CoVid19 Part XII - 4,604 in ROI (137 deaths) 998 in NI (56 deaths)(04/04) **Read OP**

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

New tinder tagline there for some one

Rvsmmnps

98 deaths per 5 million.I over heard an old chap saying if this were the 1980s this would have been labeled as a "bad dose going around"

Lets hope nout fishy is going on.

Widdensushi

the lockdown is leading to meltdowns even online, I really hope they relax it for the sake of mental health

Snipp

amadangomor wrote: »

Can't work due to infection causing asthma. Test was cancelled because I didn't have temperature.

Have to lie down for couple of hours after sweeping the kitchen so definitely can't go to work. Have limited breathing.

Did your GP medically direct you to isolate for 14 days? If so, the DEASP require two documents:
a) Medical E-Certificate of Incapacity for Work
b) IB1 form
If you didn't do one or the other, you wont get the COVID payment. The E-Cert needs to be signed and sent by the directing GP.

crossman47

froog wrote: »

heard on pat kenny yesterday lots of people are better off with the payment than before. people that were earning 100 a week part time now getting the full 350. absolute joke.

Theres bound to be anomalies in a system put together in a crisis. Anyway its not exactly a small fortune.

Stateofyou

Danzy wrote: »

They stopped working on them as the viruses burnt out.

There are at least 40 vaccines being developed with several already at human trials, to say it has been fast is an understatement.

Still will probably be next year before a shoulder is jabbed.

A shoulder has already been jabbed!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/victoriaforster/2020/03/17/first-person-injected-with-trial-coronavirus-vaccine-in-seattle/#7eb730292583

ceadaoin.

cloudatlas wrote: »

Sure it was the same kind of talk about the U.K. Some folks on here are divorced from reality. Plenty of Irish people in both countries as well.

Yes, that's it, divorced from reality is good description. I'm Irish and lived in the UK for several years and now the US. I'm not going to gloat about any of it, I'm just worried about everyone. Maybe those people's horizons are a lot smaller

froog

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Instead of looking at like people are getting more for less, maybe look at it like how little they were getting in the first place?

there's a minimum wage in this country and it's one of the highest in the world. i don't know what your point is. also if you are part time working then obviously you will be on less than 350.

someone rightly mentioned entitled earlier.

gabeeg

Snipp wrote: »

Maybe I am in the minority, but I have always viewed social welfare payments as a privilege and not an entitlement. The money is coming from others' hard earned pay check.

The money is coming from his own PRSI contributions.

It's given to people so they can manage when they're far too sick to work. To bang on about people feeling entitled is really ****ing mean.

Funkfield

amadangomor wrote: »

I'm on hold with them for the last 20 mins:)

Think they might possibly be busy? For any reason?

Hmmmmm. I wonder.

gabeeg

froog wrote: »

so you weren't laid off and you aren't even confirmed as positive.

righto.

It's near impossible to get a bloody test in this country.

He/she should not be punished for the government's inadequacies

Roger_007

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

Lockdown to go to end of the month today I heard. Must be due to fear of people breaking rules this weekend if the sun comes out.

Not sure how well that would go down.

All the expert opinion is saying that we have not reached the peak yet so it is self-evident that the lockdown will have to continue at least for this month. It would be bizarre if the restrictions were relaxed while the figures are still going up.
If the lag time, (between measures being imposed and there being a noticeable effect), is two to three weeks, it will not really be known until the end of the month what effect the current restrictions have had.
On the other hand if the current restrictions are shown to be ineffective then there is a difficult choice. There could be an even harder lockdown or there could be a partial relaxation of the restrictions on the grounds that there is no point in thrashing our economy for no benefit.
Who would want Dr Holohan’s job?

stockshares

sydthebeat wrote: »

Apart from the outlier small counties of Andorra and San Marino....

Belgium is going to become the third country to break the 100 deaths per million barrier, after Italy and Spain.

How did they get it so wrong?

I don't think they have had a proper Government for a few years now.

otnomart

frillyleaf wrote: »

This is how the nurses doctors etc treat patients in China. It’s completely sealed suits. I assumed this was how Irish nurses and doctors were kitted out when treating Covid19 patients until I saw footage or maybe it’s old footage ?

Such equipment does exist, but the quantities are limited.
I have posted previously photos of the Italian airforce transferring Covid patients from the North to the Regions less under pressure, and they are using biohazard trolleys.
Italy has some of those since at least 2014-2015 and they were used to repatriate Ebola patients and transfer TB patients.
I don't think any Country has thousands of these, though.
This photo and article show the arrival of an Ebola patient in Italy in 2015
https://www.corriere.it/foto-gallery/cronache/15_maggio_13/ebola-arrivo-infermiere-contagiato-pratica-mare-524c2816-f939-11e4-997b-246d7229677f.shtml?

Funsterdelux

Theres the possibility of a person working 2/3 days a week and getting SW for the other days.
But with 350 a week thats still more than 100 plus 2/3 days social welfare.

deisedevil

Stateofyou wrote: »

A shoulder has already been jabbed!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/victoriaforster/2020/03/17/first-person-injected-with-trial-coronavirus-vaccine-in-seattle/#7eb730292583

In all fairness, I'd say they meant the first jab as part of a proper roll out. That's a clinical trial.

FishOnABike

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Sweden not going in to lockdown has a death rate of 30 per million, ourselves going back to living in caves has a death rate of 20 per million. The suicide rate will put us many multiples ahead of Sweden.

Population doesn't really come into it until the virus starts to run out of new hosts to infect.

Comparing per million figures gives the impression Sweden has a death rate one and a half times ours. In reality it is three times ours and, if the rate of infection continues to increase, Sweden's rate will be even more.

shocksy

https://twitter.com/SkyNewsBreak/status/1246008663346679810?s=19

froog

laurah591 wrote: »

I know of an agency which supplies relief staff to nursing homes (Kitchen Porters/catering assistants etc) who are reporting that 50% of there staff are not available to work and in receipt of various covid payments. Now they are not all in self isolation and payments exceed there wages. I understand the governments reasoning for introducing additional support, but people should not be benefiting from these payments (ie doing better not at work). In addition, could payment system have been linked to employment sector opportunities (retail/manufacturing etc) - have we created a moral hazard situation?

exactly. it's an ill thought out and deeply flawed system.

Snipp

gabeeg wrote: »

The money is coming from his own PRSI contributions.

It's given to people so they can manage when they're far too sick to work. To bang on about people feeling entitled is really ****ing mean.

That is fair enough. We clearly have differing views.

normanoffside

sydthebeat wrote: »

Apart from the outlier small counties of Andorra and San Marino....

Belgium is going to become the third country to break the 100 deaths per million barrier, after Italy and Spain.

How did they get it so wrong?

Belgium is a very densely populated country.

Andorra and San Marino the same.

AlmightyCushion

is_that_so wrote: »

Here's that Google Mobility report on 131 countries.




https://www.google.com/covid19/mobility/

That is actually really cool. You can see the big spike in grocery when they announced the schools were closing.

tobefrank321

Stateofyou wrote: »

A shoulder has already been jabbed!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/victoriaforster/2020/03/17/first-person-injected-with-trial-coronavirus-vaccine-in-seattle/#7eb730292583

While promising, if you read the last line:

Although the design and production of the prospective vaccine was incredibly fast, evaluation of it will take considerable time. All of the participants will be followed for 12 months after the second vaccination to collect the data researchers initially need to figure out whether it is safe and effective.

And that's before you get to mass production.

The main reason for extensive testing of vaccines is so the company who makes them don't get sued, unless governments indemnify them. We've seen what happens with a rushed to market swine flu vaccine in Ireland. The vaccine ends up far worse than the illness some might suffer and this could especially be the case with cv19.

Realistically governments and all of us need to plan for the next 12 months without a vaccine. A lockdown of that length in not sustainable and even if it was there is still no guarantee of a vaccine at the end of it.

cloudatlas

If I lived in New York I'm not sure seeing the empire state building lit up like a siren every night would make me feel calm in fact the opposite.

The virus is going to peak in the next 2 weeks so making sure I have enough supplies in so I don't go out.

Most of the podcasts I listen to are all focused on the pandemic now, initially it was fine but now it's too much.

Funsterdelux

Funsterdelux wrote: »

Imagine how frustrated he will be if it snows the week he is banned!!

deisedevil

cloudatlas wrote: »

The virus is going to peak in the next 2 weeks

Is it? Where did you see that?

New Home

froog wrote: »

exactly. it's an ill thought out and deeply flawed system.

And they had, like, a week or something, to set it up so that people wouldn't go hungry or risk their lives. Of course it's flawed, but it's a damn sight better than what other countries are doing.

Widdensushi

Deleted User wrote: »

Imagine how frustrated he will be if it snows the week he is banned!!

miss piggy might have a frog in her throat trying to relieve his stress

jackboy

kilns wrote: »

This is not for public consumption its a peer to peer conversation, you cant pull the wool over the eyes of people in the industry which you can with the general public

It’s a corporate webinar. It is company propaganda. Talking about when a vaccine will be ready before it is fully tested is nonsense. I’m not sure how long you have worked in pharma, but I would encourage you to take such communication with a pinch of salt.

bilston

tobefrank321 wrote: »

While promising, if you read the last line:



And that's before you get to mass production.

The main reason for extensive testing of vaccines is so the company who makes them don't get sued, unless governments indemnify them. We've seen what happens with a rushed to market swine flu vaccine in Ireland. The vaccine ends up far worse than the illness some might suffer and this could especially be the case with cv19.

Realistically governments and all of us need to plan for the next 12 months without a vaccine. A lockdown of that length in not sustainable and even if it was there is still no guarantee of a vaccine at the end of it.

Even then it will take some time to mass produce a vaccine. I fear this virus will be a problem for 2 years and possibly a bit longer.

I don't think we will see restrictions like we have at the minute for that period, for a start the health system will learn to treat it more successfully and will be better equipped, us the virus won't be able to move as fast as there will be some level of immunity out there in time, but until the vast majority gets vaccinated then we will have to live with it and that could be 2022.

Going of on a tangent here but I fear the real story will soon be the developing world. Their health systems are in serious danger there. We can keep the mortality rate down because we can treat almost everyone (although that's not guarented during the surge), who knows how many won't get the treatment they need in Africa, South America, the Sub Continent and in countries like Indonesia. It could be catastrophic.

ceadaoin.

cloudatlas wrote: »

If I lived in New York I'm not sure seeing the empire state building lit up like a siren every night would make me feel calm in fact the opposite.

.

I'm not sure it's about making people feel calm, more like a sense of solidarity I suppose.

The empty hotel windows in vegas are lit up with messages. Doesn't make me feel calm but it's still uplifting in a weird way.

Stateofyou

Bill Gates speaks to Trevor Noah about vaccines and possibly opening the US by summer:

https://www.geekwire.com/2020/bill-gates-daily-show-us-reopen-summer-wont-completely-normal/


“If we get the right testing capacity, you can change by, literally millions, the number who are infected. Governments will eventually come up with lots of money for these things, but they don’t know where to direct it and they can’t move as quickly. And so because our foundation has such deep expertise in infectious diseases, we’ve thought about the epidemic. We did fund some things to be more prepared, like a vaccine effort.

"Our early money can accelerate things. For example, of all the vaccine constructs, the seven-most promising of those — even though we’ll end up picking at most two of them, we’re going to find factories for all seven. It’s so that we don’t waste time in serially saying ‘OK, which vaccine works,’ and then building the factory. Because to get to the best case, that people like myself and Dr. Fauci are saying is about 18 months, we need to do safety and efficacy and build manufacturing. And they’re different for the different constructs.

It’ll be a few billion dollars we’ll waste on manufacturing for the constructs that don’t get picked because something else is better. But a few billion in the situation we’re in, where there’s trillions of dollars being lost economically, it is worth it.

In normal government procurement processes and understanding which are the right seven, in a few months, those may kick in. But our foundation, we can get that bootstrapped and get it going and save months, because every month counts.”

Rvsmmnps

The winter of 2015 into 2016 seen almost 25,000 deaths in Italy due to influenza.
Corona virus so far has killed 14,000 people in Italy so far, where could I see a Stat for the current amount of deaths attributed to standard flu in Italy for this season?

tobefrank321

I think Gates should stick to what he's good at, making computers.

Vaccines are a complicated business and best left to those with experience in the field.

If you rush a cv19 vaccine or get it wrong, you could end up giving narcolepsy or the like to a perfectly healthy individual who might have only got a mild dose of cv19 or none at all. In fact I'd nearly prefer a mild dose of cv19 if it could be guaranteed than a vaccine that hasn't been rigorously tested.

And maybe that's the route they should be going down, identify the mildest strain of covid 19 and immunise volunteers with a low viral load. And then study the results.

Roger_007

bilston wrote: »

Even then it will take some time to mass produce a vaccine. I fear this virus will be a problem for 2 years and possibly a bit longer.

I don't think we will see restrictions like we have at the minute for that period, for a start the health system will learn to treat it more successfully and will be better equipped, us the virus won't be able to move as fast as there will be some level of immunity out there in time, but until the vast majority gets vaccinated then we will have to live with it and that could be 2022.

Going of on a tangent here but I fear the real story will soon be the developing world. Their health systems are in serious danger there. We can keep the mortality rate down because we can treat almost everyone (although that's not guarented during the surge), who knows how many won't get the treatment they need in Africa, South America, the Sub Continent and in countries like Indonesia. It could be catastrophic.

I agree about the vaccine. There is an extensive process of testing and evaluation involved that has to be gone through before a vaccine can be approved.
I’m not so sure that the developing world will be affected as bad as we might imagine. They tend to have much younger populations, (ironically, because of their poorly developed health services).

gabeeg

Rvsmmnps wrote: »

The winter of 2015 into 2016 seen almost 25,000 deaths in Italy due to influenza.
Corona virus so far has killed 14,000 people in Italy so far, where could I see a Stat for the current amount of deaths attributed to standard flu in Italy for this season?

It's only been a month or two and the country has been on lockdown for weeks.

bilston

Roger_007 wrote: »

I agree about the vaccine. There is an extensive process of testing and evaluation involved that has to be gone through before a vaccine can be approved.
I’m not so sure that the developing world will be affected as bad as we might imagine. They tend to have much younger populations, (ironically, because of their poorly developed health services).

That's a very good point that I hadn't considered about the developing world.

However what we know in Europe is that while 95% of patients to die have been over the age of 60, there do seem to be a number of patients in their 30s, 40s and 50s (even younger in some cases) who suffer severe symtpoms and need hospital care to varying degrees. That treatment might not be available in the developing world, but yeah you're right the younger populations might mean the number of deaths isn't as severe as I had originally feared.

Stateofyou

tobefrank321 wrote: »

I think Gates should stick to what he's good at, making computers.

Vaccines are a complicated business and best left to those with experience in the field.

If you rush a cv19 vaccine or get it wrong, you could end up giving narcolepsy or the like to a perfectly healthy individual who might have only got a mild dose of cv19 or none at all. In fact I'd nearly prefer a mild dose of cv19 if it could be guaranteed than a vaccine that hasn't been rigorously tested.

And maybe that's the route they should be going down, identify the mildest strain of covid 19 and immunise volunteers with a low viral load. And then study the results.

I'm pretty sure Bill Gates has a huge team of experts in that regard that he's funnelling money towards. That would be obvious he's not going at this personally pulling a John Wayne, he references his foundation.

EDit

Rvsmmnps wrote: »

98 deaths per 5 million.I over heard an old chap saying if this were the 1980s this would have been labeled as a "bad dose going around"

Lets hope nout fishy is going on.

That’s the death rate with most people in the country shut up in their homes. If we just carried on as normal, the death count would be considerably higher

Hamsterchops

Widdensushi wrote: »

the lockdown is leading to meltdowns even online, I really hope they relax it for the sake of mental health

Lockdown is finishing at the end of this month!

according to some posters on here.

tobefrank321

Roger_007 wrote: »

I agree about the vaccine. There is an extensive process of testing and evaluation involved that has to be gone through before a vaccine can be approved.
I’m not so sure that the developing world will be affected as bad as we might imagine. They tend to have much younger populations, (ironically, because of their poorly developed health services).

Agreed. One of the reasons why Italy, Spain and the UK have been badly hit is their much older populations. World class healthcare systems mean at the same time a much older population. There will be deaths in the developing world but far less and the number of confirmed cases will be far less due to less testing.

EDit

Rvsmmnps wrote: »

The winter of 2015 into 2016 seen almost 25,000 deaths in Italy due to influenza.
Corona virus so far has killed 14,000 people in Italy so far, where could I see a Stat for the current amount of deaths attributed to standard flu in Italy for this season?

It’s irrelevant what happened in Italy in 2015/2016 as the country wasn’t on lockdown as it Is now. This is the problem. People compare the death rates under strict quarantine conditions with death rates from previous years when there were no quarantine conditions and say “look, it’s not that bad”

walshb

tobefrank321 wrote: »

I think Gates should stick to what he's good at, making computers.

Vaccines are a complicated business and best left to those with experience in the field.

If you rush a cv19 vaccine or get it wrong, you could end up giving narcolepsy or the like to a perfectly healthy individual who might have only got a mild dose of cv19 or none at all. In fact I'd nearly prefer a mild dose of cv19 if it could be guaranteed than a vaccine that hasn't been rigorously tested.

And maybe that's the route they should be going down, identify the mildest strain of covid 19 and immunise volunteers with a low viral load. And then study the results.

Gates is an industrialist.....a titan..

Ultimately it is people like him and political figures that get things done....

They don't necessarily need to know a damn thing about anything (though Gates is very well educated and very well read)

It's their passion, commitment, desire and all around facilitating skills that get things done. They bring people together....and it is this that will beat the spread. Bringing the best people together...

Hamsterchops

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Finishing at the end of this month!

according to some posters in here.

There's two hopes of that happening, Bob Hope and no hope. Covid-19 is unlikely to reach a crest here for at least a fortnight. Imagine it will be well into May before restrictions are relaxed in piecemeal fashion.

tobefrank321

Stateofyou wrote: »

I'm pretty sure Bill Gates has a huge team of experts in that regard that he's funnelling money towards. That would be obvious he's not going at this personally pulling a John Wayne, he references his foundation.

Of course he has scientists working for him. I've never known a scientist to turn down funds for research, they depend on it.

But he's talking nonsense if he thinks a vaccine is possible within 6 months. Sure it could solve covid19 but it might give you a far worse life long condition. This is why you need to follow up for 12 months.

If he does come up with a vaccine within 6 months, it will probably be restricted to the elderly who don't have to worry as much about lifelong conditions. But giving a rapidly developed vaccine to young people or children would be madness.

Dcully

EDit wrote: »

It’s irrelevant what happened in Italy in 2015/2016 as the country wasn’t on lockdown as it Is now. This is the problem. People compare the death rates under strict quarantine conditions with death rates from previous years when there were no quarantine conditions and say “look, it’s not that bad”

Makes you wonder should we have strict quarantine for the flu then?
All i know is early jan i had the worse flu ive ever experienced, totally knocked me for 2 weeks with 5 days in the bed barely able to move a limb was crazy nasty.

Stateofyou

tobefrank321 wrote: »

Of course he has scientists working for him. I've never known a scientist to turn down funds for research, they depend on it.

But he's talking nonsense if he thinks a vaccine is possible within 6 months. Sure it could solve covid19 but it might give you a far worse life long condition. This is why you need to follow up for 12 months.

If he does come up with a vaccine within 6 months, it will probably be restricted to the elderly who don't have to worry as much about lifelong conditions.

Any chance you could just read the article before commenting?

"Because to get to the best case, that people like myself and Dr. Fauci are saying is about 18 months, we need to do safety and efficacy and build manufacturing."

all about the mane

Dcully wrote: »

Makes you wonder should we have strict quarantine for the flu then?
All i know is early jan i had the worse flu ive ever experienced, totally knocked me for 2 weeks with 5 days in the bed barely able to move a limb was crazy nasty.

My wife had the same. And a really raspy cough to go with it. Never saw her so bad. I was wondering afterwards if it was actually covid19

tobefrank321

walshb wrote: »

Gates is an industrialist.....a titan..

Ultimately it is people like him and political figures that get things done....

They don't necessarily need to know a damn thing about anything (though Gates is very well educated and very well read)

It's their passion, commitment, desire and all around facilitating skills that get things done. They bring people together....and it is this that will beat the spread. Bringing the best people together...

I get all that.

But you cannot rush a vaccine. it has to be extensively tested. It takes time and patience. And no amount of money can bypass that.

Its good that he's on board with his billions, but he should be careful about rushing a vaccine that could in the long run do more harm than good.

Tordelback

tobefrank321 wrote: »

I think Gates should stick to what he's good at, making computers.

Gates is neither an angel nor a genius, but he's as close to a half-decent billionaire as we're likely to get, and funding vaccination has been his passion for many years.