Covid19 Part XV - 15,251 in ROI (610 deaths) 2,645 in NI (194 deaths) (19/04) Read OP

eagle eye

Cork Boy 53 wrote:

I agree with many of your comments here. However it does seem that the Bulgarian workers actually are being quarantined if you take the statements made about them at face value anyway.

We cannot depend on third parties to do this, it has to be done by the State. We have to ensure its actually happening.

stephenjmcd

Gonzo wrote: »

I reckon pubs will open before the end of the Summer at the latest. That is a massive industry to leave closed for 6+ months and if they decide to keep them closed into 2021 most of them will never reopen.

So we could see the pubs open again by July or early August, however gone will be the days of standing shoulder to shoulder in a pub with pints in hand. Social distancing will have to be introduced to pubs, no crowds, hand sanitizers at the door on the way in and way out. Some may even have security checking that customers are washing/disinfecting their hands. Everyone will have to sit down to have their drink, no standing crowding up the place. This could work, it won't be the same as what it was but it's far better than keeping them shut for the rest of the year.

There was a suggestion made by De Gascun yesterday about some non essential business opening with a reduced capacity, likewise Harris says today we wont see packed pubs, again a suggestion of limited capacity.

BattleCorp

declanflynn wrote: »

The virus was allowed to spread to a point where our health service could handle it, the government got it almost spot on, keeping the virus out was never a runner.

The virus wasn't allowed to spread, we couldn't stop it spreading. We are just about managing to keep a lid on the spread. Any easing up and the spread will take off again.

ZX7R

Gonzo wrote: »

I reckon pubs will open before the end of the Summer at the latest. That is a massive industry to leave closed for 6+ months and if they decide to keep them closed into 2021 most of them will never reopen.

So we could see the pubs open again by July or early August, however gone will be the days of standing shoulder to shoulder in a pub with pints in hand. Social distancing will have to be introduced to pubs, no crowds, hand sanitizers at the door on the way in and way out. Some may even have security checking that customers are washing/disinfecting their hands. Everyone will have to sit down to have their drink, no standing crowding up the place. This could work, it won't be the same as what it was but it's far better than keeping them shut for the rest of the year.

A different projects manager I work with is dealing with security for the vintners association, the day of being drunk in a pub will be gone, strict enforcement of existing intoxication acts will be inforced .
But to be fair this will be more so inforced in city's large towns.
Hopefully!

podgeandrodge

stephenjmcd wrote: »

There was a suggestion made by De Gascun yesterday about some non essential business opening with a reduced capacity, likewise Harris says today we wont see packed pubs, again a suggestion of limited capacity.

Agreed. Nothing they say has not been thought out in terms of added words. ("fully opened", "packed")

BattleCorp

stephenjmcd wrote: »

There was a suggestion made by De Gascun yesterday about some non essential business opening with a reduced capacity, likewise Harris says today we wont see packed pubs, again a suggestion of limited capacity.

How do you enforce social distancing in pubs? Serious question. Everyone using same toilets, sinks etc. Loads of people in a confined space.

Difficult at the best of times but even more difficult when people have a skinful.

Lolle06

youandme13 wrote: »

I've said that to a few people to be told don't be silly! But in reality they still don't have a vaccine for SARRS which is a cousin of covid19!

They had developed a vaccine for SARS in the US but couldn’t get the funding for the trials as the governments and the pharmaceuticals lost interest in it after it was pretty much done by 2005 and other viruses (ie. MERS) came around since then.

Edit: source
https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-care/scientists-were-close-coronavirus-vaccine-years-ago-then-money-dried-n1150091

BanditLuke

growleaves wrote: »

It sweeps through countries killing as many people as a seasonal illness.



Vandals? What's being vandalised?

This is plain misinformation.

Please check your facts before posting.

podgeandrodge

ZX7R wrote: »

A different projects manager I work with is dealing with security for the vintners association, the day of being drunk in a pub will be gone, strict enforcement of existing intoxication acts will be inforced .
But to be fair this will be more so inforced in city's large towns.
Hopefully!

So this project manager who deals with security is changing the way the public enjoy pubs. Is this because of corona virus?
It seems very optimistic to stop people getting drunk!

podgeandrodge

BattleCorp wrote: »

How do you enforce social distancing in pubs? Serious question. Everyone using same toilets, sinks etc. Loads of people in a confined space.

Difficult at the best of times but even more difficult when people have a skinful.

Table service potentially for some. Maximum amount of customers. Difficult maybe but...

ChikiChiki

Discodog wrote: »

Meanwhile in the UK :pac:

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/camper-van-escort-still-seeing-21888849

She must be absolutely riddled. I doubt even Covid 19 would get up on that.

declanflynn

BattleCorp wrote: »

The virus wasn't allowed to spread, we couldn't stop it spreading. We are just about managing to keep a lid on the spread. Any easing up and the spread will take off again.

The virus was allowed to spread to a certain point.
We are well on top of it due to good government, people adhering to social distancing and some luck.

podgeandrodge

ChikiChiki wrote: »

She must be absolutely riddled. I doubt even Covid 19 would get up on that.

Spare a thought for the men queuing up after each other.

Drumpot

Serious question re pubs in particular, how can you have any meaningful social distancing and open up a pub? How can they be open up in any “safe” way while the virus is spreading? I think the answer is that you simply can’t.

You could make an argument about a lot of leisure activities, sports, schools, offices etc but one of the defining differences is that people drinking lower their inhabitions and their guard and part of the allure of pubs is being in a close Environment with friends. It seems impossible to make pubs much less breeding grounds for the virus then they were unless people drink on their own! Alcohol is a drug that makes a lot of people do stupid things and even just get sloppy.

Ultimately it will probably just boil down to people want to drink and will demand their comfort , which is kinda sad when you think about it.

BattleCorp

BattleCorp wrote: »

How do you enforce social distancing in pubs? Serious question. Everyone using same toilets, sinks etc. Loads of people in a confined space.

Difficult at the best of times but even more difficult when people have a skinful.

There are loads of pubs n town where you;re literally elbow to elbow at the urinal. Judge roy beans/porter house etc. so is it a one in and one out policy of the toilet? really where drink is concerned? you think ladies ques are long ordinarily? imagine this, it;s just not possible at all. gyms and pubs will be hit hard now.

growleaves

If you look at places where it is widespread, France,Spain, Italy, New York, Belgium it is killing multiples of the deaths caused by seasonal illness in a much shorter timeframe

It also widespread in places where it kills less than the flu, i.e. the UK. Lombardy, Madrid, NYC aren't representative of the whole world.

It would be 150,000 death in a year compared to 28,000 if no restrictions. Thats a conservative number too.

What model are you working off of?

For the UK the Imperial College prediction was 510,000 deaths without mitigation measures and a third of that - lets say 150k approx - with mitigation measures.

The UK has used mitigation measures and the result is 15,000 deaths so far.

That's if you even believe in the measures which are unproven.

It has a mortality 20 times greater and is more infectious.

Morality rate is unknown. Infectiousness is unknown. Although virologists who have researched it already believe it is far less less than believed.

It has only peaked because of a lockdown btw.

Proof?

crossman47

declanflynn wrote: »

The virus was allowed to spread to a point where our health service could handle it, the government got it almost spot on, keeping the virus out was never a runner.

I think thats about right. They could have attempted a lockdown earlier but the virus would still have got in, especially as the North didn't have one. If they had, people would have been griping after a month (like now) and restrictions would then have to be eased. This would have given us a surge.

The situation in the nursing homes is bad but the first priority had to be containing nationally and ensuring hospitals could cope. If the hospitals were overrun then the situation would be bad for all, including nursing homes.

lawred2

jibber5000 wrote: »

Yet our death rate is nearly identical to the US.

118 per million US
116 per million Ireland

The way it's portrayed by the media here we're doing a brilliant job and trump is leading them off a cliff.

All absolute nonsense of course.

How are deaths being counted here compared to the US? Unless the exact same criteria are applied then that figure is not comparable.

shinzon

growleaves wrote: »

Proof?

That would be figures graphs briefings etc from the hse that's posted on this here very thread.

Shin

growleaves

It has a mortality 20 times greater and is more infectious.

By the way if covid-19 has a mortality rate 20 times greater than the flu then, even discounting for greater infectiousness, it would kill 12.5 million people in a typical year.

So far the total deaths are at 161,000 after five months.

BattleCorp

declanflynn wrote: »

The virus was allowed to spread to a certain point.
We are well on top of it due to good government, people adhering to social distancing and some luck.

I'll respectfully disagree. If we could have kept the virus out, we would have.

I will agree that social distancing is helping control the spread of it.

YFlyer

One of my conspiracy theory friends put a chart on his Facebook page that Yemen have zero deaths. I had to tell him that there have been no tests done in the country.

He was questioning my source. I'm a sheep....lol

Sam Russell

growleaves wrote: »

It sweeps through countries killing as many people as a seasonal illness.



Vandals? What's being vandalised?

Just look around you. Travel o the Dart and see the paint can 'artists' who think a large daub is a positive contribution to life.

stephenjmcd

ZX7R wrote: »

A different projects manager I work with is dealing with security for the vintners association, the day of being drunk in a pub will be gone, strict enforcement of existing intoxication acts will be inforced .
But to be fair this will be more so inforced in city's large towns.
Hopefully!

Cant argue with that, when I worked in a pub as a student we were always told whenever the person had enough stop serving them as the publican had a duty of responsibility, if the person staggered out the door and god forbid was hit by a car then the publican gets asked the questions as to why they kept serving someone who was clearly highly intoxicated.

It was probably an arse covering exercise but that's what we always did

gabeeg

declanflynn wrote: »

The virus was allowed to spread to a certain point.
We are well on top of it due to good government, people adhering to social distancing and some luck.

So what you're saying is the government intentionally let people die, but are still doing a good job.

Fascinating insight, Decky

gmisk

ChikiChiki wrote: »

She must be absolutely riddled. I doubt even Covid 19 would get up on that.

She is getting the clap as opposed to giving a clap for NHS workers

jibber5000

Drumpot wrote: »

The USA barely started their lockdown and trump was talking about opening up again. Allowing church and mass groups to merge onto beaches is retarded and is not vital to keep an economy going.

USA is richer then Ireland, so how come we could come up with at least 3 month financial strategy to help most people/families and the USA can’t? It’s not that they can’t, its that they won’t because of political ideals.

In terms of people stuck at home, mental health issues can be addressed. I’ve suffered them myself but there are a lot of online supports. This is a red herring argument on its own.

Eventually with more knowledge and a better way of handling this and possibly down to necessity, we will have to lower restrictions. But the USA has no strategy , it’s a headless chicken throw crap at a wall and see what sticks approach with the economy’s demands overriding human safety. That on its own is a horrible indictment of that country.

This is from the last recession when unemployment was roughly half what it is.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4880023/

When you're multiplying this by tens of millions it's a massive issue.

Dr Fauci appears to be a man of honour and integrity.

He stated whenever he asked trump to place restrictions he agreed immediately. If he had such a massive issue with trumps staggered opening you don't think he'd be saying it on one of his numerous tv appearances?

All these critics are placing their own extensive public health knowledge above Dr Fauci.

crossman47

gabeeg wrote: »

So what you're saying is the government intentionally let people die, but are still doing a good job.

Fascinating insight, Decky

Hes not saying that as I see it. They knew deaths were inevitable and they sought to minimise them.

lawred2

growleaves wrote: »

By the way if covid-19 has a mortality rate 20 times greater than the flu then, even discounting for greater infectiousness, it would kill 12.5 million people in a typical year.

So far the total deaths are at 161,000 after five months.

The flu is in every corner of the globe and evolves every year.

C19 doesn't have that spread yet. It's a novel virus.

You can't compare total death counts yet.

BattleCorp

growleaves wrote: »

By the way if covid-19 has a mortality rate 20 times greater than the flu then, even discounting for greater infectiousness, it would kill 12.5 million people in a typical year.

So far the total deaths are at 161,000 after five months.

You can't compare COVID-19 and the flu. Economies aren't shut down to deal with the flu.

So far we have had 161,000 deaths with extreme social distancing measures in place. Do you not acknowledge that the death rate would be far higher if we took no social distancing/lockdown measures?