Relaxation of restrictions

JRant

carolmon wrote: »

Just to be clear I'm not begrudging the elderly couple their celebration... I was just confused about the restrictions after I saw rte report it as a good news story.

I then thought maybe we are allowed to call to a friend's garden once we don't go inside (I was hoping as it's very tough doing this totally alone)

If you think you need to call over to someone and have a chat from 2+ meters away then go for it. Helping your mental health is just as important as your physical health. Also, don't be listening to the jobsworths telling you it's breaking the rules. We have evolved as a social creature for hundreds of thousands of years. A dictate from Leo and Co a week or two ago is not going to override that basic human need to actually see and talk to people.

Stheno

VonLuck wrote: »

I was just reading an Irish Times article where they said that smaller construction sites may also re-open although offices would remain closed for “many months more”, with working from home to remain in place “for the foreseeable future”.

Slightly surprised that the government is already saying this before the end of this additional 3 week period.

It's the same as what they did last week

Everyone who followed the news knew the restrictions would be extended

They probably have a more up to date idea of the situation as well

At least it shows they've some sort of plan

alwald

MadYaker wrote: »

Go look at what they are doing in South Korea and Taiwan. That’s the road map we need to follow.

Saying there’ll be no vaccine or cure is a fantasy and if you want to engage in fantasies I won’t stop you.

First start by dropping the patronising tone and regarding the vaccine/cure there are no fantasies but rather observations.

_Kaiser_

Ace2007 wrote: »

Society will be redesigned after this - there is no question about it. People and companies will act differently - no longer will you be going to work with the cold or bad cough - If nothing else, health and safety along with insurance won't allow it. Just like nowadays, if you have sick cert from a doctor, your not insured to be in the work environment - just depends on your sector if it's enforced.

Office companies can no longer turn around and say that they can't support wfh when 99% of their current workforce are doing just that for weeks on end.

I keep reading sentiments like this and I just can't see it happening.

There won't be any great awakening out of this. I fully expect life to resume in the same way as it was 6 months ago after this is all over.

KiKi III

JRant wrote: »

If you think you need to call over to someone and have a chat from 2+ meters away then go for it. Helping your mental health is just as important as your physical health. Also, don't be listening to the jobsworths telling you it's breaking the rules. We have evolved as a social creature for hundreds of thousands of years. A dictate from Leo and Co a week or two ago is not going to override that basic human need to actually see and talk to people.

The problem isn't with any individual taking this attitude. One person having a quick chat with one other person isn't going to cause huge problems.

But if we all take that attitude we'll be f*cked.

Ace2007

screamer wrote: »

It may not be what you want to hear but there may not be a cure or a vaccine. Think of all the diseases that we currently cannot cure not prevent. We all hope for a cure and vaccine for this virus but time will be the only thing to judge whether we manage it or not.

But of how the diseases that we have at the moment there are a number of way to prevent and reduce the chances of getting such disease - clean diet, exercise, don't smoke, don't drink excessively, don't do drugs etc.

Just like this virus - we will learn and change the way we behave.

JRant

Ace2007 wrote: »

Society will be redesigned after this - there is no question about it. People and companies will act differently - no longer will you be going to work with the cold or bad cough - If nothing else, health and safety along with insurance won't allow it. Just like nowadays, if you have sick cert from a doctor, your not insured to be in the work environment - just depends on your sector if it's enforced.

Office companies can no longer turn around and say that they can't support wfh when 99% of their current workforce are doing just that for weeks on end.

Some sectors will have a rethink about how they do business. There's a lot of talk about having a 50/50 split between wfh and the office. I was lucky, I had that before the restrictions. However, it may not be possible in the long term for a lot of offices.

I agree about sick people coming into work. I have often told team members to go home when they come in with a cold/flu, especially when wfh is an option.

I can't see a massive change in society as a whole though.

Ace2007

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I keep reading sentiments like this and I just can't see it happening.

There won't be any great awakening out of this. I fully expect life to resume in the same way as it was 6 months ago after this is all over.

It's not going to be over though - why do you think it will just disappear?

Let's save a vaccine is found to work, between trials etc going to take min 12 months - probably 18. Then it has to be manufactured in bulk and rolled out globally - and when that happens, they wont' just have 5 million doses ready to go in Ireland - potentially another year before everyone in the world gets the vaccine - so that's basically 2.5 years away from now.

We need to learn to live and get on with things with this virus, but the best way is to stay in lock down a few more weeks, until the health system can cope and we have a better understanding of how other countries who lift restrictions get on.

polesheep

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I keep reading sentiments like this and I just can't see it happening.

There won't be any great awakening out of this. I fully expect life to resume in the same way as it was 6 months ago after this is all over.

True. All the silly notions of a bright new world are as nonsensical as notions that restrictions will go on indefinitely. Human nature will not change. We will reset to normal much quicker than many realise. For the vulnerable, avoiding Covid will be like taking extra care crossing the road. Most people will run across the road as normal.

polesheep

Stateofyou wrote: »

It's not responsible though is it, when it's breaking the restrictions that are there for all of us, designed for us to work together in a common goal to reduce transmission. Boo hoo? Wow. Suppose hundreds of thousands woke up tomorrow with that attitude and flouted the rules, telling themselves they all have a very good reason and causing no harm. Where would we be then.

At the next stage.

Stateofyou

JRant wrote: »

If you think you need to call over to someone and have a chat from 2+ meters away then go for it. Helping your mental health is just as important as your physical health. Also, don't be listening to the jobsworths telling you it's breaking the rules. We have evolved as a social creature for hundreds of thousands of years. A dictate from Leo and Co a week or two ago is not going to override that basic human need to actually see and talk to people.

That's the most selfish piece I've read in a while. That "dictate" is going to override actually as there is now legislation in place to enforce it. Also evolved over hundreds of thousands of years has developed a community, a society in which we must all work together to contribute our small part for each other, in lots of different ways. A global pandemic in which we're asked/required to follow rules so that we can all make it through to the best of our ability is an exceptional time. You shouldn't be openly advising people to potentially harm themselves and others.

niallo27

alwald wrote: »

First start by dropping the patronising tone and regarding the vaccine/cure there are no fantasies but rather observations.

Well you should observe that most scientists agree that there will be a vaccine, reasons for other corona vaccines not being developed was due to lack of funding as there was no commercial need for it.

trapp

Ace2007 wrote: »

It's not going to be over though - why do you think it will just disappear?

Let's save a vaccine is found to work, between trials etc going to take min 12 months - probably 18. Then it has to be manufactured in bulk and rolled out globally - and when that happens, they wont' just have 5 million doses ready to go in Ireland - potentially another year before everyone in the world gets the vaccine - so that's basically 2.5 years away from now.

We need to learn to live and get on with things with this virus, but the best way is to stay in lock down a few more weeks, until the health system can cope and we have a better understanding of how other countries who lift restrictions get on.

I would imagine the vaccine will only be for vulnerable groups, similar to the flu vaccine now.

Agree with your second paragraph.

MadYaker

screamer wrote: »

It may not be what you want to hear but there may not be a cure or a vaccine. Think of all the diseases that we currently cannot cure not prevent. We all hope for a cure and vaccine for this virus but time will be the only thing to judge whether we manage it or not.

Do you understand what clinical trials for drugs are? There are numerous anti viral drugs which already existed now be tested on Coronavirus patients to see which are effective. Some have already been shown to be effective. We will have effective treatments in a few months using drugs that already existed. This is much faster than developing a vaccine which will be next year at least. These treatments combined with testing, contact tracing, social distancing and probably mandatory mask wearing is how we get out of this lockdown gradually. Can’t see all that happening in the next 3 weeks though.

trapp

MadYaker wrote: »

Do you understand what clinical trials for drugs are? There are numerous anti viral drugs which already existed now be tested on Coronavirus patients to see which are effective. Some have already been shown to be effective. We will have effective treatments in a few months using drugs that already existed. This is much faster than developing a vaccine which will be next year at least. These treatments combined with testing, contact tracing, social distancing and probably mandatory mask wearing is how we get out of this lockdown gradually. Can’t see all that happening in the next 3 weeks though.

Can't see that happening for some reason.

Maybe at the beginning but can't picture Irish people all wearing masks rightly or wrongly!

niallo27

Ace2007 wrote: »

It's not going to be over though - why do you think it will just disappear?

Let's save a vaccine is found to work, between trials etc going to take min 12 months - probably 18. Then it has to be manufactured in bulk and rolled out globally - and when that happens, they wont' just have 5 million doses ready to go in Ireland - potentially another year before everyone in the world gets the vaccine - so that's basically 2.5 years away from now.

We need to learn to live and get on with things with this virus, but the best way is to stay in lock down a few more weeks, until the health system can cope and we have a better understanding of how other countries who lift restrictions get on.

In reality though only 5% of the population would need the vaccine first off. You do know jnj and regeneron are mass producing from september on their vaccine they think has the best chance.

alwald

niallo27 wrote: »

Well you should observe that most scientists agree that there will be a vaccine, reasons for other corona vaccines not being developed was due to lack of funding as there was no commercial need for it.

You should also observe that scientists say that there is 80% chance of a vaccine and not 100% if you know your maths well enough.

JRant

Stateofyou wrote: »

It's not responsible though is it, when it's breaking the restrictions that are there for all of us, designed for us to work together in a common goal to reduce transmission. Boo hoo? Wow. Suppose hundreds of thousands woke up tomorrow with that attitude and flouted the rules, telling themselves they all have a very good reason and causing no harm. Where would we be then.

It is responsible if you are struggling mentally and need to talk to someone. Not everyone can live like a hermit shut off from society.

Also, who was it designed by? It seems that the modelling we are constantly being reminded of has to date been completely off. That doesn't surprise me in the slightest though. I deal a good bit with computer modelling and any results from them need to be taken with a massive pinch of salt. Forecasting this type of scenario with so many variables is impossible. Look at weather forecasting. Some of the most powerful computers on the planet and scientists with decades of experience can only really get to about 3 days out with any degree of certainty. After that is a craps shoot.

MadYaker

trapp wrote: »

Can't see that happening for some reason.

Maybe at the beginning but can't picture Irish people all wearing masks rightly or wrongly!

I don’t think we’ll have a choice to be honest, in public anyway. Rather be out an about a bit wearing a mask than be stuck inside all the time.

niallo27

alwald wrote: »

You should also observe that scientists say that there is 80% chance of a vaccine and not 100% if you know your maths well enough.

Where did you see this 80% figure.

trapp

JRant wrote: »

It is responsible if you are struggling mentally and need to talk to someone. Not everyone can live like a hermit shut off from society.

Also, who was it designed by? It seems that the modelling we are constantly being reminded of has to date been completely off. That doesn't surprise me in the slightest though. I deal a good bit with computer modelling and any results from them need to be taken with a massive pinch of salt. Forecasting this type of scenario with so many variables is impossible. Look at weather forecasting. Some of the most powerful computers on the planet and scientists with decades of experience can only really get to about 3 days out with any degree of certainty. After that is a craps shoot.

Exactly.

The man from Maynooth seemed very confident in his model but how can he be?

There are far too many variables.

STB.

VonLuck wrote: »

I was just reading an Irish Times article where they said that smaller construction sites may also re-open although offices would remain closed for “many months more”, with working from home to remain in place “for the foreseeable future”.

Slightly surprised that the government is already saying this before the end of this additional 3 week period.

You haven't been paying attention to the figures then. We have went from 40 to just under 10,000 cases in a month with a limited testing regime.


There is a degree of crowd control going on with these soundbites. If they are upfront there might be anarchy so you will just have to get used to being drip fed extensions. We have one of the lowest ICU capacities in Europe and cannot take chances.

JRant

Stateofyou wrote: »

That's the most selfish piece I've read in a while. That "dictate" is going to override actually as there is now legislation in place to enforce it. Also evolved over hundreds of thousands of years has developed a community, a society in which we must all work together to contribute our small part for each other, in lots of different ways. A global pandemic in which we're asked/required to follow rules so that we can all make it through to the best of our ability is an exceptional time. You shouldn't be openly advising people to potentially harm themselves and others.

Advising people to harm themselves and others?

Would you ever get over yourself with the sensationalist nonsense. The person said they were struggling and needed someone to talk to. They aren't going around licking each other's faces.

And no, a dictate does not override human nature after a tiny amount of time. There are no laws preventing you from talking to others at a safe distance.

Maybe the government should start building bunkers for the permanently scared and let the rest of us get on with living.

Ace2007

niallo27 wrote: »

In reality though only 5% of the population would need the vaccine first off. You do know jnj and regeneron are mass producing from september on their vaccine they think has the best chance.

September that's in 5 months time?

alwald

niallo27 wrote: »

Where did you see this 80% figure.

Google, read and analyse and you will find this information from the professor in Oxford University who is heading a UK team developing a vaccine. This is from their last updates on the vaccine.

polesheep

JRant wrote: »

Advising people to harm themselves and others?

Would you ever get over yourself with the sensationalist nonsense. The person said they were struggling and needed someone to talk to. They aren't going around licking each other's faces.

And no, a dictate does not override human nature after a tiny amount of time. There are no laws preventing you from talking to others at a safe distance.

Maybe the government should start building bunkers for the permanently scared and let the rest of us get on with living.

Made my day. Thanks.

niallo27

Ace2007 wrote: »

September that's in 5 months time?

I see you know your maths too.

niallo27

alwald wrote: »

Google, read and analyse and you will find this information from the professor in Oxford University who is heading a UK team developing a vaccine. This is from their last updates on the vaccine.

A quick Google and I found no posts saying they think there will be no vaccine.

niallo27

niallo27 wrote: »

I see you know your maths too.

Realistically, it's highly unlikely that there will be any vaccine publicly available until next year.

KiKi III

niallo27 wrote: »

In reality though only 5% of the population would need the vaccine first off. You do know jnj and regeneron are mass producing from september on their vaccine they think has the best chance.

It's not like pharma companies have a vested interest in rushing an under-tested, unproven vaccine to market...