Is it just me or have SF vanished?

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

'BRITS OUT' never referred to anything but the British State and Army.

Sorry, I cannot take anyone seriously who portrays that slogan as anything else.
And please, don't start pointing at individual incidences of ignoramuses and bigots.
It was never, to my knowledge of history, a hatred or dislike of British people or a xenophobic comment..

Not for a lot of SF people it isn't and that is the truth of it. When they say 'Brits Out' they don't just mean the British State or the army. They mean the Prods. As happened in Cork in the ROI.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Not for a lot of SF people it isn't and that is the truth of it. When they say 'Brits Out' they don't just mean the British State or the army. They mean the Prods. As happened in Cork in the ROI.

And there you have the sweeping generalisation.

And also the quick retreat to isolated incidents.

Well demonstrated, not a leg to stand on in that debate. I would imagine it is multiples of decades since anyone gave a damn if you were a 'prod' or anything else tbh, in Cork and elsewhere.

gormdubhgorm

Deleted User wrote: »

Name 1 sinn fein person who it means this for??


Seems to me your pedelling nonsense tbh....quite how you think brian boru is relevant to political discussion is beyond me,

They are not going to say it out loud are they that is the game. But many in the areas SF did well in do not like 'other'.

See Clondalkin (Angus O'Snodnaigh's haunt where he topped the poll)

https://www.newstalk.com/the-pat-kenny-show/i-want-to-know-why-are-you-racist-family-leaves-dublin-home-following-racist-attacks-647487

Why did I mention Brian Boru? Because he is held up as one of the first true Irish Gaels - by the Republican 'Irish race' myth.

Yet Boru also oppressed his fellow 'Irishmen' other Kings of Ireland and overthrew the previous High King. But because it is so long ago it can be spun to fit into the republican narrative. The High King of Ireland the true Gael.

You only have to look at Reada Cronin's comments. There is clearly a them and us in some of those in SF.

https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2020/0219/1116302-cronin-comments/R

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

They are not going to say it out loud are they that is the game. But many in the areas SF did well in do not like 'other'.

See Clondalkin (Angus O'Snodnaigh's haunt where he topped the poll)

https://www.newstalk.com/the-pat-kenny-show/i-want-to-know-why-are-you-racist-family-leaves-dublin-home-following-racist-attacks-647487

Why did I mention Brian Boru? Because he is held up as one of the first true Irish Gaels - by the Republican 'Irish race' myth.

Yet Boru also oppressed his fellow 'Irishmen' other Kings of Ireland and overthrew the previous High King. But because it is so long ago it can be spun to fit into the republican narrative. The High King of Ireland the true Gael.

You only have to look at Reada Cronin's comments. There is clearly a them and us in some of those in SF.

https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2020/0219/1116302-cronin-comments/R

Bizarre.

Are Sinn Fein responsible for ALL racist attacks now or just this one in Clondalkin?

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And there you have the sweeping generalisation.

And also the quick retreat to isolated incidents.

Well demonstrated, not a leg to stand on in that debate. I would imagine it is multiples of decades since anyone gave a damn if you were a 'prod' or anything else tbh, in Cork and elsewhere.

Oh yeah SF is a bastion of professionalism in the political area.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/sinn-fein-councillor-apologises-for-stay-the-f-at-home-email-to-constituent-995190.html

https://news.sky.com/story/paddy-holohan-ex-mma-fighter-suspended-as-sinn-fein-councillor-over-underage-girl-remarks-11911168

It do not attract yahoo's at all!

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Oh yeah SF is a bastion of professionalism in the political area.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/sinn-fein-councillor-apologises-for-stay-the-f-at-home-email-to-constituent-995190.html

https://news.sky.com/story/paddy-holohan-ex-mma-fighter-suspended-as-sinn-fein-councillor-over-underage-girl-remarks-11911168

It do not attract yahoo's at all!

As I tell another poster here, you can play the 'wacky, strange, corrupt, violent Councillor' game with almost every party on the island.

They all have them...we have two FG ones here in the one constituency. Came to national prominence for corruption and violent behavior.

Does it mean, for a second that FG is all like that, or that they endorse that behaviour?
No, it doesn't for a second.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Bizarre.

Are Sinn Fein responsible for ALL racist attacks now or just this one in Clondalkin?

That is thier voter base who they play up to. Remember AOS referred to Shatter as Goebbels?

Then we recently had the O'Riada comments. Also Paddy Hoolahan's comments which which embarrassed SF.

There is definitely a thread there.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/29652064_Why_is_there_no_Radical_Right_Party_in_Ireland

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

As I tell another poster here, you can play the 'wacky, strange, corrupt, violent Councillor' game with almost every party on the island.

They all have them...we have two FG ones here in the one constituency. Came to national prominence for corruption and violent behavior.

Does it mean, for a second that FG is all like that, or that they endorse that behaviour?
No, it doesn't for a second.

SF seem to attract them like moths. And last time I checked AOS and Reada Cronin were TD's. As is Cullinane and Dessie Ellis. How many 'loose cannons' does SF have out of thier 37 TD's?

This is exactly what I mean. How could a sensible voter - vote for these yahoo's?
There is a reason SF target border areas and working class areas in the republic. They'd be the only ones who would vote for them.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

That is thier voter base who they play up to. Remember AOS referred to Shatter as Goebbels?

Then we recently had the O'Riada comments. Also Paddy Hoolahan's comments which which embarrassed SF.

There is definitely a thread there.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/29652064_Why_is_there_no_Radical_Right_Party_in_Ireland

You can do this with all parties. I couldn't be arsed going looking for examples of TD's, Councillors and members of other parties saying the wrong thing. But they most definitely are there.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

There is a reason SF target border areas and working class areas in the republic. They'd be the only ones who would vote for them.

What is the reason?

Is the mask slipping here, like Leo's did in the Dail and on Pat Kenny this AM?

The vast majority of the elected SF members in those areas are from those areas. Are they not allowed to vote for who they want, for who best represents them?
You are dangerously close to coming across as a snob and superior yourself here. Just sayin.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You can do this with all parties. I couldn't be arsed going looking for examples of TD's, Councillors and members of other parties saying the wrong thing. But they most definitely are there.

There is definitely an undercurrent there with SF. Don't mind what it says on the SF website. Many vote SF because they don't want the immigrants coming in and Vadradkar is an Indian Fággot anyway etc.
Ties in with the true Gael guff - freedom and so on.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What is the reason?

Is the mask slipping here, like Leo's did in the Dail and on Pat Kenny this AM?

The vast majority of the elected SF members in those areas are from those areas. Are they not allowed to vote for who they want, for who best represents them?
You are dangerously close to coming across as a snob and superior yourself here. Just sayin.

There is no mask slipping SF cannot get reps in any other areas simple as that.
(ironic you say mask in the context of SF blaclava and the current covid19 by the way)

Most new SF reps have not had much in the way of education they came straight in. Mark Ward and so on. Nor do they speak well or have coherent policy of thier own. That is just the way of it. Maybe Mary Lou and Joanne McDonald fancied a bit of rough from the wrong sides of the tracks. God knows how they ended up in the fold.
But lets put it this way there are certain areas of Ireland who will never have a SF rep. Why? Because the electorate there is educated and can see through populism and so on. They are not looking for someone else to blame.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

There is definitely an undercurrent there with SF. Don't mind what it says on the SF website. Many vote SF because they don't want the immigrants coming in and Vadradkar is an Indian Fággot anyway etc.
Ties in with the true Gael guff - freedom and so on.

So there isn't anything on the website saying this stuff...there isn't a single SF policy in existence that is designed to 'stop immigrants coming in', in fact they spend a lot of time doing the opposite and calling for reform of Direct Provision etc, and one Councillor goes off on an incoherent waffle (did he use that F word to describe Leo?...I don't think he did) and it is an 'undercurrent with SF' and 'many vote for them because they don't want immigrants coming in'?

You don't require a lot of proof do you? You seem to have a bit of a problem with exaggeration actually (e.g The 'F' word)

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

There is no mask slipping SF cannot get reps in any other areas simple as that.
(ironic you say mask in the context of SF blaclava and the current covid19 by the way)

Most new SF reps have not had much in the way of education they came straight in. Mark Ward and so on. Nor do they speak well or have coherent policy of thier own. That is just the way of it. Maybe Mary Lou and Joanne McDonald fancied a bit of rough from the wrong sides of the tracks. God knows how they ended up in the fold.
But lets put it this way there are certain areas of Ireland who will never have a SF rep. Why? Because the electorate there is educated and can see through populism and so on. They are not looking for someone else to blame.

Any self awareness to realise how that makes you sound? Pretty stunning stuff. Take her handy. Going out side for a glass of prosecco in the evening sun and some fresh air.

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

There is definitely an undercurrent there with SF. Don't mind what it says on the SF website. Many vote SF because they don't want the immigrants coming in and Vadradkar is an Indian Fággot anyway etc.
Ties in with the true Gael guff - freedom and so on.

SF are literally an open borders party,

Of all the critisms of them,racism is the least relevant (indeed varadkar mother is from same county myself,hes been a terrible let down,all things said)

McMurphy

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Oh yeah SF is a bastion of professionalism in the political area.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/sinn-fein-councillor-apologises-for-stay-the-f-at-home-email-to-constituent-995190.html

https://news.sky.com/story/paddy-holohan-ex-mma-fighter-suspended-as-sinn-fein-councillor-over-underage-girl-remarks-11911168

It do not attract yahoo's at all!

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

That is thier voter base who they play up to. Remember AOS referred to Shatter as Goebbels?

Then we recently had the O'Riada comments. Also Paddy Hoolahan's comments which which embarrassed SF.

There is definitely a thread there.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/29652064_Why_is_there_no_Radical_Right_Party_in_Ireland

FFS Oliver Flanagan was a raging anti Semite and Ends Kenny got into a spot of bother for a bit of casual racism and using the N word, but it's hardly proof the whole of FG are anti semite racists.


Try harder.

gormdubhgorm

Deleted User wrote: »

So outside your imagination,noone means this nor has said it....whatever medication your on,up the dosage,your losing touch with reality



Republicans reject trappings of monarchy,your really poor at this



To critise isreal is not anti-sematic....thats bush1t and just am excuse used to shut down critism of their carry-on.

So is AOS calling Alan Shatter Goebbels anti-semetic or is it just a bit of craic?

I can see right through SF and the types they attract. Granted the more intelligent in SF know when to play with words in circles mostly. But there is a large cohort in SF who sound just like thier electorate - an undercurrent of anti-immigrant types, pining for the days of the gun and rubbing shíte on the walls.

gormdubhgorm

Deleted User wrote: »

SF are literally an open borders party,

Of all the critisms of them,racism is the least relevant

I do not buy this one iota. Open borders mo thoin! SF are one of the most myopic parties on this island. Tied with the DUP in my view.
Again you only have to look at thier core voter base.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Any self awareness to realise how that makes you sound? Pretty stunning stuff. Take her handy. Going out side for a glass of prosecco in the evening sun and some fresh air.

I don't really care how it makes me sound. I am saying what I see and hear around SF.
Again, the majority of the electorate agree with me.

Shefwedfan

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

There is definitely an undercurrent there with SF. Don't mind what it says on the SF website. Many vote SF because they don't want the immigrants coming in and Vadradkar is an Indian Fággot anyway etc.
Ties in with the true Gael guff - freedom and so on.

Just check out the SF supporters all over facebook if you want a display of this....half the time it is a competition on who can say the most racist or insulting thing in regards to other parties


As usual you will get "ahh sure that is facebook". You would have the exact same on here only people would get banned.

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I do not buy this one iota. Open borders mo thoin! SF are one of the most myopic parties on this island. Tied with the DUP in my view.
Again you only have to look at thier core voter base.

Well like your free to not believe it....but there is zero evidence to support your inane ramblings here (but your free to believe them,and thats ok too)

Sinn Fein is decidedly pro-immigration; it regularly makes its progressive and multicultural views known, and anti-immigration rhetoric has never formed part of the party narrative, even when weighed against its strong adherence to Irish nationalism.

from forgienpolicy.com

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I don't really care how it makes me sound. I am saying what I see and hear around SF.
Again, the majority of the electorate agree with me.

How do you figure the majority agree with you?

FrancieBrady

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Just check out the SF supporters all over facebook if you want a display of this....half the time it is a competition on who can say the most racist or insulting thing in regards to other parties


As usual you will get "ahh sure that is facebook". You would have the exact same on here only people would get banned.

Are you sure you are not just seeing what you want to see?

If you have data showing that it is all coming from SF, can we see it?

TheCitizen

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

So is AOS calling Alan Shatter Goebbels anti-semetic or is it just a bit of craic?

I can see right through SF and the types they attract. Granted the more intelligent in SF know when to play with words in circles mostly. But there is a large cohort in SF who sound just like thier electorate - an undercurrent of anti-immigrant types, pining for the days of the gun and rubbing shíte on the walls.

SF’s voteshare has increased to 25 percent. At the same time FFG’s vote share has shrunk. They’re taking votes off FFG or they are kids of people who used to vote FFG. Your depiction of a significant and growing portion of the electorate is quite frankly disgusting and ironically given your reference to racism and xenophobia you’re using the sort of hate language that racists would use.

As well as that it’s nonsensical. FF were preparing to do a deal with SF after the election but when the results were finalised went against it. FG despite protestations to the contrary would also go into government with SF in certain circumstances at some point in the future.

Your attempt to marginalise SF is stupid and counter productive. People open to voting SF will not be turned off by lunatic assertions like yours in fact they may be encouraged to vote for SF given that you come across as an angry foaming at mouth lunatic. You’re angry because you know that they have a huge opportunity to grow in opposition and become the biggest political party in the country. The language and aggression from you is desperately poor stuff. SF will gain support because of lunatic opinions like yours. Keep it up pal.

Shefwedfan

TheCitizen wrote: »

SF’s voteshare has increased to 25 percent. At the same time FFG’s vote share has shrunk. They’re taking votes off FFG or they are kids of people who used to vote FFG. Your depiction of a significant and growing portion of the electorate is quite frankly disgusting and ironically given your reference to racism and xenophobia you’re using the sort of hate language that racists would use.

As well as that it’s nonsensical. FF were preparing to do a deal with SF after the election but when the results were finalised went against it. FG despite protestations to the contrary would also go into government with SF in certain circumstances at some point in the future.

Your attempt to marginalise SF is stupid and counter productive. People open to voting SF will not be turned off by lunatic assertions like yours in fact they may be encouraged to vote for SF given that you come across as an angry foaming at mouth lunatic. You’re angry because you know that they have a huge opportunity to grow in opposition and become the biggest political party in the country. The language and aggression from you is desperately poor stuff. SF will gain support because of lunatic opinions like yours. Keep it up pal.

It was one election. The 2019 local election, how did they go for SF?


Let's see what happens in another election before we completely write off FF/FG.....

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-needs-to-cop-on-after-electoral-nosedive-mcdonald-1.3910810

As her party reflects on its bruising at the polls, Ms McDonald said she didn’t see it coming and has yet to work out what factors were chiefly to blame.
“Did I imagine we were going to have such a bad day out, such a disappointing result? The answer to that is no,” she said.

It is worth noting she said the exact same thing about the success this time and they didn't see it coming. So which one is it next time? I doubt SF even know



https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2019/0602/1053007-local-elections-2019/

TheCitizen

Shefwedfan wrote: »

It was one election. The 2019 local election, how did they go for SF?


Let's see what happens in another election before we completely write off FF/FG.....

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-needs-to-cop-on-after-electoral-nosedive-mcdonald-1.3910810

As her party reflects on its bruising at the polls, Ms McDonald said she didn’t see it coming and has yet to work out what factors were chiefly to blame.
“Did I imagine we were going to have such a bad day out, such a disappointing result? The answer to that is no,” she said.

It is worth noting she said the exact same thing about the success this time and they didn't see it coming. So which one is it next time? I doubt SF even know



https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2019/0602/1053007-local-elections-2019/

FFG’s overall shrinking in their vote share is not one election or a once off result. It’s a steady decline over several decades.

They used to command around 80 percent of the vote between them. Now they don’t have enough between them to form a government together without support from others. But hey you carry on thinking nothing has changed eh.

FrancieBrady

TheCitizen wrote: »

FFG’s overall shrinking in their vote share is not one election or a once off result. It’s a steady decline over several decades.

They used to command around 80 percent of the vote between them. Now they don’t have enough between them to form a government together without support from others. But hey you carry on thinking nothing has changed eh.

Spot on analysis. 84% was their highest point I think.
C&S first, now a Coalition to cling on. Merger and or obliteration of one of them next as our political systems continue to mature.

Shefwedfan

TheCitizen wrote: »

FFG’s overall shrinking in their vote share is not one election or a once off result. It’s a steady decline over several decades.

They used to command around 80 percent of the vote between them. Now they don’t have enough between them to form a government together without support from others. But hey you carry on thinking nothing has changed eh.

You are saying FF/FG are losing votes to SF. I am just pointing out it was one election for SF....come back after the next one and see how they are doing.

This time last year SF was on it's ass.

The bigger winners in both elections has been the Greens. Don't see them shouting about the demise of FF/FG

James Brown

Shefwedfan wrote: »

If you say so, fact is I asked about what they have done in 30 years and your post mentioned IRA....can’t complain now when people bring IRA into conversation....you do it yourself

Fact is you're writing your own narrative here, explains you lack of quotes.
I've already explained this to you twice.

Now can you name the member of SF involved in the killing of Paul Quinn or are you just blowing smoke?

James Brown

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You can do this with all parties. I couldn't be arsed going looking for examples of TD's, Councillors and members of other parties saying the wrong thing. But they most definitely are there.

Imagine if every FG thread became a discussion on the blueshirts, FG's antisemetic members from back in the day and the Cosgrave heavy gang? Silly pointless, tedious.