CoVid19 Part XIV - 8,089 in ROI (288 deaths) 1,589 in NI (92 deaths) (10/04) Read OP

Inquitus

Arghus wrote: »

If you want a blast from the past I recommend going back and having a read through the first Coronavirus mega-thread.

It's hillarious and also depressing watching most of our blase attitudes. Just goes to show that the majority of people posting on here - myself included - don't really have a clue what we are spouting on about.

I think its more of the boy who cried wolf, we had SARS, MERS, Swine Flu, none of which had much impact in Europe, as such I guess we just assumed it would be the same again, a big panic initially, but no impact to us or our daily lives.

rebeve

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Hi guys. Sorry if this is a stupid question. I just keep hearing different things. But an increase / surge of covid is expected soon right?

This is it , we are in the plateau stage .The UK on the other hand have a couple of bad weeks ahead .A lot of people will needlessly die .

Pretzill

tobefrank321 wrote: »

The BCG vaccine story seems to have a few holes in it.

The UK had a similar program to our own, yet they have suffered badly from covid 19.

However even if it showed promise, its still 3-6 months before its rolled out and even then it would be limited.

Didn't the UK stop the BCG programme many years before us? I do find it promising.

Wibbs

tobefrank321 wrote: »

The BCG vaccine story seems to have a few holes in it.

The UK had a similar program to our own, yet they have suffered badly from covid 19.

And older folks are more at risk, yet it would be the same older folks that would have had that BCG in the UK. Maybe it's because they had it so long ago and they're looking at how it will work in somebody newly vaccinated? It's been shown to have protective attributes with other respiratory infections(and bladder cancer of all things). If it does show a protective effect that's really great news, because it's a very old and long and well tested vaccine that they could release straight away without the usual rigorous testing. Production would need a major ramping up though. Even there I'd imagine because it is such a long standing vaccine out for 60 odd years it might be easier to make in the first place?

pc7

Would immigrants in the UK have had it from their birth countries? Thinking India, West Indies etc? Could explain the difference?

Pretzill

Wibbs wrote: »

And older folks are more at risk, yet it would be the same older folks that would have had that BCG in the UK. Maybe it's because they had it so long ago and they're looking at how it will work in somebody newly vaccinated?

I actually thought the opposite, the BCG programme didn't kick in here until 1953 so I was assuming most people over 75 wouldn't have had it. If anything it might show some agent within that vaccine is key, I'll take any positive news at this stage

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Wibbs wrote: »

Sorry O, I don't buy it. When you're talking about symptoms of any disease you run with the major ones first, especially those that are much more prevalent in a particular disease, not the ones that are present in lower percentages and common in other illnesses especially in cold and flu season. And for this illness the major ones are fever, cough, difficulty breathing(in later stages) and latterly it's been found that loss of taste and smell is very common. A symptom that isn't even on that list. When they made that statement the "big three" were the ones. I mean if this was bubonic plague you'd run with the lymph swelling and fever, not the lesser symptoms.

You don't buy it? Jesus christ. Why do you buy the (very rushed) studies that came out then? (This has been in our lives 3 - 4 months. Any academic paper that has been published on it has been rushed based on that timescale, as anyone who has published in a journal knows.) How do you, as a layperson, arbitrate what you believe and what you don't?

jackboy

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

That was an influenza virus, which is known to mutate very frequently, so the second wave was far more deadly. That frequent mutation is why we need a new vaccine for it each year.

The present Covid-19 virus seems to be fairly stable and without significant mutations which would make it more lethal so far, according to Virologists.

Let us hope it stays that way.

Even if it doesn’t mutate it still has the potential to infect half the humans on the planet. Look at the damage it has done with only a relatively small percentage of people infected.

It is a fair stretch I think to assume this can be managed after a few weeks of restrictions. Potentially the darkest days could be next winter if a wave corresponds to flu season.

tobefrank321

Pretzill wrote: »

Didn't the UK stop the BCG programme many years before us? I do find it promising.

About 10 years before us.

They initially went down the herd immunity route and locked down later than us, which likely accounts for their high death rate. However you would expect if there are benefits to BCG vaccination they would have much a lower death rate rather than one similar to Spain and Italy.

Its also impossible to compare us to Italy and Spain as we are a couple weeks behind them. It was rampant in Italy by the time we had our first confirmed case.

pc7

pc7 wrote: »

Would immigrants in the UK have had it from their birth countries? Thinking India, West Indies etc? Could explain the difference?

The children of immigrants from countries where tuberculosis is still common are considered high risk and still receive it.

Pretzill

Pretzill wrote: »

Didn't the UK stop the BCG programme many years before us? I do find it promising.

People in cork/kerry could be in bother,the old southern health board stopped it long before anyone else



Would be interesting,if they ever publish deaths per county details

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Arghus wrote: »

If you want a blast from the past I recommend going back and having a read through the first Coronavirus mega-thread.

It's hillarious and also depressing watching most of our blase attitudes. Just goes to show that the majority of people posting on here - myself included - don't really have a clue what we are spouting on about.

That's totally normal though. I'd find it strange if we hadn't been blasé to be honest. When this is all under control, we'll go back to that. Staying in a heightening state of anxiety isn't normal or sustainable.

Christy42

Where did the bcg stuff come from? More snake oil?

skellig_rocks

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

WHO-China Joint Mission International Members


Above are the international members of the WHO team which went to China to investigate the Covid-19 Pandemic. They were allowed to go wherever they wanted to go in China during their investigation. The team began in Beijing and then split into two groups that, all told, traveled to Shenzhen, Guangzhou, Chengdu, and the hardest hit city, Wuhan. They visited hospitals, laboratories, companies, wet markets selling live animals, train stations, and local government offices.

Their report was unequivocal. “China’s bold approach to contain the rapid spread of this new respiratory pathogen has changed the course of a rapidly escalating and deadly epidemic,” it says. “This decline in COVID-19 cases across China is real.”

To suggest that the wool was pulled over the eyes of the world's best infection experts is quite frankly ridiculous. The epidemic in China followed the normal expected infection curve, as can be seen when Dr Bruce Aylward presented their findings.



The shutdown was real too, as can be seen from air pollution on the satellite images.



The Chinese draconian measures delayed the spread of this nasty virus for about a month. If all the infected Chinese had spread out all over the world at the end of their Lunar New Year... we would have had Italy on steroids everywhere, without the time to prepare, about a month ago.

The evidence suggests China has been truthful about this new virus, even though they have been economical with the truth about other issues.

So enough of this Sinophobic sh*t which appears on practically every page on this board... "you can't believe a word they say" etc. etc.

The same guy who said he didn’t go to any “dirty” areas in Wuhan on 24 February, nearly 3 months since the first case recorded in Wuhan, and more than a month since Wuhan lockdown.


Why waited nearly 3 months to send an WHO investigative team to the epicentre and origin of the noval coronavirus, Wuhan?


https://en.australia51.com/article/6151DD84-C03D-5B1B-6BEC-0B4E42A5EBF3/
https://twitter.com/annafifield/status/1231939336284688384

What does "dirty zone" mean? Anna Fifield, the Beijing bureau chief of the Washington Post, read on Twitter:" I think "dirty" is the technical term for the parts of hospitals with viruses. But I didn`t get a chance to ask him because he had to get to the airport.

tobefrank321

These are some countries in Europe that had or had not mass BCG programs.

Europe
France: The BCG was mandatory for school children between 1950 and 2007,[39][40] and for healthcare professionals between 1947 and 2010. Vaccination is still available for French healthcare professionals and social workers but is now decided on a case-by-case basis.[41]
Italy: BCG mass vaccination has never been performed in Italy. [37]
Ireland: The BCG was mandatory for all children until 2015 when it was discontinued as a result of global supplie issues.[42]
Germany: Mass vaccination was performed from 1961 until 1998. [43]
Norway: In Norway the BCG vaccine was mandatory from 1947 to 1995. It is still available and recommended for high-risk groups.[44]
Spain: Past national BCG vaccination policy for all from 1965 to 1981. [37]
United Kingdom: The UK introduced universal BCG immunization in 1953. From then until July 2005, UK policy was to immunize all school children aged between 10 and 14 years of age, and all neonates born into high-risk groups. The injection was given only once during an individual's lifetime (as there is no evidence of additional protection from more than one vaccination). BCG was also given to protect people who had been exposed to tuberculosis. The peak of tuberculosis incidence is in adolescence and early adulthood, and an MRC trial showed efficacy lasted a maximum of 15 years.[45] Routine immunization with BCG for all school children was scrapped in July 2005 because of falling cost-effectiveness: whereas in 1953, 94 children would have to be immunized to prevent one case of TB, by 1988, the annual incidence of TB in the UK had fallen so much, 12,000 children would have to be immunized to prevent a single case of TB.[46] The vaccine is still given to at risk healthcare professionals.[47]
Former Soviet Union. BCG was given regularly throughout life.[citation needed]
Bulgaria: The BCG vaccine is mandatory in children since 1951.[48]
Hungary: The BCG vaccination is mandatory for most newborns since 1954

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BCG_vaccine

There just isn't any evidence there to suggest BCG vaccination programs have caused lower infection or death rates. The only proven evidence so far is the only way to stop new infections is social distancing and the like.

is_that_so

From RTE feed

A 101-year-old woman crept out of an old people's home in a bid to get to visit her daughter on her birthday, German police said today.

Officers intercepted her after she had escaped via an emergency exit at the home in northern Germany.

AllGunsBlazing

tobefrank321 wrote: »

The BCG vaccine story seems to have a few holes in it.

The UK had a similar program to our own, yet they have suffered badly from covid 19.

However even if it showed promise, its still 3-6 months before its rolled out and even then it would be limited.

The affects of the bcg only last for roughly 15 years. I received the shot as an infant but still required a booster in primary school after I failed the scratch test.

The booster also may well have been responsible ridding me of chronic childhood asthma.

is_that_so

Christy42 wrote: »

Where did the bcg stuff come from? More snake oil?

Nope, just seems to be a correlation, but a lot more research needed.

Pretzill

Christy42 wrote: »

Where did the bcg stuff come from? More snake oil?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-more-striking-evidence-bcg-vaccine-might-protect-against-covid-19-1.4222110

Deeper Blue

Deleted User wrote: »

People in cork/kerry could be in bother,the old southern health board stopped it long before anyone else



Would be interesting,if they ever publish deaths per county details

Source?

pc7

Christy42 wrote: »

Where did the bcg stuff come from? More snake oil?

I first seen it on Luke O'Neills twitter, been a few interviews and articles since, https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-more-striking-evidence-bcg-vaccine-might-protect-against-covid-19-1.4222110#.XotHK7eOZh4.twitter

fritzelly

Pretzill wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-more-striking-evidence-bcg-vaccine-might-protect-against-covid-19-1.4222110


This has probably been posted before - the thread moves so fast - very interesting research into the BCG programme and it's protection against the virus.

Not counting the other 10 times you are first

Kraft.l

Does anyone have a page of links for volunteering and helping out in the Corona Virus, I can't seem to find any thanks.

Rob A. Bank

jackboy wrote: »

Even if it doesn’t mutate it still has the potential to infect half the humans on the planet. Look at the damage it has done with only a relatively small percentage of people infected.

It is a fair stretch I think to assume this can be managed after a few weeks of restrictions. Potentially the darkest days could be next winter if a wave corresponds to flu season.

True... and who knows what the future may bring.

I am optimistic that given time, the unprecedented scientific study of this virus will come up with some therapy which may modify the progress of the disease.

Anything which would stop the rapid progress to respiratory failure would be a game changer, for the 'severe' 20%.

I live in hope.

Beasty

Inquitus wrote: »

I think its more of the boy who cried wolf, we had SARS, MERS, Swine Flu, none of which had much impact in Europe, as such I guess we just assumed it would be the same again, a big panic initially, but no impact to us or our daily lives.

You missed out the millennium bug....



:pac:

Inquitus

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

Plain only.no self raiser to be got.

If you add baking soda to plain flour it becomes self raising.

tobefrank321

AllGunsBlazing wrote: »

The affects of the bcg only last for roughly 15 years. I received the shot as an infant but still required a booster in primary school after I failed the scratch test.

I still don't see how it applies to infection and death rates. Our confirmed and probable cases is likely similar to most other countries, although its actually impossible to know, given how the case numbers simply aren't reliable in any country, bar one or two.

Our median age of 49 is low for this, while in Italy its something like 66. This is more important in determining death rates.

jill_valentine

I randomly developed severe abdominal pains last night, like I've never felt before. Today some gastro stuff and I feel nauseous and fatigued. Called in sick to work, but I'm really unsure what to do about self isolating (I'm in a shared house). I've read these are common first symptoms in mild cases, but I can't tell if I've Dr. Googled myself.

fritzelly

Kraft.l wrote: »

Does anyone have a page of links for volunteering and helping out in the Corona Virus, I can't seem to find any thanks.

https://www.gov.ie/en/news/ba4e3d-covid-19-ireland-launches-the-community-call-in-major-nationwide-vol/

Wibbs

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

You don't buy it? Jesus christ. Why do you buy the (very rushed) studies that came out then? (This has been in our lives 3 - 4 months. Any academic paper that has been published on it has been rushed based on that timescale, as anyone who has published in a journal knows.) How do you, as a layperson, arbitrate what you believe and what you don't?

Well O me as a layperson here's a post I made on the 8th of February. When the question was raised about asymptomatic spread.

Apparently so and in some their symptoms are so weak that they don't know they have it, but can pass it on. Nasty little bastard of a bug.

As usual our government and health organisation are in reactive it'll be grand mode. In essence we can only really rely on the fact we have no direct flights from heavily affected areas and people who are travelling here from same will have to go through other airports and jurisdictions that have measures in place. If the government and HSE were any bloody use we'd have been doing airport checks for at least a week, but no. The HSE is badly broken and running on old style Irish civil service rules and the government is too busy with the elections. ****.

So me as a completely unqualified layperson as you very much rightly and correctly point out O was right, yet the HSE was effectively saying the opposite a full month later, which was wrong. No spark of genius on my part either. I can read and that was public knowledge at that stage. The British doctor chap who's popular on youtube who has been following this from very early on was saying it well before I was.

And I wasn't too far off the mark re the government and HSE either.