Football & Coronavirus [READ MOD NOTE IN FIRST POST - updated 06-05-20]

CrabRevolution

rgace wrote: »

Ah sure this thread is nuts. Now you have to take a position on the UK response to Covid-19 and how far behind Spain they are based on whether you support Liverpool or Man Utd.

I was thinking something similar the other day about bizarre or very narrow topics becoming polarised by being associated with one "side" .

For example you are a Trump supporter there's a huge chance you think hydroxychloroquine is an effective treatment for Covid-19, even if you know the square root of f*ck all about disease, pharmacology, scientific evidence, side effects etc. and never showed any interest in any of these topics before now or will ever again. It applies vice versa for anti-Trump people, but less so from what I've seen.

gstack166

https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/04/10/sports-arent-coming-back-soon

A good piece on the obstacles of playing behind closed doors & the difficulties it would have. It just doesn’t make sense at the moment if this is the protocol to play a few games earlier than deemed safe.

Mitch Connor

gstack166 wrote: »

And that’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it. My opinion was football should be played only when everyone is allowed back into the stadium & I was told most fans want it back ASAP anyway that’s possible & I was shot down when I said that’s not the case for the majority of match day going fans.

There’s no argument here, it’s an objective view on most clubs fans who attend home and away. If that’s beneficial or not to a clubs long term future is another matter. Obviously there’s clubs that will be in trouble I wish no ill on those people/clubs who suffer from any financial suffering - it is the entity of football that I refer to not the innocent individuals who make their living from it.

In an ideal world, football with fans would be back soon, and that is what everyone really wants.

But we are in far from an ideal world.

I don't think large scale mass gatherings will be allowed any time soon. Forget about thousands of people in one place for a football match, I think restaurants and cinemas will only be able to open under strict conditions and limitations. I know some large cinemas are looking at opening (WHEN ALLOWED TO) with only one film at a time, with different screens being used for subsequent shows, with reduced capacity in the screens they do use.

I don't see any way that football (or any sport) returns with fans numbering in the thousands, until the virus is under a significant level of control.

I understand people want to get back to watching football, but we are also talking about a world where police were called to 500 house parties at the weekend in Manchester. Where Stereophonics played to a packed house just a few weeks ago (while countries were in lockdown), where people consider sunbathing an essential activity - we are talking about a world where a significant proportion of the people think Social Distancing isn't needed and the lockdown is just a BS scare tactic. Where the PM of the country (for most replying to that message) said people need to treat this like the common cold, give it the ol' stiff upper lip and fight it on the beaches or some effing rubbish.

Football (sports in general) behind closed doors is what will come back first, and it will be months until there is any possibility of fans attending in large numbers.

I just dont understand how people don't think that is the reality of the situation, and the needed solution. People talk about it being based on a matter of greed. Maybe it is, but more likely it is based on a need of survival. If clubs don't have a way of keeping some money coming in, clubs will 100% go under. and not just 'small' clubs.

Any fan arguing against games being played behind closed doors is living in a dream world, detached from the reality of the world we are currently living in.

Can't even have more than 2 people in the local pharmacy, but 76k at old trafford is just around the corner.

MD1990

gstack166 wrote: »

https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/04/10/sports-arent-coming-back-soon

A good piece on the obstacles of playing behind closed doors & the difficulties it would have. It just doesn’t make sense at the moment if this is the protocol to play a few games earlier than deemed safe.

thats why it is being talked about for june or july.

if things are similar to how it is now there will be no games behind closed doors.

Mitch Connor

gstack166 wrote: »

https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/04/10/sports-arent-coming-back-soon

A good piece on the obstacles of playing behind closed doors & the difficulties it would have. It just doesn’t make sense at the moment if this is the protocol to play a few games earlier than deemed safe.

earlier than deemed safe to what degree?

IMO football will return around the same point that the restrictions are relaxed to the point that general office work and similar can return with Social Distancing measures in place, with an advisment that if you can work from home you 100% should.

I think that level of easment will happen before the goverment are encouraging 76,000 people to watch a football match at Old Trafford when a far smaller number could be needed to see the match takes place.

Yes, playing football behind closed doors has its own problems to be overcome.

Problems of a lower magnitude than including 76,000 people from around the country into the mix as well. Until Social Distancing is no longer required, Football with Fans simply can't take place.

gstack166

MD1990 wrote: »

thats why it is being talked about for june or july.

if things are similar to how it is now there will be no games behind closed doors.

At present it would seem that the UK has more a chance of being in a worse position come June than a better one than present.

Mitch Connor

gstack166 wrote: »

At present it would seem that the UK has more a chance of being in a worse position come June than a better one than present.

Its an evolving matter.

Right now they are talking about June.

If the UK is the same in Mid-May as it is now.... they won't be talking about June.

To be approaching this discussion in absolute terms, that football we return health of the nation be damned, is just wrong. It is bad faith arguing.

People are talking about the practicalities of football returning as soon as possible in the context of it being safe to do so and in line with Government recomendations on the subject at the time. And that will be behind closed doors.

Playing football behind closed doors will be months upon months in advance of allowed a packed Old Trafford. No matter when that actually occurs.

grumpymunster

gstack166 wrote: »

https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/04/10/sports-arent-coming-back-soon

A good piece on the obstacles of playing behind closed doors & the difficulties it would have. It just doesn’t make sense at the moment if this is the protocol to play a few games earlier than deemed safe.

Very interesting piece and yes it outlines the difficulties in the US very well, good thing about football in Europe is that travel is possible by road there and back with no overnight stops (this is why I think the CL and Europa leagues are in trouble). Therefore the amount of people involved is significantly reduced and so reducing risk accordingly.

From a European perspective the equation of giving people something to look forward to and encouraging them to stay at home by playing some sports behind closed doors V's the risk of further spread would I think be closer than for the US.

Some sports will lend themselves more to this such as cricket (baseball in the US) and horse racing where there is reduced physical contact. Football is not that bad in general. Rugby and American Football pose greater difficulties for sure.

But it all relies on the hospitals and the UK are not in that space yet.

RasTa

I didn't enjoy watching the United v LASK game behind closed doors, didn't feel like a competitive game of football

8-10

Tape iPad's to each seat. Every ticket holder gets to skype through to it and view the game as they normally would.

Done

callaway92

citytillidie wrote: »

PL are giving £125M to the Football league

They do that every year. It was just paid in advance this year.

RoryMac

RasTa wrote: »

I didn't enjoy watching the United v LASK game behind closed doors, didn't feel like a competitive game of football

Yeah games behind closed doors are awful, my already waning interest in football is going to tested when it returns

davemckenna25

6 wrote: »

What if a vaccine can't be made successfully? Are we still in the tunnel?..

I've no idea.... that's in the future and noone knows that the future holds for us all...

Thanx 4 The Fish

gstack166 wrote: »

At present it would seem that the UK has more a chance of being in a worse position come June than a better one than present.

Can I ask what you are basing that on? Yesterday was the third day in a row that numbers of deaths as a result of C19 and infections have fallen in the UK. Whilst there is an appeatite for people to get together that will not happen in the short term but there is already discussion over here that some restrictions will be relaxed in 3-4 weeks time.

davemckenna25 wrote: »

I've no idea.... that's in the future and noone knows that the future holds for us all...

You don't need to know what will happen in the future, you were being asked if you would consider us still in the tunnel if a vaccine was not discovered to give some context to you our previous post.

RasTa

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

Can I ask what you are basing that on? Yesterday was the third day in a row that numbers of deaths as a result of C19 and infections have fallen in the UK. Whilst there is an appeatite for people to get together that will not happen in the short term but there is already discussion over here that some restrictions will be relaxed in 3-4 weeks time.



You don't need to know what will happen in the future, you were being asked if you would consider us still in the tunnel if a vaccine was not discovered to give some context to you our previous post.

It's already being confirmed that the UK numbers are way off true figures. They haven't peaked yet

howiya

RasTa wrote: »

It's already being confirmed that the UK numbers are way off true figures. They haven't peaked yet

Yeah official death toll refers only to people who've died in a hospital.

gstack166

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

Can I ask what you are basing that on? Yesterday was the third day in a row that numbers of deaths as a result of C19 and infections have fallen in the UK. Whilst there is an appeatite for people to get together that will not happen in the short term but there is already discussion over here that some restrictions will be relaxed in 3-4 weeks time.



You don't need to know what will happen in the future, you were being asked if you would consider us still in the tunnel if a vaccine was not discovered to give some context to you our previous post.

https://twitter.com/telegraph/status/1249983334345826305?s=21

They don’t they’re falling.

RasTa

He posted the same yesterday about the numbers dropping. Seems strange, most of the papers over here don't agree. Wednesday you will see a big number sadly.

Thanx 4 The Fish

howiya wrote: »

Yeah official death toll refers only to people who've died in a hospital.

That is correct however the numbers of people dying in hospital are down as well even though they have more and more people in hospitals. You would expect that the numbers that re being reported for uk deaths in hospitals would reflect the numbers around the country, there is little doubt that there the numbers are not entirely reflective however the trends can be used to understand how progress is being made. I'll be honest, the way this whole thing has been handled over here has been a disgrace and there will be a reckoning subsequently. Vallance has stated that the UK is developing to be more akin to France than Italy which could see the restrictions lifted sooner than if following the trajectory in Italy and so there is a chance that some form of limited meetings and so potentially the return of football in some guise is sooner than some doomsayers say.

As long as the return is at the right time and with the health of everyone involved at the heart of the decision then fingers crossed we could have some games played sooner rather than later.

davemckenna25

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

Can I ask what you are basing that on? Yesterday was the third day in a row that numbers of deaths as a result of C19 and infections have fallen in the UK. Whilst there is an appeatite for people to get together that will not happen in the short term but there is already discussion over here that some restrictions will be relaxed in 3-4 weeks time.



You don't need to know what will happen in the future, you were being asked if you would consider us still in the tunnel if a vaccine was not discovered to give some context to you our previous post.

:D Glad to see you have taken a sudden interest in my posting.... wonder why?

Is this now a place where we must answer questions to a level that you approve?

Thanx 4 The Fish

davemckenna25 wrote: »

:D Glad to see you have taken a sudden interest in my posting.... wonder why?

Is this now a place where we must answer questions to a level that you approve?

No I was giving you some more context in order that you could understand and perhaps answer the question you were asked, obviously if you chose to answer it or not is your prerogative.

Fitz*

Was listening to a podcast recently and one of the contributors had an interesting idea to get the season finished, in a safe and fair manner. There are 9 or 10 regular league games left for the majority of the teams across the top 4 leagues in England. The festival of football idea to get as many games as possible played across 2 months is feasible, especially when you consider that not all games are actually needed to be played, and teams could declare them a draw.

If the leagues set out to play 5 rounds of game between the clubs across 31 days in the behind closed doors scenario, a lot of the league scenarios such as champions, European spots, relegation and promotion places will be a lot clearer. Teams that were hoping to get certain points in certain games have the opportunity to do so. For example West Ham might say 'well we have played Man City & Liverpool twice each and our positional rivals have not, so we have easier games remaining and it will give us more of a chance to pick up points while Norwich & Bournemouth play those teams'. Or Arsenal might say it about Man Utd etc. Bolton, even after a gallant effort will finally be officially relegated,a long with Southend. Leeds or WBA might get confirmation of promotion or fall away while Fulham steam ahead based on their form. The leagues will become a lot clearer. More than likely Liverpool would be champions, Norwich could well be relegated.

This one month of football and playing over half of the remaining games will help give a clearer picture, but it allows a week break for the players and for the organisers to re-asses the strategy before playing the remaining 4 games. You can take stock again and reassess some fixtures.

For example the Liverpool-Chelsea game that was scheduled for May at Anfield. Well Liverpool are already champions and Chelsea secured top 4 in their previous 5 behind closed doors games. They are 7 points ahead of 4th and 7 points behind 3rd so any result here would not have any affect whatsoever on the league table or other games. 'Will we call it a draw lads, as this game doesn't matter?'. Norwich might be relegated and play Man City the last day of the season. There could be no need for that game to go ahead behind closed doors as it will not affect the integrity of the league, the league table or any other games or clubs. Call it a draw lads. Do Bolton need to play all remaining games? They might not need to.

But by stopping for a break after 5 games, it also let the organizers to re-asses the future of the league.
Do we continue to play games behind closed door? Do we let some fans back in?
Do we we let all fans in?
Do we stop the season now as this was a mistake and we have enough clarity now to make decisions on final league placings and we gave every one a fair crack of the whip to the best of our ability?

davemckenna25

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

No I was giving you some more context in order that you could understand and perhaps answer the question you were asked, obviously if you chose to answer it or not is your prerogative.

So, you were giving me some context in how to answer a question from someone else but then say you don't care if I answer or not ..... :cool:

Thanx 4 The Fish

davemckenna25 wrote: »

So, you were giving me some context in how to answer a question from someone else but then say you don't care if I answer or not ..... :cool:

I didn't say I didn't care, I said it was your prerogative, I would be interested to see when you think we would be out of this tunnel though as I believe you suggested that no football should be played until that time and I too was curious as to when you thought that was. I am not sure why you continue to skirt around it rather than answer the question posed to you re whether "light at the very end of the tunnel but it should be at the very end of the tunnel, not before we get to the end." was after a vaccine was produced or not.

Tom Mann Centuria

Fcking hell, someone has a thing for tunnels.

RasTa

Squires cutting deep

davemckenna25

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

I didn't say I didn't care, I said it was your prerogative, I would be interested to see when you think we would be out of this tunnel though as I believe you suggested that no football should be played until that time and I too was curious as to when you thought that was. I am not sure why you continue to skirt around it rather than answer the question posed to you re whether "light at the very end of the tunnel but it should be at the very end of the tunnel, not before we get to the end." was after a vaccine was produced or not.

Hi, I went had a walk, during this walk I put some serious thought into this whole "Tunnel thing" that seems to have caused quite a stir for some people...



At the end of the walk I came to the conclusion that some people seem really need to get out more and stop worrying about other peoples posts.
I feel flattered that you worry so much about my hypothetical tunnel and that my posting has given you something to focus on.


However to answer you so that you can find some peace in this tread....

If only the answer was a simple as a vaccine or not. If this vaccine was available in the next few weeks then I'm sure it would be the answer. However as that won't happen and it probably won't be available until sometime next year at the earliest I feel that the vaccine might not be the end of the Tunnel we fantasise about.
The end of the Tunnel will be when we can safely return to having football in a manner which doesn't put the lives of people at unnecessary risk or put unnecessary drain on an already overstretched Health system.

But when will it actually be you ask.... stop skirting around the edges you say...

Unfortunately I'm unable to give you that answer and even more sorry to say that at the current time, none can.

I know this isn't the answer which you craved but I do hope that it can help you move forward in this tread.



Also folks the weather is beautiful, go for a walk.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

I didn't say I didn't care, I said it was your prerogative, I would be interested to see when you think we would be out of this tunnel though as I believe you suggested that no football should be played until that time and I too was curious as to when you thought that was. I am not sure why you continue to skirt around it rather than answer the question posed to you re whether "light at the very end of the tunnel but it should be at the very end of the tunnel, not before we get to the end." was after a vaccine was produced or not.

Do you actually care about his opinion, or are you just trying to catch him out on something? I would be interested to see because this post and the 3 before it certainly read like the latter.

By the way...I'm doing exactly what you did with Dave's post to Rarnes.

RasTa

More joyful news

IMF forecasts a sharp and sustained global downturn because of coronavirus pandemic: “It is very likely that this year the global economy will experience its worst recession since the Great Depression."

What I have noticed in the thread is everytime context is brought into someone's assessment on the coronavirus someone pops in to deflect and start crying out for facts or some report they spotted in a paper

People are perfectly entitled to believe that football won't be returning in 2020 or beyond

And there is tonne of reasons to believe so

That is not scaremongering or some other bolox one liner

Thanx 4 The Fish

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you actually care about his opinion, or are you just trying to catch him out on something? I would be interested to see because this post and the 3 before it certainly read like the latter.

By the way...I'm doing exactly what you did with Dave's post to Rarnes.

Genuinely interested, why do you ask? I was trying to understand where dave thought it would come back as it seemed like a very long way off. Dave has subsequently given an answer which seems like maybe in his view it would be closer than I and others got from his original post.

@Dave, fair enough so football will probably return well before a vaccine and it will probably be in a much different guise than we currently are used to. Long (and seemingly quite sunny) road ahead but I would certainly be surprised if games are not played behind closed doors in the shirt to mid term (2 monthsish) and for those lower league clubs with perhaps a subscription based system in order that people can tune in via a video streaming service to support their club and still have games played and watched by the people who would usually attend to at least make some money whilst it goes ahead like this.

gstack166

RasTa wrote: »

More joyful news

More joyful news that’s about 5 weeks old.

RasTa

gstack166 wrote: »

More joyful news that’s about 5 weeks old.

In an update to its World Economic Outlook released Tuesday

Today for this one

Thanx 4 The Fish

gstack166 wrote: »

More joyful news that’s about 5 weeks old.

And updated and released with more info and a predicted growth impact today.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-04-14/imf-forecasts-big-coronavirus-growth-hit/12147818

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/live-blog/2020-04-14-coronavirus-news-n1183181/ncrd1183311#liveBlogHeader

davemckenna25

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

Genuinely interested, why do you ask? I was trying to understand where dave thought it would come back as it seemed like a very long way off. Dave has subsequently given an answer which seems like maybe in his view it would be closer than I and others got from his original post.

@Dave, fair enough so football will probably return well before a vaccine and it will probably be in a much different guise than we currently are used to. Long (and seemingly quite sunny) road ahead but I would certainly be surprised if games are not played behind closed doors in the shirt to mid term (2 monthsish) and for those lower league clubs with perhaps a subscription based system in order that people can tune in via a video streaming service to support their club and still have games played and watched by the people who would usually attend to at least make some money whilst it goes ahead like this.

Thanks very much for the reply.

The road is currently sunny, might not always stay that way... it could yet rain on the parade.... fingers crossed it stays sunny.

8-10

davemckenna25 wrote: »

I came to the conclusion that some people seem really need to get out more

Literally the opposite of appropriate advice right now.

You can go outside for brief individual exercise within 2km of your house while observing a 2m distance from anyone else, the exception being if you are with somebody from the same household.

Yes, you should go for a walk, but a generic "people should get out more" comment when we're effectively in a form of lockdown is ludicrous.

Fitz*

It's behind a paywall, but l'Equipe are reporting that Ligue 1 and Ligue 2 will resume playing football in June. Either a June 3rd start or June 17th start. All games behind closed doors.

The start of next season is already delayed by 2 weeks and start on August 23rd instead.

https://www.lequipe.fr/Football/Article/La-lfp-travaille-sur-deux-calendriers-pour-la-reprise-de-la-saison-2019-2020-en-ligue-1/1127032

8-10

FitzShane wrote: »

It's behind a paywall, but l'Equipe are reporting that Ligue 1 and Ligue 2 will resume playing football in June. Either a June 3rd start or June 17th start. All games behind closed doors.

I will literally watch anything right now, but if it's the French league that comes back that's actually quite a good one!

davemckenna25

8-10 wrote: »

Literally the opposite of appropriate advice right now.

You can go outside for brief individual exercise within 2km of your house while observing a 2m distance from anyone else, the exception being if you are with somebody from the same household.

Yes, you should go for a walk, but a generic "people should get out more" comment when we're effectively in a form of lockdown is ludicrous.

But you can go out for that walk or run. Does it need to be brief or can you not do laps within your 2km range?

Do you even have a back garden you could use... you will definitively feel the benefit of the sun.

Just to clarify I never said that anyone is to go against government guidelines...

Do not gather in groups for this exercise unless these other people are from the same household.... not even behind closed doors...

brinty

Very interesting to see one group of supporters talking about football returning in Poland and France as a beacon of hope things will start back up in England soon.

The same Poland and France that are over run by deaths and over stretched health services. With thousands of deaths every day, and a pandemicnthat hasn't even peaked yet in their countries.

Oh wait Poland and France did things right. They took the appropriate actions, flattened their curves and passed the peak. Their deaths are miniscule compared to the UK.

C'mon folks, be realistic will you. You're fooling no one bar yourselves, and your fantasy that things will be back soon is just that ... A fantasy.

The UK isn't close to being on top of things, life won't get back to normal for them for way longer than any of us can imagine. Never mind mass gatherings or even behind closed doors sport.

grumpymunster

8-10 wrote: »

I will literally watch anything right now, but if it's the French league that comes back that's actually quite a good one!

It is a shame the Belarus league is not on TV I have become oddly fascinated with how FK Slutsk are doing

Thanx 4 The Fish

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

Genuinely interested, why do you ask? I was trying to understand where dave thought it would come back as it seemed like a very long way off. Dave has subsequently given an answer which seems like maybe in his view it would be closer than I and others got from his original post.

It was merely a 'trust' thing.

rgace

8-10 wrote: »

I will literally watch anything right now, but if it's the French league that comes back that's actually quite a good one!

Maybe I am only fooling myself but I am looking forward to being able to watch some live football.

The sooner football is back, the sooner we can all resume some semblance of our lives. I think a lot of us want that.

RasTa

As expected, drop in numbers seems to be a weekend thing. I expect over 1000 tomorrow

UK #coronavirus deaths surge again by 813 in 24hrs to 12,142 .This doesn't include 1000s more in homes & care homes.
And despite all Govt promises to 'ramp up testing', COVID-19 tests yesterday FELL to 14,506

wadacrack

Would be better to just share news/articles on Football and when it might be back.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Deleted User wrote: »

It was merely a 'trust' thing.

Same reason I asked you TBH.

Cookiemunster

RasTa wrote: »

As expected, drop in numbers seems to be a weekend thing. I expect over 1000 tomorrow

Yeah it been that way over there for a few weeks. A drop on Sunday and Monday numbers and then a rise in the Tuesday figures. Possibly due to less testing or labwork over the weekend.

Zebra3

Watching football in empty grounds on tv is not a semblance of normality and people will get bored of it very quickly.

8-10

Zebra3 wrote: »

Watching football in empty grounds on tv is not a semblance of normality and people will get bored of it very quickly.

I like the festival of football type idea. If you make an event of it with games everyday I could see it being a good watch.

Beats watching Jamie Oliver in his kitchen everyday while waiting for Fergal Bowers and the RTÉ news to tell you the daily death toll every evening.