Championship and Covid

TCDStudent1

Always_Running wrote: »

I see across the water Man United are in talks on allowing 12,000 supporters to attend their opening PL game against Crystal Palace on September 19th.

Meanwhile here club games including many upcoming county finals are played behind closed doors and the NFL is meant to return next month and still nobody knows if a small crowd such as 200 people will be allowed to attend.

Do you have a link for this? Couldn't find the article.

threeball

Always_Running wrote: »

I see across the water Man United are in talks on allowing 12,000 supporters to attend their opening PL game against Crystal Palace on September 19th.

Meanwhile here club games including many upcoming county finals are played behind closed doors and the NFL is meant to return next month and still nobody knows if a small crowd such as 200 people will be allowed to attend.

Business has been calling the shots in the UK. They kept pubs open for weeks after warnings, tube stations running to keep London businesses open and now they want no one visiting other homes but will allow 12,000 to Old Trafford. I wouldn't pay much heed to what those dozey bastards are doing over there. Boris is clueless.
I do agree that the current restrictions at club games are ridiculous. Big difference between 2-300 at a club game and 12000 in a stadium with people coming from all over the UK.

Bonniedog

seligehgit wrote: »

Mod Note

Jayesdiem

You are no longer permitted to post on this thread.

Why?

He is one of few here talking sense.

The breakdown of figures on deaths show that 95% of people who have died had some other underlying condition.

This whole thing is being totally exaggerated. Quite an interesting study in mass hysteria and blind intolerance of anyone questioning what we are being told.

Rather sad.

kippy

Bonniedog wrote: »

Why?

He is one of few here talking sense.

The breakdown of figures on deaths show that 95% of people who have died had some other underlying condition.

This whole thing is being totally exaggerated. Quite an interesting study in mass hysteria and blind intolerance of anyone questioning what we are being told.

Rather sad.

Whats exaggerated about it?

Bonniedog

kippy wrote: »

Whats exaggerated about it?

The incidence, the number of deaths, the chances of dying if you do get it, and so on ...

Basically what the HSE's own statistics show is that hardly anyone is dying solely of Covid 19. The same pattern is emerging in other countries.


This from RTE report on excess deaths between March and Julyy:

It is also notable that this latest excess mortality estimate of between 850 and 900 deaths is substantially lower than the official total of 1,763 Covid-19 related deaths reported in Ireland by the end of the July.

This may suggest that up to half of those whose deaths were either "confirmed, probably or possibly" caused by Covid-19 during the first five months of the pandemic could have been likely to pass away from other causes during that period but that Covid-19 hastened their passing.

RTE is hardly part of a conspiracy theory.

dobman88

Bonniedog wrote: »

Why?

He is one of few here talking sense.

The breakdown of figures on deaths show that 95% of people who have died had some other underlying condition.

This whole thing is being totally exaggerated. Quite an interesting study in mass hysteria and blind intolerance of anyone questioning what we are being told.

Rather sad.

Because this is a thread for GAA and the effect covid is having. All those things you mentioned are being discussed over in the covid forum on various threads.

Bonniedog

Haven't been on for a few weeks but I notice that others who actually initially brought the broader picture into discussion of GAA restrictions, are still here.

I do, however, accept your point. Rather difficult to discuss one without the other at the same time.

Always_Running

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

Do you have a link for this? Couldn't find the article.

Journalist Oliver Kay tweeted up the story earlier with article link included.

Always_Running

threeball wrote: »

Business has been calling the shots in the UK. They kept pubs open for weeks after warnings, tube stations running to keep London businesses open and now they want no one visiting other homes but will allow 12,000 to Old Trafford. I wouldn't pay much heed to what those dozey bastards are doing over there. Boris is clueless.
I do agree that the current restrictions at club games are ridiculous. Big difference between 2-300 at a club game and 12000 in a stadium with people coming from all over the UK.

The 12,000 in Old Trafford for September 19th is very unlikely to get the green light now after Boris latest restrictions of only 6 people to meet up in groups.

kippy

Bonniedog wrote: »

The incidence, the number of deaths, the chances of dying if you do get it, and so on ...

Basically what the HSE's own statistics show is that hardly anyone is dying solely of Covid 19. The same pattern is emerging in other countries.


This from RTE report on excess deaths between March and Julyy:

It is also notable that this latest excess mortality estimate of between 850 and 900 deaths is substantially lower than the official total of 1,763 Covid-19 related deaths reported in Ireland by the end of the July.

This may suggest that up to half of those whose deaths were either "confirmed, probably or possibly" caused by Covid-19 during the first five months of the pandemic could have been likely to pass away from other causes during that period but that Covid-19 hastened their passing.

RTE is hardly part of a conspiracy theory.

So you are saying that it's a bad thing that more people aren't dying from this virus?
You do realise more people aren't dying BECAUSE of the various restrictions in place?

TCDStudent1

Always_Running wrote: »

Journalist Oliver Kay tweeted up the story earlier with article link included.

Thanks. Read it there. Unfortunately, doesn't go into details about how United (or indeed other premier league teams) are trying to implement this. Would be interesting to know if they intend to implement stuff to prevent fans mingling outside the ground for example.

PTH2009

Will RTE end up streaming all the games but make it a subscription service?

kippy

PTH2009 wrote: »

Will RTE end up streaming all the games but make it a subscription service?

A complicated question with many considerations.
Unlikely would be the short answer.

Sultan of Bling

PTH2009 wrote:

Will RTE end up streaming all the games but make it a subscription service?

Was wondering this myself.

They did it with LOI. could be much needed revenue for the GAA.

I'd be interested.

Jizique

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

Was wondering this myself.

They did it with LOI. could be much needed revenue for the GAA.

I'd be interested.

They might as well open the grounds; the pubs will be packed for these

Strumms

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

Was wondering this myself.

They did it with LOI. could be much needed revenue for the GAA.

I'd be interested.

Look at the accounts of the GAA the last 2-3 years... they ain’t struggling, the opposite.

ALL attendances almost countrywide are up the last 3-4 years.

The GAA have to suck it up. Record revenues and record profits.

12% increase in attendances.

PTH2009

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

Was wondering this myself.

They did it with LOI. could be much needed revenue for the GAA.

I'd be interested.

Its a great service too

manofwisdom

Strumms wrote: »

Look at the accounts of the GAA the last 2-3 years... they ain’t struggling, the opposite.

ALL attendances almost countrywide are up the last 3-4 years.

The GAA have to suck it up. Record revenues and record profits.

12% increase in attendances.

The super 8 was mainly brought in because revenues was down. This is how much it will likely cost by just running the championship this November.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/inter-county-championship-set-to-cost-gaa-195m-39506184.html



But sure suck it up right?

dundalkfc10

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

Thanks. Read it there. Unfortunately, doesn't go into details about how United (or indeed other premier league teams) are trying to implement this. Would be interesting to know if they intend to implement stuff to prevent fans mingling outside the ground for example.

300 fans allowed at Celtic game Saturday V Ross County and Aberdeen game as trial runs (grounds hold 6,000 and 20,000 each)

TCDStudent1

manofwisdom wrote: »

The super 8 was mainly brought in because revenues was down. This is how much it will likely cost by just running the championship this November.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/inter-county-championship-set-to-cost-gaa-195m-39506184.html



But sure suck it up right?

For a slimmed down championship in the middle of winter, I am not convinced it is worth it.

John O.Groats

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

For a slimmed down championship in the middle of winter, I am not convinced it is worth it.

IMO they should forget about the Championship altogether this year and start afresh in 2021. Virus situation permitting obviously.

New Era

Up to a few weeks ago, I was certainly in the camp that the inter-county season should recommence in early 2021 due to the ongoing concerns over covid 19 rather than the proposed October 2020 date.

However I have had a change of opinion. I have still concerns over the closure of GAA facilities and dressing rooms and reading the comments of Clare footballer Jamie Malone in recent days reflect a sombre mood from a player's point of view, of these restrictions were to remain throughout championship 2020 that could lead to player drop-outs because of the lack of social contact with fellow squad members. While I've still severe reservations about inter-county teams been told to withdraw from their respective championships in the event of a confirmed covid 19 case in the squad.

Nevertheless I feel that the covid situation will get particularly troublesome in the new year, with the potentially dangerous combination of the flu/influenza season on top with the ongoing battle of covid and the likely impact on our acute public hospitals, which has the potential to overwhelm the system. With all that, it is likely that nphet and the govt won't hesitate in introducing more stringent lockdown measures come the new year.

I also believe that there is growing appetite now among inter county players and managers to proceed with the 2020 inter county gaa championship and that view is also shared with the Croke Park hierachy.

If we get a ugly and hard brexit, a no deal in other words, a hard border is inevitable and that could be problematic for Ulster counties and border counties in the south in relation to getting to stadiums here while all other counties in the South will also find that same predicament when travelling to the North for games. Of course that won't be until 2021, so that's another issue that going to be a significant challenge for the GAA. So by having a gaa championship in 2020 and completed by years end would be most preferable, certainly in the immediate future, not knowing what 2021 will bring, which looks very uncertain at this stage.

What about if there's no vaccine for covid? That also has to be taken into consideration. We also know the mood of the nation is lifted during the summer months with the full throttle of hurling and football and the excitement and enthusiasm of patrons all over the country. The smiles and joy of people when their county team does well is the most enjoyable aspect of Irish life and society IMO.

I have outlined the pros and cons over staging a inter county gaa championship in the midst of this public health emergency. But having carefully examined about the viability of having such championships take place in very tough conditions as the winter sets in, I believe that we need to give the nation hope again. Therefore I'm taking the view that as an avid and passionate gaa supporter of all codes, that we should proceed with inter county gaa action again.

It will be good for people's morale and give that sense of excitement and hope to people that we can have a brighter future ahead. Those advocating that we should wait until 2021 for the resumption of inter county action again, I know have the best interests for gaa and public health which must always be the biggest priority above any sport. As of today there is no definite effective treatment for this virus, which if there was would buy us some time ahead of a possible vaccine in the future. And there is always that risk that we will never get an effective vaccine for covid.

For those reasons alone I feel that we must proceed with Inter county Gaa again although large scale crowds at sporting events, will be a very long time in coming again for sure. This is not without risk though, but as I conclude we must find a way to ensure a pathway towards living with covid, that can be sustainable in the long run and hopefully the eagerly awaited plan that the Irish govt will introduce on next Tuesday, will bring clarity and detail to people, which has been missing from our government since taking office in late June. That is just my opinion and I look forward to your responses on when would be a good time to start inter county GAA action again.

JeffKenna

It might be selfish but I would just love a good championship match to look forward to on a Sunday.

manofwisdom

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

For a slimmed down championship in the middle of winter, I am not convinced it is worth it.

And with few or no supporters in attendance I'd tend to agree.

PTH2009

New Era wrote: »

Up to a few weeks ago, I was certainly in the camp that the inter-county season should recommence in early 2021 due to the ongoing concerns over covid 19 rather than the proposed October 2020 date.

However I have had a change of opinion. I have still concerns over the closure of GAA facilities and dressing rooms and reading the comments of Clare footballer Jamie Malone in recent days reflect a sombre mood from a player's point of view, of these restrictions were to remain throughout championship 2020 that could lead to player drop-outs because of the lack of social contact with fellow squad members. While I've still severe reservations about inter-county teams been told to withdraw from their respective championships in the event of a confirmed covid 19 case in the squad.

Nevertheless I feel that the covid situation will get particularly troublesome in the new year, with the potentially dangerous combination of the flu/influenza season on top with the ongoing battle of covid and the likely impact on our acute public hospitals, which has the potential to overwhelm the system. With all that, it is likely that nphet and the govt won't hesitate in introducing more stringent lockdown measures come the new year.

I also believe that there is growing appetite now among inter county players and managers to proceed with the 2020 inter county gaa championship and that view is also shared with the Croke Park hierachy.

If we get a ugly and hard brexit, a no deal in other words, a hard border is inevitable and that could be problematic for Ulster counties and border counties in the south in relation to getting to stadiums here while all other counties in the South will also find that same predicament when travelling to the North for games. Of course that won't be until 2021, so that's another issue that going to be a significant challenge for the GAA. So by having a gaa championship in 2020 and completed by years end would be most preferable, certainly in the immediate future, not knowing what 2021 will bring, which looks very uncertain at this stage.

What about if there's no vaccine for covid? That also has to be taken into consideration. We also know the mood of the nation is lifted during the summer months with the full throttle of hurling and football and the excitement and enthusiasm of patrons all over the country. The smiles and joy of people when their county team does well is the most enjoyable aspect of Irish life and society IMO.

I have outlined the pros and cons over staging a inter county gaa championship in the midst of this public health emergency. But having carefully examined about the viability of having such championships take place in very tough conditions as the winter sets in, I believe that we need to give the nation hope again. Therefore I'm taking the view that as an avid and passionate gaa supporter of all codes, that we should proceed with inter county gaa action again.

It will be good for people's morale and give that sense of excitement and hope to people that we can have a brighter future ahead. Those advocating that we should wait until 2021 for the resumption of inter county action again, I know have the best interests for gaa and public health which must always be the biggest priority above any sport. As of today there is no definite effective treatment for this virus, which if there was would buy us some time ahead of a possible vaccine in the future. And there is always that risk that we will never get an effective vaccine for covid.

For those reasons alone I feel that we must proceed with Inter county Gaa again although large scale crowds at sporting events, will be a very long time in coming again for sure. This is not without risk though, but as I conclude we must find a way to ensure a pathway towards living with covid, that can be sustainable in the long run and hopefully the eagerly awaited plan that the Irish govt will introduce on next Tuesday, will bring clarity and detail to people, which has been missing from our government since taking office in late June. That is just my opinion and I look forward to your responses on when would be a good time to start inter county GAA action again.

very true words and I'm very excited about the championship. A Christmas all ireland would be amazing for whoever wins it (hopefully Waterford in the hurling)

I'd fear if Dublin goes into a lockdown it could signal the end of the championship

Speakerboxx

Bonniedog wrote: »

Why?

He is one of few here talking sense.

The breakdown of figures on deaths show that 95% of people who have died had some other underlying condition.

This whole thing is being totally exaggerated. Quite an interesting study in mass hysteria and blind intolerance of anyone questioning what we are being told.

Rather sad.

You don't get it do you?

blowitupref

A living with Covid map which includes a level system 1 to 5 to be put in place by Tuesday. Counties with level 1 (low infection rate) will have little or no restrictions in place the opposite for level 5 counties.

Seems like some counties will be allowed crowds at matches others will not. Hard to see GAA HQ giving the go ahead to the championship starting next month with so much disruptions ahead but we'll see.

PTH2009

blowitupref wrote: »

A living with Covid map which includes a level system 1 to 5 to be put in place by Tuesday. Counties with level 1 (low infection rate) will have little or no restrictions in place the opposite for level 5 counties.

Seems like some counties will be allowed crowds at matches others will not. Hard to see GAA HQ giving the go ahead to the championship starting next month with so much disruptions ahead but we'll see.

The big sporting bodies meeting with government today and next week apparently

blowitupref

PTH2009 wrote: »

The big sporting bodies meeting with government today and next week apparently

Be interesting to see what comes from that. Info here

https://amp.independent.ie/sport/fai-gaa-and-irfu-issue-statement-confirming-collaborative-approach-on-return-of-spectators-39523880.html?

When outdoor sports was put behind closed doors the case count had 7 day average of 102. Right now it's 181. That pretty much confirms the issue wasn't with 200 supporters at outdoors sports but elsewhere and to the surprise of nobody this virus was/is mostly caught indoors.

New Era

"Show me the money" says the GAA to the government this evening or else there will be no inter county championship for 2020. That's the message from Croke Park to Micheal and Leo, that holding provincial and All Ireland inter county championship by mid October, is dependent on the government giving them funding to help with the logistics of holding championships in this covid environment. Some of those logistics are on the rte website this evening.

A bit concerning that to this point the govt haven't indicated one way or another about additional funding for the GAA, to ensure that we will see inter county gaa action returning again since early March of this year. Nevertheless it is expected that Croke Park will confirm within the next 24 hours that all inter county teams can return to training on this Monday, as was previously scheduled and that it will approve the resumption of inter county action and the commencement of the respective provincial and All Ireland championships on the 17th of October.

PTH2009

New Era wrote: »

"Show me the money" says the GAA to the government this evening or else there will be no inter county championship for 2020. That's the message from Croke Park to Micheal and Leo, that holding provincial and All Ireland inter county championship by mid October, is dependent on the government giving them funding to help with the logistics of holding championships in this covid environment. Some of those logistics are on the rte website this evening.

A bit concerning that to this point the govt haven't indicated one way or another about additional funding for the GAA, to ensure that we will see inter county gaa action returning again since early March of this year. Nevertheless it is expected that Croke Park will confirm within the next 24 hours that all inter county teams can return to training on this Monday, as was previously scheduled and that it will approve the resumption of inter county action and the commencement of the respective provincial and All Ireland championships on the 17th of October.

Would be massively disappointing if its canned

A championship would be a massive morale boost

Realt Dearg Sec

Would the government really want to be giving extra funding to the GAA right now? The economic benefits of holding the games are much smaller than they normally would be since local economies won't get crowds in spending money. It will probably drive people in droves into pubs to shout at the top of their voices, which the government specifically doesn't want right now. So what's the incentive from their point of view? The fact that it would be nice to have isn't enough for the GAA to be making demands over, when in effect they have the begging bowl out on this.

New Era

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Would the government really want to be giving extra funding to the GAA right now? The economic benefits of holding the games are much smaller than they normally would be since local economies won't get crowds in spending money. It will probably drive people in droves into pubs to shout at the top of their voices, which the government specifically doesn't want right now. So what's the incentive from their point of view? The fact that it would be nice to have isn't enough for the GAA to be making demands over, when in effect they have the begging bowl out on this.

You have made some very valid points there. The soccer season begins again in England this weekend, people will come in droves to watch their favorite team come September 21st. Imagine what it would be like in England this weekend, the pubs have reopened for weeks now there, cases are rising at a alarming place, is BoJo and his govt concerned?

I get the governments concerns about giving additional funding to the gaa, for the sake of proceeding with an inter county championship that has no guarantee of ever completing. I think there has to be an discussion on what is more important. If the health authorities believe that people will come in droves to pubs to watch if championship 2020 proceeds then that is clearly not preferable. So I come to this question, does the government prioritise the reopening of the wet pubs or are they prepared to give the GAA the funding required to ensure the return of inter county action since early March?

I think that both cannot be implemented at the same time. That might be a provocative opinion but given how nphet and MM led govt have been so ultra cautious in their approach to pubs and in particular the "wet pubs" that is my rationale behind my thoughts. To me if I were a member of cabinet, the safe opening of all pubs would be more preferable, as it has a more positive economic impact then the return of inter county gaa, behind closed doors.

On a separate note but slightly off the covid topic, county boards throughout the country are feeling the financial hit. "We won't survive" is the blunt assessment of Clare CB treasurer Michael Gallagher if emergency funding is not approved by government. Perhaps giving funding to county boards to help their financial woes should take priority then proceeding with championship 2020 with no crowds. I do want championship 2020 to go ahead. But if covid cases continue to rise further and taking into account past form where nphet won't hesitate in taking action, pubs and sports could be in the firing line particularly the former. Tough decisions await. But then again that's why those policy makers are getting paid the big bucks to take that responsibility. Interesting times ahead.

kksaints

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Would the government really want to be giving extra funding to the GAA right now? The economic benefits of holding the games are much smaller than they normally would be since local economies won't get crowds in spending money. It will probably drive people in droves into pubs to shout at the top of their voices, which the government specifically doesn't want right now. So what's the incentive from their point of view? The fact that it would be nice to have isn't enough for the GAA to be making demands over, when in effect they have the begging bowl out on this.

Possibly a morale issue. Running the inter county championships would be a sign that the virus hasn't broken our spirit or something like that. One thing this does highlight is the GAA's reliance on gate receipts for the running of the inter county championships. The cost of €19.5 million is considerable particularly for an amateur sport.

blowitupref

New Era wrote: »

But if covid cases continue to rise further and taking into account past form where nphet won't hesitate in taking action, pubs and sports could be in the firing line particularly the former. Tough decisions await. But then again that's why those policy makers are getting paid the big bucks to take that responsibility. Interesting times ahead.

They need to learn from past form and fully focus on what is driving cases to rise instead of going for low hanging fruit such as a few 100 supporters attending sports outdoors.

PTH2009

the rugby and soccer is going ahead but the GAA is likely not

blowitupref

From the Irish Times.

GAA don’t expect crowd restrictions to change next week

The GAA is not expecting any movement on the lifting of crowd restrictions when the Government plan, Living with Covid-19, is published next week.

Despite speculation that the return of a few hundred spectators might be green-lighted in the coming days, the view in Croke Park is that further discussions will take place before any new measures are announced.

PTH2009

great news, feck the begrudgers

https://www.gaa.ie/news/ard-chomhairle-meeting/

BENDYBINN

PTH2009 wrote: »

great news, feck the begrudgers

https://www.gaa.ie/news/ard-chomhairle-meeting/

My money is on Galway for the double!!!

Always_Running

PTH2009 wrote: »

great news, feck the begrudgers

https://www.gaa.ie/news/ard-chomhairle-meeting/

Good not great news. Let's be honest, the championship won't be the same played in November to December with little or no supporters in attendance.

The Lost Sheep

Always_Running wrote: »

Good not great news. Let's be honest, the championship won't be the same played in November to December with little or no supporters in attendance.

Is it not better than nothing?
Nothing has been the same this year in sport.

padd b1975

Leagues?

Speakerboxx

Always_Running wrote: »

Good not great news. Let's be honest, the championship won't be the same played in November to December with little or no supporters in attendance.

I agree. It will just be a farce of a championship to be honest now with it going on in November December. A joke if you ask me.

The Lost Sheep

padd b1975 wrote: »

Leagues?

What about them?

Speakerboxx wrote: »

I agree. It will just be a farce of a championship to be honest now with it going on in November December. A joke if you ask me.

Why? Should counties not play if its safe for players to play games?
Clubs will be finished so why not play them?

PTH2009

nobodies forcing anyone to watch it or take part

Its better than nothing and a Christmas all Ireland is pretty unique

petronius

If they can play rugby - the pro-14, soccer the LOI, here surely we could have the championship in GAA
Run the championship old fashioned knockout - test test test
it is unlikely there will be crowds allowed
run the old provincials
hope by provinical finals or semis we can have some spectators
an all-ireland on st. stephens day? there is a though

kksaints

No London, Warwickshire or Lancashire in the GAA championships this year. Sensible decision, otherwise the GAA would be creating a quarantine mess which would have the potential to be a PR disaster. I assume that New York are out also.

PTH2009

kksaints wrote: »

No London, Warwickshire or Lancashire in the GAA championships this year. Sensible decision, otherwise the GAA would be creating a quarantine mess which would have the potential to be a PR disaster. I assume that New York are out also.

the lads prob still want there New York piss up ha

Nah new york prob out for this year

Realt Dearg Sec

Speakerboxx wrote: »

I agree. It will just be a farce of a championship to be honest now with it going on in November December. A joke if you ask me.

The GAA seem happy enough to run the county championships in November and December every year. Are they a farce as well?

Always_Running

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Is it not better than nothing?
Nothing has been the same this year in sport.

The other option should not be nothing.

I'd go ahead with what stopped in March. The two U21 All-Ireland semi finals and final two rounds of the NFL.

The rest of the time should be left free for the provincial and All Ireland club championships.