Coronavirus (COVID-19)

fin12

Sure the cases are rising again cause of the schools back after midterm.

SusieBlue

TheChizler wrote: »

I'm not sure your can say that with any certainty about it being due to schools and meat factories. Sure they're a portion. But 20% of cases over a fortnight in September were directly traced to bars and restaurants.

https://amp.rte.ie/amp/1168014/

Restaurants were open since the 29th of June with very few outbreaks over the summer.
If 20% of cases over a fortnight in September were linked to pubs and restaurants I would suggest closing those specific businesses for deep cleaning and sending an inspector to asses their health and safety procedures should be the first port of call. Impose financial fines on repeat offending businesses.
I don’t think shutting down the entire industry nationwide because of the ineptitude of a few businesses is the answer, and I don’t think it’s a practical course of action going forward either.

Punish those who are not upholding the highest social distancing and cleaning standards and allow those who are abiding by the rules to continue trading is the fairest outcome for all involved.

Chuck Noland

TheChizler wrote: »

I'm not sure your can say that with any certainty about it being due to schools and meat factories. Sure they're a portion. But 20% of cases over a fortnight in September were directly traced to bars and restaurants.

https://amp.rte.ie/amp/1168014/

I said it at the time and I’ll say it again I’m not having that for a second!(the RTÉ article not your post) They can immediately work out how many cases were from bars and restaurants, was this 70 cases in total infected or were these 70 individuals who then went and infected others? How many people were infected from nursing homes? Meat factory’s etc? Amazing how they have an exact number for one industry but not for another!

The public buy in for a lockdown is waining, and each day that passes less and less people will support it. People WILL return for Xmas. People WILL travel. People WILL meet up and have get togethers in houses or bars. People are sick too death of restrictions and lack of quality of life

TheChizler

Chuck Noland wrote: »

I said it at the time and I’ll say it again I’m not having that for a second!(the RTÉ article not your post) They can immediately work out how many cases were from bars and restaurants, was this 70 cases in total infected or were these 70 individuals who then went and infected others? How many people were infected from nursing homes? Meat factory’s etc? Amazing how they have an exact number for one industry but not for another!

I presume they get these numbers through contact tracing, I'm inclined to believe them after hearing about a couple of large clusters directly originating in restaurants in the city. I think they probably have those numbers for nursing homes and factories but they're largely under control and have much better procedures now since public health professionals got involved. It makes sense to prioritise public reporting of cases in places where procedures are a lot more ad-hoc, there are also way more bars and restaurants than nursing homes and meat factories, they represent a much bigger risk.

We hit our lowest point of cases in the middle of the summer, I still think its more than a coincidence that the curve started sloping back up in the couple of weeks after opening restaurants. Lots of people with no masks from multiple households sitting in close proximity for more than 15 minutes: it would be weird if there wasn't an increase in cases.

SusieBlue

It wasn’t a few weeks, it was 13 weeks. The uptick in mid September occurred roughly just over 3 months after the restaurants reopened on June 29th.
I think it’s quite a stretch to blame it on them the slight increase in September when they had been open for that long.
Before that little surge the cases were negligible, to be fair. I don’t think it’s fair to lay all the blame on that industry.

ACitizenErased

Can people at least provide some actual evidence like HPSC reports rather than spouting crap about schools, pubs and restaurants, please?

Chuck Noland

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Can people at least provide some actual evidence like HPSC reports rather than spouting crap about schools, pubs and restaurants, please?

There have been 22 confirmed outbreaks in Irish pubs since the start of the pandemic, compared to 5,285 in private households, according to data from the Health Protection Surveillance Centre

Source the Irish Independent. Ffs open the pubs and let people live alongside the virus as we were told we would have too

bingo9999

Chuck Noland wrote: »

There have been 22 confirmed outbreaks in Irish pubs since the start of the pandemic, compared to 5,285 in private households, according to data from the Health Protection Surveillance Centre

Source the Irish Independent. Ffs open the pubs and let people live alongside the virus as we were told we would have too

I agree with you, when/if the number gets lower we have to save pubs and I would love to see things come back over Christmas.

But the question I have on the above is how the virus got into the homes - of course it spreads in a family when it gets in the door and that is classed as an outbreak, but the relevant thing is where the first member caught it. I'm not saying I know, but households to me seem like the result of community spread rather than main cause. I could be wrong, maybe its all house parties but not what I imagine is primary cause, anecdotally. Of course its not pubs either, they have been closed so I am not saying that - the published figures dont tell a clear story to me.

Chuck Noland

bingo9999 wrote: »

I agree with you, when/if the number gets lower we have to save pubs and I would love to see things come back over Christmas.

But the question I have on the above is how the virus got into the homes - of course it spreads in a family when it gets in the door and that is classed as an outbreak, but the relevant thing is where the first member caught it. I'm not saying I know, but households to me seem like the result of community spread rather than main cause. I could be wrong, maybe its all house parties but not what I imagine is primary cause, anecdotally. Of course its not pubs either, they have been closed so I am not saying that - the published figures dont tell a clear story to me.

We’re only told breakdowns on figures that suit the narrative in any given week!

Has anyone seen any figures from this year for deaths from
Asthma
Emphysema
Pneumonia
Flu
Lung infections

You can be sure these are all lumped into the Covid deaths

I’d love to know when we get the doom figures each day about people in ICU and on ventilators how those figures from the date in question stand up to the same date from 2015/2016/2017/2018/2019

The fact we aren’t told these suggests too me the figures are actually the same or lower then years gone by otherwise these figures would be used to increase the control and scare mongering over the general population.

bingo9999

Its true, cant lose sight of the wider suite of illnesses out there, especially as fatality rate seems to have come well down. Cancer is the big one, I dont know things well but thats one that I fear more than covid any day.

No doubt they are overcounting covid deaths, but I dont think thats a bad thing - better than undercounting and not having confidence in what the state of it out and about is. As I see it if someone is 70% sick with diabetes say, and gets 40% sicker with covid and die then its not irrelevant that they got covid and it put them over the top - but of course is not the full picture. Comorbidity is the big thing with covid, but covid is still a ****er when it hits the wrong person. So numbers are a worst case scenario for sure, but can understand the approach. I dont agree that its control or scaremongering though, the politicians will explode with relief when they get to say its all over go back to normal.

Chuck Noland

bingo9999 wrote: »

the politicians will explode with relief when they get to say its all over go back to normal.

The politicians will spend the rest of their days telling us how the healthcare system, ICU reform and people on trolleys was all about too be resolved in 2020 before the pandemic struck the country and they are dealing with the fall out from that still !

bingo9999

Chuck Noland wrote: »

The politicians will spend the rest of their days telling us how the healthcare system, ICU reform and people on trolleys was all about too be resolved in 2020 before the pandemic struck the country and they are dealing with the fall out from that still !

Of course they will, thats a whole different issue. I am saying they do not like having to tell people to stay home and let the economy tank - would you? There will be champagne popped in govt building (as everywhere) when vaccine is rolled out enough to fully end restrictions

Chuck Noland

bingo9999 wrote: »

Of course they will, thats a whole different issue. I am saying they do not like having to tell people to stay home and let the economy tank - would you? There will be champagne popped in govt building (as everywhere) when vaccine is rolled out enough to fully end restrictions

I get that. But rather then weigh up the value the effect of lockdowns has on mental health and the cost monetary, Emotionally and mentally on the population. They are taking the easy route by saying lock it down. It’s my firm belief that if they had of shut the country down at the start of lockdown 1, too international travel (with out a pre approved application to the government) We would not be in as much trouble with Case numbers. We also would not have been in lockdown for the majority of the summer. But what I outline there Would have taking time money and resources and involve the government actually looking out for the people they serve but rather than have to work hard to implement these measures they have now TWICE takin the easy route out by saying lock it down.

JP Liz V1

https://twitter.com/NeilRedFM/status/1327929940503826432

fin12

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/NeilRedFM/status/1327929940503826432

He is some asshole, commenting on others behaviors. He’s a disgrace.

ACitizenErased

A curfew some people are in the wrong country

SusieBlue

A curfew does not address the problem. The problem is that public support for these restrictions is diminishing by the day and they will just find other sneakier ways to socialise and be together if this is imposed.

The fact that so many people were willing to blatantly flout the rules last night is so telling and the government need to acknowledge that. Without compliance there is no point to any if this.
People are suffering heavily now after 8 months of isolation, loneliness, and constant restrictions and imposing a curfew won’t make that go away. It will just make these people more frustrated, even angrier and less willing to adhere to any future restrictions.

I would not be surprised to see public protests if the government go down that route.

Acosta

WTF would anyone want to be out on the street boozing on a night like last night?

ACitizenErased

While numbers are at this level, hospitalisations continue to decrease and the number in ICU does too, I don't think we should all be freaking out about some people meeting outside, to be honest.

Acosta

SusieBlue wrote: »

People are suffering heavily now after 8 months of isolation, loneliness, and constant restrictions and imposing a curfew won’t make that go away. It will just make these people more frustrated, even angrier and less willing to adhere to any future restrictions.

Doubt any of the many genuine people suffering from loneliness and isolation were drinking outside Electric last night.

SusieBlue

Acosta wrote: »

Doubt any of the many genuine people suffering from loneliness and isolation were drinking outside Electric last night.

That’s a very grand assumption to make about people whose circumstances you know nothing about.

ACitizenErased

Acosta wrote: »

Doubt any of the many genuine people suffering from loneliness and isolation were drinking outside Electric last night.

Poor of you to make such an assumption.

Acosta

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Poor of you to make such an assumption.

To say ALL of them was maybe a bit harsh on my part. I have no issue with people meeting up in small groups outside in a park for a few drinks, but that last night was just bollocks.
Those pics don't say to me that they were there out of a desperate need to be the company of a few friends or family for some harmless socialising. That looks more like loads of people who don't know each other forming a large group to have an outdoor piss up. If you're lonely and decide to organise a meet up with 2 or 3 friends in town and come across that scene, if you have any cop on at all, you will take yourself and your buddies and go elsewhere.
It's incidents like this that will give the powers that be an excuse to keep pubs closed when we move out of level 5.

JP Liz V1

fin12 wrote: »

He is some asshole, commenting on others behaviors. He’s a disgrace.

Who Neil?

fin12

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Who Neil?

Yes

TheChizler

fin12 wrote: »

Yes

Last I heard it's his producers who man the account.

Treehelpplease

I really don't understand how anyone can defend what happened at the Peace Park last night. should a few friends (~5) still meet up outdoors, including drink? if they are following the rules pretty well otherwise and try their best to keep distance while together, sure, I dont really see the harm in it. or an old person going to a family member's house as they're otherwise alone. Or young kids who go to school together anyway playing out on the road together. that's living with it, and that's what we are now doing. and for the most part this level 5 reflects that, it is much less stricter than our last one in March-May.

but people meeting up in huge groups with no social distancing for probably hours and giving a middle finger to everyone else saying i'm healthy and need to live my life whatever way i want and no matter how that affects others because we've been fighting this too long. it's nothing more than selfish. and a big F you to every vulnerable person in the country, people living with vulnerable people and people who are following the rules as best they can, all who are aiding in numbers staying low that allows for those people to be less afraid of the virus. it's ignorant and selfish and really disheartening. you can be sick of the virus and over the lockdown and try your best to still socialise while being safe and doing what makes you happy without doing what was done last night AND many other nights in the city centre. I passed a pub last night and they had a canopy up and tables right outside the door for people to sit at for their pints. talk about a slap in the face to every other pub who are staying closed to try and get this lockdown over with as fast as we can.

also, for people thinking we just need to get over the virus and that living with it is making vulernable people (and by extension their loved ones) stay indoors so 'healthy' people can still live their life. look at the rest of the world in countries where people are choosing to do that. so disheartening to see as for the most part people really are trying their best

440Hertz

To be quite honest I don’t think we are capable of managing this. There’ll always be an element of this kind of stuff.

We aren’t really able to follow rules like that - depressing as is, this thing is going to drag on and on and on and on and on and on ....

We meet every drunken Irish stereotype and the next bit will be the Americans kicking off the anti-vax stuff online and that will spread and sure we’ll all still be risking dropping dead in ICU with the nightmare of an illness in 2030.

It’s beyond depressing.

Chuck Noland

Also who ever compared those in town too the Magaluf strip has clearly never been on the strip over there

JP Liz V1

Acosta wrote: »

WTF would anyone want to be out on the street boozing on a night like last night?

I was thinking the same and paying what €5 for a flat pint in a plastic cup