Coronavirus and the effect on Public transport

punisher5112

GT89 wrote: »

Or maybe don't bother with discussions and just let on more than 17 anyway just like that gym that is remaining open despite the restrictions.

That's a total gimmick to get his business heard....

He will look the hero and shut the door the second the cops arrive as he will be slapped with fines too.

The Ginger

No doubt many here will be delighted to know C19 is currently popping up in donnybrook depot, inspector and drivers are getting it, i imagine it will only increase from here on out, most likely the same in the other depots, could have a disastrous effect on public transport considering Nphet wanted to cancel all public transport, they might yet get their way.

GT89

weldoninhio wrote: »

Overheard the driver on one of my buses this morning tell someone there'll be a bit of leeway today and tomorrow, but from Monday it's 10 strictly (was on a single decker)

Schools off for midterm next week so will probably be less of an issue

dashcamdanny

From the unions with no people permitted to stand.

Model Max capacity
VT 23
AX/EV 19
GT (1-70) 18
GT (71-100) 17
SG 17
AH 16
VH 16

GT89

dashcamdanny wrote: »

From the unions with no people permitted to stand.

Model Max capacity
VT 23
AX/EV 19
GT (1-70) 18
GT (71-100) 17
SG 17
AH 16
VH 16

Not really 25% of the buses actual capacity is it 37 wasn't 50% either. It's not the union place to make such a call either in my opinion. 17 is not even 20% of 90 let alone 25%.

If the unions were so concerned about driver safety then they should be calling for rear door boarding on dual door buses.

StreetLight

GT89 wrote: »

It's not the union place to make such a call either in my opinion.

The unions are not making any such call. They are simply relaying the information given from management.

Jamie2k9

Nice if NBRU did something useful and call for 50% capacity to be immediatly restored instead of writing to CIE asking them for extra services.

Pointless press release issued to meida outlets this afternoon...

GT89

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Nice if NBRU did something useful and call for 50% capacity to be immediatly restored instead of writing to CIE asking them for extra services.

Pointless press release issued to meida outlets this afternoon...

I agree. 50% was fine. I thought the whole purpose of making masks mandatory was to allow more people travel. Back when buses were limted to 17 passengers masks weren't mandatory. Maybe they should lift this now they're back to 17 passengers per bus or continue with 50%.

I think people should lobby TDs and the NTA to restore the service back to 50%.

punisher5112

What should have been done is if you don't have a card which is registered then you don't travel...

I have to give my details in canteen and was having to at other places when they were open.

AlekSmart

The Ginger wrote: »

No doubt many here will be delighted to know C19 is currently popping up in donnybrook depot, inspector and drivers are getting it, i imagine it will only increase from here on out, most likely the same in the other depots, could have a disastrous effect on public transport considering Nphet wanted to cancel all public transport, they might yet get their way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOgFZfRVaww

Imagination aside,life is going on,with somewhat more people now prepared to take a degree of calculated risk and attempt to resume a form of approximately normal life.

Dublin's c.22,000 cases and upward trajectory,means that Corona is not going to disappear anytime soon,but neither is it going to lay waste to the entire population overnight.

https://covid19ireland-geohive.hub.arcgis.com/pages/detailed-county-statistics

Looking at the timeline,it's difficult not to draw a correlation between Re-Opening of Schools and a significant rise in cases.
Personally,I believe the asymptomatic nature of childhood infection is leading to the spike in adult infections,whose mortality rates however, remain low in comparison with the numbers in late March.

thenightman

X bus this morning was fine with just the usual cadre of fellow commuters, albeit slightly less of them than last few months. Regular route home this afternoon was a mess, with people standing, people sitting in the (newly) blocked off seats and arguing over having the windows open despite the signs saying they should be. Not much use having these rules if nobody enforces them, not blaming driver either by the way.

L1011

GT89 wrote: »

Or maybe don't bother with discussions and just let on more than 17 anyway just like that gym that is remaining open despite the restrictions.

The gym that was grandstanding to get free PR and then closed anyway, you mean?

punisher5112

L1011 wrote: »

The gym that was grandstanding to get free PR and then closed anyway, you mean?

Cant believe they fell for it and then he gets more of a headline saying he changed his mind because he got a visit from the filth..... What utter idiot of and editor let that run... Publicity stunt.

Lifelike

GT89 wrote: »

I agree. 50% was fine. I thought the whole purpose of making masks mandatory was to allow more people travel. Back when buses were limted to 17 passengers masks weren't mandatory. Maybe they should lift this now they're back to 17 passengers per bus or continue with 50%.

I think people should lobby TDs and the NTA to restore the service back to 50%.

100% agree with the above. The bus driver on my bus this morning didn’t even enforce the 25% rule as doing so would have meant that many people would have been left behind. From talking to others the anecdotal evidence seems to be that this happened all across Dublin, reinforcing the fact that limiting the buses to 25% capacity during this lockdown is every bit as unworkable as many of us on this thread have predicted.

It really is regrettable to see public transport users being cr@pped on like this, particularly given the fact that the Green Party is in government and the government's pre-COVID policies to encourage people to use public transport.

GT89

Lifelike wrote: »

100% agree with the above. The bus driver on my bus this morning didn’t even enforce the 25% rule as doing so would have meant that many people would have been left behind. From talking to others the anecdotal evidence seems to be that this happened all across Dublin, reinforcing the fact that limiting the buses to 25% capacity during this lockdown is every bit as unworkable as many of us on this thread have predicted.

It really is regrettable to see public transport users being cr@pped on like this, particularly given the fact that the Green Party is in government and the government's pre-COVID policies to encourage people to use public transport.

Good on that bus driver for using his/her common sense. I hope some busy body arsehole dosen't report them. They have been treating public transport users particularly bus users like dirt aswell with these new cycle lanes taking up half the road like the one in Dundrum.

I think a lot of bus drivers know the score with this covid nonsense tbh saw have seen a good giving each other high fives and knuckle touches at the terminus or when changing drivers like I do with my own work colleagues few wear masks aswell.

Tickityboo

GT89 wrote: »

Good on that bus driver for using his/her common sense. I hope some busy body arsehole dosen't report them. They have been treating public transport users particularly bus users like dirt aswell with these new cycle lanes taking up half the road like the one in Dundrum.

I think a lot of bus drivers know the score with this covid nonsense tbh saw have seen a good giving each other high fives and knuckle touches at the terminus or when changing drivers like I do with my own work colleagues few wear masks aswell.

That's amazing in my many years working in Dublin Bus since the(90s) I've never witnessed any bus drivers high five each other on hand over or any other time and especially not in the last six months.

With regards to loadings I found it very quiet today e.g. on my 17.30 departure from the north side I picked up 13 passengers by the time I arrived on the south side normally you could quadruple that.

There will only be problems at peak times but I'm sure Dublin Bus will add in some extra departures if they have buses and drivers to spare.

IE 222

Seen as school transport is unaffected by the new measures would it be possible to run some school only buses with 50-60% capacity. Most routes should be albe to dedicate one or two departures in the morning and afternoon for this.

Tickityboo

IE 222 wrote: »

Seen as school transport is unaffected by the new measures would it be possible to run some school only buses with 50-60% capacity. Most routes should be albe to dedicate one or two departures in the morning and afternoon for this.

Good idea but there could be an issue around not having any seat belts as all school buses must have seatbelts.

punisher5112

Tickityboo wrote: »

Good idea but there could be an issue around not having any seat belts as all school buses must have seatbelts.

Which to be fair is pure nuts when a full school or class can go out, wait for a bus in service and get on.

Tickityboo

punisher5112 wrote: »

Which to be fair is pure nuts when a full school or class can go out, wait for a bus in service and get on.

Yep totally agree

IE 222

Surely if it was running as a regular bus route you would avoid the school transport rules. Maybe the wording of such a route can avoid any obstacles.

GT89

The NTA are going to be looking into the problems caused by the new capacity restrictions. Please do the common sense thing and bring it back to 50%.

bk

GT89 wrote: »

The NTA are going to be looking into the problems caused by the new capacity restrictions. Please do the common sense thing and bring it back to 50%.

The argument from the public health folks would be that if 25% is not efficient, then the Level 5 restrictions are not being properly enforced or even more strict restrictions are necessary.

Keep in mind, that during last March's restrictions, levels dropped to just 10%, so 25% is quiet a bit over that and 50% is WAY over that. Large numbers using public transport and traffic numbers on the roads being high will likely be an indicator to the government that Level 5 isn't working and more needs to be done.

Of course in reality we aren't really at Level 5, it is more like Level 4.5 and even Level 5 is no where near as strict as last March's restrictions, what with schools open, etc. So really there is an even more strict Level 6 too.

Hopefully this less strict Level 4/5 works and people actually do what needs to be done, so that it doesn't end up needing even longer then 6 weeks and perhaps some sort of Level 6. That would be devastating for our economy. We really all need to pull together and make this work.

If I was the NTA, I certainly wouldn't rush into anything, likely the first day or two were going to be mayhem, as people got use to the new restrictions. I'd say it will ease off and people will travel less or make other arrangements. I certainly don't see them breaking government health guidelines and increasing to 50%, instead I'd see extra buses being laid on at specific pinch points.

punisher5112

The biggest difference is schools are open this time.

Seems to be more working too.

Yesterday at around 4 it was extremely busy, people left behind.

GT89

bk wrote: »

The argument from the public health folks would be that if 25% is not efficient, then the Level 5 restrictions are not being properly enforced or even more strict restrictions are necessary.

Keep in mind, that during last March's restrictions, levels dropped to just 10%, so 25% is quiet a bit over that and 50% is WAY over that. Large numbers using public transport and traffic numbers on the roads being high will likely be an indicator to the government that Level 5 isn't working and more needs to be done.

Of course in reality we aren't really at Level 5, it is more like Level 4.5 and even Level 5 is no where near as strict as last March's restrictions, what with schools open, etc. So really there is an even more strict Level 6 too.

Hopefully this less strict Level 4/5 works and people actually do what needs to be done, so that it doesn't end up needing even longer then 6 weeks and perhaps some sort of Level 6. That would be devastating for our economy. We really all need to pull together and make this work.

If I was the NTA, I certainly wouldn't rush into anything, likely the first day or two were going to be mayhem, as people got use to the new restrictions. I'd say it will ease off and people will travel less or make other arrangements. I certainly don't see them breaking government health guidelines and increasing to 50%, instead I'd see extra buses being laid on at specific pinch points.

The fact of the matter is people couldn't less and will break the guidelines either way people are not tolerating this lockdown yesterday felt very like normal despite the so called lockdown. Traffic was busy enough and it seemed there were a lot of people out and about despite the increased restrictions.

The big difference between now and last March was that most people were genuinely terrified of catching the virus meaning most people bought into the lockdown as it was unclear the effect it had on people. Now most people accept that this only effects vulnerable people severely and couldn't care if they catch it or pass it on to others. A lockdown that relies on enforcement in order for there to be compliance has already failed at the first hurdle.

Tickityboo

GT89 wrote: »

The fact of the matter is people couldn't less and will break the guidelines either way people are not tolerating this lockdown yesterday felt very like normal despite the so called lockdown. Traffic was busy enough and it seemed there were a lot of people out and about despite the increased restrictions.

The big difference between now and last March was that most people were genuinely terrified of catching the virus meaning most people bought into the lockdown as it was unclear the effect it had on people. Now most people accept that this only effects vulnerable people severely and couldn't care if they catch it or pass it on to others. A lockdown that relies on enforcement in order for there to be compliance has already failed at the first hurdle.

We know there are lots of people who don't care about passing it on to others and you come across as precisely one of those people as you said yourself you're going around high fiving your work mates and planning on using public transport for unnecessary journeys and all the while you could be asymptomatic.

punisher5112

It's quite simple, don't travel unless needed and especially on public transport if you have no genuine reason then to be honest pee right off.

You are putting others and myself at more risk, the less I carry or see the better to be honest.
I don't like it at all, my job is to get people around, it's very weird constantly having to watch numbers and try and stay safe.

Cleaning cab as soon as take the bus over, the dirt still on the wipes is crazy especially when these are meant to be deep cleaned.....

Keep the seat for someone that needs it.

GT89

Tickityboo wrote: »

We know there are lots of people who don't care about passing it on to others and you come across as precisely one of those people as you said yourself you're going around high fiving your work mates and planning on using public transport for unnecessary journeys and all the while you could be asymptomatic.

People like yourself are ever increasingly becoming in the minority. The reason I don't care about passing it on is because no one I am around on a daily whether it be at home, friends or work is vulnerable and if they were vulnerable they have not made me aware. If you want to avoid catching the virus as much as possible stay at home if not then let the rest of us get on with our normal lives it's your choice.

Lot's of people feel the same but aren't willing to admit it or say it quietly I generally give people as much space possible it's generally others that come too close to me but I do not have a particular problem with this mind you as I don't really care if I get it.

devnull

GT89 wrote: »

The fact of the matter is people couldn't less and will break the guidelines either way people are not tolerating this lockdown yesterday felt very like normal despite the so called lockdown. Traffic was busy enough and it seemed there were a lot of people out and about despite the increased restrictions.

The big difference between now and last March was that most people were genuinely terrified of catching the virus meaning most people bought into the lockdown as it was unclear the effect it had on people. Now most people accept that this only effects vulnerable people severely and couldn't care if they catch it or pass it on to others. A lockdown that relies on enforcement in order for there to be compliance has already failed at the first hurdle.

This topic is about Coronavirus and the effect on public transport. It is very much not the place to be discussing the virus in general, how deadly it may or may not be and who it may or may not effect etc.

Whilst you may have strong views on this subject and want to discuss these things and the virus in general there is a dedicated COVID-19 forum on Boards where I suggest that you do so.

If you continue to go down this avenue and do not stick to the topic at hand I will have no choice but to ban you from posting in this thread again. The ball is in your court.

- Moderator.

How Soon Is Now

Luas doing there usual stellar job of ****ing things up at best possible times!

Been delays on Red line since this morning nearly every tram I've seen today has been busy.

Their security and their ticket inspectors are not worth a ****e at this stage. They usually just look in the window while loads of people on board ain't wearing masks or have them hanging off their chin.

Sitting at the Four Courts here since before 5 waiting on the tram to Saggart im sure it's gonna be packed when does finally come...

Lifelike

bk wrote: »

The argument from the public health folks would be that if 25% is not efficient, then the Level 5 restrictions are not being properly enforced or even more strict restrictions are necessary.

Keep in mind, that during last March's restrictions, levels dropped to just 10%, so 25% is quiet a bit over that and 50% is WAY over that. Large numbers using public transport and traffic numbers on the roads being high will likely be an indicator to the government that Level 5 isn't working and more needs to be done.

Of course in reality we aren't really at Level 5, it is more like Level 4.5 and even Level 5 is no where near as strict as last March's restrictions, what with schools open, etc. So really there is an even more strict Level 6 too.

Hopefully this less strict Level 4/5 works and people actually do what needs to be done, so that it doesn't end up needing even longer then 6 weeks and perhaps some sort of Level 6. That would be devastating for our economy. We really all need to pull together and make this work.

If I was the NTA, I certainly wouldn't rush into anything, likely the first day or two were going to be mayhem, as people got use to the new restrictions. I'd say it will ease off and people will travel less or make other arrangements. I certainly don't see them breaking government health guidelines and increasing to 50%, instead I'd see extra buses being laid on at specific pinch points.

Perhaps the reduction in public transport capacity to 25% should be linked to the closure of the schools, it just doesn’t make sense to allow just 17 people on a double decker when the schools are open. It’s not possible or safe for all kids to walk or cycle to school and the government has to take this into account when deciding to restrict capacity on public transport. If they want numbers on public transport to go back to 10% of normal levels then they need to impose the restrictions to match, ie all retail other than grocery stores and pharmacies closed, schools closed and construction sites closed, although we are unlikely to go back to that level of lockdown again due to the unsustainability of such restrictions.

Remember that at 25% capacity even public transport usage at 15-20% of normal levels will put severe strain on the service as a large portion of that 15-20% will be concentrated at peak times due to the profile of those travelling during lockdown. Non-work or school related travel, the bulk of which would be done off-peak, is currently almost non-existent at level 5.

Other countries in Europe have not seen fit to reduce PT capacity to 25% which begs the question as to why we need to. Also bear in mind that NPHET wanted to shut down public transport completely back in August. That will tell you all you need to know about their attitude to public transport users. Somehow I don’t think that Holohan, Philip Nolan et al needed to be concerned about their bus into town for their daily briefings being full this morning!

dfx-

punisher5112 wrote: »

Keep the seat for someone that needs it.

That doesn't work if the person already sitting in the seat also needs it. Which is more likely to happen at 25% capacity.

The reduction is inexplicable.

punisher5112

dfx- wrote: »

That doesn't work if the person already sitting in the seat also needs it. Which is more likely to happen at 25% capacity.

The reduction is inexplicable.

I don't think you understand, it's meant keep a place for someone that needs it, not going out for the craic like many are, it's for essential reasons, kids going off to meet their mates and then getting on at 11 or 12 at night and either not paying or throwing in a euro isn't essential travel and so on

GT89

punisher5112 wrote: »

I don't think you understand, it's meant keep a place for someone that needs it, not going out for the craic like many are, it's for essential reasons, kids going off to meet their mates and then getting on at 11 or 12 at night and either not paying or throwing in a euro isn't essential travel and so on

Almost any bus I've seen or been on after 8 at night over the last couple of months have been carrying mostly fresh air with maybe 2 or 3 on them no where near 17 or whatever the limit is. Kids travelling late at night for un essential reasons are not taking up seats for those who need them.

Most people who travel at peak times are travelling for essiential reasons most un essential travel is off peak.

punisher5112

GT89 wrote: »

Almost any bus I've seen or been on after 8 at night over the last couple of months have been carrying mostly fresh air with maybe 2 or 3 on them no where near 17 or whatever the limit is. Kids travelling late at night for un essential reasons are not taking up seats for those who need them.

Most people who travel at peak times are travelling for essiential reasons most un essential travel is off peak.

How do you know, seriously talking through your hoop, I'm out in the thick of it, there are still busy times and people are been left, obviously peak times of course but there are other times too....

I'll admit today was very quite compared to the rest of the week.

I'd be happier if people adhere to the guidelines and we get out of this before it ruins us completely. Its great you feel you're invincible etc but I'm not and neither are many other driver's, I don't want to catch this and the more that travel there is much higher a risk....

GT89

punisher5112 wrote: »

How do you know, seriously talking through your hoop, I'm out in the thick of it, there are still busy times and people are been left, obviously peak times of course but there are other times too....

I'll admit today was very quite compared to the rest of the week.

I'd be happier if people adhere to the guidelines and we get out of this before it ruins us completely. Its great you feel you're invincible etc but I'm not and neither are many other driver's, I don't want to catch this and the more that travel there is much higher a risk....

Generally they are fairly empty late on. For example a 63 passed me while I was out walking tonight and there was not a sinner on it same with the 46a, 145 and 155s I've seen.

I'm getting into a discussion about the virus on this thread as I have been warned over this. The only thing I will say is no other country in Europe has restricted public transport to this level as of yet and there have not been mass numbers of public transport staff out of work. In fact some countries have actually gotten rid of capacity restrictions on public transport and there has been no issue. Sweden for example.

punisher5112

I have seen sweet fcuk all Gardai out also, the odd car or van and that's it.

One checkpoint on O'Connell bridge earlier, well guessing as seen lights but didn't go through.

Notice a lot more stores open this time round too.

dashcamdanny

Been on lates from 2pm till late the last couple of days. None cross city routes

One instance where I had to leave kids in uniform in a group behind. But other buses close behind going the same direction.

Numbers drastically down. Practically empty after 9pm. So at least on the routes I was on, on lates there has been no issues.

100% compliance masks as well. (which is not surprising when going to working middle class areas). I expect rate of compliance to drop dramatically on the 40, 27 or 13 as there seems to be more people who just dont care on those routes.

I hear some garages are rushing through universal duties to pick up the slack on rush hour.

I do understand some main cross city routes are getting too many people which the Uni's should address.

Midnight_EG

40s and 13s have massive compliance to be honest, I'm on the 13 5 times in the last week

punisher5112

Great getting on with one, as soon as some are on and sitting off it comes, some eating, drinking, loud conversation on phone or between themselves....

Obviously a lot more are following but I still think it's not working.

thenightman

punisher5112 wrote: »

I don't think you understand, it's meant keep a place for someone that needs it, not going out for the craic like many are, it's for essential reasons, kids going off to meet their mates and then getting on at 11 or 12 at night and either not paying or throwing in a euro isn't essential travel and so on

Not many people are out for the craic at 7.30am on a weekday morning but buses are full, as mine was yesterday morning. People are going to school, or work that is deemed essential.


If government can't provide sufficient & safe PT capacity to support those then they can either increase capacity allowed on board, add more vehicles or change school opening to off peak times. Basically do anything at all, not just blindly reducing capacity & hoping for the best as seems to be the case currently.

punisher5112

thenightman wrote: »

Not many people are out for the craic at 7.30am on a weekday morning but buses are full, as mine was yesterday morning. People are going to school, or work that is deemed essential.


If government can't provide sufficient & safe PT capacity to support those then they can either increase capacity allowed on board, add more vehicles or change school opening to off peak times. Basically do anything at all, not just blindly reducing capacity & hoping for the best as seems to be the case currently.

Why you highlighting my post.

thenightman

You mentioned buses were busy cos people were going out for the craic.

punisher5112

thenightman wrote: »

You mentioned buses were busy cos people were going out for the craic.

And some are as many were in the 1st lockdown.

Drug runs, going to the beach or park, drinking etc etc...

GT89

punisher5112 wrote: »

And some are as many were in the 1st lockdown.

Drug runs, going to the beach or park, drinking etc etc...

They're probably always there just probably more noticable during lockdown as they were the only people using the bus.

.anon.

punisher5112 wrote: »

Great getting on with one, as soon as some are on and sitting off it comes, some eating, drinking, loud conversation on phone or between themselves....

Obviously a lot more are following but I still think it's not working.

I've been using the PA to get people to wear their masks properly...

"Good morning everyone... You all have lovely noses, but if I can see them, that means you're not wearing your mask properly."

TutboTommy

Normally not a fan of these forums for many reasons, but I had to correct some of the nonsense.

I don't know if he was a troll or not, but to the guy who thought there is no enforcement on PT there was and there is, you just have not seen it yet.
I work with the health minister so i'm aware of all the strategies they are using and some of them are pretty clever. They are stopping people getting off busses at major points, sometimes even boarding the bus before the stop and having driver close the door behind them.

The guards get lied to about 20 times a day, it's part of the job you have to learn to live with pretty quickly, the one plus side of it is because they get lied to so often they are good at spotting it when you are doing it. If tey doubt you they might ask for some sort of proof of what you are saying.

Remember you can't just say ''shopping'' and that's it, look at the language of the actual Act of Oireachtas and the actual miniserial order it can't just be an excuse it has to be a ''reasonable'' excuse. So if you are far from home because you are going to get chemo in hospital ok. If you are shopping but you have gone 60 miles from home past loads of possible supermarkets, chemests etc, you have failed the 'reasonable' test.

They are also checking rail they may not ride the actual train, because we don't have a transport police they can't go outside their district (which is stupid) but the train will hold while they do their thing. They often pick major interchanges but I've also seen them at smaller stations.
Incidentally, if you don't have a ticket you are technically tresspassing and that's probable cause for a search...they are catching a lot of criminals by using the covid regs as a gateway!

I think DBs idea of different fares at different times was a great notion...what seems to be happening, over and over, is the 3-4 members of the cabinet that have some cop on and brains bring stuff to the full cabinet and then the rest rip the ideas apart and some half assed watered down version comes out later. That is what happened with the house party regs, they were ripped apart and no no no last time, then covid spiked like crazy and they had to go do what was suggested in the first place...a law to deal with house parties.

THe reason they are scared re:50 percent is masks are not the total protection people seem to think they are.

There are two issues I think the govt and the last one should have put more emphasis on:

1. Covid can wreck your body even if it does not kill you, search the terms 'long term covid' etc and see about the scarred lungs, the never ending low energy, the heart problems etc etc at the start of this they were eager to put out the message 'dont worry most people just get flu like symptoms v few die' that they put out the suggestion that if you don't die you are fine...that's not the case, there is a huge third category. 60% have nurological symptoms months after they have ''recovered'

2. Masks are not a cure all, they reduce they dont' eliminate. Even the masks they wear in hospitals don't stop everything escaping, so we can't pack the busses again even if everyone is masked. There is some debate to be had (there is a range of possible reasonable options in every covid decision) about what % but we can't just stuff people in like before.

GT you are flat out WRONG that it only affects vunerable people severely, that is not true. THey are the most affected group that is not the same as saying it ONLY affects them. There are 28 year old athletes with scarred lungs for life and 30 year olds with no energy no matter how much they sleep, people with brain infarks because of lack of oxigen. It's NOT a case of die or the flu.

This things way more contagious than the flu and way more lethal.

If we had not locked down earlier in the year there would have been exponential growth and 30-50 000 deaths.
In addition, these vunerabe people can't just be thrown to the wolves. They mix with everyone else all the time there is no way to seal them off, you are talking about around 30% of the country here, everyone thiks that group includes just old people but it's a wide category. There are 20 year olds who are expected to live a normal lifespan, and going back to toral normal before a vaccine or a proper testing system would write them off.

You can't bloddy seal the vunerable off, they have LIVES they have to go to work they have to go to the supermarket they will be breathing the same air as you no matter how well protected they are.


There is a boatload of new quick test kits order coming in december that will allow people to test themselves and at work etc which should allow things to open a bit, they are quick and easy they may be a game changer they are already on order.
Theres also several vaccine trials looking promising several of which would be manufactured here. Though the vaccine will come in phases certain groups will get it first.

This won't take forever. I had someone take my head off on the 145/155 the other day. The driver got out of his cab and asked a woman (to my shame wearing a jacket from the same uni as me) to stop eating and put her mask on. She did, I got a panic in my chest I'm working from home loads because liver issues mean I'm in the vunerable group despite being extremely fit otherwise. I opened two of the small slide windows to clear the air since I just realized (which i had not before) someone maskless was sitting right behind me. She rather hysterically got up and slammed them shut. I kinda lost it and said they stay open until I get off so the air can clear, or I'll f---- toss you off the bus myself. This may be something some people read about but I have to read all these horror reports at work and in news knowing full well it could be me gasping on a respirator any day because someone was too lazy to follow some easy rules.


Our grandparents and great grandparents endured plagues, carpet bombins, world wars, genocide, famines, and diseases like smallpox with 50 and 90percent death rates...if we can't handle a few restrictions here and there we ought to be embarrased to be their successors.

Lifelike

My buses both to and from work were both more than 25% full again today. And that’s with the schools off. When are we going to stop pretending that we can get by with 25% capacity on PT?

91wx763

Lifelike wrote: »

My buses both to and from work were both more than 25% full again today. And that’s with the schools off. When are we going to stop pretending that we can get by with 25% capacity on PT?

Are DB running duplicates on the busier sections of routes ?

Lux23

Lifelike wrote: »

My buses both to and from work were both more than 25% full again today. And that’s with the schools off. When are we going to stop pretending that we can get by with 25% capacity on PT?

Is there any way your employer can let you work from home? Or provide a way for you to attend at staggered times?

I strongly suspect a lot of employers are ignoring government advice and forcing people into offices when they don't need to be there.