Wage Subsidy Scheme Issues

Duke of Url

Archieboy13 wrote: »

I think legally group redundancies have to go through a 30 day process . People laid off due to covid after the 17th only seem to be entitled to claim jobseekers. This cut off point seems really unfair ,people losing jobs after 17th getting abandoned by government, while a safety net of the COVID-19 payment provided for job losses before the 17th .

It is what it is.

The Government could keep pushing the date out and there will always be people effected who are made redundant after that date.

eg:

Move the cut off to 17 Oct => What happens to be people made redundant on the 18th Oct?

Move the cut off to 17 Nov = > What happens to be people made redundant on the 18th Nov?

Ireland cant continue to finance increased payments to Businesses and Individuals considering we are running a massive deficit and in recession.

Archieboy13

Duke of Url wrote: »

It is what it is.

The Government could keep pushing the date out and there will always be people effected who are made redundant after that date.

eg:

Move the cut off to 17 Oct => What happens to be people made redundant on the 18th Oct?


Move the cut off to 17 Nov = > What happens to be people made redundant on the 18th Nov?

Ireland cant continue to finance increased payments to Businesses and Individuals considering we are running a massive deficit and in recession.

Presume you're unaffected by job losses, ...

Duke of Url

Archieboy13 wrote: »

Presume you're unaffected by job losses, ...

Not at the moment but it could happen at any time.

But you could answer my questions above if you like.

I can understand your point as it effects you in this situation.

But if they extended by one month you will benefit but it will effect the next group of redundancies also.

it will just go around in circles.

You will never please everyone.

Archieboy13

Duke of Url wrote: »

Not at the moment but it could happen at any time.

But you could answer my questions above if you like.

I can understand your point as it effects you in this situation.

But if they extended by one month you will benefit but it will effect the next group of redundancies also.


it will just go around in circles.

You will never please everyone.

Totally understand that these payments cannot continue indefinitely. COVID-19 payment will be reduced to normal jobseekers rate in February 2021 , I think people who lose their jobs between now and then should be treated equally to those who lost their jobs prior to 17th of September and be entitled to the same assistance from government, then in February everyone still on COVID-19 payment go on to the reduced rate .

PickYourName

Archieboy13 wrote: »

Totally understand that these payments cannot continue indefinitely. COVID-19 payment will be reduced to normal jobseekers rate in February 2021 , I think people who lose their jobs between now and then should be treated equally to those who lost their jobs prior to 17th of September and be entitled to the same assistance from government, then in February everyone still on COVID-19 payment go on to the reduced rate .

Exactly. There's a basic unfairness there.

The government has already decided to fund this up until early next year, so everyone has the same notice.

It shouldn't matter when you are laid off or made redundant between now and then.

je551e

Hi anyone successfully upload the file? I keep getting header is invalid

collsoft

I was speaking with Revenue this morning and they said that there have been about 100 sweepback CSV files uploaded successfully this morning so far.

The first line of the CSV file must be "EMPLR_REG,PPSN,EMP_ID" (without the quotes) - this is the header line.

There is a template CSV file available from Revenue at

https://revenue.ie/en/corporate/communications/documents/ewss-july-august-sweepback.csv


Our Payroll Software can create the CSV file for you in the correct format. I know that Thesaurus/Brightpay also have this functionality - Im not sure about Sage, Payback or BRB, but it is likely that they may also have it too - check for an update in your Payroll Software.

je551e wrote: »

Hi anyone successfully upload the file? I keep getting header is invalid

je551e

collsoft wrote: »

I was speaking with Revenue this morning and they said that there have been about 100 sweepback CSV files uploaded successfully this morning so far.

The first line of the CSV file must be "EMPLR_REG,PPSN,EMP_ID" (without the quotes) - this is the header line.

There is a template CSV file available from Revenue at

https://revenue.ie/en/corporate/communications/documents/ewss-july-august-sweepback.csv


Our Payroll Software can create the CSV file for you in the correct format. I know that Thesaurus/Brightpay also have this functionality - Im not sure about Sage, Payback or BRB, but it is likely that they may also have it too - check for an update in your Payroll Software.

Thanks , sage haven’t created it yet. Using the header as per above but still won’t upload .

NewRed2

With this sweepback file, is it only relevant to those who were NOT on either TWSS or PUP? So if I had some on PUP and some on TWSS, and now everybody on EWSS, I take it the sweepback file is something I should ignore? Can anyone please confirm? Just a bit confused about the purpose of this one, thanks

je551e

je551e wrote: »

Thanks , sage haven’t created it yet. Using the header as per above but still won’t upload .

Sorted thanks , I had to convert it to csv comma delimited , it downloaded as a csv utf just in case anyone else has the same problem

Seve OB

NewRed2 wrote: »

With this sweepback file, is it only relevant to those who were NOT on either TWSS or PUP? So if I had some on PUP and some on TWSS, and now everybody on EWSS, I take it the sweepback file is something I should ignore? Can anyone please confirm? Just a bit confused about the purpose of this one, thanks

yea thats my understanding

qwabercd

I'm sure this has probably been covered already, but for those who have their net wages reduced due to the twss operation (with year end tax bill) that wasn't agreed to by employee, have employers agreed to true up to get the employee back to the same net position?

I've heard of some employers effectively paying a bonus to make the employees good. Not the case in other situations where the employee is left on the hook (with net pay reduced by up to 30%) even though no wage reduction was formally agreed.

Just wanted to see what general approach people are seeing.

collsoft

If you had any employees working with you in July or August who did not qualify for TWSS (and were not on PUP) then they would qualify for an EWSS sweepback subsidy now.

99% of the time we are talking about any newly hired employees who worked in July and August, but were not working with you in February.

Such employees would qualify for a sweepback subsidy even if they are no longer working for you now (but did in July/August)

NewRed2 wrote: »

With this sweepback file, is it only relevant to those who were NOT on either TWSS or PUP? So if I had some on PUP and some on TWSS, and now everybody on EWSS, I take it the sweepback file is something I should ignore? Can anyone please confirm? Just a bit confused about the purpose of this one, thanks

collsoft

Also, if you are an employer who never signed up for TWSS at all but is now signed up for EWSS then you would qualify for an EWSS sweepback for all of your employees now (excluding some connected persons)

kennethsmyth

qwabercd wrote: »

I'm sure this has probably been covered already, but for those who have their net wages reduced due to the twss operation (with year end tax bill) that wasn't agreed to by employee, have employers agreed to true up to get the employee back to the same net position?

I've heard of some employers effectively paying a bonus to make the employees good. Not the case in other situations where the employee is left on the hook (with net pay reduced by up to 30%) even though no wage reduction was formally agreed.

Just wanted to see what general approach people are seeing.

The general approach most employers are taking us keeping quiet and seeing how much pushback they get from employees when the tax bills etc come in. Essentially though if you assume the twss value to be gross along with whatever gross topup you got subtracted from your normal gross this is the amount you didn’t receive as gross pay. Under normal contracts the pay is stated gross and this amount would be due to you if you hadn’t directly consented to reduced pay or twss. It would be considered breach of contract.

Qprmeath

Has anybody tried to claim Short Time Work Support for the time they were on the TWSS? Citizens Advice says you can and Intreo also suggest so but my company won’t cooperate with a claim unless I put I worked full time which I didn’t on Xs and Os sheets

maj206

hi @qprmeath
i put in a claim for short time in mid July as my hours were cut even though my company was back up and running full time! i got back paid as far as early june from Intreo and only last week signed off it as i am back to full time hours since monday.
initally my company tried to tell me that i could not receive both TWSS and short time benefit but i knew i could , then they tried to tell me it could have huge tax implications for me if i went ahead but i did anyway cos i had no choice ......

Qprmeath

maj206 wrote: »

hi @qprmeath
i put in a claim for short time in mid July as my hours were cut even though my company was back up and running full time! i got back paid as far as early june from Intreo and only last week signed off it as i am back to full time hours since monday.
initally my company tried to tell me that i could not receive both TWSS and short time benefit but i knew i could , then they tried to tell me it could have huge tax implications for me if i went ahead but i did anyway cos i had no choice ......

Huge tax implications? But sure that’s not their problem if there’s any truth in it. My company claim Deasp told them all TWSS weeks are classed as full working weeks despite us only working 30% hours. With the result they will only process Xs and Os form for the period if you lie on them. It took them til August to finally co operate with us applying.

Tow

Qprmeath wrote: »

My company claim Deasp told them all TWSS weeks are classed as full working weeks despite us only working 30% hours.

This is partly true, but your employer is miss understanding its meaning. The J9 PRSI Class used by them to claim TWSS will be converted back to A in DEASP systems. But this is only effects for your entitlements, such as pension, maternity pay etc.

Qprmeath

Tow wrote: »

This is partly true, but your employer is miss understanding its meaning. The J9 PRSI Class used by them to claim TWSS will be converted back to A in DEASP systems. But this is only effects for your entitlements, such as pension, maternity pay etc.

Thank you for the reply. Have you any idea why an employer would actively discourage and obstruct you from applying?

Tow

Qprmeath wrote: »

Have you any idea why an employer would actively discourage and obstruct you from applying?

No. Only TWSS and PUP were mutually exclusive.


Here is the government press release for EWSS:

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/4b658-statement-on-social-welfare-payments-and-the-employment-wage-subsidy-scheme/

Subject to satisfying the relevant eligibility criteria, employees may claim casual (that is, part-time) jobseeker payments or Short-Time Work Support payments for days of unemployment, even where their employer is claiming the Employment Wage Subsidy Scheme for days of employment.

PickYourName

Qprmeath wrote: »

Thank you for the reply. Have you any idea why an employer would actively discourage and obstruct you from applying?

Pure speculation, but perhaps they don't want DEASP or Revenue enquiring too much into how they've been paying their employees.

Kewreeuss

It's very time consuming to fill in the x and o forms. That's probably why they are discouraging it.

Seve OB

Kewreeuss wrote: »

It's very time consuming to fill in the x and o forms. That's probably why they are discouraging it.

It takes about 10 seconds to sign and stamp

collsoft

Not sure if this was posted before, but PUP has been extended to allow new entrants until the end of 2020.

Originally PUP only allowed new entrants up until 17th September

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/9f11b-pandemic-unemployment-payment-to-remain-open-for-new-entrants/

Kewreeuss

Seve OB wrote: »

It takes about 10 seconds to sign and stamp

Maybe if you don't have many employees and they all work the same hours Monday to Friday, no variations.

VanGo27

je551e wrote: »

Sorted thanks , I had to convert it to csv comma delimited , it downloaded as a csv utf just in case anyone else has the same problem

Thank you JE551E. Your tip ref delimited csv is a great help. I was having the same problem with the EWSS sweepback template.

Pistachio19

Trying to do TWSS Reconciliation. I have uploaded the CSV file from our payroll to ROS but out of 20 items, 8 are invalid - main reason being 'The subsidy detail PPSN does not match the PPSN on the referenced payslip' and one with 'The payslip referenced in the subsidy data does not include an Employee ID'. The invalid ones are from July/August payroll while April - June are all valid. I cannot see any difference in the data apart from the fact that July and August were on a week 1 basis. PPSN are the same, ID are the same. I'm a bit flummoxed.

mogilvie

Pistachio19 wrote: »

Trying to do TWSS Reconciliation. I have uploaded the CSV file from our payroll to ROS but out of 20 items, 8 are invalid - main reason being 'The subsidy detail PPSN does not match the PPSN on the referenced payslip' and one with 'The payslip referenced in the subsidy data does not include an Employee ID'. The invalid ones are from July/August payroll while April - June are all valid. I cannot see any difference in the data apart from the fact that July and August were on a week 1 basis. PPSN are the same, ID are the same. I'm a bit flummoxed.

It's difficult to figure out the cause for the errors without seeing the file and the details in the Payroll Submission Request.
You only have two types of error, so I would suggest logging into ROS and taking a look at the PSR's for some of the employees. In particular looking at the EmployeeID in both the rec. file and the PSR.
If you've done that, and still can't see a difference then you'll probably have to get in touch with Revenue and your software company.

Regards,
Mark

Green Mile

Where can I get the csv template for the TWSS Reconciliation so that I an complete and load to ros?
My system doesn't produce a TWSS Reconciliation so have to do this manually.