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We're kinda communist now...right?

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2

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    #32
    growleaves
    Registered Users Posts: 7,857 ✭✭✭growleaves


    Yep, just a cover up for the stealth introduction of communism. I heard we're getting microchipped next.

    Yeah but if microchipping was a real thing how many people would say 'Whats the use in being un-microchipped if you're in a wooden box and your family and friends are in the ICU?' etc.

    In the last two weeks we've learned that fear of death is a blank cheque for whatever. People will ridicule 'conspiracy theorists' in one breath and call for martial in the law in the next.


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    #33
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    The people who hold the view that this is just to oppress us, what alternative do they suggest to curb the spread of a virus as contagious and potentially dangerous as this one? Because there ain't a vaccination or drug treatment. And people are gleefully risking the spread.

    And do they really think it's just to oppress us as opposed to stemming the spread of a virus so that the horror in Italy doesn't become a reality here?

    Who's looking for martial law and microchipping?


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    #34
    Dr. Colossus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 98 ✭✭Dr. Colossus


    It's not communism.It's social democracy and the mixed economy responding to an unprecedented crisis.


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    #35
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 16,202 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Limpy wrote: »
    If venuzuala wasn't sanctioned from east to west I would imagine they would have a better country.

    Other countries get sanctioned but their citizens aren't starving and shooting each other.
    Gross mismanagement and over dependence on oil more like.


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    #36
    Limpy
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    landofthetree wrote: »
    So they need access to the globalised world? :eek:

    Doesnt sound very commie to me,

    Even commies traded. They have vast amounts of oil they could trade for commodities they need.


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    #37
    growleaves
    Registered Users Posts: 7,857 ✭✭✭growleaves


    The people who hold the view that this is just to oppress us, what alternative do they suggest to curb the spread of a virus as contagious and potentially dangerous as this one? Because there ain't a vaccination or drug treatment

    And do they really think it's just to oppress us as opposed to stemming the spread of a virus so that the horror in Italy doesn't become a reality here?

    Ah here I'm not getting into a big back and forth.


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    #38
    mrsdewinter
    Registered Users Posts: 2,142 ✭✭✭mrsdewinter


    johnnyskeleton wrote: »
    No.....but......

    Imagine you'd been working all your life and contributing to private health care just in case you ever needed it. The money you pay to private health insurers is used to pay for private procedures which is what primarily funds these private hospitals. This is on top of the already heavy taxes you pay but you think it is worth making those sacrifices. You forgo foreign holidays, work extra shifts, don't upgrade your car etc to pay for it (it ain't cheap) but you think its worth it because it'll always be there when you need it.

    Well, over the next few weeks you might need it. Whether for Covid or for some other procedure or treatment. And guess what....you're all out of luck pal. Some feckless and irresponsible schmoe has taken your place courtesy of the HSE. He went to cheltenham instead of paying for the VHI and gambled away all his money. He also caught covid-19 and then passed it on to you when he coughed in your face for a coronavirus challenge.

    Imagine you did get Coronavirus, but like in Italy you were triaged to be too old to get a respirator. So you die. Your children are told by the private health insurer that had they had control of their hospital, they might have been able to save you, but it's too late now. Are private health insurers even suspending premiums as they aren't really offering much in return (this would be a token gesture at best, but still).

    Now, imagine you are your children. Would you pay private health insurance knowing that, when you need it, it will be temporarily socialised?

    So in an ideal world, we wouldn't have a two tier health system and it would be ready for any emergency. But we don't live in such a world, we live in an awful awful world with a self destructive desire to be seen to be socialists and private health insurance has shown itself to be basically an extra voluntary tax with no benefits to you.

    LOL!

    The private hospitals were NEVER going to admit your covid-racked body.

    Was it Stillorgan that put up a huge sign outside its gate 2 weeks ago telling visitors with suspected coronavirus to stay away??


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    #39
    Leg End Reject
    Registered Users Posts: 16,987 ✭✭✭✭Leg End Reject


    Raconteuse wrote: »
    The people who hold the view that this is just to oppress us, what alternative do they suggest to curb the spread of a virus as contagious and potentially dangerous as this one? Because there ain't a vaccination or drug treatment. And people are gleefully risking the spread.

    And do they really think it's just to oppress us as opposed to stemming the spread of a virus so that the horror in Italy doesn't become a reality here?

    Who's looking for martial law and microchipping?

    I was sarcastic when I mentioned microchipping.

    What's happening now is necessary, hopefully the naysayers will start to take note instead of wailing about being oppressed.
    https://forumofgames.com/index.php




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    #40
    growleaves
    Registered Users Posts: 7,857 ✭✭✭growleaves


    Who's looking for martial law and microchipping?

    No one is looking for microchipping (so far as I know).

    Some people are looking for a military-enforced lockdown (technically not martial law actually, but a military suspension of ordinary life) and the government has refused - Leo said he wouldn't give in to "populist pressure".


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    #41
    tabby aspreme
    Registered Users Posts: 3,942 ✭✭✭tabby aspreme


    Money trees are a thing after all


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    #42
    landofthetree
    Registered Users Posts: 2,344 ✭✭✭landofthetree


    tabby aspreme wrote: »
    Money trees are a thing after all

    It has to be paid back.


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    #43
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,874 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    So when will the US drop chemical weapons on us?


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    #44
    storker
    Registered Users Posts: 5,660 ✭✭✭storker


    banie01 wrote: »
    but I am quite happy that our Government is putting health of citizens before the rush to restart the economy.

    ...and before what their ideological instincts might suggest. Credit where credit's due. So far they seem to be rising well to the occasion.


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    #45
    Manach
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,705 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manach


    Now that you mention it, that giant statue of Comrade Leo that being erected in place of Nelson's pillar was a bit of give-away.


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    #46
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    Dr. Colossus wrote: »
    It's not communism.It's social democracy and the mixed economy responding to an unprecedented crisis.
    On another thread it's nazis.

    I think it's obvious what that truly means... :eek:

    https://frinkiac.com/caption/S09E23/38537


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    #47
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    Leg End Reject wrote: »
    I was sarcastic when I mentioned microchipping.
    Oh I know, L.


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    #48
    landofthetree
    Registered Users Posts: 2,344 ✭✭✭landofthetree




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    #49
    storker
    Registered Users Posts: 5,660 ✭✭✭storker


    landofthetree wrote: »

    "The KGB have better cars"
    "Yes, but they don't always take you where you want to go, do they?"
    - Gorki Park


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    #50
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    Leg End Reject wrote: »
    Emergency measures that have to be implemented due to exceptional circumstances?

    Yep, just a cover up for the stealth introduction of communism. I heard we're getting microchipped next.

    Mandatory or compulsory?


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    #51
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    Other countries get sanctioned but their citizens aren't starving and shooting each other.
    Gross mismanagement and over dependence on oil more like.

    The whole of South America seems poorly run no matter the method


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    #52
    AllForIt
    Registered Users Posts: 8,393 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    What is the state of Covid-19 in Russia.


    Like everything else in Russia - we don't know.


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    #53
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    growleaves wrote: »
    Ah here I'm not getting into a big back and forth.
    There is a lot of agitation of late here for sure - including from me - so I'm trying to get my head around your and some others' take on this. I'm trying to give you folks a chance and understand where you're coming from.

    But I simply can't. The restrictions are not to oppress and control us - they are a last resort for an incredible and, in places, desperate situation. What's really oppressive about them anyway? Private individuals being zealous - you could choose to see them as just bullies out to order people around, or as people worried sh1tless about vulnerable loved ones. When people are actually making an effort to go against what the WHO and HSE are appealing for people to do, a frustrated reaction is understandable. Most people don't really want shotgun armed lads patrolling the streets or prison for people who mistakenly stand too near someone.

    That this is being used as an excuse to curb our liberties in the future. Or... there are measures just being put in place now because of a desperate need for them, and the sooner everyone works to flatten the curve, the sooner we can return to normality.

    But oppression now or later (which some claim "will" happen) - oppression fetish stuff. What causes such a jaundiced view of people?

    I think some are still in denial, and/or very young.

    Nobody really wants a lockdown but thanks to fecking clowns, we've run out of options. Personally it breaks my fecking heart to see people knowing the ramifications of what they're doing, despite all the sacrifices that have to be made and will have to be made. Odious.


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    #54
    Louis Hallowed Snake
    Posts: 13,688 ✭ Louis Hallowed Snake


    When are we adding the hurley and sickle to the tri-colour?


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    #55
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    Communism is the sort of obscure political ideology that belongs in the same camp as those libertarian weirdos. If you were to believe online discourse (which you never should) then you'd believe that everyone is either a Marxist or some sort of Ayn Rand following nutjob. There's a real need to poison the well with them.

    It's entertaining to watch them get all hot and bothered, but the reality is the huge majority of people want centrist government. That's why social/christian democracy remains the only game in town. Especially for a post-pandemic Europe.

    Ignore the lunatics.


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    #56
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    johnnyskeleton wrote: »
    No.....but......

    Imagine you'd been working all your life and contributing to private health care just in case you ever needed it. The money you pay to private health insurers is used to pay for private procedures which is what primarily funds these private hospitals. This is on top of the already heavy taxes you pay but you think it is worth making those sacrifices. You forgo foreign holidays, work extra shifts, don't upgrade your car etc to pay for it (it ain't cheap) but you think its worth it because it'll always be there when you need it.

    Well, over the next few weeks you might need it. Whether for Covid or for some other procedure or treatment. And guess what....you're all out of luck pal. Some feckless and irresponsible schmoe has taken your place courtesy of the HSE. He went to cheltenham instead of paying for the VHI and gambled away all his money. He also caught covid-19 and then passed it on to you when he coughed in your face for a coronavirus challenge.

    Imagine you did get Coronavirus, but like in Italy you were triaged to be too old to get a respirator. So you die. Your children are told by the private health insurer that had they had control of their hospital, they might have been able to save you, but it's too late now. Are private health insurers even suspending premiums as they aren't really offering much in return (this would be a token gesture at best, but still).

    Now, imagine you are your children. Would you pay private health insurance knowing that, when you need it, it will be temporarily socialised?

    So in an ideal world, we wouldn't have a two tier health system and it would be ready for any emergency. But we don't live in such a world, we live in an awful awful world with a self destructive desire to be seen to be socialists and private health insurance has shown itself to be basically an extra voluntary tax with no benefits to you.

    Oh feck off. This is extremely special circumstances we find ourselves in.


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    #57
    topmanamillion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭topmanamillion


    landofthetree wrote: »
    It has to be paid back.

    This. If there was a levy for Setanta and Quinn going tits up you better bet there'll be a Covid-19 tax for at least the next decade.


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    #58
    topper75
    Registered Users Posts: 5,942 ✭✭✭topper75


    tabby aspreme wrote: »
    Money trees are a thing after all

    They can be a 'thing' yes. But sadly each leaf you pick from it makes all other leaves smaller.

    I never once met a leftist online or in real life who fully grasped the concept of scarce resources. You'd be just as successful in trying to explain to a 2-year-old tantrum thrower why they can't have the sweets.


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    #59
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 29,319 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    topper75 wrote:
    I never once met a leftist online or in real life who fully grasped the concept of scarce resources. You'd be just as successful in trying to explain to a 2-year tantrum thrower why they can't have the sweets.


    Money isn't dug out of the ground, it's simply just created at the stroke of a pen and a keyboard


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    #60
    JPCN1
    Registered Users Posts: 891 ✭✭✭JPCN1


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Communism to capitalism's rescue yet again.

    By sending us the virus?


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    #61
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,600 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    the beer revolu wrote: »
    Well for now, we have no two tier health system.
    Health insurance won't get you seen any quicker if you have covid-19. Private hospitals are now under control of the state.

    I think this is a good thing.
    I have private health insurance.

    This is misleading. I guess its true if you want to see a hospital doctor but many doctors from GPs to consultants are not. Having cash still get you an appointment with a private GP or dermatologist or ophthalmologist etc. Not withstanding the complexities of the current crisis, this is a good thing. Private healthcare means that people who are willing to pay reduce the burden from the HSE, making its objective more manageable. To make an analogy food banks don't mean we should shut down shops. Private sectors when cartels are prevented always have the ability to keep costs down and a major source of innovation.


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