How much do you miss the pub?

showpony1

double jobbing wrote: »

What's this now? All restrictions are under consideration to be lifted? Didn't see it on the main news sites. I've no problem with measures to contain rowdiness in the early stages (no sport, no music, no groups etc) but as Chalk McHugh says food and drink don't mix for me. Eat at most 30 mins before, not sooner and not during.

is that true they won't be able to show sports on 29 June?
the likes of the Woolshed bar in Dublin are advertising opening that would pretty much solely be busy for sports.

undertaker fan 88

showpony1 wrote: »

is that true they won't be able to show sports on 29 June?
the likes of the Woolshed bar in Dublin are advertising opening that would pretty much solely be busy for sports.

The pub I'm in wont be putting on sports. It's going to be hard enough to work with the bookings without a crowd who were booked in a 2 hour slot deciding they wanna watch the rest of a match that's on and not wanna give up there space which is already booked for another group. I'd much prefer if we stayed closed until we can just be a bar again

saabsaab

ShooterSF wrote: »

Yes it would really help the industry if we can safely get to 1m. I dunno what that takes though. However I still think that restricts the bar to a no go zone as staff won't be able to operate behind it while maintaining a 1m distance from punters.

Probably masks and face sheilds

PTH2009

undertaker fan 88 wrote: »

The pub I'm in wont be putting on sports. It's going to be hard enough to work with the bookings without a crowd who were booked in a 2 hour slot deciding they wanna watch the rest of a match that's on and not wanna give up there space which is already booked for another group. I'd much prefer if we stayed closed until we can just be a bar again

Yeah Liverpool should do everyone a favour and win the title before the pubs open.Can you imagine trying too control a crowd in the current circumstances for an important game

ShooterSF

undertaker fan 88 wrote: »

The pub I'm in wont be putting on sports. It's going to be hard enough to work with the bookings without a crowd who were booked in a 2 hour slot deciding they wanna watch the rest of a match that's on and not wanna give up there space which is already booked for another group. I'd much prefer if we stayed closed until we can just be a bar again

Man I've already told my boss I'm not planning to go back if they open end of June. Gonna take some hols! People are already ignoring that opening then is as a restaurant. Have regulars adding me on facebook to see if the place is opening and if they can come for a "few beers". It'll just be exhausting dealing with people not following guidelines and looking to figure out loopholes or moaning when you try and actually enforce the rules.

saabsaab wrote: »

Probably masks and face sheilds

Masks are pretty standard behind bars that have opened in America and Europe from what I have seen. That will make rushing around tough enough without a face shield. I'd rather just keep the bar empty and not have to go in in basically a hazmat suit I'd die of dehydration after 20 minutes.

undertaker fan 88

ShooterSF wrote: »

Man I've already told my boss I'm not planning to go back if they open end of June. Gonna take some hols! People are already ignoring that opening then is as a restaurant. Have regulars adding me on facebook to see if the place is opening and if they can come for a "few beers". It'll just be exhausting dealing with people not following guidelines and looking to figure out loopholes or moaning when you try and actually enforce the rules.



Masks are pretty standard behind bars that have opened in America and Europe from what I have seen. That will make rushing around tough enough without a face shield. I'd rather just keep the bar empty and not have to go in in basically a hazmat suit I'd die of dehydration after 20 minutes.

Dont start me on regulars I've met loads and there answer to the restaurant rule is ah were drinking here years we will get served. If my boss even hints at doing this il be heading home myself

weldoninhio

UI_Paddy wrote: »

Yeah, no one is forcing anyone to go to the pubs, but there is still huge amounts of peer pressure because it's so ingrained in our culture. I've worked with people who socialize in coffee shops for example, and it's been a successful avenue for them, but they've certainly had a number of people ask them to come to the pub on several occasions.



Yeah, if the recent reopening of Penney's is anything to go by I can only imagine the demand for any pubs that were allowed reopen and operate as they used to. There are hotels in the city centre that would easily be used as backups without any of the other popular pubs open.

If someone still feels peer pressure and they are over 20 they are absolutely pathetic.

Leroy42

weldoninhio wrote: »

If someone still feels peer pressure and they are over 20 they are absolutely pathetic.

Its not about peer pressure, its about being included. Sure you can sit at home while all your mates head to the pub to watch the match. Sure you can avoid going to the wedding because of the hotel bar, sure you can miss the office party, the school reunions, the club nights out.

Of course you can do all of that, and live a perfectly fine life. But, particularly in Ireland, it is very hard to avoid the pub. It is deeply ingrained in our culture. It is the cornerstone of many villages and towns.

Hell, every foreign dignitary that visits our shores is treated to a pint of Guinness.

This thread is a perfect example. The amount of people that are simply gagging to get back to the pub. It forms a major part of peoples lives, but even if one doesn't frequent pubs there are always the occasions that will be in a pub.

dominatinMC

Leroy42 wrote: »

Its not about peer pressure, its about being included. Sure you can sit at home while all your mates head to the pub to watch the match. Sure you can avoid going to the wedding because of the hotel bar, sure you can miss the office party, the school reunions, the club nights out.

Of course you can do all of that, and live a perfectly fine life. But, particularly in Ireland, it is very hard to avoid the pub. It is deeply ingrained in our culture. It is the cornerstone of many villages and towns.

Hell, every foreign dignitary that visits our shores is treated to a pint of Guinness.

This thread is a perfect example. The amount of people that are simply gagging to get back to the pub. It forms a major part of peoples lives, but even if one doesn't frequent pubs there are always the occasions that will be in a pub.

And, what exactly, is wrong with that? People love to demonise pubs, and hope that we will embrace some utopian European-style cafe culture instead. The fact is the humble public house is part of our culture, and personally, I don't want to import someone else's culture at their expense. Sure, there are issues with pubs, but they are mostly due to a lack of personal responsibility I would argue. If people don't know where to draw the line, that's on them. I love the pubs, the social interaction, the much-maligned "craic", and a few pints. Everything in moderation.

double jobbing

dominatinMC wrote: »

And, what exactly, is wrong with that? People love to demonise pubs, and hope that we will embrace some utopian European-style cafe culture instead. The fact is the humble public house is part of our culture, and personally, I don't want to import someone else's culture at their expense. Sure, there are issues with pubs, but they are mostly due to a lack of personal responsibility I would argue. If people don't know where to draw the line, that's on them. I love the pubs, the social interaction, the much-maligned "craic", and a few pints. Everything in moderation.

Exactly. Too many people look to the continent and aspire to be like them, to lift us out of some sort of backward culture.

Here's a newsflash- a large chunk, dare I say a majority, of mainland West Europeans are dry arses, and tight as a nun to boot. Germans in particular. If you want cafe bars and three bottles constituting a session and your wardrobe consisting of 20 quids worth of clothes, feckin move there.

Chalk McHugh

double jobbing wrote: »

Exactly. Too many people look to the continent and aspire to be like them, to lift us out of some sort of backward culture.

Here's a newsflash- a large chunk, dare I say a majority, of mainland West Europeans are dry arses, and tight as a nun to boot. Germans in particular. If you want cafe bars and three bottles constituting a session and your wardrobe consisting of 20 quids worth of clothes, feckin move there.

And a culture of just sticking to the person/people your meeting that day. With no interaction with any 'strangers'. It's about as much fun i'd imagine as the waiting room of a hospital. We're different animals here in Ireland. Good banter with friends, strangers and foes alike. If we're entering a boozer in Dublin anything is fair game. If you want to sit in silence and not engage with anyone there's other places that may suit you better. Like the Continent. Or a silent monks retreat.

Leroy42

dominatinMC wrote: »

And, what exactly, is wrong with that? People love to demonise pubs, and hope that we will embrace some utopian European-style cafe culture instead. The fact is the humble public house is part of our culture, and personally, I don't want to import someone else's culture at their expense. Sure, there are issues with pubs, but they are mostly due to a lack of personal responsibility I would argue. If people don't know where to draw the line, that's on them. I love the pubs, the social interaction, the much-maligned "craic", and a few pints. Everything in moderation.

I never said there was, although there is plenty of evidence to suggest that there has been significant costs to society, particularly in the past before Stricker drink driving and smoking ban laws came into effect.

I love going to the pub, great crack, but I know how dependent and pub focused Irish society is, and that what I am discussing.

MonkstownHoop

double jobbing wrote: »

Exactly. Too many people look to the continent and aspire to be like them, to lift us out of some sort of backward culture.

Here's a newsflash- a large chunk, dare I say a majority, of mainland West Europeans are dry arses, and tight as a nun to boot. Germans in particular. If you want cafe bars and three bottles constituting a session and your wardrobe consisting of 20 quids worth of clothes, feckin move there.

Not to mention we don't have the weather to enjoy that, most of those places would be largely outdoor seating

ShooterSF

undertaker fan 88 wrote: »

Dont start me on regulars I've met loads and there answer to the restaurant rule is ah were drinking here years we will get served. If my boss even hints at doing this il be heading home myself

I wonder if they do this in other places. Ah I've been coming to this tesco for years I don't need to wait outside in a queue etc. The only part of the job that kills me, the small group of people who turn into children the moment they step into a pub and have to try and bend and push all the rules they can get away with, leaving you to try and put manners on a fella who is old enough to have grand kids.
Still there are lots of regulars I can't wait to catch up with when I do go back.

Oh and for anyone that plans to go to the pub when they reopen, please for the love of god the corona hold the virus joke was tired before the shutdown

El Weirdo

ShooterSF wrote: »

Oh and for anyone that plans to go to the pub when they reopen, please for the love of god the corona hold the virus joke was tired before the shutdown

This, this, THIS.

watlantic

What about this sitting down away from the bar nonsense ? Isn't the bar in the bar there for keeping punters a good safe distance away from landlord and staff ? What about people like me who can't sit for long on a low seat due to a back injury, or other problems ? Take out a few bar stools at the bar, mark the spots and let people stand and/or sit on high stools and that problem is solved.

By the way, the German minister for health has now come out and stated that there should NOT be any more mass testing as they are getting too many false positives, he even said MORE FALSE positive Corona virus test results than real positives. :mad:
My German partner's grip of that language is trustworthy, and here's a link to the clip from the interview on Germany's main TV channel ARD on their Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/berichtausberlin/videos/259572241980794/

Leroy42

Alteratively should we really makes rules for the tiny minoroty that struggle with normal chairs?

Sitting away from the bar is, I assume, to protect the bar staff and the equipment. It isn't about you, the bar person would be in direct contact with too many people. And if you sneeze or cough then the virus gets on all the taps, all the counters.

Much better to keep as many people away from the main point.

freak scence

watlantic wrote: »

What about this sitting down away from the bar nonsense ? Isn't the bar in the bar there for keeping punters a good safe distance away from landlord and staff ? What about people like me who can't sit for long on a low seat due to a back injury, or other problems ? Take out a few bar stools at the bar, mark the spots and let people stand and/or sit on high stools and that problem is solved.

By the way, the German minister for health has now come out and stated that there should NOT be any more mass testing as they are getting too many false positives, he even said MORE FALSE positive Corona virus test results than real positives. :mad:
My German partner's grip of that language is trustworthy, and here's a link to the clip from the interview on Germany's main TV channel ARD on their Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/berichtausberlin/videos/259572241980794/

it;s not nonsense it's for social distancing , won't have a hope with the nornmal dicks at the counter waiting to talk scutter to each person that comes in

watlantic

Leroy42 wrote: »

Alteratively should we really makes rules for the tiny minoroty that struggle with normal chairs?

Sitting away from the bar is, I assume, to protect the bar staff and the equipment. It isn't about you, the bar person would be in direct contact with too many people. And if you sneeze or cough then the virus gets on all the taps, all the counters.

Much better to keep as many people away from the main point.

Keep worrying and stay away from the ''main point'' so :P. In nearly all the bars I've frequented over the years, the man (or maid) behind the bar was safely a good two metres away from me behind it. They don't like you standing on the footrail and leaning into them, you know. Even if you did that, your face would still be almost two metres from them.
...and if I sneeze or cough into the the staff member's face when he serves me while I'm sitting down at a table, that's only worse - even with a facial germ incubator (=mask) on both parties.

ShyMets

watlantic wrote: »

Keep worrying and stay away from the ''main point'' so :P. In nearly all the bars I've frequented over the years, the man (or maid) behind the bar was safely a good two metres away from me behind it. They don't like you standing on the footrail and leaning into them, you know. Even if you did that, your face would still be almost two metres from them.
...and if I sneeze or cough into the the staff member's face when he serves me while I'm sitting down at a table, that's only worse - even with a facial germ incubator (=mask) on both parties.

You could potentially have people sitting at bars. You would need to limit the amount of people at the bar. No standing at the bar and only those sitting at the bar could order.

But realistically, in order for that to happen, you would need to make face coverings mandatory

PTH2009

dispise bastards who get a sneezing attack while drinking :mad::mad::D

MonkstownHoop

PTH2009 wrote: »

dispise bastards who get a sneezing attack while drinking :mad::mad::D

I despise them

ShooterSF

watlantic wrote: »

Keep worrying and stay away from the ''main point'' so :P. In nearly all the bars I've frequented over the years, the man (or maid) behind the bar was safely a good two metres away from me behind it. They don't like you standing on the footrail and leaning into them, you know. Even if you did that, your face would still be almost two metres from them.
...and if I sneeze or cough into the the staff member's face when he serves me while I'm sitting down at a table, that's only worse - even with a facial germ incubator (=mask) on both parties.

You know 2m is over 6 feet right. Like I'm not 6 feet tall and my arms which are shorter than me can comfortably reach across the bar and touch the bar stool. But some bars have high top tables they could probably use to accommodate people with conditions like yourself. The customer I feel worst for in my bar when it reopens is a guy that lip reads. Like how ****ed up will that experience be for him with staff wearing masks. People are going to be put out unfortunately.

Breaston Plants

https://vfipubs.ie/news/latest-news/one-metre-distancing-set-to-be-introduced/

rubadub

PTH2009 wrote: »

2 more weeks to go til we can have a pint in a pub like setting

It going to be mayhem and be like when Woodies, Mcdonalds etc opened back up

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Both of them combined won’t even come close.

won't come close in what way? what do you think will be happening?

People were queuing 2 hours before woodies opened. I can imagine social media showing some eejits doing that at the local pub, but not at pubs, but I saw people outside woodies in the pissing rain days in big queues after it was opened. I do not think that will happen it would make no sense for queues to be as long.

My tesco had queues at lunchtime, they moved VERY quickly, people in and out in a few minutes doing small shops. Many will be spending the max time they can in the pub, certainly a couple of hours for most. So I do not think you will see big queues as if you are at the back it could be closing time by the time you get in.

I reckon most will just take bookings, just like an extremely popular restaurant would not usually have queues outside it. They would not want to force punters to be put out when there is an easy way around it.

There were calls for retailers to have bookings, that could work if you owned some odd retail outlet where people came and browsed for 1-8hours at a time, and that is why few bothered. I heard Brown Thomas did and I expect people were not in and out in 5mins like tesco.

redarmy

Pubs will be allowed to reopen on 29 June if they serve "substantial" meals costing not less than €9, according to new guidelines being prepared by Fáilte Ireland.

Any food offering will be required to be a substantial meal (as defined by the Intoxicating Liquor Act 1962: "the meal is such as might be expected to be served as a main midday or evening meal or as a main course in either such meal").

It will also be required to be of a kind for which "it would be reasonable to charge not less than €9".

In a statement, Fáilte Ireland said it had received guidance from the Health Protection Surveillance Centre entitled 'Covid-19: Guidance for Food Service Businesses'.

The detailed guidance is aimed at facilitating the safe reopening of food service businesses from 29 June, including pubs.

Fáilte Ireland said it is working through the guidance document in consultation with officials from the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport "to seek clarity on some aspects" for the hospitality sector.

The guidelines refer to various measures and arrangements, including a potential reduction of the current two metre physical distancing restriction to one metre in certain circumstances.

Fáilte Ireland's updated guidelines for pubs (which include pubs, gastro pubs and bars) will be published in the coming days.

The guidelines will state that from 29 June, pubs that serve food and meet other features expected of a restaurant may reopen.

Leroy42

That is a nice little cash grab by the vintners.. I fail to see the health reasons for the meal requirement.

Seems it was a way to get themselves open sooner, and get extra cash from punters.

stephenjmcd

Leroy42 wrote: »

That is a nice little cash grab by the vintners.. I fail to see the health reasons for the meal requirement.

Seems it was a way to get themselves open sooner, and get extra cash from punters.

Its not the vintners deciding this. Its gov / NPHET saying that they only want cafe / restaurant style operation for the 3 weeks which means shorter trading hours, full trading resumption for the 20th July.

To open as a restaurant you must provide a substantial meal, its already in existing legislation and has been for years

Spanish Eyes

The one metre rule is fine, but it may as well be a "mingle as you please" order in due course. Fine if people feel ok about it, I don't right at the minute, well inside anyway.

Glad the pubs are reopening, but am watching how things are going elsewhere. Most other countries in Europe apart from ourselves are well geared up for terrace drinking, even in colder climates. I was in Maastricht in December a few years ago (lovely spot), it was Baltic, but EVERYONE wanted to be outside, there were heaters and cushions and blankets. Was mighty. Covid apparently doesn't have the same ability to spread outdoors. Go figure.

Will watch and wait.

freak scence

Leroy42 wrote: »

That is a nice little cash grab by the vintners.. I fail to see the health reasons for the meal requirement.

Seems it was a way to get themselves open sooner, and get extra cash from punters.

that's bollox its bord failte saying this not the vintiners, the logic is that it would be a free for all with people just drinking all over the place ,if you have to book sit down and go after 2hrs it eliminates alot of gob****es

Spanish Eyes

I'm so confused now. Are pubs without food opening at the same time as those serving food, i.e. 29th June or what? Thanks.

double jobbing

Am I right in saying the meal requirement will be out the window when all pubs are allowed open 3 weeks later? Seeing as the odd pub might not have a cooker of any sort?

stephenjmcd

freak scence wrote: »

that's bollox its bord failte saying this not the vintiners, the logic is that it would be a free for all with people just drinking all over the place ,if you have to book sit down and go after 2hrs it eliminates alot of gob****es

Few of us have taken a few days off work at the end of July to head down the country somewhere, we've not decided where yet but what we'll do is just plan out the night in advance if we need to book, 2hrs in one place then onto the next and so on.

Won't be as mad a rush for the pubs come that time hopefully so we'll be able to have a nice few days away and a proper catch up

double jobbing

redarmy wrote: »

Pubs will be allowed to reopen on 29 June if they serve "substantial" meals costing not less than €9, according to new guidelines being prepared by Fáilte Ireland.

Any food offering will be required to be a substantial meal (as defined by the Intoxicating Liquor Act 1962: "the meal is such as might be expected to be served as a main midday or evening meal or as a main course in either such meal").

It will also be required to be of a kind for which "it would be reasonable to charge not less than €9".

In a statement, Fáilte Ireland said it had received guidance from the Health Protection Surveillance Centre entitled 'Covid-19: Guidance for Food Service Businesses'.

The detailed guidance is aimed at facilitating the safe reopening of food service businesses from 29 June, including pubs.

Fáilte Ireland said it is working through the guidance document in consultation with officials from the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport "to seek clarity on some aspects" for the hospitality sector.

The guidelines refer to various measures and arrangements, including a potential reduction of the current two metre physical distancing restriction to one metre in certain circumstances.

Fáilte Ireland's updated guidelines for pubs (which include pubs, gastro pubs and bars) will be published in the coming days.

The guidelines will state that from 29 June, pubs that serve food and meet other features expected of a restaurant may reopen.

Great amount of the words guidance and guidelines used here. Is any of this actually legally enforceable?

I know when the pubs were asked to shut, before it became law, the talk was any who flouted it would get a cold reception when their licence was due for renewal. With this however, I'd imagine Gardai on a wakthrough would be more concerned with the pub making sure there's no arm linking drunken singsongs, rather than going to every table checking the amount of leftovers on them.

stephenjmcd

double jobbing wrote: »

Am I right in saying the meal requirement will be out the window when all pubs are allowed open 3 weeks later? Seeing as the odd pub might not have a cooker of any sort?

yup it'll be gone

freak scence

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I'm so confused now. Are pubs without food opening at the same time as those serving food, i.e. 29th June or what? Thanks.

no wet pubs 20 july

Andrew00

We are still way way to slow to reopen this country.

Look at our daily numbers over the past month. Very small. WHAT'S THE WAIT???

Are they worried about a second wave which is inevitable anyway?

Just reopen the economy and stop doing more damage to it

freak scence

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Few of us have taken a few days off work at the end of July to head down the country somewhere, we've not decided where yet but what we'll do is just plan out the night in advance if we need to book, 2hrs in one place then onto the next and so on.

Won't be as mad a rush for the pubs come that Time hopefully so we'll be able to have a nice few days away and a proper catch up

end of july bookings will hopefully be gone

double jobbing

stephenjmcd wrote: »

yup it'll be gone

Seems an utter waste of time doing this for 3 weeks. With any luck another 9 days of rock bottom figures and they will knock it on the head (I'm assuming NPHET will be giving a report the Friday beforehand same as they have before every major easing)

MickeyLeari

Andrew00 wrote: »

We are still way way to slow to reopen this country.

Look at our daily numbers over the past month. Very small. WHAT'S THE WAIT???

Are they worried about a second wave which is inevitable anyway?

Just reopen the economy and stop doing more damage to it

But. what about the second wave.

Mr rebel

double jobbing wrote: »

Exactly. Too many people look to the continent and aspire to be like them, to lift us out of some sort of backward culture.

Here's a newsflash- a large chunk, dare I say a majority, of mainland West Europeans are dry arses, and tight as a nun to boot. Germans in particular. If you want cafe bars and three bottles constituting a session and your wardrobe consisting of 20 quids worth of clothes, feckin move there.

Germans? Seriously?
I could not disagree more. The most craic filled nights out I’ve had have been in German cities with the locals.

ShooterSF

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Its not the vintners deciding this. Its gov / NPHET saying that they only want cafe / restaurant style operation for the 3 weeks which means shorter trading hours, full trading resumption for the 20th July.

To open as a restaurant you must provide a substantial meal, its already in existing legislation and has been for years

Well the vintners did put out a list of ideas to allow pubs that serve food to open at the same time as restaurants so it's more a negotiated middle ground for both..

Geuze

double jobbing wrote: »

Here's a newsflash- a large chunk, dare I say a majority, of mainland West Europeans are dry arses, and tight as a nun to boot. Germans in particular. If you want cafe bars and three bottles constituting a session and your wardrobe consisting of 20 quids worth of clothes, feckin move there.

They make a lot of lovely beer, but yes, their pubs aren't like ours.

Often no standing at the bar.

It's easy to find a German bar with no craic.

Not as loud or rowdy as here.

Geuze

freak scence wrote: »

no wet pubs 20 july

Ok, so just to clarify, am I correct here?

Phase 3, on 29-June, any pub that can serve food, a substantial meal to each customer, can re-open, whether or not they have a Restaurant Certificate (Leo Varadkar said that)

Must every customer have the 9 euro meal?

All sitting down, reserved seats, no sitting at bar, no moving?

What about outside gardens, terraces, smoking areas?


Phase 4, three weeks later - all pubs can re-open as normal, food or no food, subject to the 2m (or 1m) rule?

PTH2009

A few frozen pizzas cooked in the oven or microwave

Did any other country have too do this 'food only' bollocks ?

Toasted sandwiches. Make a load up beforehand and get a few cheap version George Foreman's. Handy.

Chalk McHugh

A Nibbles Platter of Bacon Fries, Scampi Fries, Manhattan Peanuts, Manhattan Crisps and some Hot Nuts may make an appearance in some of the shebeens ill be at. That should set you back a tenner and a few lads could pitch in. Bullocks to that full, heavy dinner lackery

stephenjmcd

ShooterSF wrote: »

Well the vintners did put out a list of ideas to allow pubs that serve food to open at the same time as restaurants so it's more a negotiated middle ground for both..

Its a fair compromise at the end of the day, the main gripe was from the start pubs that serve food being put weeks behind restaurants

Leroy42

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Toasted sandwiches. Make a load up beforehand and get a few cheap version George Foreman's. Handy.

And you would pay €9 for that?

Other countries haven't done this as they simply kept the pubs closed until they wanted them open. We have landed at this silly middle ground where everyone has to pretend they are in a pub for a meal mainly.

PTH2009

I think I understand what there trying to go for
'Full stomachs = less drinking, less rowdy and people will go home earlier'

Like other posters have mentioned no interest in food and drinking at the same time. Food a few hours beforehand and enjoyable few hours on the drink

Hard to drink on a full and bloated stomach for me anyway