what CoronaVirus precautions are your club taking?

downthemiddle

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Well you might want to check on the accuracy of your statement before you put on that berating tone.

Which part do you find inaccurate?

CalamariFritti

The one with all sporting activity. As far as I know its still fine to go out for a run or a cycle or a swim. Whats the difference?

Seve OB

CalamariFritti wrote: »

The one with all sporting activity. As far as I know its still fine to go out for a run or a cycle or a swim. Whats the difference?

please look at my post above and tell me what is the difference in keeping certain golf clubs open when every club in the country was told to shut.

CalamariFritti

Seve OB wrote: »

please look at my post above and tell me what is the difference in keeping certain golf clubs open when every club in the country was told to shut.

Ye I concede that one. That all clubs line escaped me. I guess the GUI had not much choice then. I admit defeat.

However I still think that it is not of any practical value and should be reviewed as soon as we can. Golf is the one sport that still can be played safely. Of course the Taoiseach can't make reference to every single sport out there so he's going to say all clubs. I'm pretty sure paragliders and divers and surfers etc are kinda safe from corvid19 too and there will be other sports like that.

Rikand

Glasson golf club remains open to members only. 2balls only unless in a family unit in which case 4 is allowed.

Privately owned club

TaurenDruid

Guess golf clubs are an essential service, then? Ffs...

:rolleyes:

BoldReason

What this pandemic has thought me more than anything else is that you can't teach some people not to be ****ing idiots.

Seve OB

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Ye I concede that one. That all clubs line escaped me. I guess the GUI had not much choice then. I admit defeat.

However I still think that it is not of any practical value and should be reviewed as soon as we can. Golf is the one sport that still can be played safely. Of course the Taoiseach can't make reference to every single sport out there so he's going to say all clubs. I'm pretty sure paragliders and divers and surfers etc are kinda safe from corvid19 too and there will be other sports like that.

look, there are lots of things people can do that are safe and I totally agree that golf is one of them. But the point is that every single time anybody goes out into the wider community it adds to the risk of spreading the virus. We are trying to stop it, not spread it, so every single one of us has a responsibility (not only to ourselves and our families, but also to our friends, colleagues and every other citizen in Ireland and around the world) to act in a responsible manner and limit our movements. Not only that, imagine you are travelling to play golf or to the paragliding place or the beach to go scuba diving and have a crash or get caught in the rocks or whatever. Now you have to drag resources away from where they are essentially needed at the front line of battling this corona bastard. That is a pretty selfish move.

Here is a few snippets more from Leo

So, I am asking you to stay home if at all possible. That is the best way to slow the virus, ensure our hospitals are not overwhelmed.

So, you should only leave home to go to work if you can’t work from home and your attendance is essential.
You should only go to the shops for essential supplies, out for medical or dental appointments, to care for others or to take physical exercise.

No unnecessary travel should take place within the country or overseas, now or over the Easter break.

So it's not a lot to ask is it? .... eh we need your help..... please do nothing!!!

Roger_007

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Guess golf clubs are an essential service, then? Ffs...

:rolleyes:

It might be more essential than you think, not particularly golf but just outdoor activity. There is a real problem with people who live alone and who are imprisoned in their own homes, effectively in solitary confinement. I phoned a friend of mine this morning and with whom I often play golf with. He retired a few years ago and is in perfect health. He said that he might last a week or two at this cocooning lark but he’s already starting to get very depressed at the thought that this could go on for months.
He loves his golf, he has no other hobby or passtime. I think the effect on mental health of this policy has been underestimated. This will become clearer as time goes on.

zep

I love how people are spending so much time berating their fellow golfing enthusiasts.
I'm sitting here at work, in an environment with 1200 other people, and being told that this project is critical so stay at work, and you guys are arguing if golf clubs should be open or closed.
I for one would feel so much safer on a golf course that being forced into my current situation.
And while certain things are handled correctly by the government, what good is it closing a golf course when thousands are being forced to continue attending their work site where social distancing is impossible or at least more difficult than on a golf course?
Unless all places, excluding the real essentials (food, chemist etc under tight control) are told to close, this half arsed policy is not going to work.

Remind me

Roger_007 wrote: »

I went to my local park this morning for a walk. It’s not a very big park but there were literally hundreds of people out walking, some with dogs and kids. There were no Gardai there and it’s too small a park to have rangers.
I didn’t go out, I came home again but I couldn’t help thinking of my local golf club with 150 acres of beautiful parkland and the gates locked.
Does anyone have a reasonable explanation why loads of people can be out in the local park and why nobody can be out on a golf course which is jus another kind of park? If one is not safe then neither is the other.

Fully agree.

I have come into closer contact going for a walk around the block with the kids than I have playing over the last couple of weeks.

benny79

This is whats doing my head in! loads of numpties are not hearing to it! Im just back from my lunch (I head home) the amount of people gathering, walking together hanging out really is unbelievable! I fear especially when the weather gets better it will worsen. I really cant see this ended anytime soon.

CalamariFritti

Hi Seve_OB,

I get all that. But here is my worry.

We can't stop it. The projections are that the vast majority of the population will get it. It will go right through. Thats like 5 million people. Lets assume conservatively half them will get it anyway. Thats 2.5 million people.

So we went to keep the curve low to allow our hospitals to accommodate everyone who needs medical attention. Also we need to have capacity for the ones that need intensive care which is even more limited.

Again with current projections lets say 10% will need medical attention and 5% need ICU attention.

I read our ICU capacity is 6 beds per 100,000 people. With 5 million people that makes it 300 ICU beds. But 5% out 2.5 million is still 125,000 people.

If you want to keep the curve flat enough to funnel 125,000 people through 300 ICU beds we gonna be at this for quite some time. Like for years and years. At the very least until a cure or a vaccine is available.

Now don't kill me for those numbers. I kept it simple and rounded liberally..

Anyway, the message is this is going to last a long time. Leo even said it. 'We're in it for the long haul'.

In the meantime we need to stay sane and eek out whatever little bit of normality we can. Its bad enough as it is. Confined to home. No time out for a beer. Nothing on the telly but fkn corona up and down all day long. No footie, no nothing.

The last thing we want is to shut down whatever little refuges we still have out of panic and herd pressure. Which is definitely there. You can see it on the comments here. People showing up in the golf forum who are never here just to show some contempt. The herd pressure is strong.

Its really bad but lets not make it worse than it has to be.

GreeBo

CalamariFritti wrote: »

But thats the thing, this recommendation is not coming from experts, they're coming from the GUI. The GUI are no medical experts, they're just covering their arses. The actual experts are not calling for outdoor activities to be ceased given the right precautions. Quite the opposite.

Roger_007 wrote: »

The ‘experts’ in this case are not the GUI, it is the medical experts that we need to listen to. Roganstown say they are following all the recommendations laid down by the government and the medics. This is not difficult to do on a golf course.
What the GUI did was done for purely PR purposes whereby the don’t want to incur any criticism.
Golf is one pastime that we could continue to enjoy while absolutely adhering to the guidelines. This is the view that Roganstown have taken and I applaud them for it.

You mean other than the Taoiseach saying all *clubs* in Ireland are to close?

prawnsambo

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Hi Seve_OB,

I get all that. But here is my worry.

We can't stop it. The projections are that the vast majority of the population will get it. It will go right through. Thats like 5 million people. Lets assume conservatively half them will get it anyway. Thats 2.5 million people.

You are quite wrong here. The total number of cases worldwide the other day was 330k. The total in China was just over 100k. In a country of 2 billion people. They were fairly draconian in China and kept the numbers down, but Wuhan alone has a population of 10 million. The projections depend on a number of factors and social distancing is a huge one. The contact tracing here went from 20 people per infection down to just under five in a couple of weeks.

That's how you beat it. It's how they did it in China and it's the only way. Cut down on contacts so that the curve is flattened and eventually the increases start to tail off and go into decline.

The whole country will NOT get it.

GreeBo

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Hi Seve_OB,

I get all that. But here is my worry.

We can't stop it. The projections are that the vast majority of the population will get it. It will go right through. Thats like 5 million people. Lets assume conservatively half them will get it anyway. Thats 2.5 million people.

So we went to keep the curve low to allow our hospitals to accommodate everyone who needs medical attention. Also we need to have capacity for the ones that need intensive care which is even more limited.

Again with current projections lets say 10% will need medical attention and 5% need ICU attention.

I read our ICU capacity is 6 beds per 100,000 people. With 5 million people that makes it 300 ICU beds. But 5% out 2.5 million is still 125,000 people.

If you want to keep the curve flat enough to funnel 125,000 people through 300 ICU beds we gonna be at this for quite some time. Like for years and years. At the very least until a cure or a vaccine is available.

Now don't kill me for those numbers. I kept it simple and rounded liberally..

Anyway, the message is this is going to last a long time. Leo even said it. 'We're in it for the long haul'.

In the meantime we need to stay sane and eek out whatever little bit of normality we can. Its bad enough as it is. Confined to home. No time out for a beer. Nothing on the telly but fkn corona up and down all day long. No footie, no nothing.

The last thing we want is to shut down whatever little refuges we still have out of panic and herd pressure. Which is definitely there. You can see it on the comments here. People showing up in the golf forum who are never here just to show some contempt. The herd pressure is strong.

Its really bad but lets not make it worse than it has to be.

We are all going to get it.
Our healthcare system (just like the much more sophisticated Italian one) would be overwhelmed if the virus is allowed to spread unchecked.
The goal of social distancing is to slow down the rate of infection, thats it.
There is no attempt to stop people getting it, as that is pretty much impossible.
All interactions that have been deemed non critical have been suspended.


I do understand the annoyance and inconvenience
I dont understand the confusion.

CalamariFritti

prawnsambo wrote: »

You are quite wrong here. The total number of cases worldwide the other day was 330k. The total in China was just over 100k. In a country of 2 billion people. They were fairly draconian in China and kept the numbers down, but Wuhan alone has a population of 10 million. The projections depend on a number of factors and social distancing is a huge one. The contact tracing here went from 20 people per infection down to just under five in a couple of weeks.

That's how you beat it. It's how they did it in China and it's the only way. Cut down on contacts so that the curve is flattened and eventually the increases start to tail off and go into decline.

The whole country will NOT get it.

I think you're wrong there. Our experts have long ago given up the idea that they can stop it. Thats not me making this up, that message is out there everywhere. The WHO says it. Its in the word pandemic.

China did what they did by virtually halting the country. China closed everything. I mean everything. People weren't going to work. Not just people working in restaurants. I mean everyone. City streets are/were deserted. Like something out of a zombie movie. Still is in most parts.

Economical pressure is still way too strong here to even consider that. The economy has to be ticking over.

And whether China beat it that remains to be seen. I very much doubt it

Because in any case. What do you think will happen after 1 month, 2 months, 6 months of lockdown, does it matter? We will have slowed it but we won't have it eradicated. We'll be just back to square one. You open up for normal life and it will be right back on the scene and here comes the curve again. Pandora is out of the box, it won't be put back into it.

We will have to live with it forever probably the only difference will be eventually there will be medication, vaccines, herd immunity whatever.

CalamariFritti

GreeBo wrote: »

We are all going to get it.
Our healthcare system (just like the much more sophisticated Italian one) would be overwhelmed if the virus is allowed to spread unchecked.
The goal of social distancing is to slow down the rate of infection, thats it.
There is no attempt to stop people getting it, as that is pretty much impossible.
All interactions that have been deemed non critical have been suspended.


I do understand the annoyance and inconvenience
I dont understand the confusion.

There is no confusion. There is just the fact that we won't be able to live in lockdown forever or even for any length of time. We will have to find scraps of normality just to stay sane. We really don't want to self police ourselves into stuff that isn't really necessary.

Anyway I think I'm kinda done now, getting tired of this. We'll see.

prawnsambo

CalamariFritti wrote: »

I think you're wrong there. Our experts have long ago given up the idea that they can stop it. Thats not me making this up, that message is out there everywhere. The WHO says it. Its in the word pandemic.

China did what they did by virtually halting the country. China closed everything. I mean everything. People weren't going to work. Not just people working in restaurants. I mean everyone. City streets are/were deserted. Like something out of a zombie movie. Still is in most parts.

Economical pressure is still way too strong here to even consider that. The economy has to be ticking over.

And whether China beat it that remains to be seen. I very much doubt it

Because in any case. What do you think will happen after 1 month, 2 months, 6 months of lockdown, does it matter? We will have slowed it but we won't have it eradicated. We'll be just back to square one. You open up for normal life and it will be right back on the scene and here comes the curve again. Pandora is out of the box, it won't be put back into it.

We will have to live with it forever probably the only difference will be eventually there will be medication, vaccines whatever.

You don't seem to understand what the word 'pandemic' means. It does NOT mean everyone gets it. Look back at the other pandemics through history and the numbers don't add up to even a fraction of the population. An epidemic is a localised outbreak, a pandemic is a worldwide outbreak. As an example, the H1N1 flu outbreak was classed as a pandemic. It was estimated that 700 million to 1.4 billion people got it. Frightening as that is, it was still less than a fifth of the world's population and there was nothing like the current measures taken to stem it. Also, a vaccine was produced within 14 months of the estimated first cases. That was in 2009. Have you heard of H1N1 since?

CalamariFritti

prawnsambo wrote: »

You don't seem to understand what the word 'pandemic' means. It does NOT mean everyone gets it. Look back at the other pandemics through history and the numbers don't add up to even a fraction of the population. An epidemic is a localised outbreak, a pandemic is a worldwide outbreak. As an example, the H1N1 flu outbreak was classed as a pandemic. It was estimated that 700 million to 1.4 billion people got it. Frightening as that is, it was still less than a fifth of the world's population and there was nothing like the current measures taken to stem it. Also, a vaccine was produced within 14 months of the estimated first cases.

Seems I'm not done.

I understand that pandemic doesn't mean everyone gets it. Ot at least not that everyone gets sick from it.

Our own experts expect 60% of the population to get it.

In any case. I was only flinging those numbers around to illustrate that this is going to take a long time.

Euphoriasean

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Seems I'm not done.

I understand that pandemic doesn't mean everyone gets it. Ot at least not that everyone gets sick from it.

Our own experts expect 60% of the population to get it.

In any case. I was only flinging those numbers around to illustrate that this is going to take a long time.

I thought you were done after you slated the GUI for 2 days then admitted you were in the wrong by not reading the government directive.

TaurenDruid

Roger_007 wrote: »

It might be more essential than you think, not particularly golf but just outdoor activity. There is a real problem with people who live alone and who are imprisoned in their own homes, effectively in solitary confinement. I phoned a friend of mine this morning and with whom I often play golf with. He retired a few years ago and is in perfect health. He said that he might last a week or two at this cocooning lark but he’s already starting to get very depressed at the thought that this could go on for months.
He loves his golf, he has no other hobby or passtime. I think the effect on mental health of this policy has been underestimated. This will become clearer as time goes on.

He can go for a walk, or a run if he runs, by himself, or with others from his house, without putting anyone else at risk.

Going to a golf club means someone has to open the club, water the fairways and greens, cut the grass, open and staff the clubhouse, etc., etc.

What part of "stay at home unless you must go to work, or go to the shops" is hard to understand. There's even an exemption for daily exercise. Just not 5 hours on a golf course which necessarily puts other people at risk!

slave1

TaurenDruid wrote: »

He can go for a walk, or a run if he runs, by himself, or with others from his house, without putting anyone else at risk.

Going to a golf club means someone has to open the club, water the fairways and greens, cut the grass, open and staff the clubhouse, etc., etc.

What part of "stay at home unless you must go to work, or go to the shops" is hard to understand. There's even an exemption for daily exercise. Just not 5 hours on a golf course which necessarily puts other people at risk!

I'm skipping golf for the time being but just to say, no one has to "open" the majority of clubs, you just drive in, few clubs water fairways and certainly not at this time of the year, greens are sprinklers and timed if necessary, clubhouse and pro shop do not have to open if course restricts to members only.
Yes, course will need to be cut

prawnsambo

slave1 wrote: »

I'm skipping golf for the time being but just to say, no one has to "open" the majority of clubs, you just drive in, few clubs water fairways and certainly not at this time of the year, greens are sprinklers and timed if necessary, clubhouse and pro shop do not have to open if course restricts to members only.
Yes, course will need to be cut

The GUI advice is to continue maintenance during the lockdown. There was specific advice in their email on how to do that safely.

downthemiddle

The Roll of Shame

1 Roganstown
2 Swords Open
3 European Club
4 Glasson
5 K Club
6 Druid's Glen
7 Arklow (members only)

Any more to add to the boycott list?

Slimity

downthemiddle wrote: »

The Roll of Shame

1 Roganstown
2 Swords Open
3 European Club
4 Glasson
5 K Club
6 Druid's Glen
7 Arklow (members only)

Any more to add to the boycott list?

You may want to remove Druid's Glen from that list.

downthemiddle

Slimity wrote: »

You may want to remove Druid's Glen from that list.

When did it close?

Slimity

downthemiddle wrote: »

When did it close?

It is closed. Are you sure of your assertions on the others?

HighLine

Druids Glen reconsidered their stance yesterday and decided to close to members as well.

Also I believe Arklow are closed. One of their staff confirmed it to be closed on Irish Golf Noticeboard.

downthemiddle

Slimity wrote: »

It is closed. Are you sure of your assertions on the others?

They are all courses that ignored the initial directive to close. Some have closed since.