is it to your left towards Howth, or your right towards the city?

You are miles away. Dollymount pub is long gone. This happened in Raheny. literally a few hundred yards from the kilbarrack road.

Sleeper12

walshb wrote: »

Got it. Thanks...I know the area well..tragic

Had the lady been named?

Yes in the link



https://www.irishtimes.com/news/irel...XZ9SkJbHRmW1e8

walshb

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You are miles away. Dollymount pub is long gone. This happened in Raheny. literally a few hundred yards from the kilbarrack road.

Yeh, I know it’s gone. I was using it as a landmark..

Stark

Sleepy12 wrote:

You genuinely suggesting that no diabetic, anyone suffers from seizures, or anyone on anti depressants should never drive? You've ruled out half of the country

Knowing from friends of mine in that boat, you have to be seizure free for at least 12 months before being allowed drive. If you're diabetic, you're legally required to check your sugar levels before starting to drive and recheck every two hours.

d51984

Named as Nuala Grant from Bettyglen. Lovely looking woman. RIP. thoughts to Nualas family, especially her 4 children.

https://www.irishtimes.com/polopoly_fs/1.4194426.1583439622!/image/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_620/image.jpg

Princess Calla

walshb wrote: »

Your points about all this are simple spot on common sense...

Missed by so many...and, you’re are not blaming the poor victim here...

Yeah it's common sense if you are jogging along a road with no footpath and you need your wits about you.

You say you know the area well so you know this section is completely pedestrianised with two cycle lanes. There's a four foot (?) wall between the road and the walkway.

The fact she had earphones in, if she did, I honestly don't know, is irrelevant. She is 100% not at fault. The van shouldn't have been there.

I'm not going to blame the driver as I know nothing about his situation.

If you want to start a thread on the dangers of earphones while jogging feel free, but it has absolutely nothing to do with this accident.

Zulu

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You genuinely suggesting that no diabetic, anyone suffers from seizures, or anyone on anti depressants should never drive? You've ruled out half of the country

Well if they can not recognise when they are suffering or have diminished faculties, but can manage to navigate traffic, take a tight right turn onto a footpath, and continue a kilometer along that footpath, ultimately killing a mother of 4, then no, they absolutely should not be allowed to drive.

Ten of Swords

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Most probably with headphones in

Mod

You have initially speculated this in the quoted post, and the in several of your subsequent posts re-enforced this view thereby trying to make it a fact. Do you have any credible source? If not then drop this, right now.

KiKi III

d51984 wrote: »

Named as Nuala Grant from Bettyglen. Lovely looking woman. RIP. thoughts to Nualas family, especially her 4 children.

https://www.irishtimes.com/polopoly_fs/1.4194426.1583439622!/image/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_620/image.jpg

In an otherwise thoughtful post, it seems irrelevant at best and disrespectful at worst to note she was “lovely looking”.

RIP, very sad day for the family.

Spanish Eyes

Terrible tragedy for all concerned.

A few weeks ago three innocent kids were killed in Newcastle by their mother, and I know that has to be proven in court, but still.

A woman killed a person fixing his car in Citywest.

And so many other awful deaths too lately.

May they all rest in peace.

AndrewJRenko

Sleeper12 wrote: »

If we ban under 25s we will save more lives than banning diabetic people. Why would we ban one group & not the other?

.

I'm not sure that your analysis is correct, so you might want to share your source, but regardless, if it is true, then bring it on. If that's what it takes to stop this carnage, bring it on.

Princess Calla

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Utter nonsense. If we ban under 25s we will save more lives than banning diabetic people. Why would we ban one group & not the other?



No one knows but aren't there insulin devices that are fitted too? Insulin pumps I think. No one knows though it's all guessing but locally since last night it's been reported as a diabetic incident.

Ironically there were 2 or 3 teenagers killed on that stretch of road, could be 15 yrs ago at this stage, further down towards Sutton.

Yeah I think you're right about the insulin, the point I was trying to make was we don't know for certain, let's leave the pitch forks down.

Spanish Eyes

anewme wrote: »

A man was killed in Citywest. His name was Gareth Kelly.

I said a woman killed a man. Read my post again.

Sympathies to the deceased and family.

Baseball72

A medical issue can be sudden but even if onset is gradual the driver may not realise what is happening to them...

A while back, as per my usual practice, I took an antihistamine before driving to work - except that I in error took an identical looking tablet from my bedside locker. 30 mins later, oncoming traffic looks odd to me, I hit a couple of curbs, burst a tyre and pull into a side street and parked up. Turns out I had taken a sleeping tablet that I happened to have lying around the place. New tyre, new bearing - but I could easily have killed someone or myself over a stupid error....I had no idea what was happening to me whilst driving that morning.......maybe that's what happened last night in Raheny.....

Atlantic Dawn

Princess Calla wrote: »

Ironically there were 2 or 3 teenagers killed on that stretch of road, could be 15 yrs ago at this stage, further down towards Sutton.

Yeah I think you're right about the insulin, the point I was trying to make was we don't know for certain, let's leave the pitch forks down.

Yes I remember that crash...

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/three-dead-and-two-injured-in-crash-1.363335

Princess Calla

Sleeper12 wrote: »

No one knows. Some posters making the driver out to be the boogy man without any proof gets my goat up. I prefer to wait for proof before I blame the driver. If he's at fault then throw away the keys but right now he deserves the benefit of the doubt.

That's exactly the way I feel too.

But jesus I just don't know how he managed to do it.

I was talking with friends earlier, we all know the area well and everyones reaction was puzzlement.

As I said earlier I'm actually surprised only one person was injured as it's such a popular walk and cycling track.

Pawwed Rig

Princess Calla wrote: »

As I said earlier I'm actually surprised only one person was injured as it's such a popular walk and cycling track.

It was busy down there last night too. A cyclist was nearly hit in the incident and I can only assume more people had to get out of the way.

Sleeper12

Princess Calla wrote:

As I said earlier I'm actually surprised only one person was injured as it's such a popular walk and cycling track.

It's a busy spot. I've no idea if others were there & got out of the way but he wasn't travelling far on the track before the accident. I could be mistaken but I think he travelled further on the track after the accident then before it. I'd say the Gardai are scratching their heads at this one. I don't think there are any easy answers.

Ten of Swords

Mod

TheBoyConor don't post in this thread again.

This is the second thread discussing a tragic event in recent weeks that you have attempted to derail with unverified or irrelevant nonsense.

JustAThought

That cycle and walking track has a lot to answer for..Over one million euro unnecessarily spent on raising and then lowering a wall. A supposedly protected ecosystem permanently damaged and a previously SAFE and RAISED cycle and walking path bulldozed put down to road level, the protective grass verge and trees removed and both busy lanes of traffic with lanes reduced to far too narrow to accommodate safely busses or a truck and a bus coming in opposite directions . And a few inches of raised verge now all that is between this fast busy artery road and joggers/pedestrians. If the so called planners had left it the way it was before, this accident could never have happened.

No wonder thousands were at the mass meetings in Raheny and Clontarf protesting about it for months.

RIP to that poor lady.

Zulu

JustAThought wrote: »

That cycle and walking track has a lot to answer for....

I believe it was before that part; it was where the path is elevated and there is no planting.

Princess Calla

JustAThought wrote: »

That cycle and walking track has a lot to answer for..Over one million euro unnecessarily spent on raising and then lowering a wall. A supposedly protected ecosystem permanently damaged and a previously SAFE and RAISED cycle and walking path bulldozed put down to road level, the protective grass verge and trees removed and both busy lanes of traffic with lanes reduced to far too narrow to accommodate safely busses or a truck and a bus coming in opposite directions . And a few inches of raised verge now all that is between this fast busy artery road and joggers/pedestrians. If the so called planners had left it the way it was before, this accident could never have happened.

No wonder thousands were at the mass meetings in Raheny and Clontarf protesting about it for months.

RIP to that poor lady.

Except it didn't happen there, but don't let facts get in the way of a good rant!

JustAThought

Zulu wrote: »

I believe it was before that part; it was where the path is elevated and there is no planting.

I must make inquiries - the twitter feed looked as thou it might be at Blackbanks or near the Foxes Lane part but I don’t know. Regardless had the seafront walkway been left as it had been in its original, first or second state with the elevated bank and shrubs and grass banks left in place rather that flatted and tarmacadamed to resemble a ubiquitous lane of traffic it would not have been able to happen.

Regardless, RIP to this poor lady.

Princess Calla

JustAThought wrote: »

I must make inquiries - the twitter feed looked as thou it might be at Blackbanks or near the Foxes Lane part but I don’t know. Regardless had the seafront walkway been left as it had been in its original, first or second state with the elevated bank and shrubs and grass banks left in place rather that flatted and tarmacadamed to resemble a ubiquitous lane of traffic it would not have been able to happen.

Regardless, RIP to this poor lady.

It happened where there's a four foot wall between the road and the pedestrianised area.

This isn't an accident where a car lost control and swerved off the road.

The only upgrades this section has received are new tarmac and a paint job for the cycle track, the pumping station has also changed, otherwise its the same as it always been and I'm going back 40 yrs

Princess Calla

TsuDhoNimh wrote: »

Rather than it being a head scratcher for Gardaí, if it is a freak diabetic event at the centre of it they're likely to have a very clear timeline and picture of the buildup to the tragic event.

As for the specifics that occured seeming baffling to people not familiar with a hypoglycemic event... .

Can I just address these two points, as I think sleeper said it was a head scratcher and I said it was baffling.

Now while I can't speak 100% for sleeper, but the way I took him up and definitely the way I meant it was nothing to do with how a hypoglycemic event happens but everything to do with the location.

Driving straight from kilbarrack Road to get up into the pedestrian area you are mounting a dropped curb, and there's a slight hill. It's a sharp right then. If you miss it you will end in the sea. The walkway itself is probably about 8 feet wide. Between the hill and the turn it would be an awkward enough manoeuvre,you've the sea on one side and a wall on the other.

I do agree with everything you said though, I just wanted to clarify my comments.

If it was a medical issue I feel extremely sorry for the driver, it's a tragedy all round.

chooseusername

Princess Calla wrote: »

Can I just address these two points, as I think sleeper said it was a head scratcher and I said it was baffling.

Now while I can't speak 100% for sleeper, but the way I took him up and definitely the way I meant it was nothing to do with how a hypoglycemic event happens but everything to do with the location.

Driving straight from kilbarrack Road to get up into the pedestrian area you are mounting a dropped curb, and there's a slight hill. It's a sharp right then. If you miss it you will end in the sea. The walkway itself is probably about 8 feet wide. Between the hill and the turn it would be an awkward enough manoeuvre,you've the sea on one side and a wall on the other.

I do agree with everything you said though, I just wanted to clarify my comments.

If it was a medical issue I feel extremely sorry for the driver, it's a tragedy all round.

Wouldn't be too difficult as can be seen in this view of the two vans on the cycle/ walking lane

yourdeadwright

chooseusername wrote: »

Wouldn't be too difficult as can be seen in this view of the two vans on the cycle/ walking lane

Still it makes non sense, so the van goes up there and continues for over 1k?
Honestly I don't understand how a medical condition causes you to drive up there and keep going,
Also in the picture that is the widest area it get narrower further on,
I seen the Van zero damage to the side so never went near the wall

macwal

chooseusername wrote: »

Wouldn't be too difficult as can be seen in this view of the two vans on the cycle/ walking lane

Wouldn't be difficult if you weren't suffering a medical event, or were fully intending to drive on the cycle path.

Princess Calla

chooseusername wrote: »

Wouldn't be too difficult as can be seen in this view of the two vans on the cycle/ walking lane

Yeah, the Kilbarrack Road is the perpendicular blue line, so you would be driving straight then turning right.

I've seen those vans pulling in and they do so very gingerly.

The angle of that picture is also making the entrance look larger than it is.

I never said it could not be done it would just be awkward especially when suffering a medical issue.

Zulu

Princess Calla wrote: »

Yeah, the Kilbarrack Road is the perpendicular blue line, so you would be driving straight then turning right.

I've seen those vans pulling in and they do so very gingerly.

The angle of that picture is also making the entrance look larger than it is.

I never said it could not be done it would just be awkward especially when suffering a medical issue.

Exactly, it's not that it cant be done, it's just highly improbable someone having a stroke, or heart attack would be doing it without going over the edge/hitting the wall.

expectationlost

need some bollards there

spurious

A couple of weeks ago, I was behind a car whose driver almost made the same error it appears this driver did. They were coming from Kilbarrack Road, turning right, went partly onto the path to go through the gap in the wall, realised their mistake and got back on course, but they could have ended up in behind the wall.

The driving for 1km without realising the mistake is scary, but perhaps the driver was not fully aware. Terrible incident.

Princess Calla

expectationlost wrote: »

need some bollards there

I think there's none as emergency access might be required, especially as so close to water.

That may change, though this is very much a freak accident. In my opinion anyway.

Pawwed Rig

It looks like noone realised she had been hit until a while after the van was stopped. Poor woman seems to have been lying on the rocks unnoticed for a while.

Thankfully the tide was out from the coastguards perspective as they would have been searching for potential victims all night as they would have no idea how many people had been hit. It would have been a case of waiting for missing persons reports.

Princess Calla

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

It looks like noone realised she had been hit until a while after the van was stopped. Poor woman seems to have been lying on the rocks unnoticed for a while.

Thankfully the tide was out from the coastguards perspective as they would have been searching for potential victims all night as they would have no idea how many people had been hit. It would have been a case of waiting for missing persons reports.

That is heartbreaking.

The currents in that estuary are very strong. So yeah, small mercy the tide was out.

Strumms

expectationlost wrote: »

need some bollards there

Was about to post the same, there should be for sure a ‘physical’ barrier to prevent the mixing of bikes and traffic. Someone with impaired judgement due to a medical event or under the influence of alcohol or drugs could mistakenly try and use the lane in a vehicle.

Sleeper12

Pawwed Rig wrote:

It looks like noone realised she had been hit until a while after the van was stopped. Poor woman seems to have been lying on the rocks unnoticed for a while.

I'm not sure this is fact. They found her & pronounced her dead quickly enough. Unfortunately they didn't know if she was alone. Emergency services searched for another two hours in case he hit more than one person. It was the helicopter that alerted most of the neighbours