Covid19 Part XV - 15,251 in ROI (610 deaths) 2,645 in NI (194 deaths) (19/04) Read OP

Longing

bennyl10 wrote: »

very good thread,
and makes the most sense.

it isn't feasible or possible to have lock down for the next 12-18 months.
Social distancing is also not a realistic goal

people need to take responsibility, if you as much as sneeze, stay at home

Maybe we could have let's say HSE police in every town or supermarket. Just idea. Sick people will leave their homes no question about it.

smelly sock

smelly sock wrote: »

The same people on here arguing for a complete lockdown for the foreseeable future are the ones who will be disappointed when we have a vaccine.

They will probably tell people not to vaccine against Covid as it causes side effects.

I hope we can continue to be successful against Covid but we need to plan on living with it for possibly years to come.

Your first two paragraphs are probably one of stupidest things I've read on here this morning and for this thread that is something to say.

I would love to be able to go see my dad and other family members, I'd love to be sitting at a table outside a pub with a beer, but with a global recession on the way I'll be looking at keeping money for essential items.

I already told you that the stores you listed could be open online and deliver, but your not happy with that.

I am beginning to think most people can't stand to be at home with their family the way they are going on.

Hrududu

eagle eye wrote: »

I had a very brief meeting in the bank this morning. While there I observed a local publican enter the premises and deposit a bunch of cash. He doesn't own and isn't involved in any other businesses.

Excellent work. Keep us informed won't you?

Kermit.de.frog

smelly sock wrote: »

I hope we can continue to be successful against Covid but we need to plan on living with it for possibly years to come.

This seems contradicting. The only really reason we have been 'successful' in the west until now how has been the very mitigation measures you think should be lifted.

Can't have it both ways until there is a vaccine.

We have people openly saying they think they will be in Spain on holiday in June. They seem to believe this.

Seems to be a lot of denial around over what has happened.

We are where we are.

JJJJNR

JJJJNR wrote: »

Seen a Guinness van out on my walk in wicklow, are they putting plans in place..

Supermarkets and off licences possibly

Micky 32

tobefrank321 wrote: »

Can you point out specific examples of doom mongering here?

Or is it just people having a conversation about realistic outcomes?

If you want us to say the economy should be opened up, fine we can do that. If you think there will be no negative consequences to that, then its head in the sand stuff I'm afraid.

Putting words in my mouth now? My mother does that too lol. Where did my post say i want to open up shop??

As far as i’m concerened the lockdown can stay as long as it needs to. My parents are in 70’s with heart conditions. They need protecting.

wakka12

Belgium experiences about 9000 deaths in a typical 31 day period usually, and has reported at least 4157 deaths of people with COVID over the last 28 days

Wibbs

bennyl10 wrote: »

very good thread,
and makes the most sense.

it isn't feasible or possible to have lock down for the next 12-18 months.
Social distancing is also not a realistic goal

people need to take responsibility, if you as much as sneeze, stay at home

I'd mostly agree B, but that part I highlighted is the problem. It's a problem as it is. I'm pretty sure most of not all of us have seen multiple examples of people in the community not taking responsibility and not observing social distancing, or absolute minimum journeys etc. The Guards having to be out in force to stop utter morons from going to holiday homes over the last weekend alone but one example. I'm also pretty sure we've all known and had to work with people who came into work coughing and sneezing snots everywhere. Those idiots will still exist.

kg703

Longing wrote: »

Maybe we could have let's say HSE police in every town or supermarket. Just idea. Sick people will leave their homes no question about it.

100% people will leave their homes anyway.

I know of two families where one person got the virus, (with positive tests) and the rest of the family went on about their business, bringing the kids out for walks, heading to supermarket, having drinks with neighbours over the walls etc.

Now they are coming down with symptoms

These are people who are well educated and in no way rule breakers under normal circumstances but if you say anything about it (one fam are close relatives) they get really irritated and talk to you like you are the King of Paranoia.

podgeandrodge

stephenjmcd wrote: »

https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1250003948125204481?s=19

A very good thread here and with the WHO to announce guidelines today for the lifting of restrictions this gives you a good idea as to their thinking.

He also said in terms of social living that we can return to this pre vaccination so long as people take responsibility if they feel unwell. For example if you even have a common cold symptom going forward you simply dont go out and work from home if possible.

Presumably when the re-infection rate is below 1 at least - it couldn't happen now or everything we have done would be in vain no? Promising though, but I would like to know that there was something in terms of viable treatments beforehand!

Boggles

wakka12 wrote: »

Belgium experiences about 5500 deaths in a typical 4 week period usually, and has reported at least 4157 deaths of people with COVID over the last 28 days

So they have had nearly 10,000 deaths, almost double the average?

What's your point?

BLIZZARD7

smelly sock wrote: »

We will have done that long before the 5th of May. I'm arguing that Varadkar should have extended the lockdown by 7 days and no more.

My feeling is he is playing political football with it now. If he lifts the restrictions before the 5th of May he will look great.

There is a near zero chance of any restrictions being lifted before May 5th. The CMO recommended this date, it's not political football.

polesheep

polesheep wrote: »

That is the reason they gave at the start, but it clearly isn't the real reason as our hospitals are far from stretched. We are continuing on lockdown because the government does not want to differentiate between social groups. Look at voting patterns in this country, the people who should be cocooning are the people who vote. They will not tolerate being locked down while everyone else can get on with things. You can spot them on this thread and you can be sure that they are making it known to the government. The scientists would lock down until the virus is gone or until there is a vaccine, that's simply the way they are programmed. The government, however, will always have one eye on the voter.

Our hospitals are not stretched because of the action taken. Remove this restrictions too soon and things will become stretched very quickly. Its a fine balance to be maintained. The restrictions need to be left in place long enough so there is enough time to react when a new wave comes. Remove them too soon and the second wave will overwhelm the system quickly, leave it too long and when the second wave comes there may be far more resistance to the measures. Its not a decision i'd like to have to make

easypazz

JJJJNR wrote: »

Seen a Guinness van out on my walk in wicklow, are they putting plans in place..

Cleaning lines and getting the empty kegs returned, so that they can be ready to go when they get the nod.

fin12

Father pleading on 96fm now for Simon Harris to reply to his emails regarding how his disabled son will be treated if he was to contract the virus.

Simon Harris pure disgrace, answers twitter emails about a f*cking Easter bunny but can’t get in contact with this man.

virginmediapls

polesheep wrote: »

That is the reason they gave at the start, but it clearly isn't the real reason as our hospitals are far from stretched.

And that this point, you lose all credibility - you're divorced from reality if you think hospitals aren't already stretched. Can certainly tell you don't work in one.

irishgeo

irishgeo wrote: »

Either cleaning taps or arranging keg collection.

Are either essential?

wakka12

Boggles wrote: »

So they have had nearly 10,000 deaths, almost double the average?

What's your point?

Yeh..nothing remarkable at all about that

Roger_007

fin12 wrote: »

Father pleading on 96fm now for Simon Harris to reply to his emails regarding how his disabled son will be treated if he was to contract the virus.

Simon Harris pure disgrace, answers twitter emails about a f*cking Easter bunny but can’t get in contact with this man.

I think Leo is the one with the medical degree. I don’t think Simon should be giving any medical advice.

virginmediapls

smelly sock wrote: »

Is this the HSE who gave a pile of people incorrect results recently?

That wasnt the HSE.

Jesus you're actually just wrong in all of your posts. One of the least informed posters here - and that's saying something.

DubInMeath

DubInMeath wrote: »

Who is going to be spending when a global recession is on the cards?

The stores you mentioned can be open online and items delivered. No broadband for some, my dad and sister are two of those some, but I can order anything that they need for them online and the items can be delivered. No need to have people go into the store, same as my local hardware and a few other stores selling essentials at the moment.

Only way to limit the impact of the recession is to get everyone spending - lower VAT, low interest rates, incentives on spending are what is needed. Maybe even a tax on large savings over a certain value, but permit people to offset their savings tax liability against VAT

easypazz

Deleted User wrote: »

Are either essential?

Yes. Part of the food supply chain.

Kermit.de.frog

fin12 wrote: »

Father pleading on 96fm now for Simon Harris to reply to his emails regarding how his disabled son will be treated if he was to contract the virus.

Simon Harris pure disgrace, answers twitter emails about a f*cking Easter bunny but can’t get in contact with this man.

What is the complaint though?

A lot of people looking for advice on all sorts of things atm.

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

I'd mostly agree B, but that part I highlighted is the problem. It's a problem as it is. I'm pretty sure most of not all of us have seen multiple examples of people in the community not taking responsibility and not observing social distancing, or absolute minimum journeys etc. The Guards having to be out in force to stop utter morons from going to holiday homes over the last weekend alone but one example. I'm also pretty sure we've all known and had to work with people who came into work coughing and sneezing snots everywhere. Those idiots will still exist.

Aside from idiots traveling to holiday homes, on the coughing and sneezing part how many managers and employers in the past would say your grand come in or find a new job.
They might not be so cavalier with covid, but who knows.

RugbyLad11

BanditLuke wrote: »

Some posters are off their rocker if they think we are going back to any kind of normality in a few weeks time. It's an insult to the tremendous work our front line health staff are doing to suggest we will be sending them thousands of more cases because some idiot wants to have a pint or eat in a restaurant.

I don't think anyone is expecting it to go back to complete normal, but I would say a lot of restrictions will be lifted on May 5th

easypazz

fin12 wrote: »

Father pleading on 96fm now for Simon Harris to reply to his emails regarding how his disabled son will be treated if he was to contract the virus.

Simon Harris pure disgrace, answers twitter emails about a f*cking Easter bunny but can’t get in contact with this man.

Can the man not follow procedures to ensure the child does not get infected?

virginmediapls

smelly sock wrote: »

Ah stop. FFS. It's a horrible virus. I get that and wouldn't wish it on anyone but anyone who thinks a shutdown in the economy won't have as devastating an impact that Covid is living in cloud cuckoo land.

If you can work from home do so. If you need to go to a building site or woodies / power city etc to work than you should be able.

If Tesco can practice social distancing I'm sure others can manage it.

No need for the drama.

Reading more of your posts, your motivations are becoming extremely clear. You have a horse in this race. You either own a company which is on the brink of collapse, or your pissed off the Leaving Cert is delayed and it's going to cost you a few months of your summer.

Either way, you are completely wrong and have a childlike grasp of the situation. You'd be the first in blaming Varadkar for relaxing restrictions if your mammy dies from it, of course.

fits

fin12 wrote: »

Father pleading on 96fm now for Simon Harris to reply to his emails regarding how his disabled son will be treated if he was to contract the virus.

Simon Harris pure disgrace, answers twitter emails about a f*cking Easter bunny but can’t get in contact with this man.

I have seen this issue on social media. I just don’t see how anyone expects a blanket policy to be applied to everyone with a disability. It’s not the case that we are rationing beds. It has to be a case by case decision.

The biggest concern I would have is folks with cognitive issues being on their own in hospital among strangers. That breaks my heart tbh. And no one there to advocate for them.

murpho999

fin12 wrote: »

Father pleading on 96fm now for Simon Harris to reply to his emails regarding how his disabled son will be treated if he was to contract the virus.

Simon Harris pure disgrace, answers twitter emails about a f*cking Easter bunny but can’t get in contact with this man.

Do you expect him to get in touch with every tweet, email and correspondance he recieved?

There are other people that man on the radio can speak to rather than the minister who wouldn't have the answer anyway.

smelly sock

easypazz wrote: »

Can the man not follow procedures to ensure the child does not get infected?

It's a good point though.

The Easter Bunny. FFS.

Red for Danger

Worldmeters figures wont mean sweet FA once the numbers start to come down.
The conversation will then be about how best to let it run through.
And it will have to run through

4 in million or 400 in a million is about the same as been eaten by a shark or being struck by lightning.

What Username Guidelines

stephenjmcd wrote: »

https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1250003948125204481?s=19

A very good thread here and with the WHO to announce guidelines today for the lifting of restrictions this gives you a good idea as to their thinking.

He also said in terms of social living that we can return to this pre vaccination so long as people take responsibility if they feel unwell. For example if you even have a common cold symptom going forward you simply dont go out and work from home if possible.

It seems like the spikes in Spain, Italy, US, etc are as a result of 'normal' living - football matches, massive protests, no one working from home, pubs, restaurants, etc.. As those cases resolve and things start back with limited openings and social distancing, cocooning, subsequent spikes shouldn't get as bi g - likely far, far smaller.

But the issue here is that a proportion of society will not get back - elderly, publicans, hospitality staff, etc. The economy also loses their disposable income. Lots of people being overcautious is useful in keeping cases in hospital low, but will do very little to stimulate an economy.

It's understatedly a very difficult scenario. There may be some usefulness in repurposing jobs where possible, taxi drivers to grocery deliveries, wait staff to supermarkets, cleaners to well, everywhere. There will be a lot of adaptation. But in reality, can it happen? Will it be enough to stem even some of the issues involved in the alternative, an unending lockdown, which is practically impossible

smelly sock

virginmediapls wrote: »

Reading more of your posts, your motivations are becoming extremely clear. You have a horse in this race. You either own a company which is on the brink of collapse, or your pissed off the Leaving Cert is delayed and it's going to cost you a few months of your summer.

Either way, you are completely wrong and have a childlike grasp of the situation. You'd be the first in blaming Varadkar for relaxing restrictions if your mammy dies from it, of course.

I'm a Public Servant guaranteed to be paid every month regardless of whether I'm in work or not.

Now that doesn't fit with you narrative.

You and others on here have a childlike grasp of economics it would seem.

BLIZZARD7

Just on the WHO's talk of living with the virus going forward but being sensible. I agree we need to learn to live with it but quite a large portion of society are anything but sensible. There is also the asymptomatic factor, are we ignoring that now or?

duffman13

smelly sock wrote: »

Ah stop. FFS. It's a horrible virus. I get that and wouldn't wish it on anyone but anyone who thinks a shutdown in the economy won't have as devastating an impact that Covid is living in cloud cuckoo land.

If you can work from home do so. If you need to go to a building site or woodies / power city etc to work than you should be able.

If Tesco can practice social distancing I'm sure others can manage it.

No need for the drama.

Its not drama though, people seem to think underlying conditions only affect the old and frail, Blood pressure along with Asthma and other resp illness seem to be causing all kinds of issues with Covid-19 and they are common among all age categories. From personal experience a work colleague of my wife was 32 with no underlying health conditions and passed away two weeks ago. That is a sad fact, not a drama.

The simple fact that Trump who is economy first has even put a sort of lockdown in place makes me believe this is a potentially huge crisis if un-tackled. Its not drama for people to be fearful of an unknown pandemic.

virginmediapls

smelly sock wrote: »

It's a good point though.

The Easter Bunny. FFS.

Yeah, I am sure it took sooo much of his time to sign a letter for the Easter Bunny - something which will have brought joy to thousands of children profoundly impacted by this.

What a monster.

Some of ye would complain about anything - children with straw arguments who just want to complain.

BLIZZARD7

Red for Danger wrote: »

Worldmeters figures wont mean sweet FA once the numbers start to come down.
The conversation will then be about how best to let it run through.
And it will have to run through

4 in million or 400 in a million is about the same as been eaten by a shark or being struck by lightning.

What's the relevance of this?

virginmediapls

smelly sock wrote: »

I'm a Public Servant guaranteed to be paid every month regardless of whether I'm in work or not.

Now that doesn't fit with you narrative.

You and others on here have a childlike grasp of economics it would seem.

A public servant who hasn't a notion about epidemiology, healthcare or the effect that mass amount of deaths will have on the economy, it seems.

i.e someone who is completely ill-educated, spouting drivel on a public forum.

Grow up.

Dravokivich

eagle eye wrote: »

I had a very brief meeting in the bank this morning. While there I observed a local publican enter the premises and deposit a bunch of cash. He doesn't own and isn't involved in any other businesses.

Eagle Eye by name, Eagle Eyed by nature...

You don't know where the money came from, or what it was for. He could have had money retained on premise to operate floats on their tills, and with the lockdown extending further, decided to bank it.

wakka12

wakka12 wrote: »

Cases in Belgium dropping but deaths remain consistently extremely high, another 240 deaths today..if it was the size of Italy it would be same as it reporting another 1500 or so deaths today..the highest number of deaths any country in Europe has ever reported per capita in a day

Per capita figures are pretty meaningless - Italy's are massive, but both Lazio(Rome area) and Sicily which have larger populations than Ireland, have lower death rates than we do. If a breakout occurs in a densely populated area it will rapidly progress as happened in Lombardy, Madrid, Belgium, New York and to a lesser extent Dublin. Outbreaks don't conform to predefined borders, but are regional in nature, and what of true of one part of a country, does not apply to the whole country.

I believe this is why Ireland is seeing higher numbers than some small eastern European countries - we had an undetected outbreak in Dublin prior to restrictions, while other places were lucky in not having this occur. I suspect it is probably down to tourists who visited from Lombardy region for the Italian match that never took place. We actually probably would have been better of if the match went ahead, but fans were closely segregated, than cancelling the match and dispersing them all around Dublin in an uncontrolled manner.

wakka12

https://abc7ny.com/health/50-nyc-education-employees-dead-of-coronavirus/6100157/

50 Department of Education employees in NYC have died of coronavirus including 21 public school teachers

RugbyLad11

fin12 wrote: »

Father pleading on 96fm now for Simon Harris to reply to his emails regarding how his disabled son will be treated if he was to contract the virus.

Simon Harris pure disgrace, answers twitter emails about a f*cking Easter bunny but can’t get in contact with this man.

Which one will give him the better PR

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Only way to limit the impact of the recession is to get everyone spending - lower VAT, low interest rates, incentives on spending are what is needed. Maybe even a tax on large savings over a certain value, but permit people to offset their savings tax liability against VAT

Typically and going by the last recession government and banks here increase not decrease, interest rates on loans are multiples on those of savings already.
Also people hold what they have not spend if they think there is a chance that they will lose their job to be able to pay for essentials like the mortgage. No one is paying their mortgage on 203e a week (the normal JSB amount), and given that a lot of the open up the economy commentators are also calling for reducing social welfare payments like this one people are going to hold onto their money.

virginmediapls

wakka12 wrote: »

https://abc7ny.com/health/50-nyc-education-employees-dead-of-coronavirus/6100157/

50 Department of Education employees in NYC have died of coronavirus including 21 public school teachers

Don't mind that, smelly socks says it will be fine to send everyone back to work. Let's open the floodgates tomorrow.

Jesus this forum would make you lose faith in humanity at times.

easypazz

virginmediapls wrote: »

A public servant who hasn't a notion about epidemiology, healthcare or the effect that mass amount of deaths will have on the economy, it seems.

i.e someone who is completely ill-educated, spouting drivel on a public forum.

Grow up.

"Grow up"

When people start coming out with childish retorts you know they are beaten.

Destroying the economy will destroy a lot of lives.

Balance is needed, that is all people are saying.

We have to learn to live with this.

hmmm

stephenjmcd wrote: »

https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1250003948125204481?s=19

A very good thread here and with the WHO to announce guidelines today for the lifting of restrictions this gives you a good idea as to their thinking.

He also said in terms of social living that we can return to this pre vaccination so long as people take responsibility if they feel unwell. For example if you even have a common cold symptom going forward you simply dont go out and work from home if possible.

Great to hear this.

The message is difficult to hear, and everyone needs to understand there is no going back to "normal" any time soon. Anyone who thinks we simply lockdown everything for a few weeks and this all goes away are naive and unhelpful.

As the interview suggests, we can't keep hiding in our houses forever and we need to find ways to sensibly reduce the risk of the virus, while getting back to living, working, socialising etc.

crossman47

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

I don't think anyone is expecting it to go back to complete normal, but I would say a lot of restrictions will be lifted on May 5th

I wouldn't say a lot but some. Some businesses will reopen and , as an over 70, I hope we are allowed some exercise. I know not all can be trusted to take proper precautions if they are given the go ahead and thats the problem.

easypazz

hmmm wrote: »

Great to hear this.

The message is difficult to hear, and everyone needs to understand there is no going back to "normal" any time soon. Anyone who thinks we simply lockdown everything for a few weeks and this all goes away are naive and unhelpful.

As the interview suggests, we can't keep hiding in our houses forever and we need to find ways to sensibly reduce the risk of the virus, while getting back to living, working, socialising etc.

Nobody expects back to normal on May 5.

It will be a phased reopening.

fin12

Roger_007 wrote: »

I think Leo is the one with the medical degree. I don’t think Simon should be giving any medical advice.

He is the Minister for Health and he could at least acknowledge this mans emails, he clearly has time when he can go on twitter replying to queries about a Easter bunny.

Gael23

Very. good statement from the WHO this moorning saying that we need to get to a point where the World economyaand society opens again and we cant wait for a vaccine or antibodies to do that