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Subletting

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  • 10-04-2020 8:42pm
    #1
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭


    Hi not sure if this is the right thread to write . If not please move. So my sister was an estate agent. Now she is in the property management business for the last number of months she has being renting out rooms to rent so she will will rent out a house from someone. Then put a few beds in to get more people in . So at the end of each month she will pay the rent to the owners of the property and keep the rest of the money for herself.

    Is this legal ? As if the owners found out that there home has around 6 or 7 people in it would they not just do that themselves.


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    #2
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Abbey127 wrote: »
    Hi not sure if this is the right thread to write . If not please move. So my sister was an estate agent. Now she is in the property management business for the last number of months she has being renting out rooms to rent so she will will rent out a house from someone. Then put a few beds in to get more people in . So at the end of each month she will pay the rent to the owners of the property and keep the rest of the money for herself.

    Is this legal ? As if the owners found out that there home has around 6 or 7 people in it would they not just do that themselves.


    As a LL i wouldn't be happy if my property was rented out to 6-7 people all crammed in it. She should be upfront about it before signing a lease


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    #3
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭Abbey127


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    As a LL i wouldn't be happy if my property was rented out to 6-7 people all crammed in it. She should be upfront about it before signing a lease

    Hi she says she gives the landlord a contract to sign so cant just pop into the house when they like . if they did there is nothing they can do as signed a contract .


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    #4
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Abbey127 wrote: »
    Hi she says she gives the landlord a contract to sign so cant just pop into the house when they like . if they did there is nothing they can do as signed a contract .


    I may be wrong but I don't think subletting is allowed without the LL consent


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    #5
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭Abbey127


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    I may be wrong but I don't think subletting is allowed without the LL consent

    I know I'm not sure , but if gets then to sign a contract that would be there consent .


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    #6
    Del2005
    Registered Users Posts: 18,988 ✭✭✭✭Del2005


    She'd need permission from the landlord to do the rent a room but they can get added to the lease at anytime, which the landlord can't refuse, and then your sister will have fun.
    Chapter 6 of Part 4 contains the rules governing the operation of Part 4 in cases of multiple
    occupants. In some instances the multiple occupants will all be tenants but in other instances
    they will be a mixture of tenants and licensees. A tenancy becomes a Part 4 tenancy on the
    earliest date at which one of the tenants has been in occupation for 6 months. During the
    existence of a Part 4 tenancy any lawful licensee of the tenant/s may request the landlord to be
    allowed to become a tenant of the tenancy. The landlord may not unreasonably refuse such a
    request and must give his/her acceptance in writing. All the rights, restrictions and obligations
    of a tenant will then apply to the former licensee except that the protection of the Part 4 tenancy
    will not apply until the former licensee has completed 6 months of continuous occupation
    counting time spent as a licensee and as a tenant.

    https://www.rtb.ie/docs/default-source/registration-docs/licensees.pdf?sfvrsn=2


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    #7
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭Abbey127


    Hi not sure if this is the right thread to write . If not please move. So my sister was an estate agent. Now she is in the property management business for the last number of months she has being renting out rooms to rent so she will will rent out a house from someone. Then put a few beds in to get more people in . So at the end of each month she will pay the rent to the owners of the property and keep the rest of the money for herself.

    Is this legal ? As if the owners found out that there home has around 6 or 7 people in it would they not just do that themselves


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    #8
    PommieBast
    Registered Users Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    Abbey127 wrote: »
    Is this legal ? As if the owners found out that there home has around 6 or 7 people in it would they not just do that themselves
    The rooms she is letting out are basically sub-lets so main issue is whether the rental agreement with the owner for the whole house permits them or not. A lot of rental agreements specifically disallow subletting so there is a good chance it is illegal.


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    #9
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭Abbey127


    PommieBast wrote: »
    The rooms she is letting out are basically sub-lets so main issue is whether the rental agreement with the owner for the whole house permits them or not. A lot of rental agreements specifically disallow subletting so there is a good chance it is illegal.

    That's what I was thinking . But how can It be illegal if gets them to sign a contract agreeing .Seems that she doesnt mind as once contract is signed with the owner so dont think they can actually do anything .


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    #10
    PommieBast
    Registered Users Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    Abbey127 wrote: »
    That's what I was thinking . But how can It be illegal if gets them to sign a contract agreeing .Seems that she doesnt mind as once contract is signed with the owner so dont think they can actually do anything .
    As I said it depends what the contract says. If the contract on the house prohibited subletting and she went on to sublet without permissiom then she is in violation of the term of the contract she signed with the owners. The owners would in normal circumstances be within their right to have the contract terminated and most likely retain any deposit.


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    #11
    dubrov
    Registered Users Posts: 3,569 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Your sister is also likely to be breaching planning regulations.

    If she is renting out by the room but not living in the property there are some strict requirements. E.g. each bedroom must be ensuite.

    It is very unlikely a house will meet these conditions unless explicitly designed for shared accomodation.


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    #12
    CosmicFool
    Registered Users Posts: 492 ✭✭CosmicFool


    You shouldn't be subletting rooms in the house if the LL hasnt agreed to it. It's that simple.


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    #13
    s1ippy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,980 ✭✭✭s1ippy


    Del2005 wrote: »
    She'd need permission from the landlord to do the rent a room but they can get added to the lease at anytime, which the landlord can't refuse, and then your sister will have fun.



    https://www.rtb.ie/docs/default-source/registration-docs/licensees.pdf?sfvrsn=2
    Eh part four only applies after a tenant has lived there between 6 months and 4 years. I'm not sure that bit of legislation is relevant here.


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    #14
    PommieBast
    Registered Users Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    dubrov wrote: »
    If she is renting out by the room but not living in the property there are some strict requirements. E.g. each bedroom must be ensuite.
    Citation please.


    In my own country laws on multiple occupancy would kick in but for the record it would be useful to have a reference.


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    #15
    overkill602
    Registered Users Posts: 267 ✭✭overkill602


    In the current climate of social distancing this is absolute lunacy on every level


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    #16
    dubrov
    Registered Users Posts: 3,569 ✭✭✭dubrov


    PommieBast wrote: »
    Citation please.


    In my own country laws on multiple occupancy would kick in but for the record it would be useful to have a reference.

    See section 5.13 onward of this document here
    Design Standards for New Apartments - Guidelines for Planning Authorities

    Although these houses are already built, renting it as shared accommodation would most likely need consent from the local planning authority.

    Personally, I'd complain to the local authority and fire department if I noticed a neighbouring house being crammed full of tenants.


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    #17
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭Abbey127


    dubrov wrote: »
    Your sister is also likely to be breaching planning regulations.

    If she is renting out by the room but not living in the property there are some strict requirements. E.g. each bedroom must be ensuite.

    It is very unlikely a house will meet these conditions unless explicitly designed for shared accomodation.


    She must have around 20 or so propertys at the moment could be more . Tenants dent seem to know any better never question anything, its mainly students and foreign people living in them.


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    #18
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭Abbey127


    CosmicFool wrote: »
    You shouldn't be subletting rooms in the house if the LL hasnt agreed to it. It's that simple.

    IF the owners of the property have not agreed is very true but if they signed a contract what can they do ?


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    #19
    Sarn
    Registered Users Posts: 3,076 ✭✭✭Sarn


    I’m wondering why a LL would sign a contract presented to them by a tenant? Have they really signed a contract or is your sister just saying that.

    I can’t imagine the LL would be happy to know that people are being crammed into their property and someone is profiting from it without even living there.


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    #20
    Abbey127
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 127 ✭✭Abbey127


    Sarn wrote: »
    I’m wondering why a LL would sign a contract presented to them by a tenant? Have they really signed a contract or is your sister just saying that.

    I can’t imagine the LL would be happy to know that people are being crammed into their property and someone is profiting from it without even living there.

    Exactly they wouldn't be happy , true are might not even be a contract for all i know could be just a lie but i do think there has to be a contract as that would be just stupid not to have one maybe something put in the that they most people wouldn't know and once it looks ok they will sign .

    So what would happen if anything went wrong seems to not have any problems doing it


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