Is it just me or have SF vanished?

cadaliac

suicide_circus wrote: »

i get it but its not the time imo

It is.
If it were unchecked or if something like the black and tan memorial went ahead in Dublin a few months back - what do you think would happen?

I get where you are coming from but in this case SF (or the powers that run SF) are actually saving (some) people from themselves.

It is a completely avoidably situation that they are actually avoiding. I admire them for it.

It might seem like a good idea but it needs much more thought than a flippant remark or suggestion from a politician.

FrancieBrady

Hamsterchops wrote: »

The army has a second to none logistics capability, would be crazy not to use the Royal Logistic corps (if they were called for), no guns, just logistical transport support.

A border was a good idea to solve the issue with Brexit...but EVERYONE knew how destabilising it would be. It would be crazy to destabilise now just because a Unionist is trying to troll republicans/nationalists.

There my come a sad time when it is the only option but we are a long way off that.

Beasty

FrancieBrady is now threadbanned

Hamsterchops

FrancieBrady wrote: »

A border was a good idea to solve the issue with Brexit...but EVERYONE knew how destabilising it would be. It would be crazy to destabilise now just because a Unionist is trying to troll republicans/nationalists.

There my come a sad time when it is the only option but we are a long way off that.

You think Robin Swann is trying to troll?

OK.

all about the mane

all about the mane wrote: »

Still no sign of Mary. Great leader right there...

She's just so mysterious

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

Genuinely who do you think is saying that?

Feel free to offer actual solutions as opposed to opprobrium.

A FG foghorn quite literally said there is no better way. If we're going to go down the road of solutions v opprobrium, perhaps the FG online cubscout wing can do slightly better than rehashing Thatcherite insults from the 80s when alternative policies are being discussed here and elsewhere.

Ye lot are guilty as hell of just flinging insults (Venezuela, commies, the Ra blah blah blah) when people are talking through something as simple as a different approach housing or health. Or a differing approach to tax bands.

It's obnoxious as hell, self regarding, and not as half as clever as you think it is.

zerosugarbuzz

More importantly, where has eoghan Murphy disappeared to? Last I heard he was self isolating but that was a few weeks ago.

Mortelaro

Yurt! wrote: »

A FG foghorn quite literally said there is no better way. If we're going to go down the road of solutions v opprobrium, perhaps the FG online cubscout wing can do slightly better than rehashing Thatcherite insults from the 80s when alternative policies are being discussed here and elsewhere.

Ye lot are guilty as hell of just flinging insults (Venezuela, commies, the Ra blah blah blah) when people are talking through something as simple as a different approach housing or health. Or a differing approach to tax bands.

It's obnoxious as hell, self regarding, and not as half as clever as you think it is.

Au contraire I'd contend that attending Maduros inauguration is obnoxious
If a government representative went,we would never hear the end of it
Anyone that thinks ignoring who a party waves up as a shining light eg Syriza or very dodgy Venezuela or Cuba is deluded
Show me your friends and I'll tell you what you are

Sultan_of_Ping

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

More importantly, where has eoghan Murphy disappeared to? Last I heard he was self isolating but that was a few weeks ago.

I'm guessing that as housing minister there's not much need for him to visible in the midst of a public health emergency?

As an aside, it seems McDonald is due back in the Dail next week.

Yurt2

Mortelaro wrote: »

Au contraire I'd contend that attending Maduros inauguration is obnoxious
If a government representative went,we would never hear the end of it
Anyone that thinks ignoring who a party waves up as a shining light eg Syriza or very dodgy Venezuela or Cuba is deluded
Show me your friends and I'll tell you what you are

Nobody cares. SF are not Syriza or whoever you want them to be. You want to talk about Venezuela when there's a country to run. That's called a classic non-sequitur.

Let's not play the game of which Irish politician shook hands with what despot throughout the years. FG might not come out of it as squeeky clean as you'd think.

piplip87

Yurt! wrote: »

Nobody cares. SF are not Syriza or whoever you want them to be. You want to talk about Venezuela when there's a country to run. That's called a classic non-sequitur.

Let's not play the game of which Irish politician shook hands with what despot throughout the years. FG might not come out of it as squeeky clean as you'd think.

There's a massive difference between shaking hands with a world leader, which has to be done regardless of policy and stating that an election was free and fair even though most of the civilized world disagrees with it. Then after a rigged election accusing the person that is following their countries constitution of a power grab.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

A FG foghorn quite literally said there is no better way. If we're going to go down the road of solutions v opprobrium, perhaps the FG online cubscout wing can do slightly better than rehashing Thatcherite insults from the 80s when alternative policies are being discussed here and elsewhere.

Ye lot are guilty as hell of just flinging insults (Venezuela, commies, the Ra blah blah blah) when people are talking through something as simple as a different approach housing or health. Or a differing approach to tax bands.

It's obnoxious as hell, self regarding, and not as half as clever as you think it is.

Again, nothing of substance in this reply. Feel free to put forward actual solutions. hell, a few dozen pages ago people wanted Swedish tax model until it was pointed out it would involve raising the taxes on low income earners, significantly.

Even your use of "Ye" as though being anti-SF somehow makes people into a homogenous group. Helps you pretend they are a common enemy I suppose.

Yurt2

piplip87 wrote: »

There's a massive difference between shaking hands with a world leader, which has to be done regardless of policy and stating that an election was free and fair even though most of the civilized world disagrees with it. Then after a rigged election accusing the person that is following their countries constitution of a power grab.

I'm not a fan of Maduro and I think accepting an invite to the inauguration was a mistake but remember this...

... In and out of office, Irish politicians of mainstream parties rub shoulders with and glad-hand with people ranging from the questionable to outright scumbags.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

Nobody cares. SF are not Syriza or whoever you want them to be. You want to talk about Venezuela when there's a country to run. That's called a classic non-sequitur.

Let's not play the game of which Irish politician shook hands with what despot throughout the years. FG might not come out of it as squeeky clean as you'd think.

Tbf, repeatedly SF supporters on this thread have said there's no point looking at the bad job SF have done in Government in NI. (All Westministers fault, don't ya know)

We don't have to look as far as Venezuela to see their policies in action I suppose.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Tbf, repeatedly SF supporters on this thread have said there's no point looking at the bad job SF have done in Government in NI. (All Westministers fault, don't ya know)

We don't have to look as far as Venezuela to see their policies in action I suppose.

What sinn fein policies from last election manifesto are in action in venezuela??

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

Again, nothing of substance in this reply. Feel free to put forward actual solutions. hell, a few dozen pages ago people wanted Swedish tax model until it was pointed out it would involve raising the taxes on low income earners, significantly.

Even your use of "Ye" as though being anti-SF somehow makes people into a homogenous group. Helps you pretend they are a common enemy I suppose.

Have done in many threads across many topics. I don't need to prove myself to you.

Let's be real, most people getting stuck into these threads slinging insults are FG supporters or members.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

Have done in many threads across many topics. I don't need to prove myself to you.

Let's be real, most people getting stuck into these threads slinging insults are FG supporters or members.

You don't need to prove yourself to anyone, but that's hardly an answer either. I asked a genuine question and again you deflect.

I am neither a FG supporter or member, but it's easy for you to throw that line out to prevent yourself from thinking about why people in Ireland who aren't FG wouldn't support SF.

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

You don't need to prove yourself to anyone, but that's hardly an answer either. I asked a genuine question and again you deflect.

I am neither a FG supporter or member, but it's easy for you to throw that line out to prevent yourself from thinking about why people in Ireland who aren't FG wouldn't support SF.

What's your genuine question? There was none. 'contribute something' is not only not a question, it's a smarter*se dig. And a par for course one at that.

You're playing silly games here to be honest.

Mortelaro

Yurt! wrote: »

Nobody cares. SF are not Syriza or whoever you want them to be. You want to talk about Venezuela when there's a country to run. That's called a classic non-sequitur.

Let's not play the game of which Irish politician shook hands with what despot throughout the years. FG might not come out of it as squeeky clean as you'd think.

Show me your friends and I'll tell you what you are.

This was less than 16 months ago at a time when millions were fleeing Venezuela and millions more were homeless and starving

Not much PPE in their hospitals either
They dont even have medicine

If it was FG lauding a country like that in the here and now,we would never hear the end of it
It is called calling out hypocrisy

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/sinn-f%C3%A9in-reveals-true-self-again-with-venezuela-infatuation-1.3768126

Thu, Jan 24, 2019,

Sinn Féin leader Mary Lou McDonald: drew fallacious comparisons between deprivation in 1919 and the problems facing the State today.

Sinn Féin’s unfitness for government in this State has been illustrated once again in recent weeks by the party’s continuing love affair with the repressive and incompetent regime which has destroyed the economy of Venezuela over the past two decades and left the mass of its people in dire poverty.

It was bad enough that two senior members of the party attended the inauguration of Nicolás Maduro for another term as president of Venezuela but it was the defence of that decision by Sinn Féin leader Mary Lou McDonald that exposed the party’s wilful ignorance of economic reality and its lack of concern for basic human rights.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

What's your genuine question? There was none. 'contribute something' is not only not a question, it's a smarter*se dig. And a par for course one at that.

You're playing silly games here to be honest.

Again with the ad hominem attacks, do you think I take any of this personally?

But I take your point on the questions, here is a few straight forward policy ones if you have the time.

Do you think a small open economy like Ireland should narrow its tax base and raise corporation taxes?

Do you think it's possible to build adequate social housing for 65k per unit? What would be the cost of maintenance on such units?

Dublin City is owed 33 million euro in back rent, how would you collect it and what would you do with people who refuse to pay it?

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you think it's possible to build adequate social housing for 65k per unit? What would be the cost of maintenance on such units?

Dublin City is owed 33 million euro in back rent, how would you collect it and what would you do with people who refuse to pay it?

The first point has been covered at length and has been debunked. You're peddling a myth. SF never claimed they would build units at 65k. The costings they gave had the rule ran over them by Lorcan Sirr (Ireland's preeminent housing economist). Not only did he say their costings on housing were doable, he said they're the most correct course of action given the situation.

I don't even get why you're asking the second question.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

The first point has been covered at length and has been debunked. You're peddling a myth. SF never claimed they would build units at 65k. The costings they gave had the rule ran over them by Lorcan Sirr (Ireland's preeminent housing economist). Not only did he say their costings on housing were doable, he said they're the most correct course of action given the situation.

I don't even get why you're asking the second question.

Sorry if this has already been answered, but what size were the proposed units? Family or single occupancy?

Yurt2

Mortelaro wrote: »

Show me your friends and I'll tell you what you are.

This was less than 16 months ago at a time when millions were fleeing Venezuela and millions more were homeless and starving

Not much PPE in their hospitals either
They dont even have medicine

If it was FG lauding a country like that in the here and now,we would never hear the end of it
It is called calling out hypocrisy

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/sinn-f%C3%A9in-reveals-true-self-again-with-venezuela-infatuation-1.3768126

Fine let's play this game then. One that immediately springs to mind is...

Why did Senator Neale Richmond (newly minted FG TD) along with Catherine Noone appear at a conference sponsored by the People's Mojahedin Organization of Iran (also known as MEK) in France last year? Alongside assorted Trumpites.

An Islamic militant diaspora movement that had been labelled a cult in various quarters.

That's just one from last year. And there's more where that came from. I await your reply with bated breath...

By the way, Neale Richmond frames himself as some sort of foreign affairs policy expert, so I won't be letting him off the hook that he didn't know who these goons were.

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

Sorry if this has already been answered, but what size were the proposed units? Family or single occupancy?

They were a mix of units. Wasn't a one size fits all plan.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

They were a mix of units. Wasn't a one size fits all plan.

So, the €65K was an average. Did this include services and site? Again, apologies if already answered.

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

So, the €65K was an average. Did this include services and site? Again, apologies if already answered.

Nope, the average unit was costed at in or around 130k or 180k from memory. The 65k figures was plucked out of thin air by the FG online front.

Whichever it was, Lorcan Sirr came out and said it was doable and probably necessary.

It was on an Irish Times podcast where they did a deep-dive on SF's housing policy.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

The first point has been covered at length and has been debunked. You're peddling a myth. SF never claimed they would build units at 65k. The costings they gave had the rule ran over them by Lorcan Sirr (Ireland's preeminent housing economist). Not only did he say their costings on housing were doable, he said they're the most correct course of action given the situation.

I don't even get why you're asking the second question.

Third question? I ask because the state as landlord already has an issue collecting rents, how would you solve it? Fairly basic question since SF want to increase the state's role as a landlord.

Can you provide a link to the Lorcan Sirr article? I'm absolutely willing to concede this but Dublin council's costings are roughly 5 times that much for the ones they have built (and that's when they own the land) https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/dublin-city-council-says-average-housing-unit-costs-330-000-1.3523127

And can you answer the first question I asked you?

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

So, the €65K was an average. Did this include services and site? Again, apologies if already answered.

The 6.5 billion.was how much extra was proposed.....bringing average upto 130-170K or some sh1te like that


It was an reading/wording issue,what lead people to read it as 6.5 billion divided by 100K...an understandable issue for ordinary people

,but fact media continued to run with this figure dispite it being clarified is one of 2 issues, what put me towards voting shinnerz and not spoiling my vote

Mortelaro

Yurt! wrote: »

Fine let's play this game then. One that immediately springs to mind is...

Why did Senator Neale Richmond (newly minted FG TD) along with Catherine Noone appear at a conference sponsored by the People's Mojahedin Organization of Iran (also known as MEK) in France last year? Alongside assorted Trumpites.

An Islamic militant diaspora movement that had been labelled a cult in various quarters.

That's just one from last year. And there's more where that came from. I await your reply with bated breath...

By the way, Neale Richmond frames himself as some sort of foreign affairs policy expert, so I won't be letting him off the hook that he didn't know who these goons were.

Were they representing FG or there to praise the regime?
Try again

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

Third question? I ask because the state as landlord already has an issue collecting rents, how would you solve it? Fairly basic question since SF want to increase the state's role as a landlord.

Can you provide a link to the Lorcan Sirr article? I'm absolutely willing to concede this but Dublin council's costings are roughly 5 times that much for the ones they have built (and that's when they own the land) https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/dublin-city-council-says-average-housing-unit-costs-330-000-1.3523127

And can you answer the first question I asked you?

Irish times podcast around the time of the election. Quite frankly, the burden is on you with the 65k figure. That was plucked out of the air to beat SF over the head with. No such claims were made by SF so why bother even going there.

And no, I won't be answering your questions, because you ask them in bad faith.