Is it just me or have SF vanished?

blackwhite

And here’s some SF election material from 1989 - 2 years prior to Maastricht

Definitely not opposed to membership of the EEC then


https://irishelectionliterature.com/2011/02/27/eec-means-jobs-out-imports-in-kevin-dunphy-sinn-fein-1989-european-elections-leinster/



I’m sure the mental gymnastics to spin this one will be entertaining



Or maybe this one from 1989

https://irishelectionliterature.com/2009/12/14/anne-speed-sinn-fein-1989-european-elections-dublin/

“Please transfer your preferences to other anti-EC candidates”

paul71

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Before making the blanket statement above and looking, trite and silly, why not properly research?

Here's a start point.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/07907180903274834?scroll=top&needAccess=true&journalCode=fips20

Research? When talking to the SF trollfarm?

Oh the irony. Have you got over the spinal injuries from the water charge backflip yet?

FrancieBrady

blackwhite wrote: »

And here’s some SF election material from 1989 - 2 years prior to Maastricht

Definitely not opposed to membership of the EEC then


https://irishelectionliterature.com/2011/02/27/eec-means-jobs-out-imports-in-kevin-dunphy-sinn-fein-1989-european-elections-leinster/



I’m sure the mental gymnastics to spin this one will be entertaining



Or maybe this one from 1989

https://irishelectionliterature.com/2009/12/14/anne-speed-sinn-fein-1989-european-elections-dublin/

“Please transfer your preferences to other anti-EC candidates”

Seriously?

'Evolved'...do I need to explain what that word means?

FrancieBrady

paul71 wrote: »

Research? When talking to the SF trollfarm?

Oh the irony. Have you got over the spinal injuries from the water charge backflip yet?

Predictable reaction.

Somebody was preaching about 'truth' earlier. Seems you don't want any of it to cross your desk. Fair enough.

blackwhite

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Seriously?

'Evolved'...do I need to explain what that word means?

Point me to where I said they haven’t evolved. More strawmanning and lies :rolleyes: Sure just keep spinning Francie - all you can do when you’d been beating a false drum I guess

The SF cheerleaders are the ones who’ve peddled the lies that SF never opposed membership of the EEC or of the EU. Proven revisionists anyone who makes claims like that

FrancieBrady

blackwhite wrote: »

Point me to where I said they haven’t evolved. More strawmanning and lies :rolleyes: Sure just keep spinning Francie - all you can do when you’d been beating a false drum I guess

The SF cheerleaders are the ones who’ve peddled the lies that SF never opposed membership of the EEC or of the EU. Proven revisionists anyone who makes claims like that

Point me to where I said 'never'.

Maastricht was not about being in or out of the European project. Masstricht was about developing ever closer union and other developments.

Voting against it did not mean you wanted to leave the European project and it would not have ended the project if it had failed. Denmark rejected the treaty, they got reassurances and guarantees and voted and then ratified it.
In other words they rejected the version of the EU presented to them but once it was modified they accepted it.

It isn't a fair thing to say that 'Denmark opposed joining the EU' therefore.

Of course if you wanted to present Denmark in a certain light you could say they were opposed to the EU, fullstop.

paul71

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Predictable reaction.

Somebody was preaching about 'truth' earlier. Seems you don't want any of it to cross your desk. Fair enough.

Yes it is predictable. I dont read SF propaganda, for the same reason I don't read anti-vax research, Flat Earth Theory, Climate change denial or Creationalism.

blackwhite

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Point me to where I said 'never'.

Maastricht was not about being in or out of the European project. Masstricht was about developing ever closer union and other developments.

Voting against it did not mean you wanted to leave the European project and it would not have ended the project if it had failed. Denmark rejected the treaty, they got reassurances and guarantees and voted and then ratified it.
In other words they rejected the version of the EU presented to them but once it was modified they accepted it.

It isn't a fair thing to say that 'Denmark opposed joining the EU' therefore.

Of course if you wanted to present Denmark in a certain light you could say they were opposed to the EU, fullstop.

Keep strawmanning Francie - anything at all to distract from the lies your fellow travellers have been peddling (and you saw fit to wade in to try and defend).

SF were opposed to Irish membership of the EEC, and to both the establishment of and Irish membership of the EEC’s successor organisation, the EU. It was only after seeing that their anti-EEC/EU platform was deeply unpopular that they changed tack in the mid-90s.

But keep up the revisionism - it’s clear to everyone what the revisionist propaganda narrative that Parnell Sq wants pushed is - mission accomplished :pac:

FrancieBrady

paul71 wrote: »

Yes it is predictable. I dont read SF propaganda, for the same reason I don't read anti-vax research, Flat Earth Theory, Climate change denial or Creationalism.

I'm sure DCU would be very interested to learn they are employing a SF propagandist.

More triteness and silliness in the face of being presented with nuance and actual factual history.

FrancieBrady

blackwhite wrote: »

Keep strawmanning Francie - anything at all to distract from the lies your fellow travellers have been peddling (and you saw fit to wade in to try and defend).

SF were opposed to Irish membership of the EEC, and to both the establishment of and Irish membership of the EEC’s successor organisation, the EU. It was only after seeing that their anti-EEC/EU platform was deeply unpopular that they changed tack in the mid-90s.

But keep up the revisionism - it’s clear to everyone what the revisionist propaganda narrative that Parnell Sq wants pushed is - mission accomplished :pac:

I never disagreed with you on them being originally opposed. No matter how much you want to lump all opinion on here together ('fellow travellers')

I said their position on it evolved to what it is today.

I also said, I lived through the Maastricht campaign as an adult and I have no memory of it being an 'in/out' of the European project referendum.

I have also demonstrated by way of the 'Denmark' example that opposing the terms and clauses of the treaty did not necessarily mean you opposed the whole project.

Blanket claims are no help to understanding something.

piplip87

I have been looking into SF relationship with the EU. While they have been opposed to every EU treaty they would be pro EU and have been for a while. They are in favour of the EU in theory but are opposed to many aspects of it in its current form.

What we have seen from them over the Apple Tax situation is them wanting to have Their cake and eating it. The treaties and principles that the EU based their case on are the very same principles that SF disagree with. As Gerry himself put it:

"We didn't fight the British for 500 years to be ruled by the EU. "

Yet at the first chance to divide Irish Society over the Apple Tax they had no problem been ruled by the EU.

The 100% pro EU parties all seen this forn what it was. A power grab by Brussels and an attack on Irish Sovereignty. They fought it.

The parties who have lambasted the EU all seen it as an opportunity to write new slogans about turning down 13BN and doing doing what they do best try to divide and cause uproar.

It goes to show that SF are not fit to govern. They will gladly bend over and the let the EU take what they want.

Now before any of the resident Shinnerbots chime in about the 2008 bailout. It's worth remembering that because we didn't burn the bondholders, that we can now get credit at very low interest rates to get us through the current unrest.

FF made a balls of the country in the leadup to the bailout and FG could have done things better in implimenting cuts yet if SF got their way we would have burnt the bondholders, gave everybody a house 300 quid a week for the dole lifers and drove anybody with investment away. We would certainly be going cap in hand to the IMF again

As Gerry himself put it:

"We didn't fight the British for 500 years to be ruled by the EU.

When did he say this??

Seems like,from there on in yous post is a figment of your imagination and the ravings of an unwell person,whos imagination has took over

Truthvader

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When did he say this??

Seems like,from there on in yous post is a figment of your imagination and the ravings of an unwell person,whos imagination has took over

https://www.google.ie/amp/www.thejournal.ie/farage-adams-brexit-3119379-Dec2016/%3famp=1

Truthvader

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Well if nigel farage said it....it must be true**
:rolleyes:



**sarcasm

Hey its late I' m tired

Adam9213

paul71 wrote: »

Yes it is predictable. I dont read SF propaganda, for the same reason I don't read anti-vax research, Flat Earth Theory, Climate change denial or Creationalism.

But you watch a lot of other propaganda even if you're too dumb to realise what you're watching is propaganda.

timthumbni

Adam9213 wrote: »

But you watch a lot of other propaganda even if you're too dumb to realise what you're watching is propaganda.

Is it possible that SF are responsible and actively take part in the dreaded Propaganda you refer to? Look at the Adams craic.... disgraceful...

Adam9213

timthumbni wrote: »

Is it possible that SF are responsible and actively take part in the dreaded Propaganda you refer to? Look at the Adams craic.... disgraceful...

I'm talking in general not about Irish politics.

And anyways most of the things considered SF/IRA propaganda about the Brits during the troubles are now seen to be a lot more reputable these days, SF were spreading "propaganda" about high level collusion way before all the documentaries, news reports and first hand accounts we've heard about in the last ten years.

They were also spreading numerous "conspiracy theories" like the "MRF" (look them up) a secret British army unit exclusive to NI of about 40 strong made up of some members from special forces like the SAS that they were out carrying out false flag terrorism, assassinating IRA members and ordinary civilians while in the media the killings were being blamed on loyalists, they were also claiming they were using weapons exclusive to the IRA so killings were blamed on the IRA.

All of the above has been proven and released in the media 40 years later but they were also claiming back then that the MRF were carrying out false flag bombings and blaming them on the IRA or loyalists to start a sectarian war and draw the IRA from its war against the state, although there is some evidence to this nothing about that is factual like the paragraph above, it's all a conspiracy theory or propaganda until the evidence is so clear the BBC report it 40 years later when it's no longer relevant, only then will people believe it.

timthumbni

Adam9213 wrote: »

I'm talking in general not about Irish politics.

And anyways most of the things considered SF/IRA propaganda about the Brits during the troubles are now seen to be a lot more reputable these days, SF were spreading "propaganda" about high level collusion way before all the documentaries, news reports and first hand accounts we've heard about in the last ten years.

weapons exclusive to the IRA to xarr

Whats “xarr”?

Adam9213

timthumbni wrote: »

Whats “xarr”?

I hit the post reply button by accident before I finished.

timthumbni

I will tell you who in SF hasn’t vanished. That MEP Martina from Londonderry.

She is like some demented irish republican Spitting Image puppet brought to life. Constantly making a holy show of herself on camera. Like a female version of McIlduff I’m surprised she hasn’t been put out to pasture.

blanch152

timthumbni wrote: »

I will tell you who in SF hasn’t vanished. That MEP Martina from Londonderry.

She is like some demented irish republican Spitting Image puppet brought to life. Constantly making a holy show of herself on camera. Like a female version of McIlduff I’m surprised she hasn’t been put out to pasture.

McElduff hasn’t been put out to pasture, he is still a councillor for SF.

They don’t mind having sectarian, racist, misogynist bigots in their ranks like him and Houlihan. It reflects their support.

timthumbni

blanch152 wrote: »

McElduff hasn’t been put out to pasture, he is still a councillor for SF.

They don’t mind having sectarian, racist, misogynist bigots in their ranks like him and Houlihan. It reflects their support.

2 things In particular I remember about McIlduff. First was him on yapping about some silly GAA themed burger not being available in McDonalds in NI. It was funny to listen to as it was like something out of Brass Eye but showed him up big style.

The second was him on some show about England Footie team during some World Cup. He was on with some unionist and again it was embarrassing cringeworthy stuff. (Edit - in fairness I have to add the unionist was a complete tool as well)

But then after his loaf of bread nonsense it’s hardly surprising. Him, or that Londonderry MEP are unlikely to be winning many hearts and minds of unionists. Chalky ar la indeed...

paul71

Adam9213 wrote: »

But you watch a lot of other propaganda even if you're too dumb to realise what you're watching is propaganda.

I will ignore the childish insult but note that you admit to the propaganda.

Adam9213

paul71 wrote: »

I will ignore the childish insult but note that you admit to the propaganda.

What side in any conflict doesn't partake in propaganda, most of their obvious propaganda also had to do with getting people on board with the peace process.

Also a lot of the things called propaganda back then is now known to be true.

dundalkfc10

Hope all the same people who gave out about no social distancing at a funeral in Belfast will be equally enraged at the scenes at Walkinstown Roundabout.


Mod: Breach of threadban = 1 week forum ban.

blanch152

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Hope all the same people who gave out about no social distancing at a funeral in Belfast will be equally enraged at the scenes at Walkinstown Roundabout.

More idiots, but that's what happens when politicians like Mary-Lou show complete disregard for the rules. It was only a matter of time before it happened. Sure, if Mary-Lou can celebrate the death of a criminal thug, us lads can celebrate Jack Charlton.

Such is the price of bad leadership.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

More idiots, but that's what happens when politicians like Mary-Lou show complete disregard for the rules. It was only a matter of time before it happened. Sure, if Mary-Lou can celebrate the death of a criminal thug, us lads can celebrate Jack Charlton.

Such is the price of bad leadership.

Nobody was breaching rules until SF did.
How typically misrepresentative that is.
Right from plane loads of rugby fans were let in to the country there have been issues.

Can't be dealt with without somehow blaming the boogeymen/women under the bed though.

Truthvader

Cant stand SF but to be blaming them for idiots in Walkinstown just distracts from the real critism they deserve

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nobody was breaching rules until SF did.
How typically misrepresentative that is.
Right from plane loads of rugby fans were let in to the country there have been issues.

Can't be dealt with without somehow blaming the boogeymen/women under the bed though.

Truthvader wrote: »

Cant stand SF but to be blaming them for idiots in Walkinstown just distracts from the real critism they deserve

Never said that nobody was breaching rules until SF did, that is another made-up twist of my post.

In relation to the idiots in Walkinstown, they are complete idiots, no more, no less than anyone who went to Bobby Storey's funeral. All of them are in the same boat, the poster I quoted was implying that somehow we wouldn't class them all the same.

The difference is that Michelle O'Neill and Mary-Lou are supposed to be leaders, not mere idiots. If we can all agree on the two women being no better than idiots in Walkinstown, then we are making progress.

RandomViewer

Bizarre carry on in Belfast, rats and flies everywhere from illegal dump

https://www.irishnews.com/news/2020/07/21/news/work-to-begin-on-clearing-waste-mountain-in-north-belfast-2011391/