COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Henryq.

hmmm wrote: »

The EU have pre-purchased several vaccines. If there is a glut (and hopefully there will be), the EU will donate the remaining vaccines to poorer countries. The EU have also assisted with scaling up production to ensure that cheaper vaccines like Oxford are made in large quantities.

Thankfully we are part of the EU as it has allowed us to be part of large deals which would have been hard to negotiate as a small country.

The end of Covid will only happen when the entire world is vaccinated - it's in our national interest to help the rest of the world, aside entirely from a moral obligation. As long as the poorer countries still have it circulating there is a chance of a mutation which bypasses our current vaccines or a chance that it will be reintroduced as immunity has waned.

My understanding is that the risk of mutation will always be there

I'm not sure about vaccination in that scenario or how it works

CIARAN_BOYLE

Henryq. wrote: »

My understanding is that the risk of mutation will always be there

I'm not sure about vaccination in that scenario or how it works

If its circulating the risk of mutation remains.

If it's not circulating the risk of mutation will be next to nothing as it will be dead.

Henryq.

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

If its circulating the risk of mutation remains.

If it's not circulating the risk of mutation will be next to nothing as it will be dead.

Are you talking about zero-covid?

Henryq.

Henryq. wrote: »

My understanding is that the risk of mutation will always be there

I'm not sure about vaccination in that scenario or how it works

The more cases there are, the more opportunity for mutation. The more people that are vaccinated the fewer cases.

It is actually in our interest for the vaccine to be rolled out in as many countries as possible after the vulnerable have been done. If we are all vaccinated but a mutation in the infection path emerges in Moldova for example and rapidly spreads, we are back to square one.

Whereas if there is vaccine rollout in parallel in multiple countries, case levels will rapidly fall in all countries significantly reducing the opportunity for mutation, and also increasing the chance of detection of an emerging mutation as fewer countries will be in crisis mode

Henryq.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The more cases there are, the more opportunity for mutation. The more people that are vaccinated the fewer cases.

It is actually in our interest for the vaccine to be rolled out in as many countries as possible after the vulnerable have been done. If we are all vaccinated but a mutation in the infection path emerges in Moldova for example and rapidly spreads, we are back to square one.

Whereas if there is vaccine rollout in parallel in multiple countries, case levels will rapidly fall in all countries significantly reducing the opportunity for mutation, and also increasing the chance of detection of an emerging mutation as fewer countries will be in crisis mode

That is one of the mistakes we made here

Too much focus on crude lockdowns and we are back to square one in the event of another pandemic

Other countries like Korea and Japan are better placed with advanced test and trace systems in place

titan18

Deleted User wrote: »

The more cases there are, the more opportunity for mutation. The more people that are vaccinated the fewer cases.

It is actually in our interest for the vaccine to be rolled out in as many countries as possible after the vulnerable have been done. If we are all vaccinated but a mutation in the infection path emerges in Moldova for example and rapidly spreads, we are back to square one.

Whereas if there is vaccine rollout in parallel in multiple countries, case levels will rapidly fall in all countries significantly reducing the opportunity for mutation, and also increasing the chance of detection of an emerging mutation as fewer countries will be in crisis mode

Is that not the same case here though? Like if we only vaccinate the vulnerable here, it can still get a mutation in the non vulnerable here as the spread isn't exactly going to change drastically there just less serious, so why should we vaccinate the vulnerable in Moldova first then. Morally, I understand, economically I don't see why if we're still in restrictions and paying to vaccinate others.

AdamD

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1338480072483868673

This is a bit bleak to be honest. I'm in my mid-twenties and franky cannot see myself nor my social group continuing to severely restrict our lives beyond another couple of months

Stheno

AdamD wrote: »

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1338480072483868673

This is a bit bleak to be honest. I'm in my mid-twenties and franky cannot see myself nor my social group continuing to severely restrict our lives beyond another couple of months

Whats the alternative?

Hmmzis

Looks like the final readout for the Russian Sputnik V vaccine has been done (78 cases):

https://sputnikvaccine.com/newsroom/pressreleases/the-sputnik-v-vaccine-s-efficacy-is-confirmed-at-91-4-based-on-data-analysis-of-the-final-control-po/

Still at 91.4% efficacy and no severe cases in the vaccine group (20 in the placebo). It's mentioned they'll publish their data in an international journal (The Lancet most likely).

AdamD

Stheno wrote: »

Whats the alternative?

I don't see how we can't be open sooner if the vaccine rollout is done properly.

And the personal alternative? I'll start socialising more. The likelihood of this disease being an issue for me is incredibly low, my current behavior is to stop this spreading to others. On a long enough timeline I will not continue to do so.

hmmm

Deleted User wrote: »

Whereas if there is vaccine rollout in parallel in multiple countries, case levels will rapidly fall in all countries significantly reducing the opportunity for mutation, and also increasing the chance of detection of an emerging mutation as fewer countries will be in crisis mode

West Africa has done brilliantly to control Ebola with relatively small numbers of vaccine doses. The most recent outbreak spread over a large area, and it required only 40,000 to be vaccinated before the outbreak was extinguished. And that vaccine has been successfully kept at -80C in countries which often lack much basic infrastructure.

VG31

AdamD wrote: »

I don't see how we can't be open sooner if the vaccine rollout is done properly.

And the personal alternative? I'll start socialising more. The likelihood of this disease being an issue for me is incredibly low, my current behavior is to stop this spreading to others. On a long enough timeline I will not continue to do so.

I couldn't agree more.

The (correct) narrative throughout this pandemic has been while most people will not be affected badly by the virus, you could pass it on to someone who may be.

I've followed the guidelines as much as I can; primarily so I don't spread it to elderly or vulnerable family members, not beacuse I am afraid of the virus myself (not that I want to get it, but I don't go around in fear either). If it gets to the stage where everyone I know who is elderly/vulnerable is vaccinated, I really can't see myself continuing to social distance etc.

There does seem to be a moving of the goalposts recently from protecting the elderly and vulnerable to stopping covid cases. If the hospitals are empty cases shouldn't matter. If you're not vulnerable in any way but really don't want to risk getting covid them of course you can still wear a mask or isolate yourself.

Micky 32

Henryq. wrote: »

My understanding is that the risk of mutation will always be there

RTE news app headline is reporting a new strain in the UK:

In a statement, Mr Hancock said: "Over the last few days, thanks to our world-class genomic capability in the UK, we have identified a new variant of coronavirus which may be associated with the faster spread in the South of England." 

Matt Hancock said the numbers of the new variant of coronavirus "are increasing rapidly".

He told the Commons: "Initial analysis suggests that this variant is growing faster than the existing variants.

Now the important bit :

Mr Hancock added: "I must stress at this point that there is currently nothing to suggest that this variant is more likely to cause serious disease and the latest clinical advice is that it's highly unlikely that this mutation would fail to respond to a vaccine, but it shows we've got to be vigilant and follow the rules and everyone needs to take personal responsibility not to spread this virus.“

Deeper Blue

I predict that this new strain will be like the mink thing i.e. a complete non story for RTE to fawn over for a week which will be completely forgotten in a month's time.

hmmm

I find these trucks full of vaccines and pictures of healthcare staff lining up to get them so fantastic. A great achievement for humanity.

https://twitter.com/MaxFilby/status/1338511135557955587

jackofalltrades

VG31 wrote: »

I couldn't agree more.

The (correct) narrative throughout this pandemic has been while most people will not be affected badly by the virus, you could pass it on to someone who may be.

I've followed the guidelines as much as I can; primarily so I don't spread it to elderly or vulnerable family members, not beacuse I am afraid of the virus myself (not that I want to get it, but I don't go around in fear either). If it gets to the stage where everyone I know who is elderly/vulnerable is vaccinated, I really can't see myself continuing to social distance etc.

There does seem to be a moving of the goalposts recently from protecting the elderly and vulnerable to stopping covid cases. If the hospitals are empty cases shouldn't matter. If you're not vulnerable in any way but really don't want to risk getting covid them of course you can still wear a mask or isolate yourself.

Everyone's vulnerable, just to differing degrees.
I have a neighbour in his 40s, who caught COVID back in March and is still struggling to walk around his house. He had no underlying issues.
Someone else I know got it and still hasn't got their sense of smell or taste back.
I know others who got it and were fine.

It would be madness to stop socially distancing or wearing masks in public until everyone's had a chance to be vaccinated.
It would be giving up with the finish line in sight, when you could just wait a few months more and ensure everyone is protected.
We don't hit herd immunity until we get 60-70% vaccinated, based on estimates.

hmmm

This is funny. "Do we have to sign for it?" "You betcha"

https://twitter.com/therecount/status/1338512887845969920

marno21

Very informative table from yesterday’s Sunday Business Post. Didn’t see it posted already

https://twitter.com/rachellavin/status/1338484785367408640

BeefeaterHat

Stheno wrote: »

Whats the alternative?

Well the UK reckon that measures will be done away with there by the spring so maybe its time Glynn and co. pulled the finger out and hold up their end of the bargain.

Sky King

"Vaccines will not bring an end to the pandemic" according to an RTE broadcast this evening.

https://mobile.twitter.com/rtenews/status/1338546966125547527

Here was me thinking that having the vast majority of the population immune to covid would end the pandemic. Ffs.

BeefeaterHat

Sky King wrote: »

"Vaccines will not bring an end to the pandemic" according to an RTE broadcast this evening.

https://mobile.twitter.com/rtenews/status/1338546966125547527

Here was me thinking that having the vast majority of the population immune to covid would end the pandemic. Ffs.

There preparing us for another 6 months of excuses, finger pointing and arse covering while the HSE put on a modern day three stooges routine with rolling out the vaccine. Someone suggested early, very correctly that there should be press conferences dedicated to the vaccine rollout. That ain't happening because they'd expose how hopeless they truly are.

snotboogie

Sky King wrote: »

"Vaccines will not bring an end to the pandemic" according to an RTE broadcast this evening.

https://mobile.twitter.com/rtenews/status/1338546966125547527

Here was me thinking that having the vast majority of the population immune to covid would end the pandemic. Ffs.

In fairness that's not Rte's fault, they are reporting what was said. She clearly says that the vaccine will not end social distancing, madness... I don't know if its covid institutionalisation in the public service here or I've gotten everything about this vaccine wrong

JacksonHeightsOwn

Sky King wrote: »

"Vaccines will not bring an end to the pandemic" according to an RTE broadcast this evening.

https://mobile.twitter.com/rtenews/status/1338546966125547527

Here was me thinking that having the vast majority of the population immune to covid would end the pandemic. Ffs.

If a vaccine doesn't bring an end to this, then quite frankly, wtf will then?

is_that_so

snotboogie wrote: »

In fairness that's not Rte's fault, they are reporting what was said. She clearly says that the vaccine will not end social distancing, madness... I don't know if its covid institutionalisation in the public service here or I've gotten everything about this vaccine wrong

It sounds more like another let's not drop our guard speech. They will not keep people on board if a good portion of the populace have taken new vaccines and are still expected to do what we've been doing. There's unlikely to be much more than 6 months compliance with these guidelines and we continue to be subjected to Levels of living with the virus.

Goldengirl

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

Well the UK reckon that measures will be done away with there by the spring so maybe its time Glynn and co. pulled the finger out and hold up their end of the bargain.

You do realise it's not their fault ( if any exists) that the vaccine is not approved yet ?

Goldengirl

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

There preparing us for another 6 months of excuses, finger pointing and arse covering while the HSE put on a modern day three stooges routine with rolling out the vaccine. Someone suggested early, very correctly that there should be press conferences dedicated to the vaccine rollout. That ain't happening because they'd expose how hopeless they truly are.

How about waiting to see if that happens before you start giving out ?

Why would wasting time at dedicated press conferences improve the rollout of the vaccine , Ffs?

is_that_so

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

Well the UK reckon that measures will be done away with there by the spring so maybe its time Glynn and co. pulled the finger out and hold up their end of the bargain.

I'd be wary of the UK thoughts on any of this as they've been wrong so many times this year!

BeefeaterHat

Goldengirl wrote: »

You do realise it's not their fault ( if any exists) that the vaccine is not approved yet ?

I do realize that thanks. What i mean is them dragging out the distribution of a vaccine when the time comes. Japan plan on vaccinating everyone by the summer and the UK are ending restrictions by spring. Here, Martin is already giving us the 'we hope to...' routine. It's not good enough.

BeefeaterHat

is_that_so wrote: »

I'd be wary of the UK thoughts on any of this as they've been wrong so many times this year!

What about Japan? It can't be a case of everyone else getting it wrong and ireland being right.

BeefeaterHat

Goldengirl wrote: »

How about waiting to see if that happens before you start giving out ?

Why would wasting time at dedicated press conferences improve the rollout of the vaccine , Ffs?

It would provide the public with a tangible timeline and a framework for how it's going to work. How is that a waste of time? Ffs

is_that_so

Goldengirl wrote: »

How about waiting to see if that happens before you start giving out ?

Why would wasting time at dedicated press conferences improve the rollout of the vaccine , Ffs?

It's just a commentary on what was said and it was pretty underwhelming stuff. They will lose a lot of people if that is the continued message through 2021, never mind the aim of the vaccine strategy in the first place. As has been hinted by the Government good communication is vital in this next phase. On that basis they are off to a bad start.

BeefeaterHat

is_that_so wrote: »

It's just a commentary on what was said and it was pretty underwhelming stuff. They will lose a lot of people if that is the continued message through 2021, never mind the aim of the vaccine strategy in the first place. As has been hinted by the Government good communication is vital in this next phase. On that basis they are off to a bad start.

That's exactly my point. The tone regarding the vaccine compared to other countries is dreadful. They seem almost afraid to acknowledge it's existence. But I guess some people feel we should just choke down any crap the government and HSE dish up.

is_that_so

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

What about Japan? It can't be a case of everyone else getting it wrong and ireland being right.

Eh, how did Japan get into this? The UK have got strategies wrong, failed miserably on contact tracing and I've lost track of how many "game changers" they've had. In short they've spoofed a lot and Spring really means early Autumn!

Azatadine

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

That's exactly my point. The tone regarding the vaccine compared to other countries is dreadful. They seem almost afraid to acknowledge it's existence. But I guess some people feel we should just choke down any crap the government and HSE dish up.

There is a bit of that (not wanting to acknowledge it exists) for some reason alright

BeefeaterHat

is_that_so wrote: »

Eh, how did Japan get into this? The UK have got strategies wrong, failed miserably on contact tracing and I've lost track of how many "game changers" they've had. In short they've spoofed a lot and Spring really means early Autumn!

Japan have said they plan on vaccinating everyone by the summer. A country of 120 million people. Fair enough the uk have had their mishaps and disasters but so have we and at least the government there are making amends with the vaccine rollout.

Goldengirl

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

That's exactly my point. The tone regarding the vaccine compared to other countries is dreadful. They seem almost afraid to acknowledge it's existence. But I guess some people feel we should just choke down any crap the government and HSE dish up.

Absolutely not, but the continued bashing is getting just a bit tiresome.
From tomorrow we will all know what , where AND when, and ranting about public health and how terrible the HSE surely can wait until there actually is something to give out about .

Edit . I note that the UK covid management gets given the benefit of the doubt by you, despite the fact that they have been one of the worst countries through this, but always with the bashing of the Irish response .

is_that_so

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

Japan have said they plan on vaccinating everyone by the summer. A country of 120 million people. Fair enough the uk have had their mishaps and disasters but so have we and at least the government there are making amends with the vaccine rollout.

I'd believe Japan but not the UK until they actually do it! Bear in mind only one vaccine is in play and they desperately need the Oxford one, to get anywhere near their planned numbers.

BeefeaterHat

Goldengirl wrote: »

Absolutely not, but the continued bashing is getting just a bit tiresome.
From tomorrow we will all know what , where AND when, and ranting about public health and how terrible the HSE surely can wait until there actually is something to give out about .

It's not ranting or bashing it's valid criticism of an important issue. If you cant see why it's important that we roll out a vaccine as quickly as possible for economic, health and social reasons then I give up

Beasty

Threads merged

Goldengirl

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

It's not ranting or bashing it's valid criticism of an important issue. If you cant see why it's important that we roll out a vaccine as quickly as possible for economic, health and social reasons then I give up

I never said any of that .
Of course you would twist and deflect.
You just continue ranting ....

Duke of Url

Why do people think the HSE will mess up the roll out of the vaccine?

It’s not as if we are rolling out 100,000s of vaccine doses each year and have been doing it for decades.


What I’ve learned during this pandemic is that there are a large portion of thick people in this country.

It will be this huge group of people who have difficulty following the most basic simplest instructions around their first and second appointments.

The amount of doses that will be wasted due to incompetence within the public will be amazing

BeefeaterHat

Goldengirl wrote: »

I never said any of that .
Of course you would twist and deflect.
You just continue ranting ....

Point out where I'm ranting please? Everything I have said I've backed up. Is it a matter of you simply throwing a fit because you don't like what's being said?

BeefeaterHat

Duke of Url wrote: »

Why do people think the HSE will mess up the roll out of the vaccine?

It’s not as if we are rolling out 100,000s of vaccine doses each year and have been doing it for decades.


What I’ve learned during this pandemic is that there are a large portion of thick people in this country.

It will be this huge group of people who have difficulty following the most basic simplest instructions around their first and second appointments.

What worries me is the particular storage methods for the moderna vaccine. The low temperatures just leave it open for error.

Henryq.

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

There preparing us for another 6 months of excuses, finger pointing and arse covering while the HSE put on a modern day three stooges routine with rolling out the vaccine. Someone suggested early, very correctly that there should be press conferences dedicated to the vaccine rollout. That ain't happening because they'd expose how hopeless they truly are.

That was me

We should be talking vaccine rollout now

At the moment the government are throwing out soundbytes about the vaccine

is_that_so

Duke of Url wrote: »

Why do people think the HSE will mess up the roll out of the vaccine?

It’s not as if we are rolling out 100,000s of vaccine doses each year and have been doing it for decades.


What I’ve learned during this pandemic is that there are a large portion of thick people in this country.

It will be this huge group of people who have difficulty following the most basic simplest instructions around their first and second appointments.

Indeed they took care of over 1m flu' shots this year. It's all the other issues that exist in the HSE that are conflated for this. We will see tomorrow or the next day anyway.

jackboy

Henryq. wrote: »

That was me

We should be talking vaccine rollout now

At the moment the government are throwing out soundbytes about the vaccine

It’s a bit worrying alright.

However, look at Germany. They had a detailed plan in place to start rolling out the vaccine this week. Now no vaccine ready and their Covid management strategy has failed.

is_that_so

Henryq. wrote: »

That was me

We should be talking vaccine rollout now

At the moment the government are throwing out soundbytes about the vaccine

We can't roll out what is not approved. The plan will be published tomorrow or the next day.

Duke of Url

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

What worries me is the particular storage methods for the moderna vaccine. The low temperatures just leave it open for error.

Yes. The thick sh1ts not turning up for appointment because they are delayed in the hairdressers or “forget”

That’s what will mess up the lifespan of doses.

BeefeaterHat

Henryq. wrote: »

That was me

We should be talking vaccine rollout now

At the moment the government are throwing out soundbytes about the vaccine

Exactly it's pure fluff. If I answered questions the way Micheal Martin does at work I'd be kicked out the door

Goldengirl

BeefeaterHat wrote: »

Point out where I'm ranting please? Everything I have said I've backed up. Is it a matter of you simply throwing a fit because you don't like what's being said?

I have already pointed out / quoted three of your posts that are just bashing for the sake of it . Where are they backed up ?
There is no data until we know what the vaccine task force have recommended ,so I merely suggest you wait for that before you give out about it . And that you cut the Irish response the same slack you so generously cut the truly awful UK government.
No fit just responding to some very unbalanced comments .