Is it just me or have SF vanished?

costacorta

Can I ask a stupid question? Why do ye call her the fish wife ?

Fann Linn

costacorta wrote: »

Can I ask a stupid question? Why do ye call her the fish wife ?

He thinks he's a comedian.

McMurphy

McMurphy wrote: »

Are you suggesting that the shinners do not hold democratic election processes for certain positions, or are you just blindly following the narrative and repeating something without thinking?


If you believe that, I have some magic beans you might be interested in.

Don't make me make you look a complete tool on your first day back Jingle, think man, think.

Never forget,FG held an leadership election,where the person who got most votes,didnt win the election :pac:


But lecture others on democracy

McMurphy

Deleted User wrote: »

Never forget,FG held an leadership election,where the person who got most votes,didnt win the election :pac:


But lecture others on democracy

Already called that poster out on that, wouldn't engage though.

I keep asking if they really believe they don't hold elections for leadership roles but have no takers.

It's a bit strange making matter of fact statements like thatv and run from when called out.

Blanch will be along soon to pedantic the life out of it too, as sure as night follows day.

tipptom

costacorta wrote: »

Can I ask a stupid question? Why do ye call her the fish wife ?

Just take a look at that particular posters posting history,almost exclusively devoted to abusing women and making fun of people contracting covid 19.

all about the mane

costacorta wrote: »

Can I ask a stupid question? Why do ye call her the fish wife ?

Definition:
A vulgar, abusive or nagging woman with a loud, unpleasant voice.

I would have thought it was obvious

all about the mane

all about the mane wrote: »

Definition:
A vulgar, abusive or nagging woman with a loud, unpleasant voice.

I would have thought it was obvious

Tbf not many people are upto speed on 1930s insults


I assumed it was a reference to molly malone,being from dublin

smurgen

all about the mane wrote: »

Definition:
A vulgar, abusive or nagging woman with a loud, unpleasant voice.

I would have thought it was obvious

You sound like a stand-up chap.

Hamsterchops

NIMAN wrote: »

Mary Lou is on the late late show tomorrow night to tell us how she survived the virus.

Déjà vu, wasn't she on the Late Late just a few weeks ago mid March?

blanch152

McMurphy wrote: »

You're on these boards long enough to know fine well that she was the sole nominee for Adams replacement.

The recently departed Kim-Jong-Un was also the sole nominee to replace his father, so it happens. It is usually only in two scenarios, where there is only one outstanding candidate or when there is a completely undemocratic situation.

McMurphy

blanch152 wrote: »

The recently departed Kim-Jong-Un was also the sole nominee to replace his father, so it happens. It is usually only in two scenarios, where there is only one outstanding candidate or when there is a completely undemocratic situation.

The other two lads hot footed it when asked, so let's see if Blanch will take the bait.

Are you going to nail your colours to the mast here, and let me have a yes or no answer.

Does Sinn Fein have democratic elections to decide on certain roles within the party, leadership or otherwise?

Yes or no will suffice.

Randy Archer

McMurphy wrote: »

Pat wasn't the leader of labour ever, are you mixing him up with Gilmore?

Pat Rabbite was the leader of labour from 2002-2006 , before Gilmore. Gilmore was leader 2011

markodaly

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

And they don't care. They urgently need the cost of living to come down before their entire lives are wasted trying to stay afloat and not being able to build a life for themselves, and they need that to be addressed now, not in a decade or two, or whatever the timeline for "the market will fix everything on its own" BS is these days.

I agree, cost of living is an issue, yet SF want to raise the minimum wage and are looking into a living wage, which will pay circa €15 euro an hour. Now will this reduce or increase the cost of living.

We all know the answer to that one.

It still amazes me how people don't seem to get this. The cost of living is destroying peoples' lives and young people who are primarily in the rental sector for housing have been hit orders of magnitude harder than everyone else (who are being hit hard enough as it is!) - Fine Gael don't give a bollocks about those people, so why should those people vote for Fine Gael?

You keep mentioning cost of living in some blanket statement.
The biggest factors are rent, insurance and child care costs and they effect different people differently. I agree that FG should have done more to combat this issue, but lets not pretend there is an easy little solution to all this.

Housing is complex to solve, anyone who tells you otherwise is an idiot or lying to you.
Insurance is a bit of a mine-field. There you will need to take on the judicial and legal professions, which are powerful. Not impossible but there will be battle scars. Again, not an easy solution. (Its also a cultural thing here, where we Irish like to sue.) It may also mean a refferendum.
Childcare, perhaps the easiest of all solve but will require billions to do so. Essentailly to reduce the cost, the government will have to step in and start subsidising the whole industry. Are people prepared to pay more tax for this?

Honestly, I just don't get it. In what political theory or model does "Directly pursue policies which severely harm a particular demographic" logically lead into "expect that demographic to vote for you when you've done absolutely nothing for them and indeed have actively done things which have hurt them immeasurably"?

Because they also want to protect a particular demographic to vote for the,, namely older people.

EDIT: Here's a quote from journalist Glenn Greenwald (the man who broke the Snowden story a few years back) on Brexit and Trump, entirely relevant to the rise of SF here. Everything he's saying is exactly why young Irish voters have abandoned FFG.

One of the things that is bothering me and bothered me about the Brexit debate, and is bothering me a huge about the Trump debate, is that there is zero elite reckoning with their own responsibility in creating the situation that led to both Brexit and Trump and then the broader collapse of elite authority. The reason why Brexit resonated and Trump resonated isn’t that people are too stupid to understand the arguments. The reason they resonated is that people have been so f*cked by the prevailing order in such deep and fundamental and enduring ways that they can't imagine that anything is worse than preservation of the status quo. You have this huge portion of the populace in both the U.K. and the U.S. that is so angry and so helpless that they view exploding things without any idea of what the resulting debris is going to be to be preferable to having things continue, and the people they view as having done this to them to continue in power. That is a really serious and dangerous and not completely invalid perception that a lot of people who spend their days scorning Trump and his supporters or Brexit played a great deal in creating.

I get what Glenn is saying here, but that is the world we live in. We live in such an interconnected and globalised world that national governments don't have near as much control or say as they once did. That is why we are having return to both right wing and left wing populism at a time, when we really never had it so good, in many ways.

The right hate the global order because of mass migration.
The left hate the global order because of liberal free markets.

However, be careful what you wish for. The post war era has been the most prosperous and peaceful known to man, that is no accident since everyone wants to trade with everyone else.

If we revert back to a statist nationalism with traiffs and protectionism, it will make us poorer in the long run and more likely to wage war.
I always see this argument from the left, decrying neo-liberalism or how globalism operates but as always they $hit the bed when it comes to the actual problem, that of power itself. They are better off just saying, they want to return power back to national governments.

* Glenn is a bit of a tool as well, as he and his ilk before Trump directly contributed to the narrative that everyone who doesn't agree with his world view is a racist, idiot, islamaphobe...etc.etc..
Glenn has done plenty to create the world we live in now, but will never admit that he is wrong.

Bishop of hope

McMurphy wrote: »

The other two lads hot footed it when asked, so let's see if Blanch will take the bait.

Are you going to nail your colours to the mast here, and let me have a yes or no answer.

Does Sinn Fein have democratic elections to decide on certain roles within the party, leadership or otherwise?

Yes or no will suffice.

Doubt could be cast over that.
It's fine having a democratic vote, but if you're being told how to vote before you do, or a predetermined result is in place and you vote just to let the public think its so democratic then that's just window dressing.
SF and their followers have shown a lot of disrespect for democracy since the election really.
The other party's joined up, if they do, have a huge mandate to govern, SF and it's supporters don't seem to think so though do they?

blanch152

McMurphy wrote: »

The other two lads hot footed it when asked, so let's see if Blanch will take the bait.

Are you going to nail your colours to the mast here, and let me have a yes or no answer.

Does Sinn Fein have democratic elections to decide on certain roles within the party, leadership or otherwise?

Yes or no will suffice.

The Soviet Union under Stalin had democratic elections on paper and written in regulations, so by those standards, the answer is yes.

Often, there was only one candidate as well.

In those circumstances, I will concede the point.

McMurphy

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Doubt could be cast over that.
It's fine having a democratic vote, but if you're being told how to vote before you do, or a predetermined result is in place and you vote just to let the public think its so democratic then that's just window dressing.
SF and their followers have shown a lot of disrespect for democracy since the election really.
The other party's joined up, if they do, have a huge mandate to govern, SF and it's supporters don't seem to think so though do they?

blanch152 wrote: »

The Soviet Union under Stalin had democratic elections on paper and written in regulations, so by those standards, the answer is yes.

Often, there was only one candidate as well.

In those circumstances, I will concede the point.

Obviously the pair of you have very short memories, or else the O'Neil v O'Dowd leadership challenge flew under both your radars.

It's fine having a democratic vote, but if you're being told how to vote before you do, or a predetermined result is in place and you vote just to let the public think its so democratic then that's just window dressing.

Often, there was only one candidate as well.

But on theses points specifically - I may even agree with you had the pair of you not been spouting complete and utter bollocks.

As already mentioned a few times by myself and others (but no one seems to want to grasp the nettle) going back to FGs leadership election, Coveney won more than twice the votes than Leo did, and yet the hierarchy within FG made leo the leader regardless. Going by the bar set here - that vote was either window dressing, predetermined, and an utter waste of time.

O'Dowd however very publicly made a leadership challenge against O'Neill, votes were cast during the ard fheis, and just like the Simon v Leo vote O'Neill got more than double the amount of votes than O'Dowd.

https://twitter.com/molloy1916/status/1197835117231783936?s=19

O'Dowd however didn't get the gig, because he did not win the vote.

Let the backpedalling but but buts commence.

Poorly researched - blindly following the narrative. No point coming back and trying a rebuttal, there is none.

McMurphy

McMurphy wrote: »

Obviously the pair of you have very short memories, or else the O'Neil v O'Dowd leadership challenge flew under both your radars.





But on theses points specifically - I may even agree with you had the pair of you not been spouting complete and utter bollocks.

As already mentioned a few times by myself and others (but no one seems to want to grasp the nettle) going back to FGs leadership election, Coveney won more than twice the votes than Leo did, and yet the hierarchy within FG made leo the leader regardless. Going by the bar set here - that vote was either window dressing, predetermined, and an utter waste of time.

O'Dowd however very publicly made a leadership challenge against O'Neill, votes were cast during the ard fheis, and just like the Simon v Leo vote O'Neill got more than double the amount of votes than O'Dowd.

https://twitter.com/molloy1916/status/1197835117231783936?s=19

O'Dowd however didn't get the gig, because he did not win the vote.

Let the backpedalling but but buts commence.

Poorly researched - blindly following the narrative. No point coming back and trying a rebuttal, there is none.

Lol....cant believe they walked into this....i seen it coming a mile off

McMurphy

Deleted User wrote: »

Lol....cant believe they walked into this....i seen it coming a mile off

Clowns too busy trying to point score - no one on this earth is going to convince me shinner obsessive blanch wasn't aware of the O'Neill v O'Dowd very public leadership battle, but he blindly followed the narrative regardless, because no more than a moth can help itself zooming in on a lightbulb or a dog can stop itself wagging its tail when it sees it's master, he had to try and get a point scored against the shinners.

The others, if I typed out what I thought about their debating skills or intelligence levels here is probably get a ban, so I'm not going to go there.

Remember you read it here first. The shinners don't have votes for the leadership positions, that's not democratic.

Yes they do. However fg have leadership elections where it doesn't matter a shiny shyte the results because the job is going to whoever the fupp the hierarchy say so.

**Runaway shouting something about whataboutery and fishwife**

Numptiness.

Bishop of hope

McMurphy wrote: »

Obviously the pair of you have very short memories, or else the O'Neil v O'Dowd leadership challenge flew under both your radars.





But on theses points specifically - I may even agree with you had the pair of you not been spouting complete and utter bollocks.

As already mentioned a few times by myself and others (but no one seems to want to grasp the nettle) going back to FGs leadership election, Coveney won more than twice the votes than Leo did, and yet the hierarchy within FG made leo the leader regardless. Going by the bar set here - that vote was either window dressing, predetermined, and an utter waste of time.

O'Dowd however very publicly made a leadership challenge against O'Neill, votes were cast during the ard fheis, and just like the Simon v Leo vote O'Neill got more than double the amount of votes than O'Dowd.

https://twitter.com/molloy1916/status/1197835117231783936?s=19

O'Dowd however didn't get the gig, because he did not win the vote.

Let the backpedalling but but buts commence.

Poorly researched - blindly following the narrative. No point coming back and trying a rebuttal, there is none.

Sorry now, but you irked me a bit by saying I was talking bolox.
If you are trying to push me into a political box then you are very much mistaken.
I see by your response that you are on message as regards deflection anyway.
Following a blind narrative is your own failing, not mine.
There is plenty of narrative out there about how SF is run, I won't link as it's been done to death, by former SF members like councillors and a TD.
Unlike yourself I'm not guilty of such narrow thinking and claim no superiority on any party or politician when it comes to how they view democracy.
Grow up and see the light.

McMurphy

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Sorry now, but you irked me a bit by saying I was talking bolox.
If you are trying to push me into a political box then you are very much mistaken.
I see by your response that you are on message as regards deflection anyway.
Following a blind narrative is your own failing, not mine.
There is plenty of narrative out there about how SF is run, I won't link as it's been done to death, by former SF members like councillors and a TD.
Unlike yourself I'm not guilty of such narrow thinking and claim no superiority on any party or politician when it comes to how they view democracy.
Grow up and see the light.

Sorry Bishop, but I'm not taking it back - you jumped on the blind narrative hyperbolic bandwagon without doing your research, posted something about predetermined votes blah blah blah and have been proven to be completely and utterly spouting nonsense.

Deal with it.

christy c

What was the issue with the FG leadership election? The process was very clearly laid out before the election where all candidates were aware.

Its weighted to the parliamentary party correctly in my view, with ordinary members having a much smaller say.

Shefwedfan

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Sorry now, but you irked me a bit by saying I was talking bolox.
If you are trying to push me into a political box then you are very much mistaken.
I see by your response that you are on message as regards deflection anyway.
Following a blind narrative is your own failing, not mine.
There is plenty of narrative out there about how SF is run, I won't link as it's been done to death, by former SF members like councillors and a TD.
Unlike yourself I'm not guilty of such narrow thinking and claim no superiority on any party or politician when it comes to how they view democracy.
Grow up and see the light.

You will learn quickly

SF = good
Everyone else bad

Shows the stupidity of some people that they blindly follow a party, a party full of the biggest scumbags in politics

McMurphy

christy c wrote: »

What was the issue with the FG leadership election? The process was very clearly laid out before the election where all candidates were aware.

Its weighted to the parliamentary party correctly in my view, with ordinary members having a much smaller say.

I don't think anyone is arguing otherwise, the problem is that it's clearly FG supporters on this site that are running with the "undemocratic" lines.

Clearly flawed narrative however.

Mortelaro

The NI Sinn Féin leadership battle was a sham,let's be honest about that

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-grassroots-left-in-dark-on-deputy-leadership-challenge-1.4084418

McDonald justified the lack of hustings, saying the leadership took a view on how the contest would be handled 'bearing in mind it’s an internal position'
That was forcibly brought home by the extraordinary front-page headline in last Tuesday’s Irish News that declared, “O’Dowd won’t be punished for deputy leader challenge, says Sinn Féin president”.

christy c

McMurphy wrote: »

I don't think anyone is arguing otherwise, the problem is that it's clearly FG supporters on this site that are running with the "undemocratic" lines.

Clearly flawed narrative however.

Well you were clearly implying there was a problem with the FG election process, there is nothing wrong in my view.

Bishop of hope

McMurphy wrote: »

Sorry Bishop, but I'm not taking it back - you jumped on the blind narrative hyperbolic bandwagon without doing your research, posted something about predetermined votes blah blah blah and have been proven to be completely and utterly spouting nonsense.

Deal with it.

It only irked me for a second, I still managed to eat my breakfast.
None so blind as those that can't see as they say!

Bishop of hope

Bishop of hope wrote: »

It only irked me for a second, I still managed to eat my breakfast.
None so blind as those that can't see as they say!

What did ya have for breakfast pal

Bishop of hope

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What did ya have for breakfast pal

Bacon and eggs.
I've an old aunt up the road cocooning, she bakes and she gave me some homemade bread out her window yesterday, a couple of slices of that too.

all about the mane

Mortelaro wrote: »

The NI Sinn Féin leadership battle was a sham,let's be honest about that

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-grassroots-left-in-dark-on-deputy-leadership-challenge-1.4084418

SF are so f@cked up. They won’t punish someone for making a leadership challenge. And are backslapping one the strength of it. Wow.

McMurphy

christy c wrote: »

Well you were clearly implying there was a problem with the FG election process, there is nothing wrong in my view.

Hang on a minute, I've no problem with how they do their election process, I clearly stated on numerous occasions that if we are to go by the bar set by others, Leo getting the gig over Simon was undemocratic and predetermined.

Surely if that's the bar they set for the shinners, FG must have it applied to them too? Otherwise, bit hypocritical don't you think?

Bishop of hope wrote: »

It only irked me for a second, I still managed to eat my breakfast.
None so blind as those that can't see as they say!

That's the spirit bishop, at the end of the day they're only words on a screen posted by a pseudonym.

I'm off to work for a couple of hours bit of an emergency, talk to you when I get back home again.