CoVid19 Part XI - 2,615 in ROI (46 deaths) 410 in NI (21 deaths)(29/03)*OP upd 28/03*

Risteard81

facehugger99 wrote: »

The lockdown isn't going to work, anyone with access to half a brain and a calculator can see this.

According to Varadkar we're already nearly at ICU capacity after a couple of thousand confirmed cases and a few weeks in.

Even if we assume that there's actually 10 times the number of confirmed cases in the country, then we've around 20,000 infected out of 4.8 million and we're at capacity.

So, if we want to spread this out so ICU's don't get overwhelmed and need 2 weeks for every 20,000 that are infected, that works out at maintaining a lockdown for 480 weeks.

Even if we ramp up the ICU spaces by 4 times, that's 120 weeks we need to lock down.

The economy will be fcuked after 4 months of this - and there won't be money to borrow.

We're doing nothing now other than prolonging the inevitable while fcuking the economy at the same time.

Only the incredibly stupid cannot see and understand this.

Gynoid

CaoinDory wrote: »

Tempted to buy a shotgun... or a sniper. Take those gob****es out from the comfort of my home.

Hehe. I maybe be a technocratic dictator...but you are badder!

CaoinDory

niallo27 wrote: »

It's not people disagree with the lockdown, it's the idiots that think we can do this for months with no social and mental issues after it.

Who the hell ever stated that this could be done without social or mental issues after the fact? I've not seen one post to that effect.

Of course this will effect us in those ways! But those are things we cam come back from (speaking from personal experience). Thks virus is KILLING PEOPLE!!!!

ninebeanrows

Is there any clarity as to whether you can have an walk with wife or must you be alone?

paul71

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

I’ve passed a few. They’re only offering advice to people, they don’t seem to have any enforcement powers.

Not having enforcement powers and using discretion in executing those powers are 2 different things.

Bob24

magma69 wrote: »

Suck it up ffs. The measure are in place to save lives, if that means having a bit of anxiety due to being cooped up then so be it.

When did we turn into such a pack of pussies? Dozens of millions went out to die in wars not too long ago in emergencies and we're being asked to just stay at home for a few weeks. Put on your big boy/girl pants now and do your bit.

Yep ... I’ve seen elsewhere someone saying previous generations were asked to go to war to save their countrymen and coped with it, and when current generations are asked to stay at home and watch Netflix to save their countrymen some find it difficult.

I know it’s not everyone, but still some people needs to put things into perspective ...

Hurrache

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Is there any clarity as to whether you can have an walk with wife or must you be alone?

It's all spelled out by what was said last night

rahmalec

Risteard81 wrote: »

Only the incredibly stupid cannot see and understand this.

I think the idea is to get the spread under control for the moment, then reopen things slowly. By then testing would have ramped up and any flare ups can be detected quickly, all contacts traced and quarantined. That would have to go on for a while.

yerwanthere123

Just found out the husband of a colleague of mine took his own life yesterday. He leaves behind a wife and six children. Invisible impact of this pandemic is/will be huge.

niallo27

CaoinDory wrote: »

Who the hell ever stated that this could be done without social or mental issues after the fact? I've not seen one post to that effect.

Of course this will effect us in those ways! But those are things we cam come back from (speaking from personal experience). Thks virus is KILLING PEOPLE!!!!

You not think mental issues is killing people, I guarantee a lot more young people will die from mental issues in this country than the virus will ever kill.

inatissy

Tandey wrote: »

Anne Fank did die as a 15 year old teenager from a disease. However it was Completely different time and environment. Not comparable to a whinger on a Irish message board in 2020.

Yes but she was locked inside for 2 years with less than we have.

Mervyn Skidmore

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Is there any clarity as to whether you can have an walk with wife or must you be alone?

I'm telling her I have to walk alone.

Snow Garden

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Is there any clarity as to whether you can have an walk with wife or must you be alone?

Wishful thinking :)

alchemist33

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Is there any clarity as to whether you can have an walk with wife or must you be alone?

You can walk with YOUR wife, not a random one

Sierra Oscar

paul71 wrote: »

Not having enforcement powers and using discretion in executing those powers are 2 different things.

They don’t have enforcement powers. The required Ministerial Order for the new emergency powers legislation has not been made.

WhiteMemento9

Risteard81 wrote: »

Only the incredibly stupid cannot see and understand this.

I just explained in my last post why it is flawed. These people who think they are clever by predicting the envitable outcome are actually the stupid ones who just haven't considered how the situation changes after the outbreak has been controlled.

An Ciarraioch

Risteard81 wrote: »

Only the incredibly stupid cannot see and understand this.

And your alternative strategy for flattening the curve?

branie2

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

They don’t have enforcement powers. The required Ministerial Order for the new emergency powers legislation has not been made.

So they can't arrest mouthy teenagers who are not 2 meters apart at the moment?

Jin luk

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Anxiety levels have certainly crept up a notch today.

Feeling very claustrophobic around now.

I think we need to be very careful here not to go too far.

I hope no further measures are implemented

The way some of ye go on youd swear we were locked up in a tiny little space chill out take it easy relax ans enjoy the time off

Its not hard find something to keep youre mind busy a game or something of the sort would help

Tandey

inatissy wrote: »

Yes but she was locked inside for 2 years with less than we have.

You’d be surprised how little one would have to whinge about without anyone to talk to.

autumnbelle

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

Just found out the husband of a colleague of mine took his own life yesterday. He leaves behind a wife and six children. Invisible impact of this pandemic is/will be huge.

Can see this happening with a huge number of people. Rip

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

Just found out the husband of a colleague of mine took his own life yesterday. He leaves behind a wife and six children. Invisible impact of this pandemic is/will be huge.

How do you know it was pandemic-related?

Dr hoRse

Curious_Case wrote: »

Just a thought -

Would decompression units, as used by divers, assist breathing for people with respiratory problems?

There may be quite a few of these units around, the navy, garda divers, commercial divers, sports divers, etc. surely have access in case of emergency

Bear in mind that these units allow for various mixes so oxygen level could be increased

Not really, and I'll try to explain why while keeping it as basic as possible because I don't know your background.
The word coming from Italy is that they're trying to manage as many people outside of home now with home oxygen cylinders with a relatively low flow rate. This is for mildly hypoxic people not requiring positive pressure ventilation, and the idea is to keep these people out of hospital to reduce spread and contamination, hospitals are being identified as the major spreading factor in Italy and Spain now.
Those diving units I assume you're talking about are the gas cannisters? which requires normal negative pressure ventilation to draw oxygen, and you need to produce a certain level of negative pressure before you get flow, thats not going to help people unfortunately.
The positive pressure from a ventilator reduces the work of breathing for a person and prevents small airway and gas exchange units from collapsing, as these units collapse gas exchange becomes increasingly more difficult (the analogy is blowing up a balloon at the start, initially it takes a lot of effort, then as it starts to inflate you're in the sweet spot and you can increase and decrease the volume of air in the balloon with a lot less effort), these lungs are very sick, like a very stiff balloon thats difficult to inflate.

bekker

paul71 wrote: »

Not having enforcement powers and using discretion in executing those powers are 2 different things.

Don't have them as yet, waiting AG to OK it to Simon Harris so he can invoke powers which give effect to additional powers for Gardai.

Just have to avail of existing Public Order Offences powers till then if needed.

joe40

autumnbelle wrote: »

Can see this happening with a huge number of people. Rip

Not necessarily related to current measures. Suicide has always been a tragic issue.

CaoinDory

CaoinDory wrote: »

Who the hell ever stated that this could be done without social or mental issues after the fact? I've not seen one post to that effect.

Of course this will effect us in those ways! But those are things we cam come back from (speaking from personal experience). Thks virus is KILLING PEOPLE!!!!

So will an economic catastrophe, with all the addiction, despair, depression, anxiety, suicides, public health deterioration, huge health inequalities and catastrophically underfunded HSE (even more than now) that would go along with that catastrophe. The only question is would that cause more deaths than the Coronavirus. Probably, if the lockdown goes on for more than a month or so

facehugger99

pjohnson wrote: »

Oh go preach to Italy and Spain about how important the economy is and see where that gets you. Most humans value human life.

High on the thanks-whoring but light on any actual facts.

Colour me surprised.

mohawk

Hunky Monster wrote: »

On the list of essential workers...

I'm willing to bet that all american pharma/medical device companies here will stay open even if they've NOTHING to do with helping the situation. Money money money.

Of course they should still stay open. People still need their medication, people will still need stents etc

paul71

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

They don’t have enforcement powers. The required Ministerial Order for the new emergency powers legislation has not been made.

Genuine question, why do the provisions of a bill already passed into law need a ministerial order?

yourdeadwright

facehugger99 wrote: »

The lockdown isn't going to work, anyone with access to half a brain and a calculator can see this.

According to Varadkar we're already nearly at ICU capacity after a couple of thousand confirmed cases and a few weeks in.

Even if we assume that there's actually 10 times the number of confirmed cases in the country, then we've around 20,000 infected out of 4.8 million and we're at capacity.

So, if we want to spread this out so ICU's don't get overwhelmed and need 2 weeks for every 20,000 that are infected, that works out at maintaining a lockdown for 480 weeks.

Even if we ramp up the ICU spaces by 4 times, that's 120 weeks we need to lock down.

The economy will be fcuked after 4 months of this - and there won't be money to borrow.

We're doing nothing now other than prolonging the inevitable while fcuking the economy at the same time.

Weare at what 70 something ICU case with capacity for near 500

Secondly id glady be remembered as part of a generation that ****ed the economy than part of a generation that sat by and done Nothing as there parents and grand parents died alone in hospital beds,

**** the economy, **** the government, Let's save as many of our own people as we can, every day people, people you know, loved ones of us all, lifes saved from each and every community in this country means more to the people, the economy can wait

CaoinDory

niallo27 wrote: »

You not think mental issues is killing people, I guarantee a lot more young people will die from mental issues in this country than the virus will ever kill.

I know for a fact mental health can kill. Again from a very VERY personal point of view. And as someone who suffers both depression AND anxiety disorder I know for a fact that this is going to be incredibly hard... but that doesnt mean it shouldn't be done!

But no one has ever stated otherwise!!! We need to get this thing under control!

People seem to have forgotten their history. Remember small pox? A virus that wiped out... countless of people! Is that what we want to happen again?

Just stay at home people. It's not rocket science!

ihdxwz4a3pem9j

The government has to think of the collective good. They have to weigh up the excess deaths, secondary to failure to control the virus (this will include people who die of COVID and people who die from unrelated illnesses as a result of the lack of resources) versus the excess amount of people that will die from mental health issues (i.e. die by suicide) secondary to several weeks of social restrictions. Neither strategy will spare all lives . But we have to make the decision about which option will save the maximum number of lives (failure to restrict the virus could result in an excess of a hundred-thousand lives in the long-run). Social restriction will cause less societal damage. And finally, there was a great article in the Irish Times today. They touted the fact that investors will be interested in Ireland, as a long-term base, if we prove that we act cohesively and logically in a time of disaster

joe40

[Deleted User] wrote: »

So will an economic catastrophe, with all the addiction, despair, depression, anxiety, suicides, public health deterioration, huge health inequalities and catastrophically underfunded HSE (even more than now) that would go along with that catastrophe. The only question is would that cause more deaths than the Coronavirus. Probably, if the lockdown goes on for more than a month or so

The things you talk about are real risks but the coronavirus has the potential to be worse, a lot worse. I don't think anyone is saying there won't be a substantial cost to current measures. The impact will be huge but ultimately the lesser of two evils. There are no easy solutions.

cosanostra

Is our high number of healthcare workers infected due to the initial cases surrounding CUH? if memory serves me right there was an infected person returned from italy who worked in the hospital and infected people there unintentionally of course

limnam

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Weare at what 70 something ICU case with capacity for near 500

Secondly id glady be remembered as part of a generation that ****ed the economy than part of a generation that sat by and done Nothing as there parents and grand parents died alone in hospital beds,

**** the economy, **** the government, Let's save as many of our own people as we can, every day people, people you know, loved ones of us all, lifes saved from each and every community in this country means more to the people, the economy can wait

500?

I would have thought normally we're at about 80% capacity in ICU outside of covid.

+70 covid cases. Leaves very little room.

yourdeadwright

Yester wrote: »

Are vape shops closed? I know it's trivial in the scheme of things but I switched from smoking to vaping a couple of days ago and didn't stock up.

Not being funny but give serious thought that'its time to quit, vaping is very hard on the lungs and if you catch this ****er of a virus that's where it'll be targeting you,

An Ciarraioch

Two further deaths in NI, 49 new cases:

https://twitter.com/DarranMarshall/status/1243903176006303745

facehugger99

Risteard81 wrote: »

Only the incredibly stupid cannot see and understand this.

It's a mixture of stupidity and inability to want to recognise the reality.

The politicians and their advisors can't come out and say it. They just want to be able to say "well, we tried everything".

Eventually the mood will change after a couple of months of lockdown and the politicians will, as usual, follow the public mood.

The lockdown is completely unsustainable and ultimately of little benefit. It'll just take a while for the penny to drop for most people.

Tandey

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

How do you know it was pandemic-related?

Don’t think the poster said it was related. The pandemic crisis wouldn’t have helped anyway.

CaoinDory

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Probably, if the lockdown goes on for more than a month or so

If people would do this thing properly, the lock down wouldn't need to last as long... but people wont. Which will draw it out longer!

Tandey

facehugger99 wrote: »

It's a mixture of stupidity and inability to want to recognise the reality.

The politicians and their advisors can't come out and say it. They just want to be able to say "well, we tried everything".

Eventually the mood will change after a couple of months of lockdown and the politicians will, as usual, follow the public mood.

The lockdown is completely unsustainable and ultimately of little benefit. It'll just take a while for the penny to drop for most people.

Ok mister foresight.

What are you doing to help in this pandemic?

Don’t be facehugging would be my advice for you.

MipMap

Dr hoRse wrote: »

Not really, and I'll try to explain why while keeping it as basic as possible because I don't know your background.
The word coming from Italy is that they're trying to manage as many people outside of home now with home oxygen cylinders with a relatively low flow rate. This is for mildly hypoxic people not requiring positive pressure ventilation, and the idea is to keep these people out of hospital to reduce spread and contamination, hospitals are being identified as the major spreading factor in Italy and Spain now.
Those diving units I assume you're talking about are the gas cannisters? which requires normal negative pressure ventilation to draw oxygen, and you need to produce a certain level of negative pressure before you get flow, thats not going to help people unfortunately.
The positive pressure from a ventilator reduces the work of breathing for a person and prevents small airway and gas exchange units from collapsing, as these units collapse gas exchange becomes increasingly more difficult (the analogy is blowing up a balloon at the start, initially it takes a lot of effort, then as it starts to inflate you're in the sweet spot and you can increase and decrease the volume of air in the balloon with a lot less effort), these lungs are very sick, like a very stiff balloon thats difficult to inflate.

What about Nebulisers, Vetolin.


I suffer from COPD and these work great

Discodog

Wibbs wrote: »

Massive coronary just after I've shot my bolt into a Russian lingerie model. While off my tits on goofballs.

Nah. You need to copy the great Jon Entwistle - 2 young hookers & a pile of cocaine :pac:

Mervyn Skidmore

Mervyn Skidmore wrote: »

I'm telling her I have to walk alone.

Not a Liverpool fan then?

I'll get me coat. Wait, where wilI I go?

joe40

facehugger99 wrote: »

The lockdown isn't going to work, anyone with access to half a brain and a calculator can see this.

According to Varadkar we're already nearly at ICU capacity after a couple of thousand confirmed cases and a few weeks in.

Even if we assume that there's actually 10 times the number of confirmed cases in the country, then we've around 20,000 infected out of 4.8 million and we're at capacity.

So, if we want to spread this out so ICU's don't get overwhelmed and need 2 weeks for every 20,000 that are infected, that works out at maintaining a lockdown for 480 weeks.

Even if we ramp up the ICU spaces by 4 times, that's 120 weeks we need to lock down.

The economy will be fcuked after 4 months of this - and there won't be money to borrow.

We're doing nothing now other than prolonging the inevitable while fcuking the economy at the same time.

You're right anyone with access to half a brain probably will think like that.
Thankfully the medics leading this have access to full brains plus years of experience.
But please keep spouting nonsense here it passes the time...

yourdeadwright

limnam wrote: »

500?

I would have thought normally we're at about 80% capacity in ICU outside of covid.

+70 covid cases. Leaves very little room.

There was 257 i Last year in public hospitals and now the private section have opened up all there ones to be used

I believe it's 457 icu bed, 257 originally, 150 from private hospitals and a further 50 made operational by the HSE,

That's from reading different reports

Iv no idea how many are in use with non Covid cases

Curious_Case

facehugger99 wrote: »

It's a mixture of stupidity and inability to want to recognise the reality.

The politicians and their advisors can't come out and say it. They just want to be able to say "well, we tried everything".

Eventually the mood will change after a couple of months of lockdown and the politicians will, as usual, follow the public mood.

The lockdown is completely unsustainable and ultimately of little benefit. It'll just take a while for the penny to drop for most people.

Of course it's unsustainable but hasn't a duration of 12 weeks been mentioned?

The lockdown will buy time to enable preparations to be ramped up.

If nothing is done, the number of people requiring ICU care will exceed the number of available ICU beds and so the FATALITY RATE WILL RISE.

Tandey

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Not a Liverpool fan then?

I'll get me coat. Wait, where wilI I go?

Don’t go to Liverpool in the hope to see a premier league trophy anyway. Unless you enjoy disappointment.

ChikiChiki

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

Just found out the husband of a colleague of mine took his own life yesterday. He leaves behind a wife and six children. Invisible impact of this pandemic is/will be huge.

That is incredibly sad.

Suicide rates were bad before the crisis.

I think we will need a Mental Health Crisis Management planning running in parallel with our Covid 19 Crisis plan.

The fallout will be huge.

jackboy

yourdeadwright wrote: »

**** the economy, **** the government, Let's save as many of our own people as we can, every day people, people you know, loved ones of us all, lifes saved from each and every community in this country means more to the people, the economy can wait

That’s fine. Are you ok with the nurses take home pay going through the floor when this crises is over?