Working From Home Megathread

Sunny Disposition

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

If Facebook are insisting workers have to be in the office more than half the time that’s a relatively conservative move from them.

Just seen this update about facebooks policy.
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-57425636

Facebook's offices are expected to open to full capacity in October, but employees without permission to work remotely will have to come in at least half the time.


A Facebook executive, quoted by the Wall Street Journal, declined to say how many employees currently had permission to work from home, but said the company had approved about 90% of requests.

So it seems that only staff who have not been givern permission to continue WFH that are expected to spend half their time in the office.

Frank Bullitt

Supercell wrote: »

The argument that we should wear them to protect those who cannot get the vaccine holds little water. There are multiple types of vaccines, if there are people allergic to all then surely they are allergic to pretty much every other vaccine?
Or are so immunocompromised that they would be better off working at home anyhow instead of breathing office recycled air.
We haven't had to wear masks in the office for such individuals up until now so I imagine the numbers of these people are vanishingly small or have already got WFH agreements in place.

If it's to protect anti-vaxxers, why?, scientific discourse is clearly pointless:

https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1402729557136969728?s=20


Once Autumn comes and there are tiny numbers being admitted to hospital, if any, hopefully common sense will prevail and the masks in the office debate will be moot.

Good lord, that video brought pain on.

martingriff

AdamD wrote: »

Returning to the office with social distancing and masks is beyond pointless

Though wearing masks when everyone is vaccinated is baffling too

Social distancing and masks will be done away with as a guideline/rule before the autumn. Anyone who wishes to do so that's there own decisions

martingriff

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

I hate masks as much as anyone who wears one.

But we need to keep things in perspective. Some people cannot vaccinate, because of other issues they have. It's not always their choice.

That is not a new thing just because of COVID that is why we have a thing called herd immunity

givyjoe

JDD wrote: »

Well perhaps 24/7 is an over-exaggeration, but given I leave the house to take a train at 8am, spend a normal day at work, and then am on the train for an hour on the way home, that would mean I could be mask wearing for 11 hours on weekdays. Add in time spent in the shops or a restaurant or pub you'd definitely be wearing a mask for the large part of your waking hours.

I don't know how many people out there are so immune-compromised that the can't take a vaccine, but I imagine it's a very small number. Would it not be better for them to work in a closed off area in the office than insist that everyone else in the building, who is now vaccinated, wear a mask?

Ah come on now, are you serious? Work in a closed off section of the office?! Do they teleport in? Where do they eat, or what toilet facilities do they use..?! That's more reasonable than you having to wear a mask around others? What about people on those trains going to hospital appointments, who may well be one of those immunocompromised? The percentage of those folks might be small out of the total population, but from what I've read previously those numbers are in the 10's of thousands.

The logic behind vaccinated folks still wearing masks, its that we're not 100% sure they're not potentially infectious, nor are we sure how long protection lasts once vaccinated. There's already talk of the first folks vaccinated needing a booster. Not a dig at you, but I think a lot of folks are kidding themselves if they think we're returning to pre covid 'normal' by August/September.

Supercell

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Again, the vaccine stops you from getting very sick. It does not stop you from infecting others. Meaning it is irrelevant in assessing the risk you pose to others.

I'm sorry but I have to call you out on that, whilst it isnt certain, evidance is showing that isnt likely to be true :

https://www.health.com/condition/infectious-diseases/coronavirus/spread-covid-after-vaccine

So is it less likely that vaccinated people would pass the virus to others, vaccinated or not? Amesh A. Adalja, MD, senior scholar at the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security, says that that is what the study and Dr. Walensky's comments seem to suggest. "As the CDC director has stated, the new study provides real-world evidence that shows that if you are fully vaccinated, you are virtually unable to be infected with the virus or serve as a vector of spread," he tells Health.

But a spokesperson for the CDC has provided some clarity about what Dr. Walensky said on Maddow's show, telling The New York Times that "Dr. Walensky spoke broadly during this interview. It's possible that some people who are fully vaccinated could get COVID-19. The evidence isn't clear whether they can spread the virus to others. We are continuing to evaluate the evidence."

martingriff

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

In reality there are plenty of reason that tax rules cannot be changed.
As we have seen with Ireland and the corporate tax debates over the last few years countries are very slow to relinquish any sort of tax autonomy they may have, regardless of their support for single markets for goods and services.

While it would be nice to think that any company based in the EU could hire a remote employee based in any other EU country seamlessly the reality is that their is a myriad of implications to doing so that make it not seamless and it may be a long time before that changes.

For that to happen a more Federal (like the USA) will have to happen. I don't see that happening for a bit of time

martingriff

Deleted User wrote: »

Ya, I'm sure they will adjust pay, but if your ultimate aim was to move to work or move back to where you grew up it would still be a massive game changer.

Only if the company you work for have an entity in said country

martingriff

JDD wrote: »

Definitely right that's way off. I work in the public service and have a colleague who worked one day a week from London pre-pandemic. She pays her taxes here, like everyone else. No way our HR department would have allowed that had there been tax implications. One day a week adds up to about 10 weeks of employment.

Are they working in an embassy or something may have different rules

An Ri rua

martingriff wrote: »

Social distancing and masks will be done away with as a guideline/rule before the autumn. Anyone who wishes to do so that's there own decisions

We'll be going back to all the dirty gougers in offices who don't wash their hands after using a toilet. And there's lots of them, male, female, high ranking, low ranking.
Whatever about a pub, witnessing dirty filthbirds in work makes me all Howard Hughes.

Fr Tod Umptious

Quin_Dub wrote: »

A hospital in Houston has suspended ~175 staff pending dismissal for their refusal to get vaccinated.

You also have the stand-off between the Cruise-liner Companies and Texas/Florida over their ability to demand proof of vaccination from people wanting to travel on their ships

I expect we'll see more of this kind of thing.

Not sure about the legal position in Ireland , but I suspect that due to GDPR etc. companies aren't able to insist you reveal your vaccine status.

Hence the likelihood that Mask mandates are probably going to remain in place until well into the Autumn at least.

People need to stop tossing GDPR around at every hands turn.

GDPR is all about how information is handled, kept secure and destroyed.
It's not about what information a person is asked to disclose.

So if GDPR was in play here the cruise company could request your vaccination status, you would have to agree to giving and they could only use it for that purpose, would have secure and destroy it in a timely manner etc.

martingriff

An Ri rua wrote: »

We'll be going back to all the dirty gougers in offices who don't wash their hands after using a toilet. And there's lots of them, male, female, high ranking, low ranking.
Whatever about a pub, witnessing dirty filthbirds in work makes me all Howard Hughes.

You maybe right

lisasimpson

There will be some wfh but wont be as big as uptake as some may think. In our office feeders were sent out as to who would like to be partbof the 1st tranche to return to the office later in the summer and it was over subscribed. Was surprised who put their names down even those with an hours commute gave their names. Wfh wont suit everyone. For 20 and 30 somethings living in house/apt shares its v tough. Then you have single people living on their own who find they are v isolated. 2 of my friends cant wait to he back in the office a few days a week for this reason along even if they have to put up with the ofd hrad wrecker. If you are moving for a job been in the office will be a good way to get to know people. This age profile will always gravitate to the larger urban centres for social life etc reasons . Then there are others who want to get away from the maddness of young kids and trying to work. As a friend of mine said ntry explaining to 3 kids under 5 not to go near daddys office while hes trying to wfh doesnt always go to plan.
On top of that team days etc will become the new team bonding events in many mutlinationals. A lot of the new office developments in cork city have been snapped up recently so demand is still there.
Leo did have a point in saying the likes of induction people who have started jobs in the last 15 months. Some industries than others will suit WFH.
Government will be under pressure from vested interest from both return to office and wfh sides. The hyrid model probably suits the government best. Wfh a day or 2 a week or a week in office and a week from home etc. One of the advantages from government would be . Young families would have greater options of been able to live in more rural areas with remote working. This would help the state for example with the pressure for school places every year in the larger towns and cites. Many rural schools are crying out for enrollments to keep a teacher or in fact stop the school from closing.
Government are also relying on hubs as part of the rural rejuvenation plans. If you opt for hybrid to reduce mad commutes but doent want the isolation of wfh or need to get away from kids when off from schools these hubs will be a great option. Plus working in a hub could allow for some networking amoung professionals which could have positive results for job creation in rural areas.. part of rural rejuvenation is ensuring people feel part of a community. Less time commuting means more fmaily time or more time tonget involves in local sports ans socities so you dont feel so much of an outsider
There is going to be no clear winner in the full remote or full back to office debate. It will fall somewhere in between

Lillyfae

lisasimpson wrote: »

There will be some wfh but wont be as big as uptake as some may think. In our office feeders were sent out as to who would like to be partbof the 1st tranche to return to the office later in the summer and it was over subscribed. Was surprised who put their names down even those with an hours commute gave their names. Wfh wont suit everyone. For 20 and 30 somethings living in house/apt shares its v tough. Then you have single people living on their own who find they are v isolated. 2 of my friends cant wait to he back in the office a few days a week for this reason along even if they have to put up with the ofd hrad wrecker. If you are moving for a job been in the office will be a good way to get to know people. This age profile will always gravitate to the larger urban centres for social life etc reasons . Then there are others who want to get away from the maddness of young kids and trying to work. As a friend of mine said ntry explaining to 3 kids under 5 not to go near daddys office while hes trying to wfh doesnt always go to plan.
On top of that team days etc will become the new team bonding events in many mutlinationals. A lot of the new office developments in cork city have been snapped up recently so demand is still there.
Leo did have a point in saying the likes of induction people who have started jobs in the last 15 months. Some industries than others will suit WFH.
Government will be under pressure from vested interest from both return to office and wfh sides. The hyrid model probably suits the government best. Wfh a day or 2 a week or a week in office and a week from home etc. One of the advantages from government would be . Young families would have greater options of been able to live in more rural areas with remote working. This would help the state for example with the pressure for school places every year in the larger towns and cites. Many rural schools are crying out for enrollments to keep a teacher or in fact stop the school from closing.
Government are also relying on hubs as part of the rural rejuvenation plans. If you opt for hybrid to reduce mad commutes but doent want the isolation of wfh or need to get away from kids when off from schools these hubs will be a great option. Plus working in a hub could allow for some networking amoung professionals which could have positive results for job creation in rural areas.. part of rural rejuvenation is ensuring people feel part of a community. Less time commuting means more fmaily time or more time tonget involves in local sports ans socities so you dont feel so much of an outsider
There is going to be no clear winner in the full remote or full back to office debate. It will fall somewhere in between

What do you do in the office?

siblers

An Ri rua wrote: »

We'll be going back to all the dirty gougers in offices who don't wash their hands after using a toilet. And there's lots of them, male, female, high ranking, low ranking.
Whatever about a pub, witnessing dirty filthbirds in work makes me all Howard Hughes.

We used to get pizzas in our office, watching lads tear off slices knowing half of them didn't wash their hands always made me feel queasy.

Lillyfae

siblers wrote: »

We used to get pizzas in our office, watching lads tear off slices knowing half of them didn't wash their hands always made me feel queasy.

Or the people who come in dying sick to act the martyr, only to infect everyone else. We had someone come back from skiing in Italy like this weeks before the rumours of a serious virus turned out to be true. We could all work from home whenever we wanted even back then.

Bleurgh.

lisasimpson

After this whole covid thing there will be a kot less tolerance for people coming into the office sick. They will be told wfh. In a previous job someone landed into work with symptoms of the mumps. Thats just ignorant IMO

Aglomerado

An Ri rua wrote: »

We'll be going back to all the dirty gougers in offices who don't wash their hands after using a toilet. And there's lots of them, male, female, high ranking, low ranking.
Whatever about a pub, witnessing dirty filthbirds in work makes me all Howard Hughes.

I used to say about the last office I worked in that the Government Harp on the outside of the building should be replaced with a Biohazard symbol the way some of the inmates behaved.

Some of the stuff I've seen would make your eyes water. Even people eating lunch while sitting on the toilet.

In my current job people are a bit more civilised so when permitted I'd like to have the choice to come into the office at a couple of days a week.

I enjoy WFH but sometimes there is construction work or road maintenance going on near me and it's irritating - currently listening to a knobhead on a dump truck going past every five minutes.

Frank Bullitt

A close friend over here in Canada has changed job, the main swaying point for him? Being able to work from home.

It has a few less perks but the perk of working from home/anywhere pushed it over the line for him.

Confirmed today at 2 days a week in the office for us. I have no commitments in the office in terms of teams or other internal stakeholders (almost all my interaction with colleagues is over MS teams or zoom).....I just want to drop in for a change of scene and to see some other colleagues.

So figured 2 days each side of a weekend and then up to a week in the west. Suits me perfectly

JTMan

A few nuggets from a Sunday Times article (paywall) on the WFH tug-of-war ...

Another survey on WFH attitudes in the UK ...

9 per cent of employees favour hybrid working, 12 per cent want to work from the office full-time — and 38 per cent to work remotely full-time.

Deloitte are letting their UK staff make their own mind up as to where and when to work ...

On Friday, Deliotte was the latest to give its 20,000 employees the choice of when and where they work.

In terms of London, still very few people going into the office ...

15% office footfall in June 2021 compared to February 2020.

Big return expected in September (that reminds me of last year!) ...

“However, come September, after we have passed July 19 and the summer holiday period, we should reassess. The mood music by then is likely to look very different. At that stage, employers may feel emboldened to force the pace for the big return to work.”

BrianD3

Anyone see the FG party political broadcast last night? Lots of talk about improving things for workers, post pandemic. But not one mention of WFH or the right to request it. And in fact "returning to the office" was mentioned as one of the positive aspects of the end of the pandemic.

I'm not hopeful now about the right to request WFH that was announced by Varadkar a few months ago and was supposed to be in place by the end of 2021. No politician can be trusted but Varadkar is particularly bad. I fear now that the right to request WFH will be put on an infinitely long finger or else watered down enough to be useless.

Turtwig

This baffles me a little. Offices will require social distancing and masks. Or worse, if people are two metres apart they won't require masks.
All the things we've learned over the last year show this virus spreads so easily indoors. I would like hospitality to be given a chance. Adding in the risk of indoor areas filled with office workers just seems pointless to me. Can they even be as productive in a socially distanced one?

This pandemic isn't over until the globe is vaccinated. Why would we risk super spreading events in places where the livelihood of the business doesn't depend on it? Pubs and restaurants need to be given every chance the additional risk offices pose to the public level of infection just increase the risk to businesses in social settings that get impacted a lot harder by restrictions.

Mrs OBumble

JTMan wrote: »

A few nuggets from a Sunday Times article (paywall) on the WFH tug-of-war ...

Another survey on WFH attitudes in the UK ...

9 per cent of employees favour hybrid working, 12 per cent want to work from the office full-time — and 38 per cent to work remotely full-time.

So 9 + 38% = 47% want to work remotely some of the time.
Plus 12% working from the office. That takes it to 59%.

What do the other 41% want to do - stay on the dole?



I do think this September is still far too soon for a widespread return to avoidable congregated work settings : am not even convinced that indoor hospitality in July is a good idea.

Sultan of Bling

Mrs OBumble wrote:

I do think this September is still far too soon for a widespread return to avoidable congregated work settings : am not even convinced that indoor hospitality in July is a good idea.

I imagine it will all depend on the figures when indoor hospitality resumes.

I'm depressed just thinking about having to return to the office. The atmosphere in my workplace was toxic pre-lockdown. I'm dreading seeing some people again.

nearzero

Can anyone find the Government advice on Gov.ie in relation to working from home? My place is once again insisting on return to the office from 1st July - they did try in June, but it was pushed back to July and the only recourse we had before was showing them the official guidelines on Gov.ie but I cant seem to find them now at all! There is no mention of it for July

average_runner

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

So 9 + 38% = 47% want to work remotely some of the time.
Plus 12% working from the office. That takes it to 59%.

What do the other 41% want to do - stay on the dole?



I do think this September is still far too soon for a widespread return to avoidable congregated work settings : am not even convinced that indoor hospitality in July is a good idea.

Other countries are enjoying indoor hospitality successfully, why should we. Hungary football stadiums are full also for matches.


In America alot of companies have their staff back in the office also.


We got to move on with things, cant hide forever.



We have a hybrid model coming in soon.

Infoanon

color_girl wrote: »

Can anyone find the Government advice on Gov.ie in relation to working from home? My place is once again insisting on return to the office from 1st July - they did try in June, but it was pushed back to July and the only recourse we had before was showing them the official guidelines on Gov.ie but I cant seem to find them now at all! There is no mention of it for July

"You should continue to work from home where possible" - this is unchanged from previous. Politicians have been mentioning a return for interns in August might be possible IF public health guidance allows it.

In the UK transport companies have introduced 2 and 3 day weekly tickets to meet the demand from Hybrid workers.

nearzero

Infoanon wrote: »

"You should continue to work from home where possible" - this is unchanged from previous. Politicians have been mentioning a return for interns in August might be possible IF public health guidance allows it.

In the UK transport companies have introduced 2 and 3 day weekly tickets to meet the demand from Hybrid workers.

I know it hasnt changed but my company refuses to acknowledge it and I wanted to send them the gov.ie link because that worked before but now I cant see on the website anywhere! Where did you see it?

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/7894b-post-cabinet-statement-resilience-and-recovery-the-path-ahead/#your-quick-guide-to-the-changes

JohnK

color_girl wrote: »

I know it hasnt changed but my company refuses to acknowledge it and I wanted to send them the gov.ie link because that worked before but now I cant see on the website anywhere! Where did you see it?

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/7894b-post-cabinet-statement-resilience-and-recovery-the-path-ahead/#your-quick-guide-to-the-changes

From that link in the section Under consideration for August you have the following text: There are uncertainties and these will continue to be closely monitored by Government over the coming weeks. People should continue to work from home unless necessary to attend in person.