Football & Coronavirus [READ MOD NOTE IN FIRST POST - updated 06-05-20]

8-10

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

We have a lit of catching up to do. Still not in the phase of printing out ABL shirts like ABU ones in 90s yet x

I take the fact that many Man U fans wanted City to win the league last year as a massive compliment.

No issues with people being afraid of us winning things

The_Kew_Tour

8-10 wrote: »

I take the fact that many Man U fans wanted City to win the league last year as a massive compliment.

No issues with people being afraid of us winning things

2012 :cool:

sideswipe

Chuck Noland wrote: »

So it’s now gone from you KNOW to probably having meetings, that’s a big shift of the goal posts on your earlier statement. Actually come to think of it, it’s a completely new statement to your original one which you tried to defend a second time in a follow up post. No one knows how close United, City etc came to making that call but what we do know is Liverpool DID it. No amount of back tracking is going to save face here. NONE.

You may need to go back and read my post again. I said (and still maintain) that every club has examined every option available to protect themselves in a never before seen situation that threatens their business, if they haven’t examined every option they really shouldn’t be in business in the first place. That is a statement of fact from knowing how business works, you don’t have to be in the room to know that.

8-10

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

2012 :cool:

? City won that year...I don't get you

Chuck Noland

8-10 wrote: »

I take the fact that many Man U fans wanted City to win the league last year as a massive compliment.

No issues with people being afraid of us winning things

I fear we are starting to get off topic here but look at it this way

If it came down to United or Everton to win a premier league the majority of Liverpool fans would be hoping their neighbors won it and not United. Same with us. Pool are our biggest rivals and not city and has been like that along time.

The_Kew_Tour

8-10 wrote: »

? City won that year...I don't get you

Ya and liverpool fans celebrated that one pretty well. Let's just say FFP was not so important back in those days. But that's fine too. It works very ways. Got take and give.

8-10

Chuck Noland wrote: »

I fear we are starting to get off topic here but look at it this way

If it came down to United or Everton to win a premier league the majority of Liverpool fans would be hoping their neighbors won it and not United. Same with us. Pool are our biggest rivals and not city and has been like that along time.

That's my point, it would be a compliment to United to see that. but I doubt it would be a majority. I'm used to United winning things. Would definitely be happier to see them win than Everton but it's kind of as much as I'd prefer my left hand to be cut off than my right - neither are ideal!

But apologies you are correct, it's off topic. I feel I should say something about the coronavirus now to justify this post....

Chuck Noland

sideswipe wrote: »

You may need to go back and read my post again. I said (and still maintain) that every club has examined every option available to protect themselves in a never before seen situation that threatens their business, if they haven’t examined every option they really shouldn’t be in business in the first place. That is a statement of fact from knowing how business works, you don’t have to be in the room to know that.

You said “ Every club is a business, they were all examining this to protect themselves and only announced they wouldn’t do after seeing the fall out against Liverpool and Spurs”

This was a statement of fact. I asked you to back this up. Then you moved to they were “probably having meetings” I agreed and said even if they were it doesn’t change.
A. You are in no position to pass opinion off as fact
B. Liverpool done it and no amount of back tracking will save face.

What part above is incorrect?

8-10

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Ya and liverpool fans celebrated that one pretty well. Let's just say FFP was not so important back in those days. But that's fine too. It works very ways. Got take and give.

You don't understand the difference between United fans wanting City to win a league and Liverpool fans wanting them to win the league in 2012.

It'll hit you later and you'll kick yourself, those things aren't equal

Chuck Noland

8-10 wrote: »

That's my point, it would be a compliment to United to see that. but I doubt it would be a majority. I'm used to United winning things. Would definitely be happier to see them win than Everton but it's kind of as much as I'd prefer my left hand to be cut off than my right - neither are ideal!

But apologies you are correct, it's off topic. I feel I should say something about the coronavirus now to justify this post....

I know other United fans who would prefer Liverpool over City this season, not many but a few, the majority would prefer City and probably the same portion (at a guess) who’d prefer Everton over United. No one person can speak for the entire fan base tho as we’ve established

~Rebel~

yabadabado wrote: »

Can you elaborate on this or any link to articles?

The money has been printed without anything to back it ?This is newly created money ?

I posted them just 2 posts above your own post..

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Yeah, I only realised it today myself as Second Captains went into it in more detail.

Backed up by the Bank Of England's own website anyway;
https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/monetary-policy-summary-and-minutes/2020/monetary-policy-summary-for-the-special-monetary-policy-committee-meeting-on-19-march-2020

Here's the particularly relevent bit;
"At its special meeting on 19 March, the MPC judged that a further package of measures was warranted to meet its statutory objectives. It therefore voted unanimously to increase the Bank of England’s holdings of UK government bonds and sterling non-financial investment-grade corporate bonds by £200 billion to a total of £645 billion, financed by the issuance of central bank reserves"

brinty

MD1990 wrote:

crazy how some Liverpool fans on here are so obsessed with everything Manchester United. really sad.

Fyp

gstack166

https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1247240275791134720?s=21

Boris is in trouble I think. Wish him well

noodler

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Absolutely stellar contributions

Pot.kettle?

sideswipe

Chuck Noland wrote: »

You said “ Every club is a business, they were all examining this to protect themselves and only announced they wouldn’t do after seeing the fall out against Liverpool and Spurs”

This was a statement of fact. I asked you to back this up. Then you moved to they were “probably having meetings” I agreed and said even if they were it doesn’t change.
A. You are in no position to pass opinion off as fact
B. Liverpool done it and no amount of back tracking will save face.

What part above is incorrect?

Everything I said was an opinion, none of us here are anything but fans who come here to give an opinion FFS. I don’t have to post disclaimer after every opinion! If you want to think the board of any club operates in anything other Than a business manner you are naive. I know you won’t want to hear it but LFC are being largely applauded for their decision in the media this evening. So I guess they have saved some face.

I was being sarcastic suggesting they were ‘probably having meetings’ to make a decision NOT to examine all cost saving measures, sorry should have used emojis.

So for the record to answer both your questions A and B are incorrect IN MY OPINION. See I can shout too.

Chuck Noland

sideswipe wrote: »

Everything I said was an opinion, none of us here are anything but fans who come here to give an opinion FFS. I don’t have to post disclaimer after every opinion! If you want to think the board of any club operates in anything other Than a business manner you are naive. I know you won’t want to hear it but LFC are being largely applauded for their decision in the media this evening. So I guess they have saved some face.

So for the record to answer both your questions A and B are incorrect IN MY OPINION. See I can shout too.

Depends what media your following as plenty are still calling them out on it.

Where was I shouting in the above post?

How can a question be incorrect can you explain?
Neither A or B above were questions

sideswipe

Chuck Noland wrote: »

Depends what media your following as plenty are still calling them out on it.

Where was I shouting in the above post?

How can my questions be incorrect can you explain?

No, you clearly don’t understand business and you have the smell of blood in your nostrils to play out your hatred of a rival club. I’ve more important things to be doing than educating you. Good luck to ya.

Chuck Noland

sideswipe wrote: »

No, you clearly don’t understand stand business and you have the smell of blood in your nostrils to play out your hatred of a rival club. I’ve more important things to be doing than educating you. Good luck to ya.

I’ve actually lost count of how many questions I asked you that your unable to answer back. Simple questions. Straight forward questions. Easy questions. Your side stepping and goal post moving really is admirable. And now your storming off in a huff trying to claim a moral victory? If you’d even answered a couple of them maybe this wouldn’t look as bad on you but as it stands it’s akin to “it’s my ball and I’m going home”

noodler

noodler wrote: »

Pot.kettle?

You are Ob.sessed with me

Corholio

Good that Liverpool reversed the horrible decision, but it shows how out of touch that top level football is when public uproar has to change an already terrible decision. This is why I never understand why some fans go to bat and defend to death anything 'their' club do when at the very top you are not what they think about at all. It makes a lot of the Liverpool-United stuff in here utterly bizarre really, not to mind the dum dums who take part in it.

noodler

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You are Ob.sessed with me

That's not true.

Fitz*

The FA are placing staff on furlough. Queue the outrage...

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news/fa-staff-furlough-job-coronavirus-pay-cuts-gareth-southgate-england-players-a9449876.html

citytillidie

FitzShane wrote: »

The FA are placing staff on furlough. Queue the outrage...

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news/fa-staff-furlough-job-coronavirus-pay-cuts-gareth-southgate-england-players-a9449876.html

Only an outrage when it is Liverpool, noting there was no outrage when Spurs said they would do it and they were not even giving the other 20% leaving those staff with less money

Corholio

citytillidie wrote: »

Only an outrage when it is Liverpool, noting there was no outrage when Spurs said they would do it and they were not even giving the other 20% leaving those staff with less money

There was outrage when it was Spurs. What Liverpool fans read and see is bound to be biased as well in fairness. I've no doubt some Utd fans would say the same as well 'only when Utd do it' etc, and so that circle would start again. Seen plenty about when Newcastle did it as well.

The_Kew_Tour

gstack166 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1247240275791134720?s=21

Boris is in trouble I think. Wish him well

It's sad and I wish him well. It sadly might take somthing like this to actually see the British Public actually take it serious.

But nothing would surprise me with them

brinty

Deleted User wrote:

You are Ob.sessed with me

Nope, he's ob.sessed with me

Fitz*

citytillidie wrote: »

Only an outrage when it is Liverpool, noting there was no outrage when Spurs said they would do it and they were not even giving the other 20% leaving those staff with less money

Yeah Spurs gave the staff paycuts before being furloughed. Even when the football comes back and money is flowing again, will those staff even get a payrise to bring them back up to their normal wage again? Will they continue to be out of pocket while the CEO got a payrise?

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/tottenham-hotspur-staff-furlough-premier-league-coronavirus-newcastle-a9437681.html

At least Liverpool were ensuring that nobody in their staff was going to be out of pocket, or out of a job. Which is the whole reasoning behind the furlough in the first place. To protect employment. All staff able to maintain their current standard of living and pay the mortgage etc. An opportunity arose to get other contributors to pay some of this so Liverpool took the boardroom decision to avail of that. Smart business move? Absolutely, yes. Moreally wrong because of the size of their income? Probably, yes. A lot of businesses will do this. McDonald's did it, Primark, Nissan, Greggs and Williams F1 team did it. Businesses bigger than Liverpool. I bet there are tens of thousands of people in Ireland and the UK right now who would wish they could be in the same situation as the Liverpool staff, including those who work for large MNC's with a far bigger income than Liverpool.

Some of it all just seems like outrage for the sake of it just because of who these businesses are. Anyways, that's enough of it from me as to be fair does it really matter to me who pays the Anfield club shop worker? That's not football. Take it to the business or politics forum IMO.

Mitch Connor

His reckless strategy will have seen countless more infected than would have been without deliberately wanting people to get infected cause he thought it was like the flu.

He boasted about shaking hands with covid patients and how people need to take the infection on the chin and just power through it.

The_Kew_Tour

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

It's sad and I wish him well. It sadly might take somthing like this to actually see the British Public actually take it serious.

But nothing would surprise me with them

It could be the Rock Hudson moment of the pandemic alright, where the ignorant take notice and realise this is a serious problem.

Mitch Connor

FitzShane wrote: »

Yeah Spurs gave the staff paycuts before being furloughed. Even when the football comes back and money is flowing again, will those staff even get a payrise to bring them back up to their normal wage again? Will they continue to be out of pocket while the CEO got a payrise?

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/tottenham-hotspur-staff-furlough-premier-league-coronavirus-newcastle-a9437681.html

At least Liverpool were ensuring that nobody in their staff was going to be out of pocket, or out of a job. Which is the whole reasoning behind the furlough All staff able to maintain their current standard of living. An opportunity arose to get other contributors to pay some of this. A lot of businesses will do this. McDonald's did it, Primark, Nissan and Williams F1 team did it. Businesses bigger than Liverpool. I bet there are tens of thousands of people in Ireland and the UK right now who would wish they could be in the same situation as the Liverpool staff, including those who work for large MNC's with a far bigger income than Liverpool.

Some of it all just seems like outrage for the sake of it just because of who these businesses are. Anyways, that's enough of it from me as to be fair does it really matter to me who pays the Anfield club shop worker? That's not football. Take it to the business or politics forum IMO.

So don't ever talk about the Liverpool family, or their sense of community.

It's just a business now. Like any other.

Corholio

FitzShane wrote: »

Yeah Spurs gave the staff paycuts before being furloughed. Even when the football comes back and money is flowing again, will those staff even get a payrise to bring them back up to their normal wage again? Will they continue to be out of pocket while the CEO got a payrise?

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/tottenham-hotspur-staff-furlough-premier-league-coronavirus-newcastle-a9437681.html

At least Liverpool were ensuring that nobody in their staff was going to be out of pocket, or out of a job. Which is the whole reasoning behind the furlough in the first place. To protect employment. All staff able to maintain their current standard of living and pay the mortgage etc. An opportunity arose to get other contributors to pay some of this so Liverpool took the boardroom decision to avail of that. Smart business move? Absolutely, yes. Moreally wrong because of the size of their income? Probably, yes. A lot of businesses will do this. McDonald's did it, Primark, Nissan, Greggs and Williams F1 team did it. Businesses bigger than Liverpool. I bet there are tens of thousands of people in Ireland and the UK right now who would wish they could be in the same situation as the Liverpool staff, including those who work for large MNC's with a far bigger income than Liverpool.

Some of it all just seems like outrage for the sake of it just because of who these businesses are. Anyways, that's enough of it from me as to be fair does it really matter to me who pays the Anfield club shop worker? That's not football. Take it to the business or politics forum IMO.

I don't understand writing so much to try and either defend it, say others are doing it or say it's got nothing to do with 'football' to stop people talking about it. Why not just criticise it without the added defense of it? The quick reverse of it obviously shows they knew they were wrong as well. Not everyone is a United/Liverpool fan trying to troll each other on here.

Fitz*

Corholio wrote: »

I don't understand writing so much to try and either defend it, say others are doing it or say it's got nothing to do with 'football' to stop people talking about it. Why not just criticise it without the added defense of it? The quick reverse of it obviously shows they knew they were wrong as well. Not everyone is a United/Liverpool fan trying to troll each other on here.

I wasn't defending their decision. Search through my posts on the matter cos in every one I have said I didn't agree with it but could see why the owners decided to, from their perspective. Just questioning the outrage surrounding one clubs business decision to take the furlough which has since been reversed. There's plenty of businesses at it.

~Rebel~

Mitch Connor wrote: »

So don't ever talk about the Liverpool family, or their sense of community.

It's just a business now. Like any other.

Everything's always so ****in' black and white on here, it's the weirdest place sometimes.

Of course it's a business. Every professional football club is. But there's no such thing as just a business like any other. Just like people, businesses are different to each other. And they'll make decisions that are not always in line with some ultimate moral ethos, but do in fact make sense on their individual merits.

Businesses exist to make money. But sometimes they also give money and time and resources to do brilliant things within communities near and far for no reason other than that they can, and someone within the business pushed ahead with making that particular project happen.

They're the same Liverpool now that they were last week, which was never some altruistic gift to Merseyside, but was also never some cold uncaring conglomerate. Same as all the clubs we support.

8-10

Corholio wrote: »

Not everyone is a United/Liverpool fan trying to troll each other on here.

I just assume the others are playing the long game pretending to support someone else

citytillidie

Corholio wrote: »

There was outrage when it was Spurs. What Liverpool fans read and see is bound to be biased as well in fairness. I've no doubt some Utd fans would say the same as well 'only when Utd do it' etc, and so that circle would start again. Seen plenty about when Newcastle did it as well.

Thread here did not melt down last week when spurs announced it

Iused2likebusts

Good pressure by the fans to get the owners to change their mind on what was a bad PR move.

Mitch Connor

citytillidie wrote: »

Thread here did not melt down last week when spurs announced it

plenty of people, including myself, said it was utter sh1t.

We didn't have a cabal of Spurs fans saying everyone else was going to do it and deflecting.

8-10

Iused2likebusts wrote: »

Good pressure by the fans to get the owners to change their mind on what was a bad PR move.

Just like the £77 tickets

Chuck Noland

Mitch Connor wrote: »

plenty of people, including myself, said it was utter sh1t.

We didn't have a cabal of Spurs fans saying everyone else was going to do it and deflecting.

Or trying to make out how it had too be done to safe gard the future of the club

sideswipe

citytillidie wrote: »

Thread here did not melt down last week when spurs announced it

There’s been more outrage at the board doing a u-turn than there was at the original decision too.

The situation of continuing to pay 100% of wages indefinitely is not sustainable either, something gotta give. It could actually herald the end of FFP because teams will need to be bailed out.

Iused2likebusts

8-10 wrote: »

Just like the £77 tickets

Ye obviously good businessmen but when they push the business side of things too much not afraid to back down. They certainly misread both of those situations.

8-10

Iused2likebusts wrote: »

Ye obviously good businessmen but when they push the business side of things too much not afraid to back down. They certainly misread both of those situations.

Not defending them on this one as it was very misguided but there's obviously huge differences between this and US Sports which they're more familiar with. Where the biggest game of the year has everybody talking the next day about their favourite commercials during halftime

Mitch Connor

sideswipe wrote: »

There’s been more outrage at the board doing a u-turn than there was at the original decision too.

The situation of continuing to pay 100% of wages indefinitely is not sustainable either, something gotta give. It could actually herald the end of FFP because teams will need to be bailed out.

how about they start with reducing the wages of the top earners rather than the lowest, if there is a money concern.

At United, if money gets tight. Woodward and the Glazers should be the first to feel that pinch.

sideswipe

Mitch Connor wrote: »

how about they start with reducing the wages of the top earners rather than the lowest, if there is a money concern.

At United, if money gets tight. Woodward and the Glazers should be the first to feel that pinch.

Agreed. But it is likely to be across the board if they can’t open for ‘business’ agin this for months.

Foreign end of season tours are huge income generators that won’t happen this year either. Big changes coming down the tracks, lots of smaller clubs going to suffer too. I had no problem with the whole furlough thing, there are multi billion generating international corporations using it so why not football clubs that are big employers and tax generators.

Corholio

FitzShane wrote: »

I wasn't defending their decision. Search through my posts on the matter cos in every one I have said I didn't agree with it but could see why the owners decided to, from their perspective. Just questioning the outrage surrounding one clubs business decision to take the furlough which has since been reversed. There's plenty of businesses at it.

3/4 of your post was defending it in some way in fairness. There's been plenty of outrage across all business sectors for big businesses, sport related or not, to put workers on furlough. Soccer clubs are going to be discussed here, not McDonald's etc. It's just tiring reading the little defences of it, wrapped up in 'criticism'. There's plenty of fans who snipe for sure, far too many on here, but there's a lot who defence snipe as well at any form of criticism.

noodler

Mitch Connor wrote: »

plenty of people, including myself, said it was utter sh1t.

We didn't have a cabal of Spurs fans saying everyone else was going to do it and deflecting.

You also didn't have the usual posters pulling double shifts telling everyone what a disgrace the LFC is, acting smug af and generally being a pain in the arse.

dundalkfc10

Would people here not want Irish players in the UK donate some of their wages to the HSE (I Know some have)

What difference does it make what's clubs do with their money in the UK or how taxpayer helps them to Ireland at this current time.

****ing nonsense on this thread and people dying every few hours all over the country

irelandrover

Is there any chance the back and forth United vs Liverpool bickering could be moved to its own thread. This is a useful thread for information but the last 5 pages has been back and forth point scoring about the furlough scheme. It makes it unuseable. It ruined the general premier league thread as well.

The Dutch FA are holding a press conference this morning.
Competition leader KNVB emphasizes on every occasion to follow the guidelines of the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment (RIVM) and the government. For the time being, they say that small gatherings such as training sessions up to and including 28 April are prohibited and large events such as football matches until 1 June. A lot of clubs have come out for ending the season now.

They have 8 games left in the season and are struggling to finish it before the August 3rd deadline.

Mushy

irelandrover wrote: »

Is there any chance the back and forth United vs Liverpool bickering could be moved to its own thread. This is a useful thread for information but the last 5 pages has been back and forth point scoring about the furlough scheme. It makes it unuseable. It ruined the general premier league thread as well.

The Dutch FA are holding a press conference this morning.
Competition leader KNVB emphasizes on every occasion to follow the guidelines of the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment (RIVM) and the government. For the time being, they say that small gatherings such as training sessions up to and including 28 April are prohibited and large events such as football matches until 1 June. A lot of clubs have come out for ending the season now.

They have 8 games left in the season and are struggling to finish it before the August 3rd deadline.

Where did that deadline come from? Arent fifa going to announce something about no deadlines for leagues?

The_Kew_Tour

irelandrover wrote: »

Is there any chance the back and forth United vs Liverpool bickering could be moved to its own thread. This is a useful thread for information but the last 5 pages has been back and forth point scoring about the furlough scheme. It makes it unuseable. It ruined the general premier league thread as well.

The Dutch FA are holding a press conference this morning.
Competition leader KNVB emphasizes on every occasion to follow the guidelines of the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment (RIVM) and the government. For the time being, they say that small gatherings such as training sessions up to and including 28 April are prohibited and large events such as football matches until 1 June. A lot of clubs have come out for ending the season now.

They have 8 games left in the season and are struggling to finish it before the August 3rd deadline.

That's no surprise. The Dutch have been as bad if not worse then UK.

Only Sweden who have no lockdown are worse then 2 countries mentioned