Covid19 Part XV - 15,251 in ROI (610 deaths) 2,645 in NI (194 deaths) (19/04) Read OP

timmy_mallet

Blueshoe wrote: »

Johnson and Johnson are receiving most funding

Yes, those notoriously nice guys J&J. How much did they pay out for knowingly distributing a carcinogen?

is_that_so

Achasanai wrote: »

And we can take his Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin combo in the meantime.



I'm starting to feel more relaxed already!

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/04/13/health/chloroquine-risks-coronavirus-treatment-trials-study/index.html

Blueshoe

Achasanai wrote: »

And we can take his Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin combo in the meantime.



I'm starting to feel more relaxed already!

Just refuse the vaccine when it comes. Nobody will mind.
From the 2.2 Trillion bailout package 27 billion has been earmarked for "bolstering life-saving capabilities, including developing vaccines and the development, purchase, and distribution of critical supplies”.
27 billion from the Us alone.
Canada, Germany and Norway have pledged 690m between them.
The Us has also handed J+J half a billion dollars to research a vaccine.

As I said take your name off the list if you choose because Trump.

iamwhoiam

Interesting to hear a doctor from the Mater saying a huge cluster is in the area around the Mater .,He maintained it was among Roma , Brazilians living in very overcrowded accommodation in that area

smelly sock

smelly sock wrote: »

Oh everything will be ok so. Carry in with the economic lockdown.

I am a firm advocate of a controlled easing of lockdown and restarting of normal economic activity over time, however if you cant get the basic facts of your argument correct you leave yourself wide open to have any valid point you make dismissed. Whatever happens, it wont be near great depression . For one we have food security. In addition, the 1930's served as a great template in recovery from major shocks - New Deal in US vs retreat to nationalism in Germany - which worked best?

FishOnABike

Iamabeliever wrote: »

What's the issue with schools going back. if anything, expose them to it

While we're at it why not just take a random few from each school, workplace, etc.. reopened and shoot them? :rolleyes:

is_that_so

EU roadmap

https://twitter.com/JenniferMerode/status/1250350375439237121

Blueshoe

Hector Savage wrote: »

boo hoo, they are only on 8k a month instead of 10k ...

Irish politicians recently got a pay rise. SF members handed it back I believe.

Achasanai

is_that_so wrote: »

Even the main man in Sweden says it will be a long, long time before we can judge what overall approach was correct. As Mike Ryan keeps saying do it fast.

That's one way of looking at it, but then countries like the UK who were going to go down the herd immunity route did a very quick turnaround (I'm assuming based on medical advice). Hindsight is of course everything, but there are also moral questions that might apply.



Really, though I was trying to highlight that the poster doesn't really seem to know what s/he wants.

is_that_so wrote: »

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/04/13/health/chloroquine-risks-coronavirus-treatment-trials-study/index.html

Ah yeah, I should have probably used [sarcasm] tags in my post!

Achasanai

Blueshoe wrote: »

Just refuse the vaccine when it comes. Nobody will mind.
From the 2.2 Trillion bailout package 27 billion has been earmarked for "bolstering life-saving capabilities, including developing vaccines and the development, purchase, and distribution of critical supplies”.
27 billion from the Us alone.
Canada, Germany and Norway have pledged 690m between them.
The Us has also handed J+J half a billion dollars to research a vaccine.

As I said take your name off the list if you choose because Trump.

If the vaccine is tested according to proper medical regulations, then why would anyone (bar the anti-vaccers) refuse?

is_that_so

The number of deaths from the coronavirus in Spain in 24 hours fell again on Wednesday to 523, from 567. Looks like they might have hit peak.

caveat emptor

Deleted User wrote: »

Dont get too worried, while individual mutations will be random, selection pressure will drive towards lower severity over time

It's not that strain is more deadly it's just that how it binds actually changes. If this is more effective then it will be selected. It was thought that virus has only one way of binding this shows different strains can do it differently.

Professor Moriarty

Blueshoe wrote: »

Irish politicians recently got a pay rise. SF members handed it back I believe.

Would you have a link for that?

smelly sock

Deleted User wrote: »

I am a firm advocate of a controlled easing of lockdown and restarting of normal economic activity over time, however if you cant get the basic facts of your argument correct you leave yourself wide open to have any valid point you make dismissed. Whatever happens, it wont be near great depression . For one we have food security. In addition, the 1930's served as a great template in recovery from major shocks - New Deal in US vs retreat to nationalism in Germany - which worked best?

So the IMF are wrong and you are right?

I think we are splitting hairs here anyway pal. It will be a mess any which way. we need to move on from the shock phase now of getting the death toll figures and new cases to getting people back to work. We need to educate them on the best way to stay safe.

Hospitality will obviously need to remain closed. Sporting events and large gathering will also have to be put on the long finger.

Other retail outlets should be allowed to reopen though. If people can go to Tesco etc or lidl there is no reason why other shops shouldn't reopen.

is_that_so

caveat emptor wrote: »

It's not that strain is more deadly it's just that how it binds actually changes. If this is more effective then it will be selected. It was thought that virus has only one way of binding this shows different strains can do it differently.

GSK think we may need more than one vaccine.

The world will need more than one Covid-19 vaccine so drug companies must partner in the race to develop the weapons to fight the coronavirus, the GlaxoSmithKline chief executive officer, Emma Walmsley, said on Wednesday.

The drugmakers said they expect to start clinical trials for the vaccine in the second half of this year.

If successful, the vaccine would be available in the second half of 2021.

martingriff

Just watching a piece on BBC news, where they were talking to a New Zeland journalist about there partial relaxation. The BBC news person so how long were ye in lockdown. She said 21 days. The BBC person went on we are about there and just wondering when our will.

The New Zeland journalist will I suppose ye did do it to late and policy was initially heard immunity. The BBC person cut across quickly there was no government policy to which the journalists replied with statements said by Boris.

Surprisingly the question quickly disappeared to be replaced with another

FishOnABike

Hector Savage wrote: »

Exactly, this is actually a blessing in disguise, just f*ck it, get masks to everyone, wash your hands loads, maintain social distancing, but get the economy back up !!!

We survived the 1918/19 pandemic with no vaccines, doubt there were lockdowns back then either ...

If you're prepared to make the choice for one third of the world's population being infected and between 3% and 4% of the world's population dying because of it, go ahead but be among the first to volunteer yourself.

We know more now than a century ago. Ignorance of the foreseeable consequences cannot be used as an excuse for how we manage or mismanage the current pandemic.

Sweet.Science

is_that_so wrote: »

The number of deaths from the coronavirus in Spain in 24 hours fell again on Wednesday to 523, from 567. Looks like they might have hit peak.

Stupid question . But how can you know if you've hit a peak when most of the population are on a lockdown ? Its not the real peak i assume

smelly sock

martingriff wrote: »

Just watching a piece on BBC news, where they were talking to a New Zeland journalist about there partial relaxation. The BBC news person so how long were ye in lockdown. She said 21 days. The BBC person went on we are about there and just wondering when our will.

The New Zeland journalist will I suppose ye did do it to late and policy was initially heard immunity. The BBC person cut across quickly there was no government policy to which the journalists replied with statements said by Boris.

Surprisingly the question quickly disappeared to be replaced with another

Wow, incoherent at best.

Any link to that?

Blueshoe

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Would you have a link for that?

https://m.facebook.com/MaryLouMcDonaldTD/posts/10157053143011332

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/i-am-paid-more-than-enough-sinn-fein-td-returns-wage-increase-due-to-covid-19-crisis-992421.html

Mary Lou refused it before any crisis
OBroin was owed back payment. Refused the increase.

Leo, the Simons ,MM etc do no such thing

smelly sock

Achasanai wrote: »

What sort of model do you want us to follow? What we're doing or what Sweden is doing?

Controlled easing of restrictions and the lockdown.

Varadkar shouldn't have extended it by 3.5 weeks. That was wrong.

Professor Moriarty

smelly sock wrote: »

Wow, incoherent at best.

Any link to that?

I fully understood the post. It was a well-made point about the UK and Johnson's mistake in delaying containment measures.

1641

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Would you have a link for that?

There was a pay restoration across the public service some months ago under the Public Service Stability Agreement. This was part of the pay restoration process after the FEMPI reductions. TDs pay has been directly linked to public service pay scales for several years. I think Sinn Fein TDs are obliged to "donate" part of their pay to the Party.

Funsterdelux

smelly sock wrote: »

I'm rarely sick and my kids are in school. Had something in December / January and I'm convinced it was the Corona.

Good for you. The colds are a nuisance, covid19 on the other hand....

wadacrack

Sweet.Science wrote: »

Stupid question . But how can you know if you've hit a peak when most of the population are on a lockdown ? Its not the real peak i assume

Cases and Deaths are lowering. So its a fair assumption to believe they are hitting a peak.

is_that_so

Sweet.Science wrote: »

Stupid question . But how can you know if you've hit a peak when most of the population are on a lockdown ? Its not the real peak i assume

Peak in terms of daily number of deaths and new cases seem to be falling as well, a crucial measure for the health system. As numbers reduce so does the pressure on the system. People will continue to die of it and it'll still be out there anyway when this is lifted. The question is how to manage it once we do.

Professor Moriarty

Blueshoe wrote: »

https://m.facebook.com/MaryLouMcDonaldTD/posts/10157053143011332

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/i-am-paid-more-than-enough-sinn-fein-td-returns-wage-increase-due-to-covid-19-crisis-992421.html

That's 2 out of 22. Was it party policy or were they mavericks?

Professor Moriarty

1641 wrote: »

There was a pay restoration across the public service some months ago under the Public Service Stability Agreement. This was part of the pay restoration process after the FEMPI reductions. TDs pay has been directly linked to public service pay scales for several years. I think Sinn Fein TDs are obliged to "donate" part of their pay to the Party.

Right. Donating to party coffers is not returning to the exchequer.

timmy_mallet

Blueshoe wrote: »

Just refuse the vaccine when it comes. Nobody will mind.
From the 2.2 Trillion bailout package 27 billion has been earmarked for "bolstering life-saving capabilities, including developing vaccines and the development, purchase, and distribution of critical supplies”.
27 billion from the Us alone.
Canada, Germany and Norway have pledged 690m between them.
The Us has also handed J+J half a billion dollars to research a vaccine.

As I said take your name off the list if you choose because Trump.

How do you think vaccine research and development works? Just throw money at it et voila?

khalessi

smelly sock wrote: »

Controlled easing of restrictions and the lockdown.

Varadkar shouldn't have extended it by 3.5 weeks. That was wrong.

I think he was right.

The controlled ease of restrictions have to happen when there is almost no spread in comunity so it can be controlled.

As it is some people will be left with reprecussions for years to come such as heart problems and lung damage apparently

Hector Savage

is_that_so wrote: »

The number of deaths from the coronavirus in Spain in 24 hours fell again on Wednesday to 523, from 567. Looks like they might have hit peak.

nope

is_that_so

smelly sock wrote: »

Controlled easing of restrictions and the lockdown.

Varadkar shouldn't have extended it by 3.5 weeks. That was wrong.

We are not Swedish and a very good chance of mass movement on a Bank Holiday weekend is why.

smelly sock

smelly sock wrote: »

I see the Danes starting to reopen schools and creches from today with the Italians also starting to lift the lockdown.

I think they are facing the reality that we will have to learn to manage Covid 19 and live with it.

We need to start planning for this asap. In no way should this be extended past the 5th of May. It should have even gone that far.

You spent last night berating the Swedish approach to covid which includes primary and secondary schools being open, and again this morning you want us to do the same.

tobefrank321

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Interesting to hear a doctor from the Mater saying a huge cluster is in the area around the Mater .,He maintained it was among Roma , Brazilians living in very overcrowded accommodation in that area

Yes he was on tonight show last night - said as much about Roma and Brazilians. Said some Roma have already been in ICU.

smelly sock

khalessi wrote: »

I think he was right.

The controlled ease of restrictions have to happen when there is almost no spread in comunity so it can be controlled.

As it is some people will be left with reprecussions for years to come such as heart problems and lung damage apparently

A lot on here seem to be in favour of lockdown without a deadline.

How long do you think we should stay shut?

Blueshoe

timmy_mallet wrote: »

How do you think vaccine research and development works? Just throw money at it et voila?

Without money being thrown at it nothing happens. Research needs funding.
Trump has thrown 27.5 billion at it. Again America overpaying it's share
The vaccine will come from America..

Trump should stick to his America first policy and not release the vaccine until every American citizen has had there's. Possibly already written into the contract. Ie here is money for a vaccine on the condition that American citizens get it first.

is_that_so

timmy_mallet wrote: »

How do you think vaccine research and development works? Just throw money at it et voila?

Indeed, many of the candidates will fail. It's less about the vaccine and more of a defence of the idiot at the top cluelessly trying to sabotaging the response.

Funsterdelux

Blueshoe wrote: »

Johnson and Johnson are receiving most funding

These guys?

Iamabeliever

FishOnABike wrote: »

While we're at it why not just take a random few from each school, workplace, etc.. reopened and shoot them? :rolleyes:

I only implied schools as school children are known to present no symptoms and no Ill effects. Have you any ideas yourself ?

Funsterdelux

Re reopening schools etc.

If we had realtime data on cases/contacts, their locations etc. We would be able to navigate and perhaps reopen non hotspots. Thats why being up to date with testing is so vital. Dr Cillian said it last week.

caveat emptor

Italy taking disinfection very seriously including roads with help from Russia.

LOMBARDY, ITALY APRIL 14, 2020: A video screen grab shows a Russian military expert carrying out disinfection procedures at a hospital in Brignano Gera d'Adda outside Bergamo.

Servicemen of the Russian Nuclear, Biological and Chemical Protection Troops in cooperation with Italian counterparts have successfully disinfected healthcare institutions in 55 cities and towns of Bergamo,

• namely 59 buildings and facilities,
• over 370,000sqm of indoor premises
• and more than 45,000sqm of hard-top roads.

FishOnABike

smelly sock wrote: »

Controlled easing of restrictions and the lockdown.

Varadkar shouldn't have extended it by 3.5 weeks. That was wrong.

If you look at the criteria necessary for lifting lockdown restrictions as indicated by European commission president Ursula von der Leyen

is_that_so wrote: »

EU roadmap

https://twitter.com/JenniferMerode/status/1250350375439237121

We are not there yet and were even further away from it when the current restrictions were put in place.

When we do get to where we need to be to consider relaxing restrictions, it will need to be baby steps, with weeks between them to assess the effect, to ensure the spread stays under control.

XsApollo

smelly sock wrote: »

Controlled easing of restrictions and the lockdown.

Varadkar shouldn't have extended it by 3.5 weeks. That was wrong.

That can be changed anytime.
There is no point in lifting the lock down until we have the back log of tests cleared and can turn around swabs taken within 24 hours for the result.
I believe that should be happening next week according to them.
We won’t have a clear picture of where we are until we are doing the above.

You feel ill ,ring , get a swab taken on the same day and result in the morning.

If your ok max you will be isolating is the one day.
You test positive you know within 24 hours.
With social distancing in place your contacts should be minimal and be traced with greater accuracy to control the spread.

The lock down won’t be lifted until that is happening.

Lift it before that can happen and the spread will be far greater for positive cases.

timmy_mallet

Funsterdelux wrote: »

These guys?

I mean, he won't answer why he thinks those notorious liars J&J are best placed to receive the dosh.

smelly sock

caveat emptor wrote: »

Italy taking disinfection very seriously including roads with help from Russia.

LOMBARDY, ITALY APRIL 14, 2020: A video screen grab shows a Russian military expert carrying out disinfection procedures at a hospital in Brignano Gera d'Adda outside Bergamo.

Servicemen of the Russian Nuclear, Biological and Chemical Protection Troops in cooperation with Italian counterparts have successfully disinfected healthcare institutions in 55 cities and towns of Bergamo,

• namely 59 buildings and facilities,
• over 370,000sqm of indoor premises
• and more than 45,000sqm of hard-top roads.

The Italians must be useless.

Can't do anything for themselves.

Gynoid

tobefrank321 wrote: »

Yes he was on tonight show last night - said as much about Roma and Brazilians. Said some Roma have already been in ICU.

Pseudonym in AMA said Roma will be badly affected.

is_that_so

XsApollo wrote: »

That can be changed anytime.
There is no point in lifting the lock down until we have the back log of tests cleared and can turn around swabs taken within 24 hours for the result.
I believe that should be happening next week according to them.
We won’t have a clear picture of where we are until we are doing the above.

You feel ill ,ring , get a swab taken on the same day and result in the morning.

If your ok max you will be isolating is the one day.
You test positive you know within 24 hours.
With social distancing in place your contacts should be minimal and be traced with greater accuracy to control the spread.

The lock down won’t be lifted until that is happening.

Lift it before that can happen and the spread will be far greater for positive cases.

It will not be a guaranteed 24 hour turnaround in the community. They've spoken of 24-48 hours as real time.

khalessi

smelly sock wrote: »

A lot on here seem to be in favour of lockdown without a deadline.

How long do you think we should stay shut?

Not forever, but you keep comparing us to the Swedes who socialise differently to us, they are more reserved whereas the Irish like to congregate in large groups. So by extending he knocked gatherings out for 2 bank hoidays and we stll have to get through the June bank holiday.

You mentioned the Danish schools in another post. They are allowing 6 metres squared per child in a room and and a list of other requirements.

The level of Covid has to be small enough not to overwhelm the hospitals when the levels surge when the restrictions are relaxed. Children are vectors and the first thing they will want to do when they see each other is hug.


Here the schools would need to be deep cleaned daily properly not a mop dragged around the floors and there isnt the budget to do it.

THe space isnt there in schools for all the chldren, as you cant just lump them back into class. Other buildings will have to betaken over and it takes time to get them ready as they will have to be child safe.

This has to be planned right and safely for everyone. I would rather the time was taken to plan it correctly then the usual half assed attempts just for optics and social media

smelly sock

XsApollo wrote: »

That can be changed anytime.
There is no point in lifting the lock down until we have the back log of tests cleared and can turn around swabs taken within 24 hours for the result.
I believe that should be happening next week according to them.
We won’t have a clear picture of where we are until we are doing the above.

You feel ill ,ring , get a swab taken on the same day and result in the morning.

If your ok max you will be isolating is the one day.
You test positive you know within 24 hours.
With social distancing in place your contacts should be minimal and be traced with greater accuracy to control the spread.

The lock down won’t be lifted until that is happening.

Lift it before that can happen and the spread will be far greater for positive cases.

How long do you think we should leave the Economy on lockdown?

caveat emptor

smelly sock wrote: »

The Italians must be useless.

Can't do anything for themselves.

Are we doing that? I wouldn't call anybody useless when dealing with a problem of this scale. We've had quite a history of hospital acquired infections, I imagine this will be no different.

Our PPE does not look like that.