The UK response to Covid-19 [MOD WARNING 1ST POST]

Water John

Bungalow Bliss in Ireland has another upside. We like to have our own patch.

Bass Reeves

Water John wrote: »

Bungalow Bliss in Ireland has another upside. We like to have our own patch.

Ya s reason to be grateful. As well we do not have the same number of high rise apartments, lots of 3 bed semi-detached with a bit of a garden this will help as well.

Darc19

I think at this point there can't be anyone that thinks that the UK has done a good job.

Johnson simply did not show leadership.

Teresa May would have handled it well as she simply did not have the ego of Johnson and refused to be other people's puppet.

robinph

Darc19 wrote: »

I think at this point there can't be anyone that thinks that the UK has done a good job.

Johnson simply did not show leadership.

Teresa May would have handled it well as she simply did not have the ego of Johnson and refused to be other people's puppet.

Just like Brexit, this is a long way from being "done".

The quality of how anyone performed can't be claimed until this is over.

People seem to be intent on comparing the UK to Italy for how badly the UK is performing. Yet Belgium began shutting down schools etc on the day of their first death and have still followed the same trajectory as Italy. The only thing that we currently know for certain is that it's still to early to really know what happens next.

Leave the post match analysis until after the match.

Darc19

I'm not just talking about what he is doing, but how it is being done.

I've friends in the UK, I have business colleagues in the UK, they do not know what they are to do.

It's an utter mess

robinph

robinph wrote: »

Just like Brexit, this is a long way from being "done".

The quality of how anyone performed can't be claimed until this is over.

People seem to be intent on comparing the UK to Italy for how badly the UK is performing. Yet Belgium began shutting down schools etc on the day of their first death and have still followed the same trajectory as Italy. The only thing that we currently know for certain is that it's still to early to really know what happens next.

Leave the post match analysis until after the match.

I don’t think people understand what closing down a city like London actually entails.

Yes, the pictures of people crammed on the tube is alarming, but when I worked in Canary wharf, it wasn’t uncommon to watch four trains come and go before you can actually get on one. I dare say that the Paris metro is similar. And the Madrid and Barcelona ones.

Darc19

The biggest problem is the denial.

Either they have a phenomenally high rate of death of 6%, or their confirmed cases of 8,000 is utter bullsh1t

They focus on the infected cases figures and people don't see it as serious. Put the real figures of 50,000+ and you get a different reaction

robinph

Darc19 wrote: »

I'm not just talking about what he is doing, but how it is being done.

I've friends in the UK, I have business colleagues in the UK, they do not know what they are to do.

It's an utter mess

Stay at home. It's quite simple really.

Although, being a member of a few other UK based Facebook groups on various topics there does seem to have been an astonishing amount of confusion/ stupidity from people after each statement from No10 over the last week.

No10 says: Don't go out.
People: Erm, does that mean I can go out.

No10 says: Schools are closing.
People: Does that mean my kids school.

No10 says: People with serious medical conditions on this list here will get further instructions on how we'll be assisting you.
People: I've not got any of those conditions and I've not been contacted yet, what's going on.

That really is only very slight rephrasing of posts I've seen multiple times over the last week.

Yes, it's a mess. But it is a mess everywhere and I don't think there is any particular reason to think that one mess is any worse than any other mess around the world as yet.

threeball

Aegir wrote: »

I don’t think people understand what closing down a city like London actually entails.

Yes, the pictures of people crammed on the tube is alarming, but when I worked in Canary wharf, it wasn’t uncommon to watch four trains come and go before you can actually get on one. I dare say that the Paris metro is similar. And the Madrid and Barcelona ones.

They made a decision to reduce the frequency of trains on the underground which had the effect of creating the same number of people on trains despite less people actually travelling around the city. It was an utterly stupid move and I knew that would be the case the minute it was announced. Their style of leadership is to be reactive with seemingly very little thought put in to the decisions they make. You need to be proactive and have a pretty decent roadmap of where you are going in a situation like this.

robinph

Darc19 wrote: »

The biggest problem is the denial.

Either they have a phenomenally high rate of death of 6%, or their confirmed cases of 8,000 is utter bullsh1t

They focus on the infected cases figures and people don't see it as serious. Put the real figures of 50,000+ and you get a different reaction

They said that the confirmed cases numbers were bull on the day of their first press conference on the 13th. They said at that point the number was rubbish and was at least 10,000 but probably double that. I'd be surprised if they are currently working on a figure as low as 50,000 a week and a half later.

It would be useful for more testing to be done so that people would know if they had had it, although I think that should only really be done for NHS and key staff at this point. If you start confirming to masses of the general population that they have had it but have now recovered whilst you are still trying to keep most of the population under control and at home then you'll have other problems. "Why is that person allowed out but I have to stay home and cant work?"

It does need to have more testing to get NHS staff back to work though.

There is a use in doing loads of testing if you are then going to use that data for something. But what purpose is it if you are not doing contact tracing because there is too many people with it now for it to be worth while. Test more of the people in hospital, but little use in testing the general population at this point who don't actually have it bad anyway.

threeball

threeball wrote: »

They made a decision to reduce the frequency of trains on the underground which had the effect of creating the same number of people on trains despite less people actually travelling around the city. It was an utterly stupid move and I knew that would be the case the minute it was announced. Their style of leadership is to be reactive with seemingly very little thought put in to the decisions they make. You need to be proactive and have a pretty decent roadmap of where you are going in a situation like this.

I thought the decision to reduce the number of trains was bizarre. I’m not sure who made it though. I would imagine it was the mayor rather than Boris.

robinph

Aegir wrote: »

I thought the decision to reduce the number of trains was bizarre. I’m not sure who made it though. I would imagine it was the mayor rather than Boris.

Think the Mayor has the say over the tube, and announced it ahead of the lockdown being set. This evenings press conference I'm sure they said that normal tube service would be resumed, but can't find an article mentioning that now.

robinph

robinph wrote: »

Stay at home. It's quite simple really.

Although, being a member of a few other UK based Facebook groups on various topics there does seem to have been an astonishing amount of confusion/ stupidity from people after each statement from No10 over the last week.

No10 says: Don't go out.
People: Erm, does that mean I can go out.

No10 says: Schools are closing.
People: Does that mean my kids school.

No10 says: People with serious medical conditions on this list here will get further instructions on how we'll be assisting you.
People: I've not got any of those conditions and I've not been contacted yet, what's going on.

That really is only very slight rephrasing of posts I've seen multiple times over the last week.

Yes, it's a mess. But it is a mess everywhere and I don't think there is any particular reason to think that one mess is any worse than any other mess around the world as yet.

Some people are waiting for Boris to knock on their front door and tell them personally what to do.

Every single media outlet has been telling people not to socialize for over a week now, even today the police in Coventry had to break up a big barbecue session on a housing estate. It does make you wonder.

Aegir

Aegir wrote: »

I thought the decision to reduce the number of trains was bizarre. I’m not sure who made it though. I would imagine it was the mayor rather than Boris.

It was Sadiq Khan. The mayor runs transport. And he’s been given a hard time because of it. It was obvious to everyone that reducing the service would concentrate the remaining users. Hopefully he’ll reverse the decision (though probably easier said than done getting TFL staff back to work)

Darc19

robinph wrote: »

Stay at home. It's quite simple really.

Although, being a member of a few other UK based Facebook groups on various topics there does seem to have been an astonishing amount of confusion/ stupidity from people after each statement from No10 over the last week.

No10 says: Don't go out.
People: Erm, does that mean I can go out.

No10 says: Schools are closing.
People: Does that mean my kids school.

No10 says: People with serious medical conditions on this list here will get further instructions on how we'll be assisting you.
People: I've not got any of those conditions and I've not been contacted yet, what's going on.

That really is only very slight rephrasing of posts I've seen multiple times over the last week.

Yes, it's a mess. But it is a mess everywhere and I don't think there is any particular reason to think that one mess is any worse than any other mess around the world as yet.

Don't go out, but you can to exercise, to go to work, to go to shops, to go pharmacy.

Schools - depends on who you go by. Are they still open for kiss of certain jobs

How will they contact you and when? Again different answers depending who you listen to

bob mcbob

robinph wrote: »

They said that the confirmed cases numbers were bull on the day of their first press conference on the 13th. They said at that point the number was rubbish and was at least 10,000 but probably double that. I'd be surprised if they are currently working on a figure as low as 50,000 a week and a half later.

It would be useful for more testing to be done so that people would know if they had had it, although I think that should only really be done for NHS and key staff at this point. If you start confirming to masses of the general population that they have had it but have now recovered whilst you are still trying to keep most of the population under control and at home then you'll have other problems. "Why is that person allowed out but I have to stay home and cant work?"

It does need to have more testing to get NHS staff back to work though.

There is a use in doing loads of testing if you are then going to use that data for something. But what purpose is it if you are not doing contact tracing because there is too many people with it now for it to be worth while. Test more of the people in hospital, but little use in testing the general population at this point who don't actually have it bad anyway.

The Scottish CMO has estimated that the actually number of cases is 50 times the reported numbers and is in the tens of thousands in Scotland alone.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52009463

The problem with the test is that it currently only identifies who actually has the virus at the time of the test not has / has not had it.

At this point in time, it would be more useful if a test could identify if people had it and recovered.

threeball

bob mcbob wrote: »

The Scottish CMO has estimated that the actually number of cases is 50 times the reported numbers and is in the tens of thousands in Scotland alone.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52009463

The problem with the test is that it currently only identifies who actually has the virus at the time of the test not has / has not had it.

At this point in time, it would be more useful if a test could identify if people had it and recovered.

Apparently the UK has ordered 3.5m antibody tests, I assume to find those who had it and it's gone.

robinph

Darc19 wrote: »

Don't go out, but you can to exercise, to go to work, to go to shops, to go pharmacy.

Yes, exactly.

Darc19 wrote: »

Schools - depends on who you go by. Are they still open for kiss of certain jobs

Yes, open for certain jobs.

Darc19 wrote: »

How will they contact you and when? Again different answers depending who you listen to

That was clearly stated in the briefings that they would be sending out letters.
There have been some people, depending on health region, who have also got texts. But if they don't contact you then it's not you.

Told you it was simple. You've got it all perfectly.

McGiver

meeeeh wrote:

Anyway I think Ireland will have to implement stricter rules too. We are lucky that population density here is lower but both UK and Ireland could still end up in a bit of a mess.

Density is the key benefit in Ireland, particularly outside of Dublin.

We need masks in public, mandatory.

McGiver

Darc19 wrote:

Either they have a phenomenally high rate of death of 6%, or their confirmed cases of 8,000 is utter bullsh1t

Hard to tell. Italy had the same rate at that time stage. Italian mortality is 9.9% at the moment (deaths / total cases).

lawred2

the purple tin wrote: »

Saw Trump on telly this morning. He looks like crap, not sleeping probably. All his bluster and confidence are gone too. I think the enormity of the situation has finally dawned on him.

I doubt it.

splinter65

lawred2 wrote: »

I doubt it.

He’s too old to deal with this, apart from any other inadequacies he may have.
But so would Biden, Bernie or Corbyn be too old either.
These kind of mega 24/7 once in 100 year crisis demonstrate that managing and being responsible for people’s lives is a younger persons game.
The Queen of England just ****ed off to one of her other castles to sit it out till it’s over because she’s 94.

Darc19

McGiver wrote: »

Density is the key benefit in Ireland, particularly outside of Dublin.

We need masks in public, mandatory.

Masks?
Why?

Darc19

McGiver wrote: »

Hard to tell. Italy had the same rate at that time stage. Italian mortality is 9.9% at the moment (deaths / total cases).

The same in italy.

The only real figure to focus on should be the level of mortality.

Suggesting that just 8,000 people have it gives a false sense of it not being as bad as it is

Darc19

Darc19 wrote: »

The same in italy.

The only real figure to focus on should be the level of mortality.

Suggesting that just 8,000 people have it gives a false sense of it not being as bad as it is

Do you really think only 1200 people have it here?

There is a shortage of testing kits, globally. That is why the Irish government has changed the testing criteria and the UK government is testing those with a higher chance of being positive.

dogbert27

bob mcbob wrote: »

The Scottish CMO has estimated that the actually number of cases is 50 times the reported numbers and is in the tens of thousands in Scotland alone.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52009463

The problem with the test is that it currently only identifies who actually has the virus at the time of the test not has / has not had it.

At this point in time, it would be more useful if a test could identify if people had it and recovered.

I've been saying this too. Denmark's total recovered figure has been on 1 for more than 2 weeks since this began.
The only figures that get reported are the new cases when they eventually test someone and the death figure.

All these figures as you say mean nothing if they're not being used for anything.

Donald Trump

McGiver wrote: »

Density is the key benefit in Ireland, particularly outside of Dublin.

I always find the density to be particularly pronounced in Cork people

Donald Trump

Aegir wrote: »

Do you really think only 1200 people have it here?

There is a shortage of testing kits, globally. That is why the Irish government has changed the testing criteria and the UK government is testing those with a higher chance of being positive.

It's fish in a barrel stuff in the UK due to their faffing about and inaction.

Looks like they are well on their way to getting their wish of fabulous herd immunity :rolleyes:

I just hope that we aren't following them

Donald Trump

dogbert27 wrote: »

I've been saying this too. Denmark's total recovered figure has been on 1 for more than 2 weeks since this began.
The only figures that get reported are the new cases when they eventually test someone and the death figure.

All these figures as you say mean nothing if they're not being used for anything.

Those tests might be useful in the medium term but they are less important right now than finding those that might have it and could be spreading it.

Bass Reeves

Donald Trump wrote: »

Those tests might be useful in the medium term but they are less important right now than finding those that might have it and could be spreading it.

Even here it was said we might get to a stage where we might not test. I saw that Norris said they hoped to reach 35k tests/day with in 4 weeks. It will be all over then bar the shouting.

At present here we only now have to trace 5/case rather than 20/case two weeks ago. Hopefully we can get on top of it or at least flatten the curve enough to control it.

Italy and they are actively trying to control it will hit 10k deaths. UK may be a bit higher. You would have to wonder about Chinese figures considering that it hit an area of 50 million and they did not get on top of it for 12ish weeks.

The US could be a real disaster area. Internal flights were on full swing until a few days ago. No testing. Some really high population density cities. Huge high density buildings. If the heat of summer fails to kill it you could be looking at a death toll in the millions