American response

ceadaoin.

Leroy42 wrote: »

Surely the right thing to do is to properly resource the claim departments. You seen to be suggesting that things are reopened, not on any medical ability, but because the system sucks.

Why is the system so unable to cope you need to ask? Why, since they knew from January, has nothing been done to address this?

They are adding resources, but a system that was never built to support that big of a load can't be updated just like that.

I'm saying things should be reopened, not because the system sucks (even though it does), but because if it doesn't far more people will die or have their lives adversely affected. We aren't New York. my state of 3 million people has 3000 confirmed cases and a little over 100 deaths. Half the cases have recovered. We took measures early and indications are we have passed the peak of infections. I don't mean business as usual straight away or anything, but a controlled and gradual return.

ceadaoin.

dresden8 wrote: »

They did that with foreigners though. Part of the new America is rejecting foreigners.

I'm a foreigner. My husband is a foreigner. His boss and owners of the company he works for are foreigners. Our friends who emigrated here just a few months ago are foreigners. We know loads of other foreigners. So I don't think they are rejected at all.

threeball

ceadaoin. wrote: »

1 in 10 people in my state are out of work now. The system can't cope, and many can't even get their claim started because its totally blocked. It can't go on like this. And yet people are criticized as heartless bastards for even the merest suggestion of loosening restrictions. Its easy to say that when you aren't in dire straits yourself. There is no safety net here. It has to happen

So double down on all the mistakes of the past and walk the country into an even bigger crisis, thats what you're suggesting.

This election is 6 months too early for Sanders. Give it a few months and he'd have walked home. This uber capitalism crap loses its sheen pretty quick when you're starving.

ceadaoin.

threeball wrote: »

So double down on all the mistakes of the past and walk the country into an even bigger crisis, thats what you're suggesting.

This election is 6 months too early for Sanders. Give it a few months and he'd have walked home. This uber capitalism crap loses its sheen pretty quick when you're starving.

No, I'm not suggesting that. Every state is different. What works for one state might not work for the whole country. We didn't make mistakes. We, as in the state I live in, shut down, and it worked. 119 deaths, out of a population of 3 million.

And also, yes I agree. my state overwhelmingly voted for Bernie in the primaries last election and this one. Doesn't change the fact we can't keep the whole economy completely shut down indefinitely. People need to earn a living.

Leroy42

dresden8 wrote: »

They did that with foreigners though. Part of the new America is rejecting foreigners.

It's not the dislike of foreigners, its that they are scared. Scared of anything new, fear of change, fear of losing what they have.

US was built of doing things first, faster or better. Now it's all about blaming others, denying science and facts.

If you can't acknowledge what the problem is you can't hope to solve it.

They have become prisoners to what was supposed to set them free. They spend so much time defending their seemingly perfect constitution that they have no time to deal with the many glaring issues with it and its interpretation.

US used to relish in its position of leader of the world, now it wants to retreat into itself scared of everything and everyone different.

gormdubhgorm

Leroy42 wrote: »

It's not the dislike of foreigners, its that they are scared. Scared of anything new, fear of change, fear of losing what they have.

US was built of doing things first, faster or better. Now it's all about blaming others, denying science and facts.

If you can't acknowledge what the problem is you can't hope to solve it.

They have become prisoners to what was supposed to set them free. They spend so much time defending their seemingly perfect constitution that they have no time to deal with the many glaring issues with it and its interpretation.

US used to relish in its position of leader of the world, now it wants to retreat into itself scared of everything and everyone different.

The irony is thier isolationist policies are very reminiscent of China (sorry I mean Chi-nah) hundreds of years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haijin

alchemist33

The lawyer for a pastor who continued to hold large services in Louisiana despite an order not to has been admitted to hospital. Can you guess what he has?

https://blackchristiannews.com/2020/04/59-year-old-lawyer-for-louisiana-evangelical-megachurch-who-defied-social-distancing-orders-is-in-hospital-with-coronvairus-after-attending-a-ppacked-palm-sunday-service-but-he-insists-he-has-no-ide/

This is like the American response summed up in a single story

Carfacemandog

alchemist33 wrote: »

The lawyer for a pastor who continued to hold large services in Louisiana despite an order not to has been admitted to hospital. Can you guess what he has?

https://blackchristiannews.com/2020/04/59-year-old-lawyer-for-louisiana-evangelical-megachurch-who-defied-social-distancing-orders-is-in-hospital-with-coronvairus-after-attending-a-ppacked-palm-sunday-service-but-he-insists-he-has-no-ide/

This is like the American response summed up in a single story

Add it to the list, same happened to another pastor in Virginia a few days ago - https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-us-pastor-who-said-god-is-larger-than-this-virus-and-defied-social-distancing-dies-of-covid-19-11973094 - "A US pastor who defied social-distancing rules to host large congregations has died after contracting coronavirus."

And he wasn't even the first covid denying pastor in Virginia to die from this - https://www.rawstory.com/2020/03/christian-pastor-who-thought-covid-19-is-just-mass-hysteria-among-the-first-in-virginia-to-die-from-virus/

They used to claim many bad things that happened I nthe US over Obama's tenure as punishment from God. I wonder if they might take this as a sign over supporting Trump? Ha, who am I kidding, I'll let this lady take it from here:

Stateofyou

Leroy42 wrote: »

It's not the dislike of foreigners, its that they are scared. Scared of anything new, fear of change, fear of losing what they have.

US was built of doing things first, faster or better. Now it's all about blaming others, denying science and facts.

If you can't acknowledge what the problem is you can't hope to solve it.

They have become prisoners to what was supposed to set them free. They spend so much time defending their seemingly perfect constitution that they have no time to deal with the many glaring issues with it and its interpretation.

US used to relish in its position of leader of the world, now it wants to retreat into itself scared of everything and everyone different.

A question for you: have you ever lived in the US or do you live in the US?
That is a massive blanket statement. You should replace the words "they" and "it" with "Trump." There are wonderfully kind, accepting, intelligent, innovative and interesting people there. It's a huge, diverse country-a melting pot of immigrants and foreigners. And 3 million more people voted for Hillary than Trump. Many have regretted voting for Trump, thinking he represented some radical change for the status quo and would help the forgotten middle class as pledged. Obviously they were wrong. And of course a portion of the group who voted for him did so off some set of lower values and stupidity. And lets not forget the huge issues with voting- disenfranchisements, gerrymandering and dirty moves by dirty politicians often powered by big money. It just annoys me to see an entire country labeled one way especially when a never before seen at this level corrupt government is the one calling the shots.

NSAman

Stateofyou wrote: »

A question for you: have you ever lived in the US or do you live in the US?
That is a massive blanket statement. You should replace the words "they" and "it" with "Trump." There are wonderfully kind, accepting, intelligent, innovative and interesting people there. It's a huge, diverse country-a melting pot of immigrants and foreigners. And 3 million more people voted for Hillary than Trump. Many have regretted voting for Trump, thinking he represented some radical change for the status quo and would help the forgotten middle class as pledged. Obviously they were wrong. And of course a portion of the group who voted for him did so off some set of lower values and stupidity. And lets not forget the huge issues with voting- disenfranchisements, gerrymandering and dirty moves by dirty politicians often powered by big money. It just annoys me to see an entire country labeled one way especially when a never before seen at this level corrupt government is the one calling the shots.

I live here. It is not just government, it is not just corruption, it is not just Trump (and I say that heavy heartedly).

It is years of no one caring enough about the systems that are in place. It is years of mis-management. It is too many people in jobs that have no idea how to DO those jobs. There is little if NO Emergency planning.

This country is broken!

Not only in political lines, also in societal lines, America is a basket case.

My own state, a simple example... the unemployment assistance line is the same as the employers/job search line... you cannot get through. The website to advertise jobs in the State is not working, you cannot get through, it is a complete joke.

Simple things that SHOULD work, do not!

ChikiChiki

Think the way things are going in the states we might see escalated tensions in some states as the lockdown needs to be reintroduced leading to martial law leading to the emergence of the NRA supporting gun wielding maniacs "defending their freedoms".

It's been simmering for a long time. The Pandemic might be the catalyst.

KilOit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE6B9Mmvpyo

Carfacemandog

The very first link when I googled "Pastor Spell"

Parishioner and 'right hand man' of controversial pastor Tony Spell who has defied lockdown measures dies from coronavirus
"Pastor Spell disputed the cause of death saying he died from a broken heart."


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8229015/amp/Parishioner-controversial-pastor-Tony-Spell-dies-coronavirus.html

NSAman

Carfacemandog wrote: »

The very first link when I googled "Pastor Spell"

Parishioner and 'right hand man' of controversial pastor Tony Spell who has defied lockdown measures dies from coronavirus
"Pastor Spell disputed the cause of death saying he died from a broken heart."


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8229015/amp/Parishioner-controversial-pastor-Tony-Spell-dies-coronavirus.html

Sums up many of the so called “churches” of Christianity in the States.

These Pastors are about as religious as a Bank!

Leroy42

Stateofyou wrote: »

A question for you: have you ever lived in the US or do you live in the US?
That is a massive blanket statement. You should replace the words "they" and "it" with "Trump." There are wonderfully kind, accepting, intelligent, innovative and interesting people there. It's a huge, diverse country-a melting pot of immigrants and foreigners. And 3 million more people voted for Hillary than Trump. Many have regretted voting for Trump, thinking he represented some radical change for the status quo and would help the forgotten middle class as pledged. Obviously they were wrong. And of course a portion of the group who voted for him did so off some set of lower values and stupidity. And lets not forget the huge issues with voting- disenfranchisements, gerrymandering and dirty moves by dirty politicians often powered by big money. It just annoys me to see an entire country labeled one way especially when a never before seen at this level corrupt government is the one calling the shots.

Amazingly, I have access to media, reports, and lots of social media. You don't need to live in a place, particularly one as you point out so diverse and large as the US, to understand it. Do you think Trump understands the US, or Obama did?

Unfortunately for all those opposed to Trump, he is their president as well. He represents the US. You have to take your lead from somewhere. Otherwise we would need to take account of each of the 350m odd peoples views everytime we want to talk about anything, which is of course impossible.

So democracy was invested as a way to try to get the majority view, and the US system is the one they work with and people know. So if they feel bad about that they need to fight to sort it out.

Of course within the US, just like every country, there are kind people. Loving, caring, open. But the direction of any country, including Ireland, is set from the government. They try to reflect the will of the people, whilst of course looking to get themselves re elected.

But there is little doubt that the US has, on average, turned in on itself. It is bound, and wrapped, in a constitution that he deemed unchanging and almost mythical despite it clearly having major issues. It has allowed it courts system to become completely politicised. It has allowed fear to overtake it previously can do atitude.

For example, for scared are they of Mexicans that they feel they literally need to build a wall! Not only is it almost completely useless in dealing with the issues they fear the most, but it is a solution from years past.

Instead of looking to creating future where they continue to be the biggest, they are fearful of China and have no idea how to deal with it save for locking them out.

Of course within that you have companies like Apple, Google, FB. So there is of course innovation and advancement but the lead from the WH is that questions are scary, the outside world is out to get them, they are losing, and the US they thought they knew is gone.

And, of the people that actually bothered or could vote, almost half agree with that.

threeball

KilOit wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE6B9Mmvpyo

Amazing how so many people will go and pay their entire cheque or even a portion of it to that absolute crook. But there will be hundreds who do. It takes a special kind of stupid not to see that for what it is.

Billy Mays

Fauci explaining things to one of Dim Donnie's trusted advisers

https://mobile.twitter.com/Acyn/status/1250971873627668483

threeball

Leroy42 wrote: »

Amazingly, I have access to media, reports, and lots of social media. You don't need to live in a place, particularly one as you point out so diverse and large as the US, to understand it. Do you think Trump understands the US, or Obama did?

Unfortunately for all those opposed to Trump, he is their president as well. He represents the US. You have to take your lead from somewhere. Otherwise we would need to take account of each of the 350m odd peoples views everytime we want to talk about anything, which is of course impossible.

So democracy was invested as a way to try to get the majority view, and the US system is the one they work with and people know. So if they feel bad about that they need to fight to sort it out.

Of course within the US, just like every country, there are kind people. Loving, caring, open. But the direction of any country, including Ireland, is set from the government. They try to reflect the will of the people, whilst of course looking to get themselves re elected.

But there is little doubt that the US has, on average, turned in on itself. It is bound, and wrapped, in a constitution that he deemed unchanging and almost mythical despite it clearly having major issues. It has allowed it courts system to become completely politicised. It has allowed fear to overtake it previously can do atitude.

For example, for scared are they of Mexicans that they feel they literally need to build a wall! Not only is it almost completely useless in dealing with the issues they fear the most, but it is a solution from years past.

Instead of looking to creating future where they continue to be the biggest, they are fearful of China and have no idea how to deal with it save for locking them out.

Of course within that you have companies like Apple, Google, FB. So there is of course innovation and advancement but the lead from the WH is that questions are scary, the outside world is out to get them, they are losing, and the US they thought they knew is gone.

And, of the people that actually bothered or could vote, almost half agree with that.

They've also created most of their own problems. They outsourced pretty much 90% of their manufacturing to China whilst their neighbours were being overrun with crime due to drugs consumed by and guns sold by the US. If they truly wanted to tackle immigration then they should have invested in it. Outsource your manufacturing to Mexico, then on to Honduras etc. Give these people a leg up rather than a competitor on the other side of the world that was ripping off IP at every turn.

Starting wars in the middle east to enrich a handful of people involved in oil and weapons and create enemies that were never there. Creating boogeymen that were coming to get ya with constant fear being peddled by the media. They had it all coming out of WW2, the envy of the world and now its disappearing from under them like a melting glacier.

Stateofyou

Leroy42 wrote: »

Amazingly, I have access to media, reports, and lots of social media. You don't need to live in a place, particularly one as you point out so diverse and large as the US, to understand it.

For example, for scared are they of Mexicans that they feel they literally need to build a wall! Not only is it almost completely useless in dealing with the issues they fear the most, but it is a solution from years past.

Instead of looking to creating future where they continue to be the biggest, they are fearful of China and have no idea how to deal with it save for locking them out.

Of course within that you have companies like Apple, Google, FB. So there is of course innovation and advancement but the lead from the WH is that questions are scary, the outside world is out to get them, they are losing, and the US they thought they knew is gone.

And, of the people that actually bothered or could vote, almost half agree with that.

Wow, you have superhuman powers unlike any other! :pac::pac: The fact that you haven't lived there (or likely anywhere abroad?) is showing. You do actually need that for perspective that you can't get by being an armchair psychologist. You've obviously not understood it that well either, for all your internet sluething, evidenced by your blanket statements of an extremely diverse country. You haven't got any sort of grasp on reality there at all.

There you go with the "they" again - it was literally Trump's racist idea for the wall that his mind-melted followers love to rant about. It's not supported widely, and many who live on the border (or not) have spoken up and fought back. Mayors and Governors have given statistics about their border cities which actually rank among the lowest of crime rates. Politicians and gov't officials have kicked up and blocked funding. Etc. When you live somewhere, you see all this happen in real time and you have a much better grasp of it all. If you have missed it or not experienced it you wouldn't even know what to look for.

NSAman

Leroy42 wrote: »

Amazingly, I have access to media, reports, and lots of social media. You don't need to live in a place, particularly one as you point out so diverse and large as the US, to understand it.

I would disagree. To an extent you understand what people write about it, but here I do not understand it. Media reports are crazy, the amount of distortion of actual things in media is Europe is incredible. When reports in the USA cannot even agree on things, how can anyone outside a country rely on anything? I judge and measure things based on what I read, what I experience and by talking to many many people locally, statewide and nationally.. ( my job involves liaising with companies and heads of companies globally).

Of course within the US, just like every country, there are kind people. Loving, caring, open. But the direction of any country, including Ireland, is set from the government. They try to reflect the will of the people, whilst of course looking to get themselves re elected.

America is not directed by the government, it is directed by corporations and wealthy individuals and is still “open” in thought process for advancement of ideas.

But there is little doubt that the US has, on average, turned in on itself. It is bound, and wrapped, in a constitution that he deemed unchanging and almost mythical despite it clearly having major issues. It has allowed it courts system to become completely politicised. It has allowed fear to overtake it previously can do atitude.

The can-do attitude is STILL very much alive outside of State and Federal Government. It is the people and ideas that make the US work. Lawmakers and Government stymie development here. I have never worked in a country like this before (and I have lived in many) that is open and willing to develop ideas like the USA. Europe can only dream of having the development and ideas creation that exists here. The lack of an “old boys” network stopping people developing ideas is a main driver here, although I sense that the larger corporations are acting as an “old boys” network here.

For example, for scared are they of Mexicans that they feel they literally need to build a wall! Not only is it almost completely useless in dealing with the issues they fear the most, but it is a solution from years past.

Most Mexicans are hard working, this is a narrative being drive by Trump and some. The US needs workers and it is not only Mexicans being stopped from coming in, they are also making it much more difficult for anyone other than “monied” individuals moving here.

Of course within that you have companies like Apple, Google, FB. So there is of course innovation and advancement but the lead from the WH is that questions are scary, the outside world is out to get them, they are losing, and the US they thought they knew is gone.

Apple, Google and FB are ruining innovation in the US IMHO.

I agree with some of what you are saying, having lived here on and off for early 20 years, and full time for 8 years, this country is HUGE and has so many divergent local culture/attitudes and ways of doing things. The main inhibitor in my opinion, is the State and Local governments are by and large useless. The Federal Government is a completely broken gravy train that adds little to the direction this country takes.

Leroy42

So wait, only a person that lives i a certain place can have an understanding of it? How would that even work? No body could ever be given any job in politics unless they have lived in every diverse part of a country? Seriously now.

If one only consumes one type of media then I would agree that one would not be qualified, but I don't. And in terms of the US, we are all very much involved in their culture and many of us have a deep interest in the country through TV, film, books, journals, contacts, work colleagues, family.

But, whilst it is clearly very diverse, but only in terms of the extremes for every country is diverse, there are a number of commonalities that run through the middle. Love/belief in capitalism. Dislike of big government and the idea of society. And that the POTUS is the head of the country and as such the face and leader.

You may not personally think that, but that is the reality. Enough people decided in 2016 that Trump was more representative of their views that anyone else they could vote for (I understand the popular vote, but their system doesn't work that way).

You cannot just put Trump as some rogue individual, he wasn't born into the role, the great people of US voted for him. It is their POTUS.

So the question becomes why so many of the US voted for him. My belief, and it continues to be borne out during his time as POTUS, is that the US has indeed lost its way. Why has a country that got a man to the moon lost it ability to lead the world? I think it's because they have forgotten what made them great. We have seen it in all previous empires, they become 'fat' and forget that there will always be others looking to steal their crown. China has done it because they (and the EU are the same) got lazy and complacent. We thought we could ship off the crappy stuff and they would be happy with that, but they used that to get a foothold and now they are using this to their advantage.

Carfacemandog

Fox news to defend itself in a lawsuit just good as openly admitted it has been intentionally lying about the coronavirus, claiming lies are constitutionally protected.

https://truthout.org/articles/fox-news-defends-its-covid-lies/

“Under the First Amendment and state law, the truth or falsity of this type of speech must be resolved through free and open debate in the marketplace of ideas — not through burdensome litigation seeking to impose legal penalties on political statements that a jury might deem ‘false’ or ‘outrageous,'” the motion said. “In addition, the Complaint also fails because the statements are constitutionally protected opinions. Again, even accepting the Complaint’s characterization of the speech at issue, the Fox commentators were expressing their view on the scientific question of how dangerous the Coronavirus is and how society should respond to it — including what type of governmental action should be taken.”

Of course, it's the US where there are almost no standards required in televised news, so legal experts are predicting that the courts will decide outright and deliberate lies in news media are perfectly acceptable.

Stateofyou

Leroy42 wrote: »

So wait, only a person that lives i a certain place can have an understanding of it? How would that even work? No body could ever be given any job in politics unless they have lived in every diverse part of a country? Seriously now.

If one only consumes one type of media then I would agree that one would not be qualified, but I don't. And in terms of the US, we are all very much involved in their culture and many of us have a deep interest in the country through TV, film, books, journals, contacts, work colleagues, family.

So the question becomes why so many of the US voted for him.

I don't think those career people tend to go around using broad terms like "they" and painting an entire country of 330million with one brush in black/white terms. Just internet armchair psychologists.

People think they know the US because they watch films, tv shows, listen to music and digest the big headlines. Or maybe their co-worker is from there (I recently had two co-workers, one from Syria and one from the DR of Congo. Though I get some insights I wouldn't presume to state anything unequivocally) Would you say people have a good grasp of Ireland having never lived here because they watched the Quiet Man, The Commitments, Ryan's Daughter, listen to U2, follow RTE on Twitter and think we're all poets and drinkers living in magical green fields because, stereotypes?

In fairness, I don't think that's the question as this thread is about the Trump/American response to Coronavirus. You should probably start a new topic on that subject if you want to go down that rabbit hole.

NSAman

Leroy42 wrote: »

So wait, only a person that lives i a certain place can have an understanding of it? How would that even work? No body could ever be given any job in politics unless they have lived in every diverse part of a country? Seriously now.

If one only consumes one type of media then I would agree that one would not be qualified, but I don't. And in terms of the US, we are all very much involved in their culture and many of us have a deep interest in the country through TV, film, books, journals, contacts, work colleagues, family.

But, whilst it is clearly very diverse, but only in terms of the extremes for every country is diverse, there are a number of commonalities that run through the middle. Love/belief in capitalism. Dislike of big government and the idea of society. And that the POTUS is the head of the country and as such the face and leader.

You may not personally think that, but that is the reality. Enough people decided in 2016 that Trump was more representative of their views that anyone else they could vote for (I understand the popular vote, but their system doesn't work that way).

You cannot just put Trump as some rogue individual, he wasn't born into the role, the great people of US voted for him. It is their POTUS.

So the question becomes why so many of the US voted for him. My belief, and it continues to be borne out during his time as POTUS, is that the US has indeed lost its way. Why has a country that got a man to the moon lost it ability to lead the world? I think it's because they have forgotten what made them great. We have seen it in all previous empires, they become 'fat' and forget that there will always be others looking to steal their crown. China has done it because they (and the EU are the same) got lazy and complacent. We thought we could ship off the crappy stuff and they would be happy with that, but they used that to get a foothold and now they are using this to their advantage.

While I agree with the majority of what you posted here, there are absolutely differences in living full time in a place and not.

It was obvious to anyone looking that Trump would win last time. All you had to do was talk to people. Pieces in the press by reporters mainly living in democrat strongholds had Hillary as the winner. talking to people in person gave a completely different view.

You can have an understanding of how things work in the States, the reality is far more different.

I have an understanding of how thins work in Ireland, based on reading social media and talking to people(not to mention living there), do I understand it all ? Nope! Neither do I understand the USA and never will.

Leroy42

So just wondering how you think I should phrase it.

Should I individually account for each and every one of the 330m views? Should I personally visit each one each time to check if their views have changed?

Or should we never talk about it again because none of us really know, for that seems to be what you are suggesting.

NSAman

Leroy42 wrote: »

So just wondering how you think I should phrase it.

Should I individually account for each and every one of the 330m views? Should I personally visit each one each time to check if their views have changed?

Or should we never talk about it again because none of us really know, for that seems to be what you are suggesting.

Express any view you wish, that is your right.

No matter what any of us state, they are our own views. It doesn’t mean we are always correct on anything we say. No matter what we say anyhow, nothing will be changed until something makes that change happen. This crisis SHOULD make change happen, will it? I doubt it!

USA will be continued to be lead by The POTUS some will scream he is an idiot, some will follow him blindly.

Personally, all I am hoping is that all my employees, family and friends are safe and healthy and can survive through all of this..... priorities..;)

BarryD2

I think the old US needs to go down a bit further and then people will see through and beyond Trump. Right now unemployment is rising, substantial Covid deaths and the values of citizens investments are being dented. That's what is going to do for the Donald. He's gotten away with outrageous carry on - but once the people turn, they'll turn badly against the Republicans. If they've any sense at all, they'll persuade him to not stand for re election and put up a fresh candidate with a 'clean' pair of hands. Even now, he's beginning to a have the look of a drowning man thrashing about and seeing who else he can blame, cling onto and pull down.

ceadaoin.

Lol, random internet person thinks they have an in depth understanding of the American people based on what they read on the internet and TV shows. Meanwhile those of us who actually live here say differently but hey, what do we know about the place we have lived for years. If it was any other country, sweeping generalizations about "them" would generally be frowned upon.

ceadaoin.

BarryD2 wrote: »

I think the old US needs to go down a bit further and then people will see through and beyond Trump. Right now unemployment is rising, substantial Covid deaths and the values of citizens investments are being dented. That's what is going to do for the Donald. He's gotten away with outrageous carry on - but once the people turn, they'll turn badly against the Republicans. If they've any sense at all, they'll persuade him to not stand for re election and put up a fresh candidate with a 'clean' pair of hands. Even now, he's beginning to a have the look of a drowning man thrashing about and seeing who else he can blame, cling onto and pull down.

haha there's no way Trump won't stand for re election. Some people will never vote any other way then republican, no matter who the candidate is. They won't turn against the party. That's part of the problem.

Harry Palmr

The MAGA goons at it again, hopefully a few of them will die screaming as God judges their stupidity.