Is it just me or have SF vanished?

Mortelaro

McMurphy wrote: »

Hang on a minute, I've no problem with how they do their election process, I clearly stated on numerous occasions that if we are to go by the bar set by others, Leo getting the gig over Simon was undemocratic .

That's sh1te
The FG electoral process is clear and democratic
The hustings were open to the public,streamed online

No hustings for Sinn Féins why ?
Because it was a sham election, let's be honest about that

Despite the lack of evidence, she claimed that both she and O’Dowd had taken their message and their plans to the Sinn Féin membership, speaking personally with many delegates.

However, The Irish Times was unable to ask O’Dowd for his interpretation. Despite requests to the Sinn Féin press office over several days, no response came by the time of going to print.

McDonald argued the same point as O’Neill, saying both had talked to “people right across the country”, yet that engagement, such as it was, must have been behind hermetically-sealed doors considering there is such little public – and perhaps even grassroots Sinn Féin – knowledge about what is at play in this contest.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-grassroots-left-in-dark-on-deputy-leadership-challenge-1.4084418

all about the mane

Mortelaro wrote: »

That's sh1te
The FG electoral process is clear and democratic
The hustings were open to the public,streamed online

No hustings for Sinn Féins why ?
Because it was a sham election, let's be honest about that



https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-grassroots-left-in-dark-on-deputy-leadership-challenge-1.4084418

But there’ll be no punishment. Jesus wept.

How about Mary loo. How did her leadership vote go?

christy c

McMurphy wrote: »

Hang on a minute, I've no problem with how they do their election process, I clearly stated on numerous occasions that if we are to go by the bar set by others, Leo getting the gig over Simon was undemocratic and predetermined.

Surely if that's the bar they set for the shinners, FG must have it applied to them too? Otherwise, bit hypocritical don't you think?

I couldn't care less about how the shinners appoint a leader, but FG parliamentary party and members voted (I assume freely), so not undemocratic. If we both agree with that then there is no issue.

markodaly

SF appears to do internal elections and politics very very differently from all other parties in the country. That much is clear.
They are like the CCP ( Chinese Communist Party ). Sure Xi Jingping was 'elected' by a vast majority to be leader for life, but we all know its smoke and mirrors.

Its the illusion of democracy.

smurgen

McMurphy wrote: »

No mark, all I was doing was commenting on the reported number of deaths and how they were the highest in a single day, you said yourself I freely admitted to reading it wrong and confusing them as all dying in the one day.

However, for you, you of all people to try and accuse anyone else on this site to use the deaths of others for political hay, or capital, "sick and twisted" has to be one of the most goddam ironic and downright hypocritical pieces of sh1t I have ever read on this site in the 14 years of using it.

Hundreds of posts about the IRA victims v (/insert random loyalist paramilitaries groups/security forces etc) you just were a few steps away from getting out a few corpses and waving them about.

Political point scoring over people dying, my absolute bollocks, all the more hypocritical coming from yourself or anyone from the FG camp be it members or supporters, the high fcuking moral ground you do not get to take - I can assure you on that one.

Won't be long until hopefully this pandemic is behind us, a new election can be called and yourself and the political party you oh so emphatically cheer lead for can get out the spades and shovels and dig up a few more corpses to once again wave around to score political points, because it worked so well the last time.

The same lads who were non stop demanding Mary Lou to apologize for stuff in the troubles she had no hand in are now defending the governments abandonment of the elderly in our biggest health crisis and absolving them of responsibility. Couldn't make it up.

christy c

smurgen wrote: »

The same lads who were non stop demanding Mary Lou to apologize for stuff in the troubles she had no hand in are now defending the governments abandonment of the elderly in our biggest health crisis and absolving them of responsibility. Couldn't make it up.

Absolute rubbish, you make it sound like the government deliberately caused the situation in the nursing homes. I wont even repeat your idiotic comment about Harris.

This is coming from you, who said a couple of weeks ago that Borris was making them look bad.

Shefwedfan

smurgen wrote: »

The same lads who were non stop demanding Mary Lou to apologize for stuff in the troubles she had no hand in are now defending the governments abandonment of the elderly in our biggest health crisis and absolving them of responsibility. Couldn't make it up.

But you are making it up.....

Plus you comment on Harris, shows your a clown

Bishop of hope

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Bacon and eggs.
I've an old aunt up the road cocooning, she bakes and she gave me some homemade bread out her window yesterday, a couple of slices of that too.

We have an elderly neighbour and she rings to get us to drop few bottles of wine and port into her each week ....never knew she was a lush until now :pac:

Bishop of hope

McMurphy wrote: »

Hang on a minute, I've no problem with how they do their election process, I clearly stated on numerous occasions that if we are to go by the bar set by others, Leo getting the gig over Simon was undemocratic and predetermined.

Surely if that's the bar they set for the shinners, FG must have it applied to them too? Otherwise, bit hypocritical don't you think?



That's the spirit bishop, at the end of the day they're only words on a screen posted by a pseudonym.

I'm off to work for a couple of hours bit of an emergency, talk to you when I get back home again.

Stay safe Mc.

smurgen

Shefwedfan wrote: »

But you are making it up.....

Plus you comment on Harris, shows your a clown

I'm making it up? Here's the words of a care home owner that had multiple deaths in a facility. Here are the standout comments for me:

"Speaking to RTÉ's Morning Ireland, the operator said that she had been concerned about the potential for infection at the beginning of last month and made the decision to restrict visitors to the nursing home on 6 March

However, when she consulted the authorities she was told the restrictions were unnecessary.

"I was told there was no need. We were to keep doing what we were doing.

"Thankfully Nursing Homes Ireland stepped in and recommended visitor restrictions," she said."

And

"As the Covid-19 pandemic developed she remained concerned at the pace of State supports and intervention.

"My words were - it will be potentially catastrophic to nursing homes if Covid comes in, and it has been.


"We needed to plan at the earliest opportunity and the guidelines should have been in place for long term care facilities as a priority."

And

""I raised it with authorities because I felt everybody had a right to be tested. Staff need to know to deliver care and residents and families have the right to know."

Following a change in criteria last week the operator requested tests for all residents and a considerable number tested positive"

Incredible stuff.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0415/1130653-coronavirus-nursing-home/

tikkahunter

McMurphy wrote: »

Hang on a minute, I've no problem with how they do their election process, I clearly stated on numerous occasions that if we are to go by the bar set by others, Leo getting the gig over Simon was undemocratic and predetermined.

Surely if that's the bar they set for the shinners, FG must have it applied to them too? Otherwise, bit hypocritical don't you think?



That's the spirit bishop, at the end of the day they're only words on a screen posted by a pseudonym.

I'm off to work for a couple of hours bit of an emergency, talk to you when I get back home again.

Hope the emergency isn’t too serious lad . Mc it was fixed for Mary Lou to get to the position she is in , she was strategically placed in areas wich would have a high SF vote to promote her , basically build her up bit by by bit to leader . How am I so sure ? Well it could of been a member of my family in her place . They walked away from SF because of what they had become and would be pushing for and would be forced to peddle something they had no belief in and be made jumped on the populist bandwagon . It is the reason I can’t stand them now and deep down the politicians like Dougherty , Mc Donald know that is not what they signed up for when they went into SF . Mary Lou knew by leaving FF she would have a much easier route to the top . She is far more intelligent than a lot in that party that stood in her way and the main part is she is female so they can go with the softer changed angle . Far more attractive to the voter than Adams or Ellis .

Shefwedfan

Mary Lou was identified a long way out by SF, simple face is she has a brain and isn't as big of a (insert your own description) as the rest of the "politicians" in the party, What other options would they have? people who shout "up da Ra", the one who robbed off a charity and slags people off on faceboojk, or the one married to a Garda killer. F**k me it is slim pickings in that group

I have no idea if this is true, someone mentioned it to me, Mary Lou was going down the FF route or was in FF, anyway no route to the top so she jumped ship into SF because she seen a quicker and easier route. As I said, a few people said it to me, could be BS

She is a good politician, dragged down by the rest of the party that is in SF

all about the mane

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Mary Lou was identified a long way out by SF, simple face is she has a brain and isn't as big of a (insert your own description) as the rest of the "politicians" in the party, What other options would they have? people who shout "up da Ra", the one who robbed off a charity and slags people off on faceboojk, or the one married to a Garda killer. F**k me it is slim pickings in that group

I have no idea if this is true, someone mentioned it to me, Mary Lou was going down the FF route or was in FF, anyway no route to the top so she jumped ship into SF because she seen a quicker and easier route. As I said, a few people said it to me, could be BS

She is a good politician, dragged down by the rest of the party that is in SF

This is true

markodaly

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Mary Lou was identified a long way out by SF, simple face is she has a brain and isn't as big of a (insert your own description) as the rest of the "politicians" in the party, What other options would they have? people who shout "up da Ra", the one who robbed off a charity and slags people off on faceboojk, or the one married to a Garda killer. F**k me it is slim pickings in that group

I have no idea if this is true, someone mentioned it to me, Mary Lou was going down the FF route or was in FF, anyway no route to the top so she jumped ship into SF because she seen a quicker and easier route. As I said, a few people said it to me, could be BS

She is a good politician, dragged down by the rest of the party that is in SF

On the money.

To be honest, if she stayed sane and in FF she would be Taoiseach by now. But it appears she drank the kool-aid on the Irish Republicanism.

Mortelaro

smurgen wrote: »

I'm making it up? Here's the words of a care home owner that had multiple deaths in a facility. Here are the standout comments for me:

"Speaking to RTÉ's Morning Ireland, the operator said that she had been concerned about the potential for infection at the beginning of last month and made the decision to restrict visitors to the nursing home on 6 March

However, when she consulted the authorities she was told the restrictions were unnecessary.

"I was told there was no need. We were to keep doing what we were doing.

"Thankfully Nursing Homes Ireland stepped in and recommended visitor restrictions," she said."

And

"As the Covid-19 pandemic developed she remained concerned at the pace of State supports and intervention.

"My words were - it will be potentially catastrophic to nursing homes if Covid comes in, and it has been.


"We needed to plan at the earliest opportunity and the guidelines should have been in place for long term care facilities as a priority."

And

""I raised it with authorities because I felt everybody had a right to be tested. Staff need to know to deliver care and residents and families have the right to know."

Following a change in criteria last week the operator requested tests for all residents and a considerable number tested positive"

Incredible stuff.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0415/1130653-coronavirus-nursing-home/

Why do you consistently link to old news reports?
You do that all the time
Do you trawl the internet search engines, going down the list page by page until you find something out dated to moan about?
That one is a fortnight ago
A lot has happened since then
60% of the country's ppe by the way now goes to care home settings

Tokyo

Mod: @Shefwedfan - rein it in.

smurgen

Mortelaro wrote: »

Why do you consistently link to old news reports?
You do that all the time
Do you trawl the internet search engines, going down the list page by page until you find something out dated to moan about?
That one is a fortnight ago
A lot has happened since then
60% of the country's ppe by the way now goes to care home settings

Because timelines are important in this crisis. Putting in place measures now after people are sick or dead shows the impact the lack of quick action had. It displays the attempt to close the gate after the horse had bolted.
Plus the inevitable revisionism that will occur needs to be watched closely.

smurgen

Mortelaro wrote: »

Why do you consistently link to old news reports?
You do that all the time
Do you trawl the internet search engines, going down the list page by page until you find something out dated to moan about?
That one is a fortnight ago
A lot has happened since then
60% of the country's ppe by the way now goes to care home settings

Here's a more recent headline for you, 21 dead in a single nursing home.

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/coronavirus-ireland-21-people-die-18151824

blanch152

McMurphy wrote: »

Obviously the pair of you have very short memories, or else the O'Neil v O'Dowd leadership challenge flew under both your radars.





But on theses points specifically - I may even agree with you had the pair of you not been spouting complete and utter bollocks.

As already mentioned a few times by myself and others (but no one seems to want to grasp the nettle) going back to FGs leadership election, Coveney won more than twice the votes than Leo did, and yet the hierarchy within FG made leo the leader regardless. Going by the bar set here - that vote was either window dressing, predetermined, and an utter waste of time.

O'Dowd however very publicly made a leadership challenge against O'Neill, votes were cast during the ard fheis, and just like the Simon v Leo vote O'Neill got more than double the amount of votes than O'Dowd.

https://twitter.com/molloy1916/status/1197835117231783936?s=19

O'Dowd however didn't get the gig, because he did not win the vote.

Let the backpedalling but but buts commence.

Poorly researched - blindly following the narrative. No point coming back and trying a rebuttal, there is none.

The Soviet Union often had a patsy as well in the election process, as did other "democratic" regimes over the years.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-grassroots-left-in-dark-on-deputy-leadership-challenge-1.4084418

"It has been dubbed the political contest that never was."

I wouldn't be holding up O'Dowd vs O'Neill as any exemplar of any kind of democracy. In fact, it completely backs up my view.

blanch152

christy c wrote: »

What was the issue with the FG leadership election? The process was very clearly laid out before the election where all candidates were aware.

Its weighted to the parliamentary party correctly in my view, with ordinary members having a much smaller say.

It is pretty similar to how many other political parties run their elections.

all about the mane

blanch152 wrote: »

It is pretty similar to how many other political parties run their elections.

Not SF

Mortelaro

smurgen wrote: »

Here's a more recent headline for you, 21 dead in a single nursing home.

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/coronavirus-ireland-21-people-die-18151824

That's actually a district hospital. I'm sure there will be an investigation there as in all hospitals as to how things went
I'd imagine a world wide shortage of PPE contributed
I doubt it was infection control once the disease got in
This crisis is only 60 days old
Moaning about its impact devoid of facts is petty in my opinion

atticu

McMurphy wrote: »

Obviously the pair of you have very short memories, or else the O'Neil v O'Dowd leadership challenge flew under both your radars.





But on theses points specifically - I may even agree with you had the pair of you not been spouting complete and utter bollocks.

As already mentioned a few times by myself and others (but no one seems to want to grasp the nettle) going back to FGs leadership election, Coveney won more than twice the votes than Leo did, and yet the hierarchy within FG made leo the leader regardless. Going by the bar set here - that vote was either window dressing, predetermined, and an utter waste of time.

O'Dowd however very publicly made a leadership challenge against O'Neill, votes were cast during the ard fheis, and just like the Simon v Leo vote O'Neill got more than double the amount of votes than O'Dowd.

https://twitter.com/molloy1916/status/1197835117231783936?s=19

O'Dowd however didn't get the gig, because he did not win the vote.

Let the backpedalling but but buts commence.

Poorly researched - blindly following the narrative. No point coming back and trying a rebuttal, there is none.

Do you expect people to take SF’s word on an internal SF vote?
It was not an open and transparent vote that any independent person could verify.
Do you really think that people are so stupid?




Actually, it seems that you have already answered that.

McMurphy wrote: »

The others, if I typed out what I thought about their intelligence levels here is probably get a ban, so I'm not going to go there.

Numptiness.

Stay classy.

gormdubhgorm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Mary Lou was identified a long way out by SF, simple face is she has a brain and isn't as big of a (insert your own description) as the rest of the "politicians" in the party, What other options would they have? people who shout "up da Ra", the one who robbed off a charity and slags people off on faceboojk, or the one married to a Garda killer. F**k me it is slim pickings in that group

I have no idea if this is true, someone mentioned it to me, Mary Lou was going down the FF route or was in FF, anyway no route to the top so she jumped ship into SF because she seen a quicker and easier route. As I said, a few people said it to me, could be BS

She is a good politician, dragged down by the rest of the party that is in SF

She is not the only one in family to have went down the Republican route - despite the plummy Dublin Rathgar voice.
Her sister Joanne McDonald used to be involved in Eirigi

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

She is not the only one in family to have went down the Republican route - despite the plummy Dublin Rathgar voice.
Her sister Joanne McDonald used to be involved in Eirigi

Didnt she paintball or something to do with paint anyway,mary harney at 1 stage with red paint iirc

Jinglejangle69

Love the irony of SF comrades calling Leo and Eoghan Murphy posh boys.

When Mary Lou and Eoin O Brion(Blackrock College boy) grew up exactly the same.

gormdubhgorm

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Love the irony of SF comrades calling Leo and Eoghan Murphy posh boys.

When Mary Lou and Eoin O Brion(Blackrock College boy) grew up exactly the same.

There is a reason why SF pick them and promote them. They want to move away from the AOS, Dessie Ellis types and make the party respectable.

I just watched Mary Lou on the Late Late. She had the neck to go on about the hypocrisy of FF/FG etc etc in saying that SF are not fit for government.

Yet in the very next question she very awkwardly answered the David Cullinane - 'up the ra' question. She seemed to bluff the answer after going on about FF/FG wanting it both ways in the previous question. And said the 'up the ra' statement is part of republicanism and is said even used outside SF circles (who was never clarified). Although she can understand how it can make some people uncomfortable that are not used to it!

Basically a bluffers answer. And she neither condemned the phrase 'up the ra' nor directly condemned David Cullinane's use of the phrase. A classic SF stance in my view - dancing around the edges. She even said to Tubridy that he would have to ask Cullinane why he said it - despite knowing full well Cullinane's views on it!

Shefwedfan

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

There is a reason why SF pick them and promote them. They want to move away from the AOS, Dessie Ellis types and make the party respectable.

I just watched Mary Lou on the Late Late. She had the neck to go on about the hypocrisy of FF/FG etc etc in saying that SF are not fit for government.

Yet in the very next question she very awkwardly answered the David Cullinane - 'up the ra' question. She seemed to bluff the answer after going on about FF/FG wanting it both ways in the previous question. And said the 'up the ra' statement is part of republicanism and is said even used outside SF circles (who was never clarified). Although she can understand how it can make some people uncomfortable that are not used to it!

Basically a bluffers answer. And she neither condemned the phrase 'up the ra' nor directly condemned David Cullinane's use of the phrase. A classic SF stance in my view - dancing around the edges. She even said to Tubridy that he would have to ask Cullinane why he said it - despite knowing full well Cullinane's views on it!

She made a balls of the David cullinane, she didn’t condemn it and that tells you what she is dealing with in that party

SF will never change

gormdubhgorm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

She made a balls of the David cullinane, she didn’t condemn it and that tells you what she is dealing with in that party

SF will never change

Yeah she could not say time has moved on we need to move away from this phraseology etc etc. As it would have been a slap in the face to the hardline SF supporters and recent 'republican history'. So she had to couch the thing in waffle.

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Yeah she could not say time has moved on we need to move away from this phraseology etc etc. As it would have been a slap in the face to the hardline SF supporters and recent 'republican history'. So she had to couch the thing in waffle.

Aye,gives SF new TDs great cover politically too,as any time they fcuk up,cullinane will be wheeled out to distract and set off outrage culture among those who would never vote SF


The man apoligised,so he cant,nor should he do anymore to appease irrational people,who cant accept that.....