Schools closed until undetermined date - was March 29th

Teach30

If we dont teach LC or exam classes what will we be doing in school in July.

Also if we have an important even such as a wedding can we still take time off. I’ll take the days unpaid if I have to but wonder will the still give me the 5 days..

CraftySue

TheDriver wrote: »

There was a letter from Sean Foley, DESk a few weeks back about the days being counted as school days etc etc.

But if the DES on their website are saying students have lost 15 instruction days, is that not a contradiction of what was said before. Even so, if schools are closed now - as the minister kept repeating, and online lessons were to cease- that time will have to be made up.

spurious

Not buying the social distancing argument.
The LC could have run two subjects a day as normal over a period of somewhere between 15 and 19 days, with a slightly earlier start, followed by one JC subject a day in the same centres after the two LC exams.
They will already be paying for extra superintendents.
Someone somewhere chose to not facilitate the JC.

Hiring JC examiners to take LC papers would lessen the number of scripts everyone would get which might be a factor in some deciding not to bother at all.

Rosita

thefasteriwalk wrote: »

There’s a written statement available on examinations.ie. It seems to indicate that schools will be given the actual JC papers that students were due to sit in June. It seems that other elements, such as ATs, also need to be completed. It just is not clear who will be correcting them.

It's such a shame that they didn't have the leadership to say, right, forget about ATs, project work or whatever. And also lacked the leadership to state clearly if they were the same exam papers or not. And as regards the "flexibility" within the school........would this be a as me flexibility the Dept of Ed showed re. SLAR meetings? Never great when you have weeks to prepare arrangements yet raise more questions than answers.

km79

km79 wrote: »

There needs to be a circular issued clarifying this immediately
No other professional who is working from home is being asked to do so AND use annual leave to do so
There would be uproar
And yet .......

And here we are
Note the subtle change in language from tuition time to classroom tuition time on the Dept website
We will be fools if we continue online after Easter without that being clarified in black and white

solerina

I personally think this is a crazy decision, students will totally struggle to stay motivated until the end of July especially with no class contact, two weeks tuition before hand will not make any difference to this, we all know they opt out when it gets close to the exams...on top of this I for one don’t want to have to go into work for two weeks during potentially the best month of the year...I am full sure that I am not the only teacher the fells like this. I have been spending hours engaging with my students since the closure began and I had my course finished anyway so I have no need to meet them in person in July.

TheDriver

I see Sean Sherlock, Labour, has done a right rant in support of SNAs. I'm wondering should this be something he would like to know about?

acequion

solerina wrote: »

I personally think this is a crazy decision, students will totally struggle to stay motivated until the end of July especially with no class contact, two weeks tuition before hand will not make any difference to this, we all know they opt out when it gets close to the exams...on top of this I for one don’t want to have to go into work for two weeks during potentially the best month of the year...I am full sure that I am not the only teacher the fells like this. I have been spending hours engaging with my students since the closure began and I had my course finished anyway so I have no need to meet them in person in July.

Totally agree Solerina. I'm actually struggling to take it in!

km79

solerina wrote: »

I personally think this is a crazy decision, students will totally struggle to stay motivated until the end of July especially with no class contact, two weeks tuition before hand will not make any difference to this, we all know they opt out when it gets close to the exams...on top of this I for one don’t want to have to go into work for two weeks during potentially the best month of the year...I am full sure that I am not the only teacher the fells like this. I have been spending hours engaging with my students since the closure began and I had my course finished anyway so I have no need to meet them in person in July.

One other point on this
The actual logistics of it assuming social distancing is still in play
Will class be split into 2/3/4 and we do the same things over 2/3/4 times
or 6/7/8 in my case as i have 2 classes for same subject
I dunno
It feels like what it is . A poorly and hastily thought out "plan". Which is buying time and being made up as we go along.
Does anybody think this has helped ease LC students stress and provided clarity?

Greensoup

Any ideas on what happens with project work research topics? Will there be time to write them up?

acequion

If ever we needed our unions, we need them now! And we need to make them work for us.

Clarity as to our rights is needed asap. Clarity as to what we should and should not be expected to do is needed asap.

For starters that JC plan should be stopped in its tracks.Way over the top to foist that on schools and teachers after all this.

mirrorwall14

Every single person here needs to contact all their TDs and their union now. Not tomorrow. Now. There’s needs to be an immediate response

MacGyver007

km79 wrote: »

Does anybody think this has helped ease LC students stress and provided clarity?

Not if the reaction on Twitter is anything to go by

https://twitter.com/Education_Ire/status/1248631190564847617

thefasteriwalk

Greensoup wrote: »

Any ideas on what happens with project work research topics? Will there be time to write them up?

It says in the statement that they are also due whenever the exams will eventually take place. Nightmare. With history, students have them done and dusted approximately two months before the written exam. Now they could possibly be writing them up mere days before their exam. I know, for my 6th years at least, that this will detract from their performance in the written exam.

I also agree with Spurious above. I’m due to correct this summer but if I get fewer papers than usual then it won’t be financially worth my while.

jimmytwotimes 2013

Susan Quiet Stool wrote: »

If the reason for no JC alongside the delayed LC is the need for social distancing, then that raises serious questions about how school could reopen fully just a couple of weeks later. If two year groups can't be managed in August, how can six year groups be managed in September?

Schools probably won't reopen fully. Cud be looking at days of week divided amongst different year groups to not have a full school population present at any one time

bren2001

km79 wrote: »

One other point on this
The actual logistics of it assuming social distancing is still in play
Will class be split into 2/3/4 and we do the same things over 2/3/4 times
or 6/7/8 in my case as i have 2 classes for same subject
I dunno
It feels like what it is . A poorly and hastily thought out "plan". Which is buying time and being made up as we go along.
Does anybody think this has helped ease LC students stress and provided clarity?

That's exactly how plans are made.... No feasible way to setout a clear schedule when there's a virus circulating that doesn't abide by the rules.

I have not seen a better proposal than postponing the exams. I believe the Department made the correct decision today. Nothing hasty about it.

CraftySue

TheDriver wrote: »

I see Sean Sherlock, Labour, has done a right rant in support of SNAs. I'm wondering should this be something he would like to know about?

I think we need to take in on the chin and get on with it, the unions should ensure that this is the only year it happens due to exceptional circumstances.

Also if covid transmission numbers are below 1, as they suspect they are, and they can deal with new outbreaks and contact trace in real time, there would be no need for social distancing in July.

jimmytwotimes 2013

Millem wrote: »

My job is not being replaced.
Who Is expected to correct my class?
I am sure I am not the only one in this position.

Presume somebody will be in for your maternity leave and they'd do it

km79

bren2001 wrote: »

That's exactly how plans are made.... No feasible way to setout a clear schedule when there's a virus circulating that doesn't abide by the rules.

I have not seen a better proposal than postponing the exams. I believe the Department made the correct decision today. Nothing hasty about it.

Cancelling the JC was a no brainer
It has created a lot of issues that could have been avoided that will affect new school year
They would get a JCPA anyways which is worth about the same of not more than the dumbed doen exams

acequion

CraftySue wrote: »

I think we need to take in on the chin and get on with it, the unions should ensure that this is the only year it happens due to exceptional circumstances.

"Take this on the chin" and god only knows what you'll be doing next!! Have some backbone for god sake!!

Yes these are exceptional circumstances but you can't stand idly by and allow the Govt who have a record of making dire decisions when it comes to education, continue to make dire decisions that impact negatively on students and teachers alike. Collectively we need to take a stand here as several aspects of this decision are an absolute disaster.

bren2001

km79 wrote: »

Cancelling the JC was a no brainer
It has created a lot of issues that could have been avoided that will affect new school year
They would get a JCPA anyways which is worth about the same of not more than the dumbed doen exams

and postponing the LC is a no-brainer as well.

Multipass

solerina wrote: »

I personally think this is a crazy decision, students will totally struggle to stay motivated until the end of July especially with no class contact, two weeks tuition before hand will not make any difference to this, we all know they opt out when it gets close to the exams...on top of this I for one don’t want to have to go into work for two weeks during potentially the best month of the year...I am full sure that I am not the only teacher the fells like this. I have been spending hours engaging with my students since the closure began and I had my course finished anyway so I have no need to meet them in person in July.

Not a teacher, parent of a LC student, and I agree with you. My son has being working hard, he’ll be ready for the exam by June. I’m worried the delay will burn him out.

combat14

US have cancelled their SAT exams

UK have cancelled their GCSE and A Levels

China which is back to "normal" have postponed their exams till July

This is all about saving face after Leo's "by hook or by crook" statement

no proper thought or consultation with education professionals has gone in to this at all .. still leaves more questions than and answers and significant unnecessary stress for students

there has to be a better way

jimmytwotimes 2013

Multipass wrote: »

Not a teacher, parent of a LC student, and I agree with you. My son has being working hard, he’ll be ready for the exam by June. I’m worried the delay will burn him out.

I'd advise him to put away the books for about 5/6 weeks and return to them refreshed. A total break.

Keep as active as he can under current conditions and try not to let sleeping pattern get too out of control as teenagers naturally drift towards very late nights and lie-ins.

That's about all I could say to him, feel very sorry LCs 2020

CraftySue

acequion wrote: »

"Take this on the chin" and god only knows what you'll be doing next!! Have some backbone for god sake!!

Yes these are exceptional circumstances but you can't stand idly by and allow the Govt who have a record of making dire decisions when it comes to education, continue to make dire decisions that impact negatively on students and teachers alike. Collectively we need to take a stand here as several aspects of this decision are an absolute disaster.

I have plenty of backbone thank you very much, I can't see how these are dire educational decisions. The leaving cert date has been rescheduled, students will have been sitting at home since March, we as teachers should support them complete practical subjects and prepare for exams. Not only that if 1st,2nd years etc are asked to come back in July ,-I think we should do that as well. I think it's ironic how teachers here never said a word in support, or were willing to throw SNAs under the bus with the prospect of redeployment into health care roles are now up in arms for been asked to do their job- teaching and preparing students for exams

Calahonda52

solerina wrote: »

.... I for one don’t want to have to go into work for two weeks during potentially the best month of the year...I am full sure that I am not the only teacher the feels like this.

acequion wrote: »

If ever we needed our unions, we need them now! And we need to make them work for us.
Clarity as to our rights is needed asap. Clarity as to what we should and should not be expected to do is needed asap.
For starters that JC plan should be stopped in its tracks.Way over the top to foist that on schools and teachers after all this.

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

Every single person here needs to contact all their TDs and their union now. Not tomorrow. Now. There’s needs to be an immediate response

Where is the student in all of this?

Are these unions the same unions that shafted the yellow packs during the last recession to feather the nests of teachers who had jobs rather than take a pay cut.

combat14

km79 wrote: »

And here we are
Note the subtle change in language from tuition time to classroom tuition time on the Dept website
We will be fools if we continue online after Easter without that being clarified in black and white

So do we stop online teaching after Easter if coming back to teach in july?

km79

combat14 wrote: »

So do we stop online teaching after Easter if coming back to teach in july?

We all really need clarity
McHugh’s choice of words about schools remaining closed has confused a lot of students and parents

Something else that will need clarifying
Will junior certs also need to be “retaught”?
When will this be expected and from whom

By hook or by crook is why we are here

Multipass

CraftySue wrote: »

I have plenty of backbone thank you very much, I can't see how these are dire educational decisions. The leaving cert date has been rescheduled, students will have been sitting at home since March, we as teachers should support them complete practical subjects and prepare for exams. Not only that if 1st,2nd years etc are asked to come back in July ,-I think we should do that as well. I think it's ironic how teachers here never said a word in support, or were willing to throw SNAs under the bus with the prospect of redeployment into health care roles are now up in arms for been asked to do their job- teaching and preparing students for exams

I can only speak from my experience - but my son has not been sitting at home. He has got up early every Monday morning and attended a normal school week. His teachers, nearly all of them, have been engaged and working hard to keep everyone moving along. Today has been a huge disappointment.

mtoutlemonde

CraftySue wrote: »

But if the DES on their website are saying students have lost 15 instruction days, is that not a contradiction of what was said before. Even so, if schools are closed now - as the minister kept repeating, and online lessons were to cease- that time will have to be made up.

They have only missed 14 days instruction days and in most schools it's 13. They obviously forgot that St. Patrick's Day is a bank holiday. DES not able to count