Is it just me or have SF vanished?

is_that_so

Iscreamkone wrote: »

I’m not a SF supporter or voter.
But I do find it interesting that all those who said “where will you get the money?” to SFs economic polices didn’t raise an eyebrow to the gargantuan spending by a “right wing government” over the last few weeks.

It is cash we have or have easy access to. The approach is also cautious - i.e. 12 weeks maximum not a full on indefinite tap for everyone in the country. The pre-election promises were estimated at €11-14bn for FF & FG and €18bn+ for SF.

maccored

blanch152 wrote: »

That is all small beer compared with saving the country.

dont be speaking too soon

Runaways

blanch152 wrote: »

That is all small beer compared with saving the country.

The current government haven’t even pretended to be serious about our main crisis prior to this.

They’ve been warned by any amount of multinationals that if housing *and infrastructure isn’t available and rents through the roof there’s no point locating or remaining in Ireland or coming here.

But they’re in the grasp of some other cohort whoever or whatever the vulture funds are. And happily servicing them and not future foreign direct investments.

This is going to haunt not just FG but the entire country no matter what happens with corona.

maccored

jh79 wrote: »

Which is all well and good if they agree to it but if they up and jump ship, what then?

ah right - live in fear of pissing off the big companies ... perfect way to run the country. glad you have it all thought out. :rolleyes:

all about the mane

maccored wrote: »

ah right - live in fear of pissing off the big companies ... perfect way to run the country. glad you have it all thought out. :rolleyes:

It’s a simple economic decision. They are here because they can pay low tax. They will go if they can’t. What will you do with all those unemployed then? The ones who are paying most of the tax to support everyone else.

all about the mane

Iscreamkone wrote: »

I’m not a SF supporter or voter.
But I do find it interesting that all those who said “where will you get the money?” to SFs economic polices didn’t raise an eyebrow to the gargantuan spending by a “right wing government” over the last few weeks.

It’s money they will have to borrow, and pay back. Remember when SF were screaming to burn the bond holders? Well if we did, we wouldn’t be able to borrow now.

jh79

maccored wrote: »

ah right - live in fear of pissing off the big companies ... perfect way to run the country. glad you have it all thought out. :rolleyes:

It's about having the right balance, SF are not the party to do that based on their manifesto.

smurgen

all about the mane wrote: »

What’s your solution to the health service?

This is your reply? Seriously?

Runaways

all about the mane wrote: »

It’s money they will have to borrow, and pay back. Remember when SF were screaming to burn the bond holders? Well if we did, we wouldn’t be able to borrow now.

Always wondered about that.

Say we had burned them.

You really think the EU would have stood by and watched us sink?

I’m not sure they would

Wanderer78

jh79 wrote: »

It's about having the right balance, SF are not the party to do that based on their manifesto.

again, its highly unlikely sf will be in government anytime soon, relax and go for a walk, normal ffg service will resume, it actually already has resumed

all about the mane

smurgen wrote: »

This is your reply? Seriously?

Yes. You are constantly hitching and moaning but never provide any solutions. A bit like your hero Mary Loo

all about the mane

Runaways wrote: »

Always wondered about that.

Say we had burned them.

You really think the EU would have stood by and watched us sink?

I’m not sure they would

Imagine the rates we would be paying?

Runaways

Runaways wrote: »

Always wondered about that.

Say we had burned them.

You really think the EU would have stood by and watched us sink?

I’m not sure they would

What does "sink" mean, in the above context?

It's a very vague term to use for a fairly nuanced issue.

jh79

maccored wrote: »

ah right - live in fear of pissing off the big companies ... perfect way to run the country. glad you have it all thought out. :rolleyes:

I'd rather keep my job then be unemployed because SF need a new bogeyman.

smurgen

Runaways wrote: »

The current government haven’t even pretended to be serious about our main crisis prior to this.

They’ve been warned by any amount of multinationals that if housing *and infrastructure isn’t available and rents through the roof there’s no point locating or remaining in Ireland or coming here.

But they’re in the grasp of some other cohort whoever or whatever the vulture funds are. And happily servicing them and not future foreign direct investments.

This is going to haunt not just FG but the entire country no matter what happens with corona.

We're facing a recession now and FFG have left infrastructure crumbling and many homeless. They couldn't make progress during the good times and now we're being told that more or the same is the solution. Are these people for real?

jh79

Wanderer78 wrote: »

again, its highly unlikely sf will be in government anytime soon, relax and go for a walk, normal ffg service will resume, it actually already has resumed

Hope your right but populist parties are having success all over the world.

Runaways

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What does "sink" mean, in the above context?

It's a very vague term to use for a fairly nuanced issue.

If we had burned the bond holders (who even are they?? A bank outside the banks?) and were unable to borrow.

Would the Eu just let us crash into depression?

all about the mane

smurgen wrote: »

We're facing a recession now and FFG have left infrastructure crumbling and many homeless. They couldn't make progress during the good times and now we're being told that more or the same is the solution. Are these people for real?

What’s your solution?

dasa29

is_that_so wrote: »

It is cash we have or have easy access to. The approach is also cautious - i.e. 12 weeks maximum not a full on indefinite tap for everyone in the country. The pre-election promises were estimated at €11-14bn for FF & FG and €18bn+ for SF.

I would agree with this except that as far as I knew, this was the way things were going regarding pre-election promises after reading them:

€11-14bn for FF & FG over 5 years of government

€18bn+ for SF first year of government

Wanderer78

jh79 wrote: »

Hope your right but populist parties are having success all over the world.

theres a reason for the populist 'successes' globally, both right and left, the main establishment parties are slowly failing/falling, we re going through some sort of complex transition phase. we re lucky in a way that parties such as ffg are holding ground in ireland, and i think it might be showing a level of maturity in us, and maybe stubbornness from these parties, but its also interesting to see them change, slowly accepting ideas and policies that they simply would not have entertained in the past

smurgen

all about the mane wrote: »

Yes. You are constantly hitching and moaning but never provide any solutions. A bit like your hero Mary Loo

If I offered solutions as a lay person you'd ridicule me as an armchair expert.i'd be better off debating a plaster board than a Finnerbot like yourself.

Runaways

Runaways wrote: »

If we had burned the bond holders (who even are they?? A bank outside the banks?) and were unable to borrow.

Would the Eu just let us crash into depression?

Firstly, it's important to note most of the borrowings were to keep the state functioning (circa 65% iirc), so that means money to pay wages of nurses, teachers, doctors, Gardaí etc.

Had we burned the bond-holders, and let our banking system collapse we would have wiped out the savings and pensions of a huge amount of Irish people (as well as Europeans etc). At the time only savings to 25k were guaranteed, iirc. That is a lot of money, sure, but imagine working your entire life to lose anything you have saved above that?

We would also have ensured no multi-national would ever trust Irish banks again, which would have massive downstream affects for when the recovery (if it had ever happened), happened. You think Dell would keep money in Irish banks when the banks can disappear over night? Dell and Regeneron, to give two examples, employ 10,000's in the Midwest of Ireland either directly or indirectly. You take them away you aren't just losing the jobs they directly create, you are taking away the indirect jobs (pubs, restaurants, shops etc) their wages support.

It is arguable we should have left Anglo and INBS collapse, sure. But we know this with hindsight. We were rightly worried about contagion at the time. As it is, a certain amount of the loan books of both institutions were eventually profitable for the State.

Using the phrase "burn the bondholders" is meaningless imo. It's not nuanced enough for an extremely complex situation.

all about the mane

smurgen wrote: »

If I offered solutions as a lay person you'd ridicule me as an armchair expert.i'd be better off debating a plaster board than a Finnerbot like yourself.

So you haven’t a clue how to fix it. There’s a surprise. No wonder you have a hardon for Mary loo.
You just keep in bitching and moaning

smurgen

all about the mane wrote: »

So you haven’t a clue how to fix it. There’s a surprise. No wonder you have a hardon for Mary loo.
You just keep in bitching and moaning

You're the most negative person on boards. Anything that isn't the status quo is torn apart or dismissed.i don't owe suggestions to idealist driven fanatics like yourself.

Auguste Comte

Auguste Comte wrote: »

Wasted by FFG mismanagement, leaving us facing into this crisis with the worst health care service in Europe.

Have you been to the UK? While no longer part of the Eurozone, their healthcare system is far worse than ours. The ones with better systems also have higher taxes.

smurgen

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Have you been to the UK? While no longer part of the Eurozone, their healthcare system is far worse than ours. The ones with better systems also have higher taxes.

Do they have a higher health spend?

all about the mane

smurgen wrote: »

You're the most negative person on boards. Anything that isn't the status quo is torn apart or dismissed.i don't owe suggestions to idealist driven fanatics like yourself.

Negative person? You are the one bitching and moaning. I’m the one saying what a positive position we are in.. .

Jinglejangle69

I find the comments that our health service is the worst in the EU disrespectful.

We actually have a fabulous health service were patients get the best treatment that would match anyone in the world.

The trolley crisis we have been hearing about for years has shown to be a myth.

11 people waiting yesterday.

Lowest ever.

Shows that muppets drunks and wasters have been clogging it up all this time.

The exact sentiment I feel about the " homeless" crisis.

Wasters spongers and dregs of society.

Auguste Comte

all about the mane wrote: »

So you haven’t a clue how to fix it.

The one thing we can be absolutely sure of, is that FG definitely haven't a clue how to fix it.

all about the mane

Auguste Comte wrote: »

The one thing we can be absolutely sure of, is that FG definitely haven't a clue how to fix it.

They are fixing it. Try to keep up