The UK response to Covid-19 [MOD WARNING 1ST POST]

J Mysterio

AllForIt wrote: »

One would have to be born yesterday to believe that. The idea that those in the Guardian and The Mirror were merely looking for an apology after sitting on the story for a few weeks and unleashing it in drabs for effect would have then said okay we forgive you, lets move on...not even in a parallel universe would that happen. If he did actually apologie they'd be disappointed.

Sorry, it's not just the Guardian and the Mirror weighing in is it? Will you still buy the Daily Mail?

maebee

My take on it is the same as to Enzokk's. BJ et al all knew and now know that Cummings broke their own rules. Today they tried to massage the rules in Cumming's favour. Stupid tactic. The rules were there in print and on video. Couldn't have been clearer. "If you have symptoms, do not travel anywhere. Full stop.

BJ should have come out today and said something like "Dominic was spooked/shocked/panicked/whatever, at the news that his wife was ill with Corona symptoms. (the day he raced out of No. 10), packed his family up and went to Durham. He made a mistake. He, and we are desperately sorry about this etc. The rules are there for everyone".

BJ and Cummings should have put their hands up. Big mistake in not doing so. They have angered their population who abided by their rules and suffered as a result.

Never thought I'd say it but the UK is a basket case right now.

Mike3287

When will we get pics of him getting a snickers and haribo in the petrol station?

Had to have stopped for a coffee on his 400km one leg journey

J Mysterio

maebee wrote: »

My take on it is the same as to Enzokk's. BJ et al all knew and now know that Cummings broke their own rules. Today they tried to massage the rules in Cumming's favour. Stupid tactic. The rules were there in print and on video. Couldn't have been clearer. "If you have symptoms, do not travel anywhere. Full stop.

BJ should have come out today and said something like "Dominic was spooked/shocked/panicked/whatever, at the news that his wife was ill with Corona symptoms. (the day he raced out of No. 10), packed his family up and went to Durham. He made a mistake. He, and we are desperately sorry about this etc. The rules are there for everyone".

BJ and Cummings should have put their hands up. Big mistake in not doing so. They have angered their population who abided by their rules and suffered as a result.

Never thought I'd say it but the UK is a basket case right now.

I agree with your post except the last sentence. The UK has been a basket case for about 5 years now.

J Mysterio

How the **** can they open schools on June 1st?

maebee

J Mysterio wrote: »

How the **** can they open schools on June 1st?

The "Opening schools on June the 1st" is the dead cat

ChikiChiki

Cummings spent all afternoon in Downing Street cultivating the narrative.

The man is beyond diluded that he thought they can weather it. What is more concerning is the inability of Boris to think for himself and anticipate how this strategy was going to play out.

Cummings absolutely controls Boris who is spellbound by DC's past achievements. A very weakened limp Prime Minister in charge today.

Joe_ Public

Mike3287 wrote: »

When will we get pics of him getting a snickers and haribo in the petrol station?

Had to have stopped for a coffee on his 400km one leg journey

Been a totally surreal day. From Grant Shapps "won't somebody ask me about the A66" this morning to the announcement that the pm was finally swinging into action to "nip the story in the bud" for once and for all and then that train wreck of a briefing!

And not forgetting the multiple sightings of cummings oop north on not one but two further occasions, details of which may emerge in the coming days.

Had Cummings a shred of honour and taken his due punishment there could have been some damage limitation but no chance now. Johnson authority shredded, tory party fractured, any semblance of trust remaining well and truly gone. Worst of all, they've pretty much fcked the lockdown. How can a cop in all conscience go out tomorrow and get tough on anyone tweaking regulations? They'd be laughed at and that's entirely a Johnson/Cummings joint production.

Richard Hillman

Water John wrote: »

If Boris has lost the Daily Mail, Cummings is toast. Really poor call today, Boris has few to trust actually, without his attack dog.That governed his decision. He'll be weakened.

The Daily Mails readership is about 1m per day. The Conservatives got 14m votes in the last election. Even if they managed to convince all 1m readers to vote Labour in 2024 over something that will be forgotten about next week, it will still be irrelevant.

Strazdas

J Mysterio wrote: »

How the **** can they open schools on June 1st?

I read that pressure for this is coming from the Chancellor.

declanflynn

Richard Hillman wrote: »

The Daily Mails readership is about 1m per day. The Conservatives got 14m votes in the last election. Even if they managed to convince all 1m readers to vote Labour in 2024 over something that will be forgotten about next week, it will still be irrelevant.

A 7% swing to Labour from the tories would make all the difference in a general election.

robinph

J Mysterio wrote: »

How the **** can they open schools on June 1st?

Please don't have them change tack on the schools. I need them to reopen.

Think far more damage will be done by the rest of the population not paying as much attention to social distancing in the rest of their day than by a handful of kids going back to schools and washing their hands loads whilst sat 2m apart from each other.

munsterlegend

Williamson education secretary on sky news now repeating ad nauseum that BJ met with DC and he is happy with that. Another rabbit in the headlights interview. You can even see he knows he is defending the indefensible.

Mushy

Williamson on Sky now saying it should be expected that somebody would definitely be telling the truth to the PM. Surely nobody can believe that, not even himself

robinph

Mushy wrote: »

Williamson on Sky now saying it should be expected that somebody would definitely be telling the truth to the PM. Surely nobody can believe that, not even himself

Like how you'd expect that the PM would tell the truth to their monarch presumably?

Roger_007

Mushy wrote: »

Williamson on Sky now saying it should be expected that somebody would definitely be telling the truth to the PM. Surely nobody can believe that, not even himself

He’s being very clever/cowardly about what he says. He is very pointedly saying that whatever story Boris is putting out, it was cooked up between Cummings and Boris and nothing to do with him.
He is not throwing Cummings under a bus, he’s actually throwing Boris under a bus.

Enzokk

AllForIt wrote: »

One would have to be born yesterday to believe that. The idea that those in the Guardian and The Mirror were merely looking for an apology after sitting on the story for a few weeks and unleashing it in drabs for effect would have then said okay we forgive you, lets move on...not even in a parallel universe would that happen. If he did actually apologie they'd be disappointed.

No, not in May. They had the story in April when it happened and they asked for a comment from No.10 and they declined to comment. If the story about his child was true in April and they came out with the "truth" at that time, it would have been done already. There wouldn't have been this backlash as he would not have gone out to Barnard Castle as he would have known they eyes of the press would have been on him and no second breach.

But for me the story about the child was put forward because they thought it would give them the cover. The fact it is a lie means it unraveled almost from the start under even the flimsiest of questioning. Let us remember they went to his parents place to be close to his parents. First unravel, the parents are over 70 so they were putting them in danger.

Second lie added, it wasn't the parents but they went to be close to his sister who did all the shopping for them but they were in isolation for the recommended time. Sighting in another town before the 14 day period is up apparently.

So yeah, had the truth been the story about the child and had they been truthful from the start, there would not have been this furore. Keir Starmer was just newly elected and the feeling at that time was we were all in it together still. But you keep telling yourself this is nothing more than the liberal lefty media making a fuss about nothing if it makes you feel better.

You still haven't answered even though you have had a lot to say about the topic since, do you think it was right of him to break the isolation rules and guidelines?

Richard Hillman wrote: »

The Daily Mails readership is about 1m per day. The Conservatives got 14m votes in the last election. Even if they managed to convince all 1m readers to vote Labour in 2024 over something that will be forgotten about next week, it will still be irrelevant.

Another child of summer, for the Daily Mail and the Sun it isn't all about their readership but the headline that people see when they go about their daily business or it is shared around. The reach of people seeing the headline only and not the story is massive and it has just as much of a impact if not more than the story itself I think.


Gavin Williamson is another idiot putting himself in a difficult position. Did he just say on Sky that he believed that Cummings acted lawfully because Cummings told the PM he acted within the law? Does Williamson think Cummings is the arbitrator of what is legal now? Think before you speak.

J Mysterio

J Mysterio wrote: »

I agree with your post except the last sentence. The UK has been a basket case for about 5 years now.

I’ve been watching reruns of the 2012 olympics in the last few days, including those amazing montages that Eddie Butler narrated. I was living in London that summer, and it makes me really genuinely sad to see what has happened to the UK since then. It is a different place

theteal

A snippet from our local "political" group attached. Id love say this was an isolated opinion but it's far from it in this little bastion of Tory worship. There is no hope

LuckyLloyd

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I’ve been watching reruns of the 2012 olympics in the last few days, including those amazing montages that Eddie Butler narrated. I was living in London that summer, and it makes me really genuinely sad to see what has happened to the UK since then. It is a different place

That’s a decent reference point. I attended some events that summer and it was quite the experience: commuting on excellent public transport to gleaming venues that were well laid out; enjoying some decent food; heading home with volunteers lining the route bidding spectators goodbye and goodnight. It was quite the show.

Unfortunately the rot was setting in by then. Austerity was biting hard and unevenly, alienating thousands more with each cut. The distrust of Iraq and the expenses scandal was left to linger; and social media and the Internet was opening up a new conversation that was at odds with the centre aligned suits of Cameron, Clegg and Miliband.

brickster and AllForIt exemplify the attitude that Cummings stokes and embodies. Say anything, ignore inconvenient truths or questions, apologise for nothing, and make it simply about winning and losing - preferably expressed as a slogan.

The most dangerous aspect of course is the denial or reshaping of truth. Cummings’ leave campaign and general election campaigns have taken the reshaping of truth to new frontiers in British politics. Johnson has directly benefited from this sophistry first hand, and is therefore unwilling to lose it. It seems ridiculous for him to stand up infront of the nation ignoring questions, muting journalists from attempting clarifications and trying to label some of the transgressions as “fake news”. But then again, these are the people who sat in a ‘£350m to the NHS’ or pushed social media ads that indicated Turkey was joining the EU. And more recently, Dominic Cummings is a man caught talking about a mass cull of older age brackets in the U.K. What is right is an irrelevancy to these scumbags. They have no shame.

Professor Moriarty

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

That’s a decent reference point. I attended some events that summer and it was quite the experience: commuting on excellent public transport to gleaming venues that were well laid out; enjoying some decent food; heading home with volunteers lining the route bidding spectators goodbye and goodnight. It was quite the show.

Unfortunately the rot was setting in by then. Austerity was biting hard and unevenly, alienating thousands more with each cut. The distrust of Iraq and the expenses scandal was left to linger; and social media and the Internet was opening up a new conversation that was at odds with the centre aligned suits of Cameron, Clegg and Miliband.

brickster and AllForIt exemplify the attitude that Cummings stokes and embodies. Say anything, ignore inconvenient truths or questions, apologise for nothing, and make it simply about winning and losing - preferably expressed as a slogan.

The most dangerous aspect of course is the denial or reshaping of truth. Cummings’ leave campaign and general election campaigns have taken the reshaping of truth to new frontiers in British politics. Johnson has directly benefited from this sophistry first hand, and is therefore unwilling to lose it. It seems ridiculous for him to stand up infront of the nation ignoring questions, muting journalists from attempting clarifications and trying to label some of the transgressions as “fake news”. But then again, these are the people who sat in a ‘£350m to the NHS’ or pushed social media ads that indicated Turkey was joining the EU. And more recently, Dominic Cummings is a man caught talking about a mass cull of older age brackets in the U.K. What is right is an irrelevancy to these scumbags. They have no shame.

TBF to Dom, he practices what he preaches.

Joe_ Public

Mushy wrote: »

Williamson on Sky now saying it should be expected that somebody would definitely be telling the truth to the PM. Surely nobody can believe that, not even himself

Given that Gavin Williamson is the guy who had to resign last year after lying to then pm Theresa May about leaking details from a national security meeting, i have a hunch he might not believe it at all.

Enzokk

Let us not forget why these rules were brought in. In all the clamor to defend Cummings the rules were brought in for a reason. It may be that we have all become a little complacent about Covid-19. I know I have, more trips to the shops where before I could go without the item I forgot to buy.

https://twitter.com/Craig_A_Spencer/status/1264724313955078144?s=20

Roanmore

munsterlegend wrote: »

Williamson education secretary on sky news now repeating ad nauseum that BJ met with DC and he is happy with that. Another rabbit in the headlights interview. You can even see he knows he is defending the indefensible.

Car crash again. He was asked a few time about Cummings visit to the Castle and just kept repeating that he me with BJ and all is good.

munsterlegend

Roanmore wrote: »

Car crash again. He was asked a few time about Cummings visit to the Castle and just kept repeating that he me with BJ and all is good.

I know it’s just a simple yes/no question. He obviously did go or else would be rejected immediately. Yesterday the transport secretary was certain he didn’t go back back to Durham on the 19th but everything else was not possible to answer.

devnull

theteal wrote: »

A snippet from our local "political" group attached. Id love say this was an isolated opinion but it's far from it in this little bastion of Tory worship. There is no hope

In a local community, non political group for a small town (very safe Tory seat) where I spent part of my teenage years in the UK, there's an admin who every day is posting all of the Government spin lines and transcripts of press statements and blocking comments on such posts.

They're also not allowing any posts discussing coronavirus whatsoever and say that also political discussion is not allowed. I happen to know of two people who posted comments about disagreeing with the Tory stance in a respectful way and they were banned for 'political point scoring' and 'putting the group at risk by defaming the Government' which is laughable.

Ironically the same group says that racism ''Will be dealt with by hiding the comment concerned." so as you can see they certainly have their priorities right.

devnull

WeTimes have come out in defence of Cummings:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-view-on-whether-dominic-cummings-should-resign-cummings-cornered-zhvl3kqlc

Paywall but if you sign up without paying you can see two articles a week

This bit isn't behind paywall

The Times view on whether Dominic Cummings should resign: Cummings Cornered
Despite causing political embarrassment, Boris Johnson’s adviser should stay

Margaret Thatcher declared: “Advisers advise; ministers decide.” This is constitutionally correct but not quite the full story. Advisers also act as lightning rods for the ministers they serve. Calls over the past 48 hours for the resignation of Dominic Cummings, the prime minister’s special adviser, should be seen in that light.

Mr Cummings has questions to answer about allegations that he breached government rules on the lockdown during the coronavirus crisis, and did so repeatedly. On the evidence that has so far emerged, however, his conduct is not a cause for resignation. The calls for him to go are not politically disinterested, but come from longstanding critics of Boris Johnson among opposition parties and the press, along with a few Conservative MPs who cordially detest Mr Cummings and resent the pivotal role he plays in the government. It would be wrong for Mr Johnson to accede to these......

Enzokk

devnull wrote: »

WeTimes have come out in defence of Cummings:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-view-on-whether-dominic-cummings-should-resign-cummings-cornered-zhvl3kqlc

Paywall but if you sign up without paying you can see two articles a week

This bit isn't behind paywall

So the Times are going with the excuse that they want him fired because they don't like him angle it seems. It doesn't matter really, the damage this has caused government isn't just confined to No.10 and Cummings, but all those who tweeted in support of him.

https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1264819896443076610?s=20

Joe_ Public

devnull wrote: »

WeTimes have come out in defence of Cummings:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-view-on-whether-dominic-cummings-should-resign-cummings-cornered-zhvl3kqlc

Paywall but if you sign up without paying you can see two articles a week

This bit isn't behind paywall

The Spectator called for him to go yesterday. The Spectator! My (free) advice to the pm would be, if or when Cummings does go, not to hire anyone who had anything to do with that Times leader as his replacement or in any capacity whatsoever.

Enzokk

James O'Brien was supposed to be on a break for a week but came in for today to do a show. First call, father of an ITU nurse and he is angry. He has not been able to see his family since the start of this. I think the government misjudged how angry people are going to be over this.

Call me Al

maebee wrote: »

My take on it is the same as to Enzokk's. BJ et al all knew and now know that Cummings broke their own rules. Today they tried to massage the rules in Cumming's favour. Stupid tactic. The rules were there in print and on video. Couldn't have been clearer. "If you have symptoms, do not travel anywhere. Full stop.

BJ should have come out today and said something like "Dominic was spooked/shocked/panicked/whatever, at the news that his wife was ill with Corona symptoms. (the day he raced out of No. 10), packed his family up and went to Durham. He made a mistake. He, and we are desperately sorry about this etc. The rules are there for everyone".

BJ and Cummings should have put their hands up. Big mistake in not doing so. They have angered their population who abided by their rules and suffered as a result.

Never thought I'd say it but the UK is a basket case right now.

Which they probably would have said if that was the only trip he'd made.
But they can't say that because they probably know he travelled earlier this month too, if the rumours on twitter from may 12th are true. There may be several trips.
Either way though Cummings m.o. isn't to say something like sorry.
He is abrasive sneaky and cunning... but never apologetic.

Joe_ Public

Our old friend Brendan O'Neill is on rte radio right now lecturing a colleague about journalistic integrity. The guy defending Cummings who a few weeks ago called Neil Ferguson a "pr!ck" for breaking the lockdown.

Enzokk

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Our old friend Brendan O'Neill is on rte radio right now lecturing a colleague about journalistic integrity. The guy defending Cummings who a few weeks ago called Neil Ferguson a "pr!ck" for breaking the lockdown.

It's a joke and anyone thinking about defending what has happened should be treated as a joke.

Meanwhile,

https://twitter.com/mattuthompson/status/1264853173170311169?s=20

robinph

Enzokk wrote: »

Meanwhile,

https://twitter.com/mattuthompson/status/1264853173170311169?s=20

Wouldn't read too much into that particular one. That hospital has been open and closed every other month for the last year or so and gets overwhelmed if someone turns up with a cut finger. Didn't even think they had their A&E department open for the last year and it was probably only reopened because they needed something more local than having to drive to Bristol for the last couple of months.

A Dub in Glasgo

Full article from the Times

Margaret Thatcher declared: “Advisers advise; ministers decide.” This is constitutionally correct but not quite the full story. Advisers also act as lightning rods for the ministers they serve. Calls over the past 48 hours for the resignation of Dominic Cummings, the prime minister’s special adviser, should be seen in that light.

Mr Cummings has questions to answer about allegations that he breached government rules on the lockdown during the coronavirus crisis, and did so repeatedly. On the evidence that has so far emerged, however, his conduct is not a cause for resignation. The calls for him to go are not politically disinterested, but come from longstanding critics of Boris Johnson among opposition parties and the press, along with a few Conservative MPs who cordially detest Mr Cummings and resent the pivotal role he plays in the government. It would be wrong for Mr Johnson to accede to these on their own.

The allegations against Mr Cummings are that he violated these rules on at least three occasions by leaving his home to make non-essential trips. The lockdown that took effect on March 23 included the guidance: “You should not be visiting family members who do not live in your home.” The exceptions to the prohibition on visiting another family member included delivering medicine or food, without entering the property. And the principal stipulation was that anyone with the symptoms of Covid-19 should self-isolate, along with their entire household.

Those restraints, unprecedented in the peacetime history of modern Britain, were the right course to stem the spread of infection. Those in government and public service have a particular responsibility to uphold them. It is not disputed that Mr Cummings left his home in London at the end of March to drive, with his wife and their child, to his parents’ home in Durham 260 miles away. He did so as his wife, Mary Wakefield, was showing symptoms of the coronavirus. He was, on his account, fearful of contracting it himself and concerned about caring for their young son. He then self-isolated in part of the house.

Mr Cummings is alleged by members of the public to have additionally visited Barnard Castle, a tourist attraction 30 miles from Durham, and a local beauty spot. He denies this. The question for Mr Johnson is whether his aide’s conduct was within the rules. It is at least plausible that Mr Cummings could conscientiously conclude that he was, given the exceptions in place.

Dr Jenny Harries, England’s deputy chief medical officer, spoke at the government’s daily press conference on March 24 of the “exceptional circumstance” in which an adult with Covid-19 would be unable to care for a child. Mr Cummings’s alleged further visits to Durham from London need to be investigated thoroughly, but the care of a father for a young child, a “vulnerable individual” in Dr Harries’s words, and with a sick wife should need no defence.

The government’s communications strategy and Mr Cummings’s abrasive response to criticism have been tin-eared by ignoring the sensitivity of the issue and failing to acknowledge that the public have undergone extreme privations in observing the lockdown. That defensiveness is itself a failure, but, meanwhile Mr Johnson has a government to run and a public health crisis to defuse. He should be allowed to get on with it.

Enzokk

robinph wrote: »

Wouldn't read too much into that particular one. That hospital has been open and closed every other month for the last year or so and gets overwhelmed if someone turns up with a cut finger. Didn't even think they had their A&E department open for the last year and it was probably only reopened because they needed something more local than having to drive to Bristol for the last couple of months.

I will pivot here and say that I posted it not for some dramatic moment but as a way to highlight the dangers we still face.:o

In all seriousness we shouldn't forget that lives are still at risk and the virus hasn't gone away, even if we hope it has.

devnull

I'm starting to see the argument that this is all about the left wing media trying to get revenge for and stop a true Brexit from happening is now really starting to gain traction on local Facebook groups and Brexit supporters.

Even people who were anti-Cummings are now appearing to be moving towards either neutral or pro Cummings positions and also I'm seeing a change in tack from accounts who yesterday got Caroline Flack stuff trending to move towards Leave.EU style messaging about Brexit and Cummings as well as his autistic child.

As sad as it is to say, the Brexit argument appears to be the most effective false narrative so far. My father was very anti-Cummings yesterday but the moment he felt a true Brexit could be at threat, he felt preserving that was far more important.

Leroy42

Nothing says true Brexit more than fighting to keep an unelected bureaucrat in his job where he can be allowed break the rules.

Enzokk

devnull wrote: »

I'm starting to see the argument that this is all about the left wing media trying to get revenge for and stop a true Brexit from happening is now really starting to gain traction on local Facebook groups and Brexit supporters.

Even people who were anti-Cummings are now appearing to be moving towards either neutral or pro Cummings positions and also I'm seeing a change in tack from accounts who yesterday got Caroline Flack stuff trending to move towards Leave.EU style messaging about Brexit and Cummings as well as his autistic child.

As sad as it is to say, the Brexit argument appears to be the most effective false narrative so far. My father was very anti-Cummings yesterday but the moment he felt a true Brexit could be at threat, he felt preserving that was far more important.

Brexit is done. The fact that people don't know that is worrying.

robinph

devnull wrote: »

I'm starting to see the argument that this is all about the left wing media trying to get revenge for and stop a true Brexit from happening is now really starting to gain traction on local Facebook groups and Brexit supporters.

Even people who were anti-Cummings are now appearing to be moving towards either neutral or pro Cummings positions and also I'm seeing a change in tack from accounts who yesterday got Caroline Flack stuff trending to move towards Leave.EU style messaging about Brexit and Cummings as well as his autistic child.

As sad as it is to say, the Brexit argument appears to be the most effective false narrative so far. My father was very anti-Cummings yesterday but the moment he felt a true Brexit could be at threat, he felt preserving that was far more important.

But the only side bringing up Brexit in this episode is the Leave side. Haven't seen anyone bringing up Remain in their attacks on Cummings, just Leave being used as a defence of him.

bilston

Enzokk wrote: »

I will pivot here and say that I posted it not for some dramatic moment but as a way to highlight the dangers we still face.:o

In all seriousness we shouldn't forget that lives are still at risk and the virus hasn't gone away, even if we hope it has.

The case numbers aren't exactly falling at a dramatic rate either...not compared to say Italy or Spain, and I know the UK is a couple of weeks behind those countries, but still I don't think the UK is where it needs to be at the minute.

I suppose...and I hope...it is possibly down to increased testing.

LuckyLloyd

Leroy42 wrote: »

Nothing says true Brexit more than fighting to keep an unelected bureaucrat in his job where he can be allowed break the rules.

Taking back control right there!

Professor Moriarty

bilston wrote: »

The case numbers aren't exactly falling at a dramatic rate either...not compared to say Italy or Spain, and I know the UK is a couple of weeks behind those countries, but still I don't think the UK is where it needs to be at the minute.

I suppose...and I hope...it is possibly down to increased testing.

The new cases rate has remained somewhat stable for the past week. Which is not good news considering that the mortality rate typically lags the new cases rate by 18 days.

J Mysterio

This is quite powerful.

https://twitter.com/tug/status/1264815080132182016

AllForIt

Enzokk wrote: »

You still haven't answered even though you have had a lot to say about the topic since, do you think it was right of him to break the isolation rules and guidelines?

It's a bit rich of you to say I have a lot to say when you have on average more posts per day here than I have on the whole thread.


As for your question the reason your asking it is to deflect from my points. My points stand whether it was right of Cummings to break the rules or not. For example does reposting a tweet of 20 odd Journos/photographs not socially distancing defend Cummings in any way? Does pointing out that the MSM spent 2 days asking nothing but questions about Cummings at the Corona Virus briefings defend Cummings in any way? No,I never defended him once.


But I will give my opinion on Cummings anyway. I think if he lied about anything he should defiantly go. There are still unanswered questions as whether the second trip happened as reported and this thing with the Police involvement hasn't been fully cleared up ether. In the case he didn't lie about anything should he go anyway well I'm not sure about that one. If he was a government minister I would say it would be right for Boris to sack him on the grounds of bring seen to give the impression he was breaking lockdown rules whether he did or didn't actually break them. But I'm not sure if Government advisors are held to the same standards as cabinet ministers. There is no precedent for this I can recall.


LuckyLloyd

brickster and AllForIt exemplify the attitude that Cummings stokes and embodies. Say anything, ignore inconvenient truths or questions, apologise for nothing, and make it simply about winning and losing - preferably expressed as a slogan.

I apologise for seeing the bigger picture. Happy now?

Enzokk

AllForIt wrote: »

It's a bit rich of you to say I have a lot to say when you have on average more posts per day here than I have on the whole thread.

I said you have a lot to say in that you keep posting on the thread but then avoiding questions to your posts. It is your right to not answer posts, but I think it is bad form if you decide to post in a thread but then not answer when questioned by others.

As for what who and how many times they post, not sure what that has to do with this topic or your answer to my post.

AllForIt wrote: »

As for your question the reason your asking it is to deflect from my points. My points stand whether it was right of Cummings to break the rules or not. For example does reposting a tweet of 20 odd Journos/photographs not socially distancing defend Cummings in any way? Does pointing out that the MSM spent 2 days asking nothing but questions about Cummings at the Corona Virus briefings defend Cummings in any way? No,I never defended him once.

I don't know what your point is. I don't want to have the wrong understanding of our point. You have a habit of posting a tweet and just leaving it there without pointing out what you want us to see. Yes, we see journalists and photographers not keeping to the social distancing rules, but what does it have to do with what we are discussing? Are you trying to deflect and just cause confusion on the thread? Why else not explain why you are posting this?

I have asked you before to clarify, but seeing as you don't I am going to assume you are just out to deflect and cause confusion on the thread as you don't like what is being discussed, unless you tell us what you mean when someone is confused on a post of yours.

I mean you posted the video of the 2 police officers at the door of Cummings house, what were you trying to say?

AllForIt wrote: »

But I will give my opinion on Cummings anyway. I think if he lied about anything he should defiantly go. There are still unanswered questions as whether the second trip happened as reported and this thing with the Police involvement hasn't been fully cleared up ether. In the case he didn't lie about anything should he go anyway well I'm not sure about that one. If he was a government minister I would say it would be right for Boris to sack him on the grounds of bring seen to give the impression he was breaking lockdown rules whether he did or didn't actually break them. But I'm not sure if Government advisors are held to the same standards as cabinet ministers. There is no precedent for this I can recall.

That is fine, not really answering the question directly. So you are happy that he and his wife broke the guidance to go into isolation if you show symptoms.

nacho libre

AllForIt wrote: »

I apologise for seeing the bigger picture. Happy now?

If you really saw the bigger picture, as you put it, you would accept he broke the rules and his position is untenable given he was at the heart of devising the message about the important of staying home to contain the virus. There are countless people in Britain who could claim extenuating circumstances, but they abided by the rules for the common good. Morag's excuse for his actions is very hurtful and disrespectful to all those who made heartbreaking sacrifices in order to help stem the spread of the virus.

Donald Trump

UK apparently swapped the imagined boogeyman of the un-elected and unaccountable bureaucrat in Brussels for an actual real version in Westminister.

O'Neill

Cummings to make a statement today aparently taking questions. Beggers belief

https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1264885031920701440

Dave0301

He mustn't have been impressed with how Boris handled it yesterday. He is going to have to step in and do it himself.

Surely it will have to be an apology...if it is anything other than that he will just rile the public up further.