Relaxation of restrictions

lainey_d_123

KiKi III wrote: »

Fact check: No one is imprisoned in their homes. No one is suggesting this should go on indefinitely.

They basically are. A lockdown so strict that people are being shamed for exercising outside (even when officially allowed) and only expected to go out for essential food is basically being imprisoned in your home. What else would you call it? I'm certainly not free to do whatever I want and would certainly be stopped if i tried to do something as inoffensive as read a book in the park in the sun. This is a total stripping of civil liberties - whether it's for the greater good is irrelevant. Stop lying to yourself about what it is.

Blueshoe

ITman88 wrote: »

We don’t know if it’s the restrictions. What is implemented elsewhere may not be effective in Ireland. I think we should of followed Singapore’s stance, kids in school and business open. Then shut the airports.
Implementing a lockdown is useless if its not implemented within a 10 day timeframe. To early or to late and it will have no effects.

We can’t compare Ireland to mainland Europe or the UK.

We don’t have any historical issues with flu endemics like the ageing populations in Europe have had over the last few years.

The Italian health service have had warnings about this before and they also had triage issues and overcrowding like they are experiencing now.

In Italy they had an incredibly low number of flu deaths this season in comparison to recent years and thus a number of vulnerable people were then in a precarious scenario when this hit. (Germany interestingly had a very difficult flu season with many deaths accountable to flu up to February)

Our population density is also a positive in a pandemic, in Lombardy they have an ageing 10m in an area the size of Munster.

The ageing population in Italy was becoming such a problem that they introduced grants to encourage people to have kids.

I believe we won’t see anything like we have seen on the European mainland, I’ll stay optimistic

We are relying on the HSE. A service that cannot cope with the annual winter flu. A service with 800,000 people on waiting lists for appointments (imagine the figure after this is over)

We cannot risk them being overrun. It would be mayhem and a complete disaster. .

suicide_circus

the comparisons with WWI veterans are fun but not exactly useful.

The lads who fought in WWI didn't know how good they had it, early Christians were fed to the lions in Roman colosseums!

Harry Palmr

The governments balancing act is not to rob people of light at the end of the staycation tunnel. If the reaction to the next announcement is one of annoyance/frustration/sorrow rather than an "ah well" shrug then it won't be long before the whole policy is in tatters.

Raconteuse

niallo27 wrote: »

Exactly, could you imagine what the generations who fought wars would have said, get back to work you soft *****, i saw thousands die all around me and you are afraid of a virus.

Let the over 60s and immuno-compromised just die in their hundreds per day like in Italy and Spain eh?

Shur they're only useless people anyway.

Thelonious Monk

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

They basically are. A lockdown so strict that people are being shamed for exercising outside (even when officially allowed) and only expected to go out for essential food is basically being imprisoned in your home. What else would you call it? I'm certainly not free to do whatever I want and would certainly be stopped if i tried to do something as inoffensive as read a book in the park in the sun. This is a total stripping of civil liberties - whether it's for the greater good is irrelevant. Stop lying to yourself about what it is.

Lainey your posts are a bit hysterical on these matters. You are freaking out about the whole thing but most of us are doing ok.

lainey_d_123

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

There's no way people can cope with it being that long. Honestly just no way. The only reason there should ever be an 'explosion of cases' once people have been locked down for several weeks is if mass travel starts up again. I can understand that being pushed back as far as possible. But this extreme social distancing and isolation cannot last for months more.



Such an incredible lack of empathy, it's unbelievable.

You do realise a lot of people have mental and physical health needs which are going completely or almost completely unmet during this crisis? As everything else is shelved in favour of coronavirus stuff, people are going without therapy sessions, medication and having operations pushed back, and on top of all this, are unable to do anything which might help, such as meet friends, play group sports or any of the other things which are normally suggested when you're having a hard time? How do you think it feels for someone with chronic depression or illness to be stuck inside 24/7, alone?

That's only one aspect. There's also the pressure it puts on relationships, probably an increase in domestic violence, people cracking under pressure trying to homeschool kids, do housework AND work from home, in addition to the worries and stress many people are facing about money, security and work at the moment.

You might be fine, but that doesn't mean everyone else is. Pretty hard to focus on reading or doing online courses when you're in a terrible mental state and have no idea when it will end.

I've got some pretty extreme anxiety and depression, been on it for years. Also have a chronic illness that requires me to get treated in a hospital every two months. No idea if that treatment will go ahead. I also faced a drastic pay cut.

Yes, I feel pretty awful about it all but I view the measures as entirely necessary. We're only a few days into a very light lockdown and posters are behaving as if it's been ongoing for months.

Blueshoe

Today's figures should put an end to the nonsense talk

landofthetree

http://www.westmeathexaminer.ie/2020/04/01/over-by-summer-if-we-comply/

June or July at the earliest according to Kingston Mills- an expert experimental immunology at TCD.

ITman88

Raconteuse wrote: »

Let the over 60s and immuno-compromised just die in their hundreds per day like in Italy and Spain eh?

Shur they're only useless people anyway.

No one is suggesting that.

It has however been happening for years now, so while you were being passive aggressive you need to check out what’s being going on in Italy for a number of years

lainey_d_123

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Lainey your posts are a bit hysterical on these matters. You are freaking out about the whole thing but most of us are doing ok.

Oh, well that's grand then, once you're alright, Jack.

No need to worry about the many, many people who are NOT doing OK, and who will be unable to cope with this situation if it went on for many months.

KiKi III

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

There's no way people can cope with it being that long. Honestly just no way. The only reason there should ever be an 'explosion of cases' once people have been locked down for several weeks is if mass travel starts up again. I can understand that being pushed back as far as possible. But this extreme social distancing and isolation cannot last for months more.



Such an incredible lack of empathy, it's unbelievable.

You do realise a lot of people have mental and physical health needs which are going completely or almost completely unmet during this crisis? As everything else is shelved in favour of coronavirus stuff, people are going without therapy sessions, medication and having operations pushed back, and on top of all this, are unable to do anything which might help, such as meet friends, play group sports or any of the other things which are normally suggested when you're having a hard time? How do you think it feels for someone with chronic depression or illness to be stuck inside 24/7, alone?

That's only one aspect. There's also the pressure it puts on relationships, probably an increase in domestic violence, people cracking under pressure trying to homeschool kids, do housework AND work from home, in addition to the worries and stress many people are facing about money, security and work at the moment.

You might be fine, but that doesn't mean everyone else is. Pretty hard to focus on reading or doing online courses when you're in a terrible mental state and have no idea when it will end.

My empathy is primarily with those suffering from Covid 19, their families, those mourning lost loved ones and the frontline medical staff dealing with it.

Is it crap to miss a therapy session if you’ve got depression? Yes. Is it crap to feel lonely or bored at home on your own for a few weeks? Yes. Do we need to suck it up for a few weeks? Yes.

I’m doing my therapy sessions over Skype and it’s going fine. Pieta House are still providing remote support. People need to get creative and come up with solutions instead of problems.

We’re still able to get outside every day, speak to our loved ones, find all sorts of entertainment, stay safe and healthy and all we have to do is stay at home. It’s a small sacrifice.

13 new deaths and 400 new cases today.

I’m bored and frustrated at home. I miss my family. My housemate and I are starting to get on each other’s nerves. But I’m more than happy to continue with this for the next 2-4 weeks to save hundreds, or maybe thousands of lives.

HBC08

ITman88 wrote: »

So are you suggesting we lift the restrictions then?

Do the opposite of the UK?

No,
What I said wasnt hard to read.

ITman88

ITman88 wrote: »

No one is suggesting that.

It has however been happening for years now, so while you were being passive aggressive you need to check out what’s being going on in Italy for a number of years

I honestly am inclined to trust the various global medical authorities including virologists and epidemiologist in terms of the necessity of maintaining the lockdown..

Thelonious Monk

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Oh, well that's grand then, once you're alright, Jack.

No need to worry about the many, many people who are NOT doing OK, and who will be unable to cope with this situation if it went on for many months.

I'm not alright, my parents and brother are stranded abroad, I haven't spoken to someone in person in ages. But until I have no shelter or food on the table I'll just have to relax. Try doing the same yourself.

lainey_d_123

Deleted User wrote: »

I've got some pretty extreme anxiety and depression, been on it for years. Also have a chronic illness that requires me to get treated in a hospital every two months. No idea if that treatment will go ahead. I also faced a drastic pay cut.

Yes, I feel pretty awful about it all but I view the measures as entirely necessary. We're only a few days into a very light lockdown and posters are behaving as if it's been ongoing for months.

I would hardly call almost everything being shut and only being able to leave the house for food and exercise a 'light lockdown'.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't do the lockdown or try our best to limit the spread of the virus. But there will be a point where the collateral damage will outweigh the benefits. It simply can't go on for as long as some people here are saying. I don't think some people understand what the economy collapsing will actually look like.

Thelonious Monk

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

It simply can't go on for as long as some people here are saying

It simply might have to Lainey, it's not up to you

KiKi III

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

They basically are. A lockdown so strict that people are being shamed for exercising outside (even when officially allowed) and only expected to go out for essential food is basically being imprisoned in your home. What else would you call it? I'm certainly not free to do whatever I want and would certainly be stopped if i tried to do something as inoffensive as read a book in the park in the sun. This is a total stripping of civil liberties - whether it's for the greater good is irrelevant. Stop lying to yourself about what it is.

I’m not lying to myself, I’m just not quite as dramatic as you.

Padre_Pio

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

There's no way people can cope with it being that long. Honestly just no way. The only reason there should ever be an 'explosion of cases' once people have been locked down for several weeks is if mass travel starts up again. I can understand that being pushed back as far as possible. But this extreme social distancing and isolation cannot last for months more.



Such an incredible lack of empathy, it's unbelievable.

You do realise a lot of people have mental and physical health needs which are going completely or almost completely unmet during this crisis? As everything else is shelved in favour of coronavirus stuff, people are going without therapy sessions, medication and having operations pushed back, and on top of all this, are unable to do anything which might help, such as meet friends, play group sports or any of the other things which are normally suggested when you're having a hard time? How do you think it feels for someone with chronic depression or illness to be stuck inside 24/7, alone?

That's only one aspect. There's also the pressure it puts on relationships, probably an increase in domestic violence, people cracking under pressure trying to homeschool kids, do housework AND work from home, in addition to the worries and stress many people are facing about money, security and work at the moment.

You might be fine, but that doesn't mean everyone else is. Pretty hard to focus on reading or doing online courses when you're in a terrible mental state and have no idea when it will end.

Sake, our hospitals are soon to be packed to the brim with Coronavirus patients, soon to have large numbers of deaths and illnesses and your gripe is that the 5 a side is cancelled, parents have to spend more time with their kids and people's therapy sessions arent going ahead (not even online?)
Also NO ONE, not a single person in the country, not even solitary confinement prisoners, is forced to be indoors alone 24/7.I can understand that people may have illnesses or disabilities where they can't go outside, but the needs of the vast vast majority need to out weigh the needs of the few here.

This lock down isn't bad. I totally understand it's outside the norm, stressful and we'll all be happier when it's over, but I'm going for a walk now on a lovely afternoon, my neighbours kids are playing out their back garden, I'm working and chatting to friends and family online daily.

If the alternative means my parents and gradparents might die, then I'll easily endure this.

ITman88

Blueshoe wrote: »

Today's figures should put an end to the nonsense talk

Can you elaborate?

lainey_d_123

KiKi III wrote: »

My empathy is primarily with those suffering from Covid 19, their families, those mourning lost loved ones and the frontline medical staff dealing with it.

Is it crap to miss a therapy session if you’ve got depression? Yes. Is it crap to feel lonely or bored at home on your own for a few weeks? Yes. Do we need to suck it up for a few weeks? Yes.

I’m doing my therapy sessions over Skype and it’s going fine. Pieta House are still providing remote support. People need to get creative and come up with solutions instead of problems.

We’re still able to get outside every day, speak to our loved ones, find all sorts of entertainment, stay safe and healthy and all we have to do is stay at home. It’s a small sacrifice.

13 new deaths and 400 new cases today.

I’m bored and frustrated at home. I miss my family. My housemate and I are starting to get on each other’s nerves. But I’m more than happy to continue with this for the next 2-4 weeks to save hundreds, or maybe thousands of lives.

But we're not talking 2-4 weeks, are we? There are people on here suggesting it could be months, and we'd have to suck it up. That's what the issue is.

I'm sure most people could manage if they knew for sure that this situation would be over in a month. Far easier to cope with being stuck at home and all that comes with it if it's for a defined period of time. It's the uncertainty that people are struggling with. I've been having some horrendous symptoms with my chronic illness and it's enormously stressful trying to decide whether I can justify taking up NHS resources by trying to see a doctor, or whether I can just wait it out. Far easier to do that if you know it's just a few weeks compared to it potentially being 6 months.

lainey_d_123

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It simply might have to Lainey, it's not up to you

How long do you think things can go on like this before there is serious social unrest and economic consequences? I don't think it's as long as you seem to think.

Jurgen Klopp

I'd say current lockdown will be extended for 2 more weeks, giving 4 in total.

Then back to restrictions.

The only way we'll know for sure how long that can last is when Leo addresses the nation to say we can no longer pay dole, pensions, invalidity and disability benefit and expect medicines to be rationed in hospitals as we cannot borrow anymore

I say this as someone that would be labeled "vulrenable" there will be crunch point when they can't keep up the payments lads, that unemployed list gets bigger the longer it goes on

ITman88

HBC08 wrote: »

No,
What I said wasnt hard to read.

So we do follow what the UK officials have implemented then?

KiKi III

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

But we're not talking 2-4 weeks, are we? There are people on here suggesting it could be months, and we'd have to suck it up. That's what the issue is.

I'm sure most people could manage if they knew for sure that this situation would be over in a month. Far easier to cope with being stuck at home and all that comes with it if it's for a defined period of time. It's the uncertainty that people are struggling with. I've been having some horrendous symptoms with my chronic illness and it's enormously stressful trying to decide whether I can justify taking up NHS resources by trying to see a doctor, or whether I can just wait it out. Far easier to do that if you know it's just a few weeks compared to it potentially being 6 months.

Maybe listen to what government ministers and health officials are talking about in terms of guidelines instead of getting yourself in a tizzy because of what some anonymous boards posters are saying.

Likewise, the best way to decide if you need to go to the doctor with your symptoms is to phone up and speak to them.

Thelonious Monk

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

How long do you think things can go on like this before there is serious social unrest and economic consequences? I don't think it's as long as you seem to think.

There are economic consequences already. We're all gonna be f*cking broke for ages. There's no more foreign holidays. But what can you do. We'll hopefully still have food and shelter, and have it better than most people have ever had in the past up until recently.
Social unrest - maybe where you are but people in Ireland generally don't riot etc. So I'm not worried about that.

ITman88

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

But we're not talking 2-4 weeks, are we? There are people on here suggesting it could be months, and we'd have to suck it up. That's what the issue is.

I'm sure most people could manage if they knew for sure that this situation would be over in a month. Far easier to cope with being stuck at home and all that comes with it if it's for a defined period of time. It's the uncertainty that people are struggling with. I've been having some horrendous symptoms with my chronic illness and it's enormously stressful trying to decide whether I can justify taking up NHS resources by trying to see a doctor, or whether I can just wait it out. Far easier to do that if you know it's just a few weeks compared to it potentially being 6 months.

Exactly.
Posters suggesting lockdown to go on indefinitely can’t happen.
Incidentally Dr Holohan said St. James was empty Tuesday night.

ITman88

ITman88 wrote: »

So we do follow what the UK officials have implemented then?

The UK's lockdown is pretty non existent, people are still going to work. The underground has been full... So their measures are not exactly limiting the spread. In addition, you only end up tested if you end up in hospital. So they don't even know where the hotspots are. So no country should model their policy on the UK's implementation.

lainey_d_123

Padre_Pio wrote: »

Sake, our hospitals are soon to be packed to the brim with Coronavirus patients, soon to have large numbers of deaths and illnesses and your gripe is that the 5 a side is cancelled, parents have to spend more time with their kids and people's therapy sessions arent going ahead (not even online?)
Also NO ONE, not a single person in the country, not even solitary confinement prisoners, is forced to be indoors alone 24/7.I can understand that people may have illnesses or disabilities where they can't go outside, but the needs of the vast vast majority need to out weigh the needs of the few here.

This lock down isn't bad. I totally understand it's outside the norm, stressful and we'll all be happier when it's over, but I'm going for a walk now on a lovely afternoon, my neighbours kids are playing out their back garden, I'm working and chatting to friends and family online daily.

If the alternative means my parents and gradparents might die, then I'll easily endure this.

And here we go, another person minimising the issue and talking rubbish.

I didn't say a thing about 5-a-side being cancelled. I said that mental illness is not a joke, and there will be huge numbers of people suffering from being either alone or trapped with others, including domestic violence, self harm and suicides, which are also going take up resources. There will be lots of deaths which could have been prevented if people had had access to healthcare.

I'm in support of the lockdown, BTW. I think it's definitely worth a try for everyone to do what they can to prevent spread and deaths. But what happens after this initial stage? It's not going to just disappear. Then what?

ITman88

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

There are economic consequences already. We're all gonna be f*cking broke for ages. There's no more foreign holidays. But what can you do. We'll hopefully still have food and shelter, and have it better than most people have ever had in the past up until recently.

Very noble comment.

However foreign holidays are the least of our worries.
More lives will be lost due to the economy