CoVid19 Part XIV - 8,089 in ROI (288 deaths) 1,589 in NI (92 deaths) (10/04) Read OP

owlbethere

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

It seems that Denmark seems to think the same as myself and a lot of other people were talking about last week, which was that the effects from lockdown will kill more than the virus.

"Denmark is expected this weekend to reveal plans to relax its coronavirus lockdown, becoming the first country outside Asia to do so, reasoning that the risks of a deep recession may now be more dangerous for Danish society than a second outbreak."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/04/denmark-prepares-ease-coronavirus-restrictions-200403162421642.html

The alternative to a lockdown is to continue as normal with some guidelines in place but it's still not a great solution to this. The virus sweeping across the population will lead to other problems. There won't be a person unaffected. There will be people in and out from work with illness and the death of loved ones and family, so there will be a recession there anyways. The medical and health system will be overrun with too many people getting sick at the same time and it will collapse the health system.

is_that_so

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

Some people on here seem to think the lockdown we have right now will still exist in September and beyond

That's just not remotely feasible, people will given up on it well before that. I'm inclined to go along with the Reid comment- week by week.

rebeve

The party spin merchants are out in force today .

khalessi

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

Some people on here seem to think the lockdown we have right now will still exist in September and beyond

I get the impression that is more to do with schools and normal life getting back a semblance of normality rather then strict lockdown similar to what is going on at the moment

Phoebas

Azatadine wrote: »

Asymptomatic or pre symptomatic?

Good point.
The CNN article isn't clear on that; there was something published in the Economist along the same lines that might be clearer - I'll see if I can find it again.

jesus_thats_gre

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Do Aer Lingus even have 300 planes? ( I genuinely don't know btw).

Some of the tripe I read I don't know whether to laugh or cry. The one I really cannot understand is why passenger planes are being used to transport medical supplies? Surely a cargo plane is the job here? Just saying.

A degree of self awareness would do you no harm given the set of questions you are asking.

300 flights does not require 300 planes.

Cargo plans are possibly not available. They are also not really necessary given the cargo is bulky but lightweight. What is the problem with using a passenger plane if it's getting the job done - and done safely.

bekker

cameramonkey wrote: »

50% asymptomatic in some studies. Higher in others.

In one group of Irish skiers 18 people were tested when they returned , 8 had the virus none of them had symptoms.

In proportion to population, Iceland has now screened five times as many as in South Korea, it is the most statistically valid sample in terms of population percentage.

Though a tiny sample it's 44% which is in line with Icelandic study, not aware of any large scale studies showing greater than 50%, would be interested if you have a link handy.

Phoebas

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I would trust your instincts on that particular fact.

Do Aer Lingus even have 300 planes? ( I genuinely don't know btw).

Some of the tripe I read I don't know whether to laugh or cry. The one I really cannot understand is why passenger planes are being used to transport medical supplies? Surely a cargo plane is the job here? Just saying.

They certainly don't have anywhere near that number and only a small number that can get to Beijing.
They're using the planes that are usually used for their long haul flights - these carry both passengers and cargo.

easypazz

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I would trust your instincts on that particular fact.

Do Aer Lingus even have 300 planes? ( I genuinely don't know btw).

Some of the tripe I read I don't know whether to laugh or cry. The one I really cannot understand is why passenger planes are being used to transport medical supplies? Surely a cargo plane is the job here? Just saying.

Maybe use the same plane multiple times?

IAMAMORON

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

Some people on here seem to think the lockdown we have right now will still exist in September and beyond

It sounds severe, but I think we will be lucky to be back in the pub by then.

The biggest issue Ireland now faces is the lack of social immunity the virus is creating. Unlike the UK we were very quick to instigate social distancing. This is great at the outbreak phase of a virus epidemic, however it still leaves a high percentage of our population exposed to future infections. We cannot be complacent about when we let people out to play again in the future, it will need to be phased in some shape or form, otherwise we risk bigger clusters in July and and August. The virus does not sleep or go on holidays.

jesus_thats_gre

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

It seems that Denmark seems to think the same as myself and a lot of other people were talking about last week, which was that the effects from lockdown will kill more than the virus.

"Denmark is expected this weekend to reveal plans to relax its coronavirus lockdown, becoming the first country outside Asia to do so, reasoning that the risks of a deep recession may now be more dangerous for Danish society than a second outbreak."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/04/denmark-prepares-ease-coronavirus-restrictions-200403162421642.html

In terms of expectations, you should probably get used to some sort of restrictions being in place for quite some time. That is, until a vaccine is developed or the critical mass of the population have contracted the virus and can be verified as now being immune.

It's a guess but a contact tracing app will probably be the critical path to restrictions being reduced.

IAMAMORON

easypazz wrote: »

Maybe use the same plane multiple times?

I am not an expert in logistics, please forgive me.

caveat emptor

Watched the press briefing there . Confounding issues.

How is it China’s fault that the PPE required to protect HCW from this NOVEL virus is not familiar to staff and they require training?

Is it not a bit late when 25% of our cases are HCW

Then stating that the donated items I.e items not ordered and given in addition to those ordered is not suitable.

I used to not like the socks my granny gave me a Christmas . I wouldn’t say it to her face.

They should have ordered and trained.

We prefer gowns? Corona don’t give a ****. Suit and boot up to save lives. Every other country has had to adjust and have done so far quicker.

Ce he sin

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I would trust your instincts on that particular fact.

Do Aer Lingus even have 300 planes? ( I genuinely don't know btw).

Some of the tripe I read I don't know whether to laugh or cry. The one I really cannot understand is why passenger planes are being used to transport medical supplies? Surely a cargo plane is the job here? Just saying.

Aer Lingus don't have 300 planes and don't need that many to make 300 flights. Planes are normally capable of being used more than once.
They don't have cargo planes.. They do have passenger aircraft and their crews which are sitting around. Best make use of them. The whole world wants cargo planes right now and their owners are charging accordingly.

GM228

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I would trust your instincts on that particular fact.

Do Aer Lingus even have 300 planes? ( I genuinely don't know btw).

Some of the tripe I read I don't know whether to laugh or cry. The one I really cannot understand is why passenger planes are being used to transport medical supplies? Surely a cargo plane is the job here? Just saying.

Aer Lingus have 57 planes of which 11 are of the A330-300 type which are conducting the China flights.

https://m.planespotters.net/airline/Aer-Lingus

6 of them (EI-GCF, EI-EIM, EI-GAJ, EI-DUZ, EI-EDY and EI-FNH) are currently in the air as of now conducting the flights (2 x outbound, 4 x inbound).

There are not enough cargo planes available and besides AL don't have any.

is_that_so

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

In terms of expectations, you should probably get used to some sort of restrictions being in place for quite some time. That is, until a vaccine is developed or the critical mass of the population have contracted the virus and can be verified as now being immune.

It's a guess but a contact tracing app will probably be the critical path to restrictions being reduced.

An app may be with us in about two weeks, user-testing at present they said.

Phoebas

easypazz wrote: »

Maybe use the same plane multiple times?

In a bid to become more environmentally friendly, Aer Lingus phased out using single use aircraft a few years ago.

nacho libre

is_that_so wrote: »

That's just not remotely feasible, people will given up on it well before that. I'm inclined to go along with the Reid comment- week by week.

I think once the virus transmisson rate has lowered sufficiently- ie the virus has infected a large majority of the population, then people over 70 will be asked to continue to self- isolate, while everyone else gets back to near normal life. I doubt that will take until September, but i don't see restrictions being eased to the point whereby large sporting or entertainment events will be allowed till late Summer at least. Of course I may be wrong about that.

wrangler

easypazz wrote: »

Where did I say that?

But you keep representing the front line staff, I am sure they appreciate your efforts a lot more than they appreciate the people flying 300 flights and the people working endless hours in warehouses, driving trucks, unloading planes etc. to get them the best equipment they can in a volatile market.

Of course they should have the best stuff, but so too should the public have a better service than heretofore and this latest episode is just another example of poor service.
Had those that made the cockup been fired fired for lesser offences, of which I'm sure there were many, you wouldn't be in the mess you're in now

ZX7R

podgeandrodge wrote: »

anyone?

The issue regards supermarket started by an English professor ,then it was picked up by some health organization that I never heard of.
The world health organization is of the opinion on the matter is that spread in supermarkets is inconclusive at the present time and more investigation is needed.

khalessi

I watched it too.

THey were not expecting the jumpsuits.

caveat emptor wrote: »

Watched the press briefing there . Confounding issues.

How is it China’s fault that the PPE required to protect HCW from this NOVEL virus is not familiar to staff and they require training?

THe jumpsuit coveralls require training as it was discovered post Ebola breakout that HCW were getting infected getting out of them. SO it requires best practice a second person to help ensure they are being removed safely.

Is it not a bit late when 25% of our cases are HCW

NO because not all are infected and we would like to keep it that way

Then stating that the donated items I.e items not ordered and given in addition to those ordered is not suitable.

That is why they said they would be used elsewhere or as back up
I used to not like the socks my granny gave me a Christmas . I wouldn’t say it to her face.

They should have ordered and trained.

As they said they could only inspect the order on arrival and didnt realise coverall jumpsuits would be sent.

We prefer gowns? Corona don’t give a ****. Suit and boot up to save lives. Every other country has had to adjust and have done so far quicker.

THey will adjust and quickly as our HCW adapt quickly

IAMAMORON

caveat emptor wrote: »

Watched the press briefing there . Confounding issues.

How is it China’s fault that the PPE required to protect HCW from this NOVEL virus is not familiar to staff and they require training?

Is it not a bit late when 25% of our cases are HCW

Then stating that the donated items I.e items not ordered and given in addition to those ordered is not suitable.

I used to not like the socks my granny gave me a Christmas . I wouldn’t say it to her face.

They should have ordered and trained.

We prefer gowns? Corona don’t give a ****. Suit and boot up to save lives. Every other country has had to adjust and have done so far quicker.

You should apply for a job as the HSE procurement officer, you seem to know what is going on.

is_that_so

nacho libre wrote: »

I think once the virus transmisson rate has lowered sufficiently- ie the virus has infected a large majority of the population, then people over 70 will be asked to continue to self- isolate, while everyone else gets back to near normal life. I doubt that will take until September, but i don't see restrictions being eased to the point whereby large sporting or entertainment events will be allowed till late Summer at least. Of course I may be wrong about that.

I generally agree but I'd say continued social distancing will be the tool rather than extending self-isolation.

jesus_thats_gre

is_that_so wrote: »

An app may be with us in about two weeks, user-testing at present they said.

I really don't have a clue what I am talking about but any relaxing of restrictions will probably use a combination of levers - with a heavy dependency on data.

1. The capacity of the health service
2. Virus testing capacity - with dramatically lower feedback loops for receiving result (hours I would imagine) being mandatory.
3. Some sort of antibody testing - probably tied to further confirmations around immunity to the virus once recovered.
4. Contact tracing app whereby contacts are aggressively quarantined.

Government will probably be in a position to scale up and down restrictions in a pretty agile manner at that point. And do so at a more localised level as opposed to nationwide mandates.

Timberrrrrrrr

Phoebas wrote: »

In a bid to become more environmentally friendly, Aer Lingus phased out using single use aircraft a few years ago.

T'was worse than the plastic bags, everywhere you looked there were Boeing 747's stuck in trees where the wind had blown them, sure my uncle once had to unblock a sewer because the were NINE of the feckers down there.

ArmaniJeanss

Ce he sin wrote: »

Planes are normally capable of being used more than once.

Except those Boeing 737-MAX's obviously.

woohoo!!!

6 planes in the air, that is fantastic. Speed, not perfection, is the name of the game. And if that means kissing CCP ass, who cares, this stuff saves lives and protects our most vital asset, our health workers.

BanditLuke

Good news from France, Italy and Spain considering how bad things are over there.

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-number-of-daily-covid-19-deaths-in-spain-continues-to-fall-11968826

Hopefully this trend continues over the next week

cameramonkey

bekker wrote: »

In proportion to population, Iceland has now screened five times as many as in South Korea, it is the most statistically valid sample in terms of population percentage.

Though a tiny sample it's 44% which is in line with Icelandic study, not aware of any large scale studies showing greater than 50%, would be interested if you have a link handy.

50 percent of the documented COVID-19 cases are asymptomatic cases,

https://promarket.org/why-mass-testing-is-crucial-the-us-should-study-the-veneto-model-to-fight-covid-19/

GM228

woohoo!!! wrote: »

6 planes in the air, that is fantastic. Speed, not perfection, is the name of the game. And if that means kissing CCP ass, who cares, this stuff saves lives and protects our most vital asset, our health workers.

To increase to 10 of the 11 in use with 5 in each direction per day.

300 flights will be fulfilled in no time.