Coronavirus Pandemic Information- Local and Worldwide

endainoz

The majority of people in my own age group (mid 30s) are quite eager to get it. The ironic thing of course is that the same couple that are dead set against getting it are the same lads who wouldn't have any issue with what sh1te they put into their bodies on a Saturday night.

Morris Moss

green daries wrote: »

It will the amazing thing is that it hasn't happened but the real kicker is that we got really lucky as a species because of the age group it really attacked first it was expected that it would be like the kanas flu and would wipe out children and young people

You'd give George Lee a run for his money with this scaremongering.

Nekarsulm

carrollsno1 wrote: »

Ive a cousin who thinks there is something really sinister going on and he gets very upset when people mention the vaccine around him, its advised to leave the house if he kicks off over it. The PUP has him destroyed i cant see him ever working again, at a family wedding the first ftom our generation he declared hell never give us a day out as he doesnt want the government getting involved in his life. But ar the sane time you have the extremists on the other side too and as the song goes "clowns to the left of me, jokers to my right and here i am stuck in the middle with you.

Vaccine or no vaccine, sooner or later, we all give our friend and family a "day out"...

wrangler

carrollsno1 wrote: »

Ive a cousin who thinks there is something really sinister going on and he gets very upset when people mention the vaccine around him, its advised to leave the house if he kicks off over it. The PUP has him destroyed i cant see him ever working again, at a family wedding the first ftom our generation he declared hell never give us a day out as he doesnt want the government getting involved in his life. But ar the sane time you have the extremists on the other side too and as the song goes "clowns to the left of me, jokers to my right and here i am stuck in the middle with you.

If he's getting the PUP, the govrnment is already on to him

carrollsno1

wrangler wrote: »

If he's getting the PUP, the govrnment is already on to him

I know hes away with the birds, only against the establishment when it suits but is damn glad to take whatever payment he can from it.

yosemitesam1

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

Not true. Covid will still be here if we vaccinate everyone on the planet. It's going nowhere regardless of vaccination.

A young person needs to decide if the risk of being infected with a disease that causes no symptoms to mild cold symptoms is a risk worth taking. There's zero need for it. All those who had a use for it are covered at this stage.

A large percentage of the population not being vaccinated is a great thing to have to reduce selection pressure for variants that will be highly effective at circumventing vaccine immunity

I have actively tuned out of Covid stuff tbh, but something struck me reading the above was when the photos came from the inside of Italian hospitals first, it wasn't all old fogeys with bubbles on their heads in ICU.

green daries

Morris Moss wrote: »

You'd give George Lee a run for his money with this scaremongering.

Yup whatever you think but that's the way it generally works that's how pandemics usually go because usually the older people have had some sort of encounter with the virus that hits guess what we've a vaccine to prevent it which I've said is totally safe so wouldn't think it's much for scare mongering

yosemitesam1

Deleted User wrote: »

I have actively tuned out of Covid stuff tbh, but something struck me reading the above was when the photos came from the inside of Italian hospitals first, it wasn't all old fogeys with bubbles on their heads in ICU.

Covid has never been a major issue for the young. Either that photo was not representative or else that was very early on in the pandemic when it was wrongfully decided that the only way to give oxygen was with ventilators so as to prevent the creation of aerosols

yosemitesam1

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

Covid has never been a major issue for the young. Either that photo was not representative or else that was very early on in the pandemic when it was wrongfully decided that the only way to give oxygen was with ventilators so as to prevent the creation of aerosols

Either, or, it's an imperfect situation.

Am I happy taking the vaccine today given it's so new in relative terms, not really, but I got it.

Am I happy getting Covid, not knowing possible long term issues, not really, but I hope not to get it.

amacca

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

A large percentage of the population not being vaccinated is a great thing to have to reduce selection pressure for variants that will be highly effective at circumventing vaccine immunity

Am I understanding the above correctly?

Are you saying that if a large group remains unvaccinated then the virus won't evolve as much as it won't meet as many hosts it has to change in order to infect?

Whereas if nearly everyone is vaccinated then only the virus that evolves can infect?

That seems a bit off to me as I would have thought the every time it gets passed on it is a chance for it to mutate so if a large group is unvaccinated you have more instances of transmission and therefore mutation and a greater chance of new variants which could represent even more of a problem......

Morris Moss

green daries wrote: »

Yup whatever you think but that's the way it generally works that's how pandemics usually go because usually the older people have had some sort of encounter with the virus that hits guess what we've a vaccine to prevent it which I've said is totally safe so wouldn't think it's much for scare mongering

A virus that has a 99.97% survival rate, enjoy your safe vaccine.

endainoz

Morris Moss wrote: »

A virus that has a 99.97% survival rate, enjoy your safe vaccine.

It's 97% when your talking millions of people that's a huge difference.

green daries

Morris Moss wrote: »

A virus that has a 99.97% survival rate, enjoy your safe vaccine.

Yes they do but they with the help of vaccines become a background thing mostly like the common cold or flu it will just be another one to live with and some deaths hopefully it will be a century or more for the next one to come along.
I will thank god its available to those who want to take it an I hope you enjoy whatever you choose be it vaccine or not as long as people are healthy and there loved ones are protected as much as possible that's all that matters to me

yosemitesam1

amacca wrote: »

Am I understanding the above correctly?

Are you saying that if a large group remains unvaccinated then the virus won't evolve as much as it won't meet as many hosts it has to change in order to infect?

Whereas if nearly everyone is vaccinated then only the virus that evolves can infect?

That seems a bit off to me as I would have thought the every time it gets passed on it is a chance for it to mutate so if a large group is unvaccinated you have more instances of transmission and therefore mutation and a greater chance of new variants which could represent even more of a problem......

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying.
Evolution is not just a numbers game. It is selection pressure that drives new variants.
Natural infection has a tiny amount of selection pressure in comparison to antibody therapy or a vaccine which only targets a very small portion of the virus.
What you will find with natural infection is that a wide range of antibodies are created that target the whole virus. Thus a mutation in one area does not lead to a large drop in immunity. So a new variant comes along and a large amount of immunity remains, spread of new variant is limited and it is unlikely to have any significant advantage over previous strains.
Compare that to someone relying entirely on the vaccine immunity. Small changes in the spike can lead to significant drops in immunity, which will then eventually lead us into a self reinforcing cycle of reducing effectiveness of the vaccine (unless it's constantly reformulated). As the only strains in circulation will be the ones that are ever evolving against vaccine immunity.
That will make little difference to the majority of the population but for those who need protection most, it could make all the difference.

amacca

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying.
Evolution is not just a numbers game. It is selection pressure that drives new variants.
Natural infection has a tiny amount of selection pressure in comparison to antibody therapy or a vaccine which only targets a very small portion of the virus.
What you will find with natural infection is that a wide range of antibodies are created that target the whole virus. Thus a mutation in one area does not lead to a large drop in immunity. So a new variant comes along and a large amount of immunity remains, spread of new variant is limited and it is unlikely to have any significant advantage over previous strains.
Compare that to someone relying entirely on the vaccine immunity. Small changes in the spike can lead to significant drops in immunity, which will then eventually lead us into a self reinforcing cycle of reducing effectiveness of the vaccine (unless it's constantly reformulated). As the only strains in circulation will be the ones that are ever evolving against vaccine immunity.
That will make little difference to the majority of the population but for those who need protection most, it could make all the difference.

Thank you. Every day is a school day!

So in your opinion a cohort unvaccinated isnt necessarily a bad thing. Is there an ideal percentage of population to remain unvaccinated?

dzer2

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying.
Evolution is not just a numbers game. It is selection pressure that drives new variants.
Natural infection has a tiny amount of selection pressure in comparison to antibody therapy or a vaccine which only targets a very small portion of the virus.
What you will find with natural infection is that a wide range of antibodies are created that target the whole virus. Thus a mutation in one area does not lead to a large drop in immunity. So a new variant comes along and a large amount of immunity remains, spread of new variant is limited and it is unlikely to have any significant advantage over previous strains.
Compare that to someone relying entirely on the vaccine immunity. Small changes in the spike can lead to significant drops in immunity, which will then eventually lead us into a self reinforcing cycle of reducing effectiveness of the vaccine (unless it's constantly reformulated). As the only strains in circulation will be the ones that are ever evolving against vaccine immunity.
That will make little difference to the majority of the population but for those who need protection most, it could make all the difference.

While I believe the same just to remind ye that this virus mutated before any vaccine was given and seems to mutate in mostly unvaccinated countries where there should have being an element of herd immunity. It is why I am of the believe this didn't come from a market in China. I also think we and the world should start to live with it. If your vulnerable then mind yourself, if you are likely to come in contact with some that could give it to you then take precautions.

yosemitesam1

amacca wrote: »

Thank you. Every day is a school day!

So in your opinion a cohort unvaccinated isnt necessarily a bad thing. Is there an ideal percentage of population to remain unvaccinated?

Vaccinate the bare minimum, those at most risk only and then the healthy and young can get natural immunity. That would prolong the effectiveness of the vaccine in the most at risk groups.
Ideally antibody therapy would also be abandoned. Then there would be very little pressure to select for new variants and things would reach an equilibrium with covid much faster.

yosemitesam1

dzer2 wrote: »

While I believe the same just to remind ye that this virus mutated before any vaccine was given and seems to mutate in mostly unvaccinated countries where there should have being an element of herd immunity. It is why I am of the believe this didn't come from a market in China. I also think we and the world should start to live with it. If your vulnerable then mind yourself, if you are likely to come in contact with some that could give it to you then take precautions.

I posted reseach a few days ago about the effect of giving plasma to a longer term infected person. That sort of treatment is by far the most likely source of the new variants we've seen over the past year.
The effects of mass vaccination will take longer to show

dzer2

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

I posted reseach a few days ago about the effect of giving plasma to a longer term infected person. That sort of treatment is by far the most likely source of the new variants we've seen over the past year.
The effects of mass vaccination will take longer to show

Not picking a fight but your saying that Brazil South Africa and India were at this practice

yosemitesam1

dzer2 wrote: »

Not picking a fight but your saying that Brazil South Africa and India were at this practice

Yes

jaymla627

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

I posted reseach a few days ago about the effect of giving plasma to a longer term infected person. That sort of treatment is by far the most likely source of the new variants we've seen over the past year.
The effects of mass vaccination will take longer to show

The covid testing in america is been gamed too, the thresehold for a positive covid test in a non vaccinated case is up to 35, for a vaccinated person the thresehold is under 25, the latest doomsday scenario been spun with the delta variant is the vaccinces are ineffective at preventing infection of it, thats why Tony and co are sh**ting the bed....
Its going to be fascinating to see when the 360 is done by the pharma industry re the use of ivermectin, im not confident they will just own up to it be a effective treatment, until the thing really goes sideways

yosemitesam1

jaymla627 wrote: »

The covid testing in america is been gamed too, the thresehold for a positive covid test in a non vaccinated case is up to 35, for a vaccinated person the thresehold is under 25, the latest doomsday scenario been spun with the delta variant is the vaccinces are ineffective at preventing infection of it, thats why Tony and co are sh**ting the bed....
Its going to be fascinating to see when the 360 is done by the pharma industry re the use of ivermectin, im not confident they will just own up to it be a effective treatment, until the thing really goes sideways

We see some of that here. Give it a few weeks and we'll be getting told how its almost entirely unvaccinated getting infected. All because being vaccinated means one isnt a close contact

yosemitesam1

Tony very much appears to be in control now.
Hopefully this is the straw that breaks the camels back...

Water John

A lot of stuff is back pretty close to normal. Indoor gatherings is the main restriction. Whether that be dining, pubs, concerts or religious ceremonies. This is not a savage imposition and waiting a bit longer on those, won't kill anyone, whilst the opposite will.
Go for a nice walk in the lovely summer.

Stop personalising it with, TONY.

mahoney_j

Water John wrote: »

A lot of stuff is back pretty close to normal. Indoor gatherings is the main restriction. Whether that be dining, pubs, concerts or religious ceremonies. This is not a savage imposition and waiting a bit longer on those, won't kill anyone, whilst the opposite will.
Go for a nice walk in the lovely summer.

Stop personalising it with, TONY.

What’s pissing me off with them is the mixed messages and afraid to make a hard decision .4 million vaccinated ,vulnerable snd old age covered hospital numbers low and we still persist with lockdowns ….business and lives been destroyed ….then look across Europe big crowds in stadiums indoor dining open weeks and there living with this …..we’re not been given the chance ff fg Michael Leo are all finished snd will be wiped out at next election ….they had a chance to redeem themselves a bit here and show a bit of bottle but failed miserably …..the Christmas and January arguemrnt dosnt wash as no vacines then

Water John

Fully vaccinated is what counts in this scenario. That one vaccine calculation that UK went with is now for nought. Managing a changing scenario means being willing the tweak the plan. The far easier political stroke would have been to stick to their openings.
By July 19th a much higher % will be fully vaccinated, both the vulnerable and over 50s. Really doesn't bother me, cooking my own dinner.

mahoney_j

Water John wrote: »

Fully vaccinated is what counts in this scenario. That one vaccine calculation that UK went with is now for nought. Managing a changing scenario means being willing the tweak the plan. The far easier political stroke would have been to stick to their openings.
By July 19th a much higher % will be fully vaccinated, both the vulnerable and over 50s. Really doesn't bother me, cooking my own dinner.

I just don’t buy that narrative ….even more so looking to Europe and there is no guarntee for July 19 either ….time to just start living with this

yosemitesam1

Water John wrote: »

Fully vaccinated is what counts in this scenario. That one vaccine calculation that UK went with is now for nought. Managing a changing scenario means being willing the tweak the plan. The far easier political stroke would have been to stick to their openings.
By July 19th a much higher % will be fully vaccinated, both the vulnerable and over 50s. Really doesn't bother me, cooking my own dinner.

Theres still an awful lot of things we cant do and this is further pushing back everything INDEFINITELY. There will always be a reason why we shouldn't open up fully but we have to grow a pair of balls and get on with things.
If that means people like yourself who feel very safe under restrictions no longer feel safe, there's no reason you can't hide under the bed, get your food delivered to the door and never leave the house again until it's in a wooden box.
But the rest of us deserve to be given a shot at leading a full life without this nonsense

paddysdream

Water John wrote: »

A lot of stuff is back pretty close to normal. Indoor gatherings is the main restriction. Whether that be dining, pubs, concerts or religious ceremonies. This is not a savage imposition and waiting a bit longer on those, won't kill anyone, whilst the opposite will.
Go for a nice walk in the lovely summer.

Stop personalising it with, TONY.

If you think things are almost back to normal then I wonder what you consider normal ?
No attendance at matches ,no pubs open for normal service ,restricted numbers at weddings/funerals ,wearing a mask everytime you go into a shop ,no indoor dining ,fill out covid app for kids training ,everywhere you go for medical type stuff its 20 questions ,talk of masks for kids again in school next term ,swimming pool numbers limited ,no indoor classes,meetings etc allowed .

Maybe waiting a bit longer is like covid ie it won't kill you .

mahoney_j

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

Theres still an awful lot of things we cant do and this is further pushing back everything INDEFINITELY. There will always be a reason why we shouldn't open up fully but we have to grow a pair of balls and get on with things.
If that means people like yourself who feel very safe under restrictions no longer feel safe, there's no reason you can't hide under the bed, get your food delivered to the door and never leave the house again until it's in a wooden box.
But the rest of us deserve to be given a shot at leading a full life without this nonsense

Tad harsh but bang on the money