Corona virus and social protection

Wanderer78

Dempo1 wrote: »

Agreed in one sense but the very people who brought in PUP and are now try to dismantle it are all FG ministers

unfortunately, fg are hardwired economic conservatives, even though it is important to have good bookkeeping, conservatives really need to get over this thinking that governments must always balance the budget, they dont. governments are not like a household, households cannot create money, but governments can, via bonds. the important part of government bookkeeping is making sure debts are continually serviced, rolling over debt is common, for many decades, and doesnt cause any serious problems. balancing the books now, could be catastrophic for our society and economy, keep printing!

timetogo1

Dempo1 wrote: »

Sorry to hear this, however notifications whilst sent to my welfare account also generates a text message and or email. Also the department stated yesterday that it's next week payments being stopped, they made no mention that anyone has had payment stopped yet because of this eligibility confirmation, I wonder has anyone else been affected by this? this said its hard to believe much coming out of the department at this stage, so many mixed messages, rule changes etc. I'm sure her appeal will be successful.

She was self employed, had her own travel company so that's gone now so probably a bit different criteria.
She didn't receive text messages or emails and they confirmed the contact details they had when she rang them.
So log onto the welfare site anyway. Don't wait for a text. When she logged on there was a listing of notifications in one of the menu options (not super obvious but not hidden away). But as she didn't use the Welfare page as her day to day email program she didn't know to check it frequently.

Corholio

A relative was getting Jobseekers and changed payments to be paid into bank a few months ago, now that the payments are back to 1 week does anybody know if they revert back to post office collection or if they will continue to be paid into the bank?

I'm presuming the lack of information about it on their websites means it will still be paid into the bank, but just wanted to check.

Dempo1

Corholio wrote: »

A relative was getting Jobseekers and changed payments to be paid into bank a few months ago, now that the payments are back to 1 week does anybody know if they revert back to post office collection or if they will continue to be paid into the bank?

I'm presuming the lack of information about it on their websites means it will still be paid into the bank, but just wanted to check.

There's no payment method change, just when it's paid, Dept would contact anyone who's payment is being changed directly

Corholio

Dempo1 wrote: »

There's no payment method change, just when it's paid, Dept would contact anyone who's payment is being changed directly

Thanks!

Snow_White1987

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

They might not but revenue will have access and might flag it for investigation.

I don’t think revenue have access to your bank accounts - they have to ask you to provide those details. They certainly can see what SW payments you’re on (as that’s tied to your PPSN) but they can’t just look into your bank account - they need to ask you to provide those details first, as I understand it.

Snow_White1987

Has anyone heard if they are still cutting the PUP payments for essential travel abroad? I know a few saying they are terrified to go near an airport (even though they will be fully self-isolating when they return for the two weeks, green list or not) as a result of what when on a couple of weeks ago....

It’s so wrong to put this fear in people!

I presume it’s died down since all the media attention on it but just wanted to see if anyone else had heard anything on it?

Dempo1

Snow_White1987 wrote: »

Has anyone heard if they are still cutting the PUP payments for essential travel abroad? I know a few saying they are terrified to go near an airport (even though they will be fully self-isolating when they return for the two weeks, green list or not) as a result of what when on a couple of weeks ago....

It’s so wrong to put this fear in people!

I presume it’s died down since all the media attention on it but just wanted to see if anyone else had heard anything on it?

They are permitting travel in green list countries only with no penalty re payment but they advise you tell them, 2 weeks permitted, however not to none green list countries as you have to self isolate for two weeks on return and won't be paid PUP or SW payments of any sort in this scenario

Snow_White1987

Dempo1 wrote: »

They are permitting travel in green list countries only with no penalty re payment but they advise you tell them, 2 weeks permitted, however not to none green list countries as you have to self isolate for two weeks on return and won't be paid PUP or SW payments of any sort in this scenario

How can they enforce this if they aren’t told in advance though? As in, do they track people going through airports?

I don’t think anyone would do non essential travel to a country that was not on the green list at this stage!

Dempo1

Snow_White1987 wrote: »

How can they enforce this if they aren’t told in advance though? As in, do they track people going through airports?

I don’t think anyone would do non essential travel to a country that was not on the green list at this stage!

It was then catching people at the airport a few weeks ago that caused major contraversy, they stopped payment on 84 people although they were appealed and apparently reinstated.

The problem arose firstly as No one knew and prior to a ministerial order passed late one night with no notice, SW recepients were always entitled to 2 weeks holidays without penalty. To get around this, they now only permit every SW recepient to travel to green list countries but will penalise anyone going to none green.

I'm guessing there's not as many checks at airports after the contraversy but its a risk not informing them as there's not that many flying so checks easy for them to do. They interview people in boarding Q"s but even that is open to questions as it's being suggested blanket screening of all passengers may be illegal, that said that's a debate for another day

Snow_White1987

Dempo1 wrote: »

I know, so many have returned only to be let go again, its going to be a challenging few months ahead.

On top of this, I see more spin coming from SW yesterday with a bizzare claim 29,000 pup recepients have not confirmed their eligibility and may loose payment next week. I seriously doubt these figures, it's also interesting they are giving these people until Friday next to confirm but have actually neglected to tell the media that SW have now closed the confirm eligibility feature on my welfare and even have a customer notice to that affect. Its hard to be anything coming out of this department I'm afraid.

I also found that utterly unbelievable RE the PUP eligibility - there’s no way 29,000 didn’t provide details as you were told payments would be closed if you didn’t comply!

Though I have a friend who works in a building society and he mentioned he can see people back in work months who are still getting €350 a week - yet they are targeting people at airports! Makes zero sense to me.

I don’t think they have a clue what they are doing.

Dempo1

Snow_White1987 wrote: »

I also found that utterly unbelievable RE the PUP eligibility - there’s no way 29,000 didn’t provide details as you were told payments would be closed if you didn’t comply!

Though I have a friend who works in a building society and he mentioned he can see people back in work months who are still getting €350 a week - yet they are targeting people at airports! Makes zero sense to me.

I don’t think they have a clue what they are doing.

Agreed, the funny thing about the eligibility thing was they closed off the facility to confirm we'll over 2 weeks ago. I don't think those affected realise that if they haven't and I doubt anywhere near 29k have not, they must reapply.

Snow_White1987

Dempo1 wrote: »

It was then catching people at the airport a few weeks ago that caused major contraversy, they stopped payment on 84 people although they were appealed and apparently reinstated.

The problem arose firstly as No one knew and prior to a ministerial order passed late one night with no notice, SW recepients were always entitled to 2 weeks holidays without penalty. To get around this, they now only permit every SW recepient to travel to green list countries but will penalise anyone going to none green.

I'm guessing there's not as many checks at airports after the contraversy but its a risk not informing them as there's not that many flying so checks easy for them to do. They interview people in boarding Q"s but even that is open to questions as it's being suggested blanket screening of all passengers may be illegal, that said that's a debate for another day

It’s ludicrous - if anyone attempted to interview me while in a boarding queue I’d tell them where to go!

And I read that quite a few are in fact travelling through airports nonetheless so I’d be interested to see how they are policing it...

Feels utterly wrong as so many are unemployed through no fault of their own, yet they will potentially be punished for travel while others not on PUP will not!

Dempo1

Snow_White1987 wrote: »

It’s ludicrous - if anyone attempted to interview me while in a boarding queue I’d tell them where to go!

And I read that quite a few are in fact travelling through airports nonetheless so I’d be interested to see how they are policing it...

Feels utterly wrong as so many are unemployed through no fault of their own, yet they will potentially be punished for travel while others not on PUP will not!

I do agree and wait till the "must be looking for work clause" kicks in, they've gone all quite now because of bad pr last few weeks but rest assured communications will commence soon, another 200 new cases today, shocking. I'm in the midl, currently lockedown again, I know a few people who started back 2 weeks ago, only to be laid off again and had to sign back on again, its just a crazy situation.

Irishphotodesk

Snow_White1987 wrote: »

I don’t think revenue have access to your bank accounts - they have to ask you to provide those details. They certainly can see what SW payments you’re on (as that’s tied to your PPSN) but they can’t just look into your bank account - they need to ask you to provide those details first, as I understand it.

Revenue can and do have access to your account - for the purposes of an investigation, I doubt anyone involved in money laundering would be required to give their permission for revenue to view their accounts.

a member of revenue is not going to randomly view someones accounts as they know its a sackable offence, but for the purposes of an investigation they are permitted access to accounts, accounts can also be frozen by revenue, if they suspect something illegal is happening.

Dempo1

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

Revenue can and do have access to your account - for the purposes of an investigation, I doubt anyone involved in money laundering would be required to give their permission for revenue to view their accounts.

a member of revenue is not going to randomly view someones accounts as they know its a sackable offence, but for the purposes of an investigation they are permitted access to accounts, accounts can also be frozen by revenue, if they suspect something illegal is happening.

Yes as stated previously on foot of an order and investigation, Revenue do not arbitrarily have access to personal bank accounts and certainly can not monitor personal bank accounts on a routine / ongoing basis. They have many separate tools such as monitoring off shore accounts interest payments that require taxation be paid, this is generally how they hone in on specific individuals claiming a benifit that requires a mean test for example, that is were someone has not disclosed substantial savings etc when claiming a benifit.

The OP"S specific question related to revenue monitoring /having access invidual accounts and the answer remains no unless something has warrented an investigation and even at that, certain protocols / orders are required.

edwardkiley

hey everyone
Does anyone know what happens if I get paid for a weeks work in a new job and I still get a covid payment in?

Dempo1

edwardkiley wrote: »

hey everyone
Does anyone know what happens if I get paid for a weeks work in a new job and I still get a covid payment in?

Hello again, this depends, is it your arrears week PUP payment, in other words have you started a new job, signed off PUP, and got your final weeks PUP which is paid in arrears,

or is it you've started a new job and forgot to sign off PUP (you'd have to pay this back, details on website)

or if your self employed you can earn some income without affecting your PUP?

Need to be more specific

edwardkiley

Dempo1 wrote: »

Hello again, this depends, is it your arrears week PUP payment, in other words have you started a new job, signed off PUP, and got your final weeks PUP which is paid in arrears,

or is it you've started a new job and forgot to sign off PUP (you'd have to pay this back, details on website)

or if your self employed you can earn some income without affecting your PUP?

Need to be more specific

Ye i started a new job and forgot to cancel. I only canceled it on tuesday and I received a payment but also am going to get wages for that week.

do you what this is called on the site?

Dempo1

edwardkiley wrote: »

Ye i started a new job and forgot to cancel. I only canceled it on tuesday and I received a payment but also am going to get wages for that week.

do you what this is called on the site?

So to be clear, did you start the job and wait a week before closing payment, if so, go to SW website, click on covid pandemic payment, you will see a link on how to payback an over payment.

If you started the new job on the same week you closed payment, it's not an issue, you should close payment on the day you start new job or return to existing job

dublinman1990

I was told by a lady in the post office that the regular Jobseekers Allowance is back to the weekly payment as of last Tuesday. I would assume here that other SW payments that existed pre-covid would also be back to a weekly payment or am I over thinking things.

Nollog

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I was told by a lady in the post office that the regular Jobseekers Allowance is back to the weekly payment as of last Tuesday. I would assume here that other SW payments that existed pre-covid would also be back to a weekly payment or am I over thinking things.

The payments restored to a weekly schedule include One-Parent Family Payment, Working Family Payment, Illness Benefit, Jobseeker’s Allowance and Jobseeker’s Benefit.

arex93

My cousin left job after her boss called her back to work and she is still getting covid benefit. She won't cancel it, even though she knows it is wrong. Does the revenue system not track this type of situation? How many dishonest people are doing the same?

Dempo1

arex93 wrote: »

My cousin left job after her boss called her back to work and she is still getting covid benefit. She won't cancel it, even though she knows it is wrong. Does the revenue system not track this type of situation? How many dishonest people are doing the same?

Not clear if your cousin is still working or not?, essentially the rules are clear, if you leave your job, you are not entitled to the payment, instead need to apply for JSA but will be penalised for a number of weeks for leaving a job rather than being let go.

Revenue's only involvement in PUP is supplying SW of a claimants earnings and if a claimant is working and claiming any benefits. Revenue do not administer PUP.

At some stage, I'm assuming employers may be contacted by SW to confirm employment status of PUP claimants that are confirming they are temporarily laid off and I presume at some stage those actually let go because of Covid-19 may be required to supply proof of this from former employers, I am only guessing and its really up in the air at the moment.

arex93

Dempo1 wrote: »

Not clear if your cousin is still working or not?, essentially the rules are clear, if you leave your job, you are not entitled to the payment, instead need to apply for JSA but will be penalised for a number of weeks for leaving a job rather than being let go.

Revenue's only involvement in PUP is supplying SW of a claimants earnings and if a claimant is working and claiming any benefits. Revenue do not administer PUP.

At some stage, I'm assuming employers may be contacted by SW to confirm employment status of PUP claimants that are confirming they are temporarily laid off and I presume at some stage those actually let go because of Covid-19 may be required to supply proof of this from former employers, I am only guessing and its really up in the air at the moment.

Got it. I thought the government had more control about who has the right to get the benefit. Unfortunately we can not expect that everyone is honest.

My cousin is not working anymore, her boss called her back several times... she said she would not come back and signed her resignation letter one month ago. She laugh at my face because she will do nothing until April and earn 300euros/week. Disgraceful.

Dempo1

arex93 wrote: »

Got it. I thought the government had more control about who has the right to get the benefit. Unfortunately we can not expect that everyone is honest.

My cousin is not working anymore, her boss called her back several times... she said she would not come back and signed her resignation letter one month ago. She laugh at my face because she will do nothing until April and earn 300euros/week. Disgraceful.

If SW contact your cousins former employer and they may, there'll be some explaining to do, it is disgr but I feel the vast majority on PUP are honest and decent and not on it out of choice, there's always going to be $€#ts unfortunately

kingbhome

edwardkiley wrote: »

hey everyone
Does anyone know what happens if I get paid for a weeks work in a new job and I still get a covid payment in?

Similar to someone I know. He did a job before the lockdown but didn't get paid untill last week by cheque. He's now afraid to put the cheque in the bank because it might look like he's working while getting the payment. However I've advised him just to phone the dole and let them know and let the bank know aswell. Or leave it until after the payment stops next week (or so I think, it's what I've read somewhere that all covid payments stop in September) and lodge then but definitely tell both about the situation.

Dempo1

kingbhome wrote: »

Similar to someone I know. He did a job before the lockdown but didn't get paid untill last week by cheque. He's now afraid to put the cheque in the bank because it might look like he's working while getting the payment. However I've advised him just to phone the dole and let them know and let the bank know aswell. Or leave it until after the payment stops next week (or so I think, it's what I've read somewhere that all covid payments stop in September) and lodge then but definitely tell both about the situation.

Are you saying it was money owed to you? if so not an issue,

if it wages earned from being back at work and you hadn't closed the PUP claim you need to check the payback option on the SW Site.

If it's a case, you returned to work, closed the payment on the day you returned to work (the correct thing to do) and got another payment, it's likely to have been your last payment as PUP is paid in arrears x 1 week which is fine

kingbhome

Dempo1 wrote: »

There will be no new PUP payments or claims processed after the 17th September. As of now, it' seems the government intention is to only offer JSA/JSB benefits to new claims after the 17th September if you loose your job having returned. That may changed with the various flip flops but its doubtful.

What if there's another lockdown. Surely they'll have to pay again. I know another person on it and is staying on it for this reason rather than going back to work. He was offered 2 weeks work but said if he signs of it, he's afraid he won't get back on it if there's another lockdown. I know it isn't right but he has to think about his future in all this. We know others who've committed suicide during the lockdown who hadn't a cent to there name because of one thing or another.

kingbhome

Dempo1 wrote: »

Are you saying it was money owed to you? if so not an issue,

if it wages earned from being back at work and you hadn't closed the PUP claim you need to check the payback option on the SW Site.

If it's a case, you returned to work, closed the payment on the day you returned to work (the correct thing to do) and got another payment, it's likely to have been your last payment as PUP is paid in arrears x 1 week which is fine

It's not me! But someone I know we'll. Yes it was money owed. I think it was 1500euro. He's afraid to lodge it while on the payment incase it gets stopped! The money was owed from the mid September but only got the cheque last week as the client of his fell into financial difficulty and only can pay now.