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Is this the end of Debenhams?

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    #122
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,975 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    ongarboy wrote: »
    May be an unpopular opinion but the longer this drags on, it'll come to the stage that having Debenhams on your CV could act as a deterrent to future employers as

    I believe it's already long past that stage.


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    #123
    rolling boh
    Registered Users Posts: 2,065 ✭✭✭rolling boh


    Some of the more vocal protesters will be given a wide berth by any potential employers they would certainly be seen as possibly difficult and not worth the grief. .


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    #124
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    rolling boh wrote: »
    Some of the more vocal protesters will be given a wide berth by any potential employers they would certainly be seen as possibly difficult and not worth the grief. .

    Judging by their Facebook page, there aren’t many protesters left, vocal or otherwise. The numbers are usually bulked up by the likes of Ruth Coppinger.

    The protesters that are left have no interest in getting another job.


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    #125
    Jerry Attrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 243 ✭✭Jerry Attrick


    Ex-Debenhams workers vote to end industrial dispute after 406 days

    "These brave trade unionists maintained their legal pickets no matter the weather and in the midst of a global pandemic they socially distanced on picket lines whilst facing down the government and KPMG at every opportunity," said Gerry Light, Mandate General Secretary. :-)


    Frankly I'm shocked! How on earth will Coppinger and her pals pass the time now that this is over? I wonder if they'll find something a bit more useful to do - like picketing the Israeli Embassy.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40294034.html


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    #126
    Rrrrrr2
    Registered Users Posts: 982 ✭✭✭Rrrrrr2


    RGARDINR wrote: »
    Was up in Newry debenhams on Friday. Was a good sale in it now. Was a shame they didn't get to do that down here. Say some of the stock was from stores down here and brought up there. Bíg queues at the tills. 1st time I ever saw a trolley in a debenhams with some one packing it out with things to buy.

    I reckon it would have been too much hassle- I support the workers to a point but at this stage it’s flogging a dead horse- the business was dying/dead anyhow and would have happened anyhow. The sensible thing would have been to have a quick clearance sale in situ but would have been a lot of trouble. Their workforce seem very militant


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    #127
    mikemac2
    Registered Users Posts: 2,956 ✭✭✭mikemac2


    The Facebook group seems to lay the blame 50:50 on the government and union leadership

    That’s not scientific, just a quick scan by me


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    #128
    afro man
    Registered Users Posts: 617 ✭✭✭afro man


    Rrrrrr2 wrote: »
    I reckon it would have been too much hassle- I support the workers to a point but at this stage it’s flogging a dead horse- the business was dying/dead anyhow and would have happened anyhow. The sensible thing would have been to have a quick clearance sale in situ but would have been a lot of trouble. Their workforce seem very militant



    Fair play to the Workers for Protesting .. imagine you lost your job after 10-20 years and company can walk away and then have the neck to go back into store and remove items for a quick sale.. Militant now if you protest for your jobs or Money owed.. Note Government were Shocking with no help or support and to make it even worse they sent in Gardaí to help the company clean out the Stock .


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    #129
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    afro man wrote: »
    Fair play to the Workers for Protesting .. imagine you lost your job after 10-20 years and company can walk away and then have the neck to go back into store and remove items for a quick sale.. Militant now if you protest for your jobs or Money owed.. Note Government were Shocking with no help or support and to make it even worse they sent in Gardaí to help the company clean out the Stock .

    They got their statutory redundancy.

    Only one fifth of the former workers voted on the accepted deal. A case of a few empty vessels making a lot of noise.


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    #130
    newuser99999
    Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭newuser99999


    afro man wrote: »
    Fair play to the Workers for Protesting .. imagine you lost your job after 10-20 years and company can walk away and then have the neck to go back into store and remove items for a quick sale.. Militant now if you protest for your jobs or Money owed.. Note Government were Shocking with no help or support and to make it even worse they sent in Gardaí to help the company clean out the Stock .

    The goods need to be sold to pay their creditors. It’s not just free money and stock.


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    #131
    Rrrrrr2
    Registered Users Posts: 982 ✭✭✭Rrrrrr2


    newuser99999 wrote: »
    The goods need to be sold to pay their creditors. It’s not just free money and stock.

    The business was dead at this stage- I like Debenhams but was an outdated business model-menswear at least was often very behind the times.


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    #132
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    ongarboy wrote: »
    May be an unpopular opinion but the longer this drags on, it'll come to the stage that having Debenhams on your CV could act as a deterrent to future employers as they may wonder if you are one of the militant protesters. I strongly believe its just a minority of workers and their vested interest supporters keeping this going. The rest of the laid off staff found replacement jobs many months ago and have earned multiples of the few thousand euro the protestors are campaigning for in that interim.

    Its all over the news that retailers are struggling to fill jobs so there is plenty of such work available.

    It already does.

    It was a subject of discussion at an online retailer conference and the overwhelming majority said that they would discard CVS that had Debenhams on them without immediate new employment when they closed


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    #133
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Darc19 wrote: »
    It already does.

    It was a subject of discussion at an online retailer conference and the overwhelming majority said that they would discard CVS that had Debenhams on them without immediate new employment when they closed

    That’s a surprise. Not! Trouble makers are never wanted. They did great to last as long as they did. No talent. No work ethic. No ambition.

    Trouble is that the small minority are ruining it for the majority.


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    #134
    Jerry Attrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 243 ✭✭Jerry Attrick


    Darc19 wrote: »

    It was a subject of discussion at an online retailer conference and the overwhelming majority said that they would discard CVS that had Debenhams on them without immediate new employment when they closed

    But none of the Debenhams strikers will contemplate working in retail again!

    They've been given access to a €3m re-training fund which will enable them all to qualify as astronauts or nuclear physicists or, God forbid, as Solidarity-PbP TDs!


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    #135
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    So, they were expecting to be laid off.

    “I remember just saying to one of the managers, jokingly; ‘I’ll probably never see you again, they’ll probably walk away now with the pandemic and take the opportunity’.”
    https://www.thejournal.ie/debenhams-workers-2-5444168-May2021/


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    #136
    RGARDINR
    Registered Users Posts: 2,036 ✭✭✭RGARDINR


    Deleted User wrote: »
    So, they were expecting to be laid off.

    “I remember just saying to one of the managers, jokingly; ‘I’ll probably never see you again, they’ll probably walk away now with the pandemic and take the opportunity’.”
    https://www.thejournal.ie/debenhams-workers-2-5444168-May2021/
    More the staff were offered this package months ago and didn't take it and after months of not taking it now they have, if you were on the pickets you would be thinking well those months were a total waste of my life, what was the point of that? Shame didn't open the shop even now and sold off the stock. Was extremely busy in the Newry store the 2 times I went up just before it closed down, people were buying a lot in it. Might make liquidators more money that way then sell g it off as bulk to shops or whoever is buying it.


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    #137
    Wanderer2010
    Registered Users Posts: 6,740 ✭✭✭Wanderer2010


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    That’s a surprise. Not! Trouble makers are never wanted. They did great to last as long as they did. No talent. No work ethic. No ambition.

    Trouble is that the small minority are ruining it for the majority.

    Thats a real sweeping judgment of the workers. They did their job for years and years and only wanted a fair pay off, fair play to them for trying to stick up for workers rights. Saying they have no talent or ambition is just needlessly mean.


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    #138
    Jerry Attrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 243 ✭✭Jerry Attrick


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    Thats a real sweeping judgment of the workers. They did their job for years and years and only wanted a fair pay off, fair play to them for trying to stick up for workers rights. Saying they have no talent or ambition is just needlessly mean.


    The dispute had nothing to do with "workers' rights" as what they were looking far went far beyond the 'rights' of every Irish worker made redundant.

    The strikers were seeking to benefit from the terms of a 2016 Debenhams redundancy package that had already expired long before Covid 19 came on the scene.

    In essence, they wanted money that wasn't there from an insolvent company that no longer existed.

    Failing which, they wanted the State to throw more taxpayers' money at them in addition to the €13m in statutory redundancy payments to which they, like every other Irish worker who has become redundant were entitled.


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    #139
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,975 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    Saying they have no talent or ambition is just needlessly mean.

    It's not polite, for sure. But it's not untrue. Debenham closure had been expected for literally years. Anyone with ambition or talent was long gone to a company with better prospects.


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    #140
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    Thats a real sweeping judgment of the workers. They did their job for years and years and only wanted a fair pay off, fair play to them for trying to stick up for workers rights. Saying they have no talent or ambition is just needlessly mean.

    It’s my opinion of the workers who were on strike, a small proportion of the employees who lost their jobs. Some 400 out of 2,000 voted with only 100 rejecting the final deal.

    They did their jobs in a business that was obviously failing.

    They weren’t sticking up for workers rights. They were demanding twice the statutory redundancy from a company that no longer exists.

    Probably a bit harsh, but if they had either talent or ambition, they’d have taken the earlier redundancy offer and moved on to bigger and better things.


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    #141
    Wanderer2010
    Registered Users Posts: 6,740 ✭✭✭Wanderer2010


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    It’s my opinion of the workers who were on strike, a small proportion of the employees who lost their jobs. Some 400 out of 2,000 voted with only 100 rejecting the final deal.

    They did their jobs in a business that was obviously failing.

    They weren’t sticking up for workers rights. They were demanding twice the statutory redundancy from a company that no longer exists.

    Probably a bit harsh, but if they had either talent or ambition, they’d have taken the earlier redundancy offer and moved on to bigger and better things.

    Well its easy for you to say that but if you were in their shoes, and having received a sh!tty email one day akin to "your jobs are gone, we cant afford redundancy, see ya" im sure you would be angry too and not just roll over. And this statutory redundancy you talk of had to be fought hard for too.


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    #142
    Jerry Attrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 243 ✭✭Jerry Attrick


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »

    And this statutory redundancy you talk of had to be fought hard for too.

    No it didn't - at least not by the Debenhams strikers/workers!

    Evidently you have a somewhat vague understanding of the meaning of the word Statutory!


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    #143
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    Well its easy for you to say that but if you were in their shoes, and having received a sh!tty email one day akin to "your jobs are gone, we cant afford redundancy, see ya" im sure you would be angry too and not just roll over. And this statutory redundancy you talk of had to be fought hard for too.

    Sh1t happens. I’ve been made redundant 3 times in my long working life. Each time was because of changes in working practices due to technical improvements. I had a home to run and children to rear, so wouldn’t have had time for pointless pickets. I just picked myself up and moved on.

    All those former employees who were entitled to statutory redundancy will gotten it. Trying to bully the government into paying double was greed. Pure and simple.


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    #144
    mikemac2
    Registered Users Posts: 2,956 ✭✭✭mikemac2


    Some of the picketers need to get jobs as advisors to government Ministers

    Considering they rejected this offer in January and now accepted it I'm amazed at their ability to spin it as a victory. The facebook group has it as #undefeated and #proudanddefiant


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    #145
    Jerry Attrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 243 ✭✭Jerry Attrick


    mikemac2 wrote: »
    Some of the picketers need to get jobs as advisors to government Ministers

    Considering they rejected this offer in January and now accepted it I'm amazed at their ability to spin it as a victory. The facebook group has it as #undefeated and #proudanddefiant


    The truly sad thing is that some of them probably believe it!


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    #146
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    mikemac2 wrote: »
    Some of the picketers need to get jobs as advisors to government Ministers

    Considering they rejected this offer in January and now accepted it I'm amazed at their ability to spin it as a victory. The facebook group has it as #undefeated and #proudanddefiant

    And a very large and respected retailer walked away from taking over three of the stores last year.

    Mandate handled this extraordinarily badly.


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    #147
    domrush
    Registered Users Posts: 1,186 ✭✭✭domrush


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    Well its easy for you to say that but if you were in their shoes, and having received a sh!tty email one day akin to "your jobs are gone, we cant afford redundancy, see ya" im sure you would be angry too and not just roll over. And this statutory redundancy you talk of had to be fought hard for too.
    The statutory redundancy did not have to be fought for, you clearly haven’t a clue what you are talking about!


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