COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Caraibh

Caraibh wrote: »

The data were clear, but they were manipulated to push an agenda.

What about what Professor Risch says about Fauci and HIV?

No, a theory was postulated, tested and disproved. The proponents of the theory got themselves emotionally and professionally invested in the theory however and refused to accept when study after study found no evidence to support the claims. There is zero evidence whatsoever of a cover up or data manipulation.

On fauci and HIV

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/528319-fauci-awarded-lifetime-achievement-award-for-hiv-aids-work-by-elton-john

https://www.thebodypro.com/article/tony-fauci-md-coronavirus

Do a bit of research for yourself rather than parroting the misrepresentations, misinformation and lies peddled by those you follow on Twitter or wherever you get your information

lbj666

brisan wrote: »

I have said this before and I’ll say it again

And we got you the first time

Ashbourne hoop

Irish Stones wrote: »

I have understood that UK is following their own rules outside EU's rules, and that's fine.
But a question comes to my mind. If EU is still waiting for the approval from EMA because they want to be absolutely cautious and play safe, would this mean that they could even not approve the vaccine?

Possible, but very unlikely.

ixoy

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I understand that but is 70% not a very high threshold when the vaccine is 100% effective for the people that need it.

But it's not 100% effective.

brisan

Dickie10 wrote: »

i presume we should be well fit to vaccinate all vulnerable by end of jan?

I doubt that very much
Unforeseen logistical problems will inevitably arise

funnydoggy

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1202/1181971-ireland-vaccine/

RTÉ again, but feck it

The Government has said the Pfizer BioNTech Covid-19 vaccine could be available in Ireland from early January, if it is approved by the European Medicines Agency in the coming weeks.

It's probably already been posted here, but it was updated with new info this morn.

brisan

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Except they won't actually be going into a hospital. Vaccination centres would be outside on hospital grounds.

Bit of a difference between going into hospital and turning up to a tent outside

Has the plan been released ?
I assume it has and you have read it
Or are you just assuming ??

brisan

Irish Stones wrote: »

Italy has identified only 300 centres across the whole country, this will have lots of people move, even very long distances, when rules are "not leave your town/city" when in red and orange alert.

They have a plan
Might not be a great one but it’s a lot more than we have

Pasteur.

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

How have England approved the vaccine so fast?

I thought it would take a few months to trawl through the data of the studies?

Why is the EU complaining

Sounds like sour grapes

timsey tiger

Sheep2020 wrote: »

Ridiculous post, not a like for like comparison at all

Only a few hundred or so of those in the trial actually got Covid or came anywhere near it

Of those few hundred, a few were sick even with the vaccine and 1 severly sick with the vaccine

Only a challenge trial could draw your conclusions.

Wow. Swing and a miss.

Caraibh

Caraibh wrote: »

So Professor Risch is a conspiracy theorist on Twitter? I quoted the man himself. He blames Fauci for the deaths of those people who died of HIV.

Yet Fauci was awarded a lifetime achievement award for his work on HIV and is widely praised for his work. Maybe that tells you Risch has a axe to grind and maybe not to take everything at face value without fact checking yourself first. Either way, I never commented on the Fauci aspect of your post, only the Hydroxychloroquine, so I fail to see why you are so anxious to get me to respond to this specifically? The slur on Fauci itself was an overt attempt to discredit Fauci with the implicit function of equating the facts on the drug as presented by Fauci with the HIV /AiIDS issue and the invented controversy from the late 80's. If the argument on Hydroxychloriquine was that strong it would stand on its own two feet. The Professor Risch sounds like a bitter little man.

I also notice you prefaced your original post of athe article on this subject with the statment that you could not provide the link? Why not? Was it because it was from the Palmer Foundation pushing Hydroxychloroquine because Clive Palmer purchased 32million doses of it early in the year?

timsey tiger

carq wrote: »

Surely the U.K's bullishness is for everyone's benefit?

Sit back and watch the results of their mass vaccine roll out and see how effective it is.
Beats lab testing and trials !

No, there won't be time for this, the EU will be rolling it out before the first UK subjects have developed full immunity.

Caraibh

Caraibh wrote: »

Because as a new member I am unable to post links.

I believe that Professor Risch is saying that Fauci has previous when it comes to being hostile to drugs. That's the point he was making. I have no reason to believe that it's personal against Fauci.

Yet Fauci is widely praised for his work on HIV including expatiating the clinical trial process

Caraibh

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yet Fauci is widely praised for his work on HIV including expatiating the clinical trial process

I understand that, but all I'm saying is that I found what Professor Risch had to say about him very worrying.

But let's move on and agree to disagree.

stephenjmcd

brisan wrote: »

Has the plan been released ?
I assume it has and you have read it
Or are you just assuming ??

Its highly unlikely to be hugely different to other countries.

Quite possible it'll be very similar to the UK one.

They aren't going to have people walking in and out of a hospital to get vaccinated, thats just stupidity. Let's think logically about this.

Your likely to see something very similar to test centres that were deployed around the country.

speckle

Have your vaccines arrived?

stephenjmcd

Paul Reid " All going well it's realistic to expect Ireland to commence vaccination in the early days of January 2021"

9 ultra low temp freezers have arrived in the country and due to be fully commissioned by next week.

Caraibh

Caraibh wrote: »

I understand that, but all I'm saying is that I found what Professor Risch had to say about him very worrying.

But let's move on and agree to disagree.

Will leave it with what Fauci said about Risch

“In terms of science and studies, this does raise another question, and I don’t want to relitigate hydroxychloroquine, because the science hasn’t changed on it in the last week or the last day.,” Berman said. “However we did have Dr Harvey Risch from Yale on Monday, and he suggested what you have been saying, that random controlled trials, placebo-controlled trials, you say they’re the gold standards. He says that’s not so. We shouldn’t be so reliant on them when determining the efficacy of hydroxychloroquine.”

“Why do you feel so strongly about those trials?” Berman asked.

“Well, because it is the gold standard,” Fauci said, and explained “You have to compare your intervention with something. Because the medical literature and experience is full of situations of anecdotal retrospective cohort studies that have proven to be wrong.”

“I might add, agreeing with me is virtually every scientist who is competent in clinical trials, that will say that the randomized place placebo-controlled trial is in fact the gold standard,” Fauci added coolly. “So I would have to respectfully totally disagree with him.”

https://www.mediaite.com/news/dr-fauci-sides-with-cnns-john-berman-over-pro-hydroxychloroquine-yale-doc-nearly-every-competent-scientist-agrees/

hmmm

Caraibh wrote: »

I understand that, but all I'm saying is that I found what Professor Risch had to say about him very worrying.

But let's move on and agree to disagree.

BTW just as an aside, we call the CMO in Ireland "Tony" not "Anthony". I know it's probably his official name when you're researching, but that's not what he's known as. Feed that back to who-ever is writing the script and trying to discredit Western experts and vaccines.

brisan

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Its highly unlikely to be hugely different to other countries.

Quite possible it'll be very similar to the UK one.

They aren't going to have people walking in and out of a hospital to get vaccinated, thats just stupidity. Let's think logically about this.

Your likely to see something very similar to test centres that were deployed around the country.

And yet someone else pointed out they cant use test centres because people have to be monitored afterwards
I understand it poses problems but its not as though this came out of the blue
What if the EU had passed the vaccine the same time as Britain ?
WE have no plan

brisan

hmmm wrote: »

BTW just as an aside, we call the CMO in Ireland "Tony" not "Anthony". I know it's probably his official name when you're researching, but that's not what he's known as. Feed that back to who-ever is writing the script and trying to discredit Western experts and vaccines.

As an aside his name is William Gerard Anthony Holohan
Anybody researching his name would call him William

stephenjmcd

brisan wrote: »

And yet someone else pointed out they cant use test centres because people have to be monitored afterwards
I understand it poses problems but its not as though this came out of the blue
What if the EU had passed the vaccine the same time as Britain ?
WE have no plan

How could they approve a vaccine in the same time ?

It wasn't submitted to EMA until Monday just gone.

The plan is due next week, I'm sure you can hang on a few days and let them actually finalise it. No point in releasing a plan early and then having to change it, such as the UK plan might have to be adjusted already.

MrMusician18

afatbollix wrote: »

EMA used to be based in London, London has all the experts already.

How many people of the EMA wanted to stay in London instead of Amsterdam when it moved last year?

The UK has also been doing a rolling review of the data. They didn't get the data all on day 1 like the EMA.

But they will be seen as wrong in the EU or Irish eyes no matter what they do.

I expect the Vaccine to be approved by the EMA it will just take longer, We should be asking the experts why it is taking longer?

This is incorrect. The UK had access to rolling review data on 30 October. The EMA has had access to preliminary pfizer data from 1st Oct.

The EMA has stated, in a statement critical of the UKs approach, that the UKs approach was less thorough and analysed less data. The former head of the EMA said the UK was taking a small risk with it's approach.

Given the way it's being spun by the Tories, it looks like MHRA were told to make their decision ahead of the EMA. Hancock claimed it was Brexit that permitted the approach (it didn't), which want true, this points to politicization of the approval.

Sky King

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Hancock claimed it was Brexit that permitted the approach (it didn't), which want true, this points to politicization of the approval.

There was some other A hole from the UK govt on LBC radio claiming they were first because "Britain is smarter and better than the other countries". :rolleyes:

https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1334430489957031938

Sky King

Sky King wrote: »

There was some other A hole from the UK govt on LBC radio claiming they were first because "Britain is smarter and better than the other countries". :rolleyes:

https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1334430489957031938

What about the German scientists who actually developed the vaccine? There is something broken in the British psyche as evidenced by this type of attitude. What will the Brexiteers say when they find out the CEO and founder of BioNTech was a Turkish immigrant?

polesheep

Deleted User wrote: »

What about the German scientists who actually developed the vaccine? There is something broken in the British psyche as evidenced by this type of attitude. What will the Brexiteers say when they find out the CEO and founder of BioNTech was a Turkish immigrant?

Should he be given the benefit of the doubt? I'm not sure he was serious. They were both laughing as he said it.

is_that_so

Varadkar has said that NIAC(National Immunisation Advisory Committee) will decide who gets the vaccine and in what order.


https://www.rcpi.ie/policy-and-advocacy/national-immunisation-advisory-committee/

polesheep

polesheep wrote: »

Should he be given the benefit of the doubt? I'm not sure he was serious. They were both laughing as he said it.

I think Ferrari may have been laughing at the fact that he got him to say it. And Williamson was blustering and even if he truly doesn't believe what he said, he said it because it goes down well with their target demographic

is_that_so

For fans of the immunity passports, the WHO are not in favour, but are looking at e-certificates.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1203/1182107-covid-world-health-organization/

ixoy

So an article on the Journal has a few more details url]https://www.thejournal.ie/vaccine-hse-5287862-Dec2020/[/url. Some choice quotes:

“Based on these dates, and all going well according to that plan, it is realistic to expect that Ireland will commence its vaccination programme in the early days of January 2021 and that certainly is the plan that we’re working towards,” Reid said.

The European Commission has agreed advance purchase arrangements with six vaccine developers and Ireland will have the capacity to acquire almost 16 million vaccine doses.

“The key requirement in our preparation for the vaccination program has been the procurement, we just took delivery this week of nine ultra low temperature freezers on 1 December.”

He said each of those nine freezers can store about 200,000 doses of vaccine and there is already a cold storage facility at Citywest that was procured a number of years ago.

funnydoggy

ixoy wrote: »

So an article on the Journal has a few more details URL]https://www.thejournal.ie/vaccine-hse-5287862-Dec2020/[/URL. Some choice quotes:

“The key requirement in our preparation for the vaccination program has been the procurement, we just took delivery this week of nine ultra low temperature freezers on 1 December.”

He said each of those nine freezers can store about 200,000 doses of vaccine and there is already a cold storage facility at Citywest that was procured a number of years ago.

Incoming "Operation Lockstep / Event 201 / Great Reset posts :pac:

Stark

I just wish they hadn't revealed the location. I can see some far-right nutjob trying to attack/vandalise it.

polesheep

Deleted User wrote: »

I think Ferrari may have been laughing at the fact that he got him to say it. And Williamson was blustering and even if he truly doesn't believe what he said, he said it because it goes down well with their target demographic

That's true.

Pasteur.

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Its highly unlikely to be hugely different to other countries.

Quite possible it'll be very similar to the UK one.

They aren't going to have people walking in and out of a hospital to get vaccinated, thats just stupidity. Let's think logically about this.

Your likely to see something very similar to test centres that were deployed around the country.

That was my first thought

Would they be using the test centres as vaccination centres

Pasteur.

Why is Dr Fauci criticising the UK

They've approved the vaccine so calling them out will only reduce the uptake

BrianD3

German MEP on sky news about an hour ago. Very defensive against any accusations of EU bureaucracy delaying vaccine approval. Criticised the UK for approving using a less onerous emergency authorisation process rather than the EMA's conditional one. Stated that by doing this, the liability for any problems with the vaccine rests with the state whereas with EMA conditional approval, the liability rests with the manufacturer.

Then said that he is "confident" that the EMA will approve the vaccine "before Christmas".

Given that we have previously heard about approval "by the" 29th December, the manoeuvring and politicisation of this is continuing and not just on the UK side.

The earlier the approval, the more likely that the HSE will be caught with its head up its ass which is the default position for it.

crossman47

The fact this country doesn't have a unique national identifier will complicate the process. But of course those who scream "Big Brother" at such a suggestion won't care. We shouls have had one years ago.

wes

crossman47 wrote: »

The fact this country doesn't have a unique national identifier will complicate the process. But of course those who scream "Big Brother" at such a suggestion won't care. We shouls have had one years ago.

PPS number could be repurposed.

brisan

Pasteur. wrote: »

That was my first thought

Would they be using the test centres as vaccination centres

They have a lease on the IKC exhibition centre until July 21 so possibly
No word on leases of other large centres
However another poster said this would not work the same way as you need to be monitored after receiving the jab

brisan

wes wrote: »

PPS number could be repurposed.

By their own admission the HSEs IT systems are not fit for purpose and are currently being upgraded
To ask them to repurpose the PPS numbers would be stretching them a bit far

brisan

brisan wrote: »

By their own admission the HSEs IT systems are not fit for purpose and are currently being upgraded
To ask them to repurpose the PPS numbers would be stretching them a bit far

PPS number is used to record flu vaccine uptake.

brisan

Deleted User wrote: »

PPS number is used to record flu vaccine uptake.

Seemingly its the double dose thing that the system cant handle plus keeping track of which particular vaccine each individual got and the date they received the first dose and when the second dose is due

ShineOn7

is_that_so wrote: »

For fans of the immunity passports, the WHO are not in favour, but are looking at e-certificates.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1203/1182107-covid-world-health-organization/

Can we, for love of all that is holy, stop sending RTE traffic?

The Irish Times is a great resource if you want to keep it Irish

And, although it's not Irish, the Guardian website is superb

odyssey06

brisan wrote: »

Seemingly its the double dose thing that the system cant handle plus keeping track of which particular vaccine each individual got and the date they received the first dose and when the second dose is due

Billions spent on 2020 on presumptive vaccine development... parallel phases of development...
We didnt have to develop the vaccine but we should have build a presumptive IT system to keep track of multiple vaccine variants and doses. Ffs.

Water John

odyssey06 wrote: »

Billions spent on 2020 on presumptive vaccine development... parallel phases of development...
We didnt have to develop the vaccine but we should have build a presumptive IT system to keep track of multiple vaccine variants and doses. Ffs.

Is there a system that tracks each baby from birth through its vaccine schedule? Isn't that the same?

crossman47

Water John wrote: »

Is there a system that tracks each baby from birth through its vaccine schedule? Isn't that the same?

There can't be unless each baby has a unique identifier and they don't. That was my point earlier.

odyssey06

Water John wrote: »

Is there a system that tracks each baby from birth through its vaccine schedule? Isn't that the same?

Would it handle 5 different vaccines with double doses? Maybe key each one as a unique vaccine eg covid-oxford-1, covid-pfizer-2 etc could work.

hmmm

Pfizer has run into problems with quality in its supply chain.
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/02/stock-market-futures-open-to-close-news.html

"Pfizer now expects to ship half of the doses it had previously planned this year after finding raw materials in early production that didn’t meet its standard, Dow Jones reported."

It's good to see that quality control is being maintained, even if it costs supply in the short-term.

brisan

Water John wrote: »

Is there a system that tracks each baby from birth through its vaccine schedule? Isn't that the same?

Each hospital probably does it individually
One issue that was discussed on the Tonight show was that systems from different health authorities in different parts of the country could not talk to each other

Pasteur.

There's too much optimism and good news overall with the vaccines

There's gonna be a shedload of problems next year

The vaccine itself , efficacy, supply ,distribution etc