Supporting craft breweries

Macy0161

dominatinMC wrote: »

Crew Brewery is probably the micro you are thinking of?

Yes!

Twee.

flended12 wrote: »

Its remarkable the amount of towns ive been in that have brewerys on their doorstep and dont want to know about supporting local business.

They simply don't care. Sales reps won't change their minds, customers need to go in and ask for their local brew or spirit by name. I asked if there was any Irish craft beer in a bar in Dublin last summer and was told no, but I should try a lovely Italian craft beer they have instead - Lagunitas :pac: When paying at the bar I saw they had Rascals in the fridge :rolleyes: It's a whole thing and I could talk about it all day!

Black Sheep

Twee. wrote: »

I asked if there was any Irish craft beer in a bar in Dublin last summer and was told no, but I should try a lovely Italian craft beer they have instead - Lagunitas :pac: When paying at the bar I saw they had Rascals in the fridge :rolleyes: It's a whole thing and I could talk about it all day!

This drives me bananas. I asked the head barman of a pub last week if he had any craft beer. He threw his eyes to heaven, said he didn't know, ask someone else etc.

I actually can't even understand this attitude from a part time worker - I think all servers should know what they have to serve, however junior they are - but from a senior lad, well, it's mad but it's been like that for years and probably will never change. :pac:

Pen Rua

I used to work in a hotel during college, and only can wish to have been more knowledge about (craft) Irish beer, and to be into it as much as I am now.

Galway Hooker was about the most crafty we got.

BeerNut

The Porterhouse in Temple Bar used to be the starkest example of this: a huge range of beers, lots of rotation, clueless and indifferent staff. I mentioned it to the owner once and he threw up his hands and said it's literally impossible to train bar staff in this stuff becuase they turn over so rapidly. And yet up the street there was The Bull & Castle where the staff changed as often as anywhere else, but they knew their stuff and mostly actually cared. Galway Bay seem to have got this pretty much right over the years too. It really shouldn't be just the nerd-bars though.

Basq

Don't even ask for craft beer most places.. I ask for an IPA or Pale Ale and see what they suggest.

If in the North-West, you're more likely to get a Limeburner or Rustbucket at the very least.

Macy0161

Twee. wrote: »

and was told no, but I should try a lovely Italian craft beer they have instead - Lagunitas

Makes a change from being offered HH13 as "craft"

Pen Rua

At different points in time, our wine supplier and spirits supplier did tasting sessions with us to prep us to sell the products.

No such training from any beer distributors.

Heck, even if hotel management took an evening to feed us pints of the stuff to get us to sell it...!

Nowadays I'd have no problem selling a pint of Galway Hooker to tourists. Back then I didn't know the beer, brand, story or even what it tasted like!

Macy0161

I'm not too bothered by a lack of range, but places should have at least one of the local brewery imo. I was at a conference in the Galmont pre-covid, and at least had bottles of Galway Hooker Pale Ale.

Ironically enough, around here it's the tourists looking for the local beer that seems to be the driver, rather than supporting another local business/ giving people the option. Tourist pubs have them, locals pubs just the usual line up.

Shaka Hislop

In Tralee if you ask for a craft beer you're given Hophouse13....I actually wish I was joking

irish_goat

BeerNut wrote: »

The Porterhouse in Temple Bar used to be the starkest example of this: a huge range of beers, lots of rotation, clueless and indifferent staff. I mentioned it to the owner once and he threw up his hands and said it's literally impossible to train bar staff in this stuff because they turn over so rapidly. And yet up the street there was The Bull & Castle where the staff changed as often as anywhere else, but they knew their stuff and mostly actually cared. Galway Bay seem to have got this pretty much right over the years too. It really shouldn't be just the nerd-bars though.

It really doesn't take much to train staff. All we did was make sure staff always got a taste of a beer as soon as it was kegged up, and if they weren't beer drinkers, gave them a few keywords they could at least say about the beer if asked.

Mimon

Shaka Hislop wrote: »

In Tralee if you ask for a craft beer you're given Hophouse13....I actually wish I was joking

Guinness hoodwinking people has worked to some extent then

Zaph

I stayed in a hotel a few years ago where they had about 6 or 7 craft beers on their drinks menu. The only problem was that you couldn't tell what they actually were, because in each case all that was listed was the name of the brewery, as if that was the name of the beer. And once I'd figured out what exactly they had, ordering was an ordeal as the staff hadn't a clue what I was asking for. This is a hotel that makes a big deal about how good their service is, and considering the ridiculously exorbitant prices they were charging for the beers I would have thought they'd have been trying to sell as much of it as they could.

TaurenDruid

Ivefoundgod wrote: »

As a local, Tullys is by far the best in terms of craft beers and almost always has at least 2/3 local beers (Ballykilcavan and 12 Acres usually) as well as 5 or 6 others, change it up regularly as well and they do growlers which is great. They don't seem to support O' Haras much anymore which is fair enough I think. Dinn Ri actually has an ok selection of craft now as well though typically only 2/3 taps and usually O' Haras and 12 acres though I have seen other brands like Lagunitas there as well.

Lagunitas is Heineken-owned, though. Decent beer, at least, last time I had it, unlike that "Cute Hoor" ****e.

Black Sheep

To me the lack of staff knowledge comes down to culture and supervision. It's actually not a big ask for people to know what their bill of fare is, whether it's drinks or food or whatever else. But in bars where there's an indifference - even on the part of permanent staff - to being able to tell you what's on tap, what cans are in the fridge and so on, in my view it can only be because there's a prevailing culture where that's accepted by supervisors.

It's not a senior management issue, it's something that first line supervisors can tackle, and it doesn't have to be a big deal. But in the bar I mentioned above there can be no surprise that staff don't know what drinks they can sell you if even the head barman affects that he doesn't know himself, and it's an imposition to actually ask the question But if you have the right supervisor and the right expectations are set in early course, and there's a big of gentle course correction as required, it's obviously do-able.

I think a lot of it has to do with how old school barmen in Ireland sometimes see their job. The head barman I mentioned probably keeps a meticulous till, a clean bar and knows all of his regulars by name. He's just not willing to stretch any further, even if it's not actually going to require much extra work, for something he probably thinks is 'wanky', and no one has told him he must.

The other weekend, in a different place in Dublin, I asked if there was a craft beer on tap and was told they had something called "Kippure" on tap. The server was very nice but couldn't tell me any more. I was under some pressure because I was in a group and of course I was at risk of being "that guy" so I said I would try it. Out it comes, and it's

Cute Hoor

... LOL

TaurenDruid

BeerNut wrote: »

The Porterhouse in Temple Bar used to be the starkest example of this: a huge range of beers, lots of rotation, clueless and indifferent staff. I mentioned it to the owner once and he threw up his hands and said it's literally impossible to train bar staff in this stuff becuase they turn over so rapidly. And yet up the street there was The Bull & Castle where the staff changed as often as anywhere else, but they knew their stuff and mostly actually cared. Galway Bay seem to have got this pretty much right over the years too. It really shouldn't be just the nerd-bars though.

Galway Bay staff can go too far the other way, though. I've been in Alfies with work colleagues, one wanted "a lager, just a lager, none of that weird stuff" The barman kept trying to get her to try various hoppy/hazy/flavoured ales, each of which caused her to make a worse face. I drew the line when he tried to give her a sour beer, and told him to just give her a Fischers Pils. He was never going to make a convert there, and it should have been obvious!

But yeah, staff should absolutely know their stock. Was meeting someone in the pub on the corner of Leeson St and the Green a couple of years ago; they went to the bar, got me a "pint of IPA" that turned out to be HH13; I went to get the next round in and they had White Hag Little Fawn on tap :rolleyes:

TaurenDruid

Black Sheep wrote: »

Out it comes, and it's

Cute Hoor

... LOL

Commiserations!

Black Sheep

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Commiserations!

It came in a cool pint glass and all, that used to mean something, damn it...

BeerNut

TaurenDruid wrote: »

I drew the line when he tried to give her a sour beer, and told him to just give her a Fischers Pils.

It's a Helles, not a Pils.
/runs away very fast

TaurenDruid

BeerNut wrote: »

It's a Helles, not a Pils.
/runs away very fast

I sit corrected! (On my barstool!)

youcancallmeal

A friend owns a pub in East Cork. He says the likes of Diageo will offer discounts and free barrels if they keep independent stuff out. My friend is happy to forgo the discounts to sell craft stuff as he likes it himself but the problem is the craft stuff sells very little. The tourist trade almost always just want Guinness and Irish whisky.

Hotblack Desiato

youcancallmeal wrote: »

He says the likes of Diageo will offer discounts and free barrels if they keep independent stuff out.

How is that not illegal?

youcancallmeal

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

How is that not illegal?

I'd imagine it's not but these kind of agreements between bar owners and the reps will be 'under the table' so to speak

BeerNut

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

How is that not illegal?

Weak laws. Diageo isn't the problem here, it's the "likes of" crew.

The law forbids the absue of a dominant market position, but that position is seen as held by Diageo alone as the company which sells the most beer. That gives Heineken, C&C and Molson Coors carte blanche to offer freebies and muscle out the independents to their hearts' content.

A few years ago, Heineken's behaviour was reported to the Competition & Consumer Protection Commission whose job it is to police these things. Their conclusion was that Heineken Ireland was definitely engaged in anti-competitive practices but wasn't doing anything illegal so there was nothing they could do. Case closed.

There's absolutely zero political will to tackle this and even the victims are unwilling to support radical legislative intervention in the market in case it backfires on them.

All you can do is drink the beer from the breweries you like and stop drinking the beer from the ones you don't. If you think that what the multinationals are doing is wrong, every pint and can of theirs that you buy is endorsing their behaviour. The only thing with any chance of changing the shape of the beer market in Ireland is consumer preference.

youcancallmeal

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

I just got my hands on a White Hag Supersplit from my local offie, the rep had left a couple of samples in unstickered cans, its fair tasty but one really is enough

Yeah this would be my conclusion as well, does taste exactly like a super split but incredibly sweet which quickly turns sickly if take too long drinking it.

L1011

BeerNut wrote: »

Weak laws. Diageo isn't the problem here, it's the "likes of" crew.

The law forbids the absue of a dominant market position, but that position is seen as held by Diageo alone as the company which sells the most beer. That gives Heineken, C&C and Molson Coors carte blanche to offer freebies and muscle out the independents to their hearts' content.

A few years ago, Heineken's behaviour was reported to the Competition & Consumer Protection Commission whose job it is to police these things. Their conclusion was that Heineken Ireland was definitely engaged in anti-competitive practices but wasn't doing anything illegal so there was nothing they could do. Case closed.

There's absolutely zero political will to tackle this and even the victims are unwilling to support radical legislative intervention in the market in case it backfires on them.

All you can do is drink the beer from the breweries you like and stop drinking the beer from the ones you don't. If you think that what the multinationals are doing is wrong, every pint and can of theirs that you buy is endorsing their behaviour. The only thing with any chance of changing the shape of the beer market in Ireland is consumer preference.

The reports of the many times predecessor of the CCPC has the same findings going back to the 70s. Anticompetitive but not illegal sales practices were the norm for the then big 3

Twee.

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

How is that not illegal?

My experience on this side of it is more with spirits, but you wouldn't believe the **** that goes on! Even things like drinks groups or distributors contributing to the cost of production/printing of cocktail menus to guarantee X number of placements for their portfolios in cocktails. If you're in a good cocktail you're guaranteed volume.

youcancallmeal

Has anyone tried the 4 new Trouble Brewing Lucky beers? I believe the idea is they all have the same hops and malt but with different yeast, seems interesting. I have them in fridge and going to try them tonight

Update: Fruitbowl was the winner, tropical and stonefruit flavours shining through with a slight bitterness. Sanders and Saturn were nice too but fairly similar. New England was fine but vanilla dominating. All in all a more interesting experiment compared to when breweries do a variety of single hop beers.

Pen Rua

I know the price of UK beers has come up in the not so distant past of this thread.

Craft Central are carrying 440ml cans of Cloudwater beers for €2.75 - €3.50 which seem exceedingly reasonable.

Passenger

Pen Rua wrote: »

I know the price of UK beers has come up in the not so distant past of this thread.

Craft Central are carrying 440ml cans of Cloudwater beers for €2.75 - €3.50 which seem exceedingly reasonable.

Those Cloudwater beers are brewed by BrewDog though which might explain their 'reasonable' prices.