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Sweden avoiding lockdown
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Very eloquently stated, even if I`m not sure I would have went quite so far describing the poster you were replying to.
Always impressive how so many with phds on immunology and pandemics from the university of youtube and facebook are also the most arrogant dicks around. Obviously my dear charlie, they will never answer your questions, it's easier to insult and mock you than actually using their brain cells to reply.
It really does not matter any facts at all, only the reality they create themselves and any kind of obscure video they can find to validate that alternative reality.
It really does not matter to them if yesterday alone Sweden had 2203 cases reported, the highest they ever had and this with a flawed testing system, imagine if they actually "tested" like they should...
stay strong charlie...
And now let's see them throwing insults at me or mocking me because that's the only kind of facts they have 0 -
by the way Norway, it's closest neighbor with half a population but about a million higher than Ireland, had only 154 cases reported yesterday.
Let's compare a few countries just for the hell of it:
Sweden: over 2200 cases
Norway: 154 cases
Ireland: over 800 cases
Portugal: over 1200 cases for the 4th day in a row on a population of over 10 Million. Biggest hospital in Northern Portugal now on level 3 alert as ICU beds almost full with covid patients!
But all wrong... all those youtube videos are clearly right...
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Always impressive how so many with phds on immunology and pandemics from the university of youtube and facebook are also the most arrogant dicks around. Obviously my dear charlie, they will never answer your questions, it's easier to insult and mock you than actually using their brain cells to reply.
It really does not matter any facts at all, only the reality they create themselves and any kind of obscure video they can find to validate that alternative reality.
It really does not matter to them if yesterday alone Sweden had 2203 cases reported, the highest they ever had and this with a flawed testing system, imagine if they actually "tested" like they should...
stay strong charlie... And now let's see them throwing insults at me or mocking me because that's the only kind of facts they have
Ah now thats unfair. They are posting youtube videos for him too. 0 -
Did you use brain cells to work out the number of cases in Sweden for yesterday alone?Always impressive how so many with phds on immunology and pandemics from the university of youtube and facebook are also the most arrogant dicks around. Obviously my dear charlie, they will never answer your questions, it's easier to insult and mock you than actually using their brain cells to reply.
It really does not matter any facts at all, only the reality they create themselves and any kind of obscure video they can find to validate that alternative reality.
It really does not matter to them if yesterday alone Sweden had 2203 cases reported, the highest they ever had and this with a flawed testing system, imagine if they actually "tested" like they should...
stay strong charlie... And now let's see them throwing insults at me or mocking me because that's the only kind of facts they have 0 -
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You do realise that yesterday's figure of 2200 cases and 5 deaths for Sweden are for 4 days (Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday)?Always impressive how so many with phds on immunology and pandemics from the university of youtube and facebook are also the most arrogant dicks around. Obviously my dear charlie, they will never answer your questions, it's easier to insult and mock you than actually using their brain cells to reply.
It really does not matter any facts at all, only the reality they create themselves and any kind of obscure video they can find to validate that alternative reality.
It really does not matter to them if yesterday alone Sweden had 2203 cases reported, the highest they ever had and this with a flawed testing system, imagine if they actually "tested" like they should...
stay strong charlie... And now let's see them throwing insults at me or mocking me because that's the only kind of facts they have
You call people arrogant dicks but can't even botter to check the meaning of the figures before you report them...
Tell me why the Swedish testing system is flawed? Unlike the Irish you don't even need a referral or go through a GP to have a test, just go and have one or order one online for free (delivered and collection by taxi) and you have the result the next day.0 -
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You do realise that yesterday's figure of 2200 cases and 5 deaths for Sweden are for 4 days (Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday)?
You call people arrogant dicks but can't even botter to check the meaning of the figures before you report them...
Tell me why the Swedish testing system is flawed? Unlike the Irish you don't even need a referral or go through a GP to have a test, just go and have one or order one online for free (delivered and collection by taxi) and you have the result the next day.
of course it is
And even if it was, you do realize how absolutely flawed that is if every two days they release data for the previous 4 days, all you need to do is look at the numbers and see that it keeps going up and is not a success story..
But gotta love how twisting reality to force blocks of information into your narrative works. One day you'll notice you can't force a cube into a spheric slot... and judging by the cases coming up we'll see that pretty soon..
OH BUT I KNOW! You'll then find some other alternative interpretation to fit your narrative and you'll keep doing it until either the answer is David Icke's lizard people or the Illuminati... so I'll keep laughing at your theories, thanks 0 -
Spiderman0081 wrote: »Did you use brain cells to work out the number of cases in Sweden for yesterday alone?
Thanks for proving my point. 0 -
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Really really funny how the defender of Sweden are not listening to.... SWEDISH PRESS OR AUTHORITIES
From The Local.se that was linked here before:
"Sweden is set to tighten its coronavirus recommendations on October 19th, making it possible for regional authorities to introduce additional local guidelines if needed. You can read more about that here. Such local guidelines could include urging people to avoid public transport or shopping centres, but these are just examples.
Pictures and videos of people partying in crowded Stockholm nightclubs amid rising cases of the coronavirus have sparked concern and anger in Sweden. And several politicians have hit the headlines after getting too close to friends and acquaintances at a series of birthday parties. Read more about this story here."
So essentially is not life as normal in Sweden at all, only in the heads of those that live in alternative realities as always...
But wait... let's continue
From the other article:
" Updated coronavirus recommendations will come into effect on October 19th, to curb cluster outbreaks in specific regions. These will enable regional authorities to introduce their own local guidelines in their area.
According to slides shown by the National Board of Health and Welfare at Tuesday's press conference, these could for example include local recommendations urging people to:
avoid public transport
avoid unnecessary travel
avoid visiting people in a risk group, for example elderly care homes
avoid going to shopping centres, gyms, swimming pools or other busy indoor venues
avoid physical contact with people not belonging to your household, if possible
These are just examples, and it is important to note that they will not automatically come into force on October 19th – it is up to the regional infectious disease doctor and the Public Health Agency to decide if and when to introduce one or more of them if they believe it would be necessary in a particular area."
AND
"Currently, Sweden's national recommendations urge everyone in the country to work from home if they can, stay at home if they have symptoms, wash their hands carefully, avoid large social gatherings and keep a distance, and use other means of travel than public transport if possible."
So it's not like so many are trying to pass here that Sweden is behaving like it has achieved herd immunity. The cases are rising a lot AND authorities are concerned.
Except, actual facts don't matter to people that live in lalaland where this is not a health emergency. So I'll just continue to laugh at you and your constant dismissal of THE FREAKIN SWEDISH HEALTH AUTHORITIES in favor of some youtube video 0 -
Bit cynical wrote: »In fairness, Vieira82, you made a mistake with the numbers.
Did I really? Fine I did "a" mistake can you now nail me to a cross a burn my body and feed my ashes to the fishes?
But let's look at it deeply... 2200 cases divided by the days they don't report how much is that?
Oh yes! around 500 cases daily if you average it evenly that way and we all know this is not correct. Because normally on weekends there are less reported cases so... ROLL ON THURSDAY! And let's see how many cases Sweden has then
But let's stick to those 500 cases. Is 500 cases really nothing when Norway in comparison is having around 100 cases daily? Or did I get that wrong too?
In short, cases are around a week or so behind Ireland and Ireland is less than a week behind in comparisson to Portugal in regards to growth.
But hey i made a mistake, burn me at the cross now
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Always impressive how so many with phds on immunology and pandemics from the university of youtube and facebook are also the most arrogant dicks around. Obviously my dear charlie, they will never answer your questions, it's easier to insult and mock you than actually using their brain cells to reply.
It really does not matter any facts at all, only the reality they create themselves and any kind of obscure video they can find to validate that alternative reality.
It really does not matter to them if yesterday alone Sweden had 2203 cases reported, the highest they ever had and this with a flawed testing system, imagine if they actually "tested" like they should...
stay strong charlie... And now let's see them throwing insults at me or mocking me because that's the only kind of facts they have
In fairness to many of the pro Swedish strategy posters that particular individual is a bit of an outlier whose whole existence seems to revolve around collecting thanks for post while making little or no worthwhile contribution, and hopping around threads in avoidance when the heat is applied to his feet.
Most of the posters here do put their points in a reasoned manner.
There are a few though that stuck with the "Sweden`s strategy was nothing to do with herd immunity" for long after the writing was on the wall and got caught with their pants around their ankles that need to get over it and move on.0 -
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Why tout 500 cases a day as a sign of failure when Czechia has around 8,300 new cases a day? A country with about the same population as Sweden.
It's a sign that the so called herd immunity failed and not a success like it's blatantly defended here.
And look I'm all for being wrong and maybe in 3 years time we look back and Swedens numbers look better than countries that did lockdowns. But at the moment nothing indicates this and on top of that I'll cut my left ear (Van Gogh style) if Thursdays report we won't see another substantial increase in cases in Sweden...
The fact there's a delay or even, if there where like 10 cases a day in Sweden right now that would never be proof that they had herd immunity but could be from a number of facts including travel restrictions from abroad for example.
In any case you can't just look at a cause and immediately believe wholeheartedly it's the result of one single effect when all scientific data has not been fully analyzed.
Look at the Spanish Flu, it hapenned at the dawn of current scientific thought and even for that the data is very jittery to take accurate scientific conclusions.
We're in the middle of a pandemic, so at the moment any real epidemologist, any real scientist will not say with all certain nothing. The best answer you will get from science will be always a "maybe" "might be" and a "we need to study this further" because no one with an actual scientific mind will be able to have all the data and to provide you with a clear answer. If this does not happen in normal times is not 6 months into a new virus that as it stands has infected 38 Million people worldwide.
So I prefer to say "we don't know yet, but the data shows a certain pattern that is not indicative of herd immunity being achieved in Sweden at the moment"
I asked this in another thread so I'll ask here too. Can someone show me a virus that infected 38 Million people in it's first 10 months of existence? Virus as in a gene code which causes a an infectious, spreadable disease.
If you look at the data, you will see not many fall into this category even if you take into account the demographics associated with it... 0 -
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It's a sign that the so called herd immunity failed and not a success like it's blatantly defended here.
And look I'm all for being wrong and maybe in 3 years time we look back and Swedens numbers look better than countries that did lockdowns. But at the moment nothing indicates this and on top of that I'll cut my left ear (Van Gogh style) if Thursdays report we won't see another substantial increase in cases in Sweden...
The fact there's a delay or even, if there where like 10 cases a day in Sweden right now that would never be proof that they had herd immunity but could be from a number of facts including travel restrictions from abroad for example.
In any case you can't just look at a cause and immediately believe wholeheartedly it's the result of one single effect when all scientific data has not been fully analyzed.
Look at the Spanish Flu, it hapenned at the dawn of current scientific thought and even for that the data is very jittery to take accurate scientific conclusions.
We're in the middle of a pandemic, so at the moment any real epidemologist, any real scientist will not say with all certain nothing. The best answer you will get from science will be always a "maybe" "might be" and a "we need to study this further" because no one with an actual scientific mind will be able to have all the data and to provide you with a clear answer. If this does not happen in normal times is not 6 months into a new virus that as it stands has infected 38 Million people worldwide.
So I prefer to say "we don't know yet, but the data shows a certain pattern that is not indicative of herd immunity being achieved in Sweden at the moment"
I asked this in another thread so I'll ask here too. Can someone show me a virus that infected 38 Million people in it's first 10 months of existence? Virus as in a gene code which causes a an infectious, spreadable disease.
If you look at the data, you will see not many fall into this category even if you take into account the demographics associated with it...
Other than discussing herd immunity in a few emails, there is zero evidence Sweden actively pursued a herd immunity approach. They have a wide range of restrictions short of shutting down retail and hospitality. If they had no restrictions they might have achieved herd immunity at some stage.
Sweden's problem is not that they followed herd immunity but that they didn't follow it enough. A large number of people are still susceptible to being infected who weren't infected in the spring and summer. You will probably see the deaths from now on will be in nursing homes that avoided the earlier wave or else in localities that avoided the earlier wave. Those who were hit with the first wave will probably avoid a significant second wave.
As for comparisons with Norway, all due respect to Norway but its on the periphery of Europe and Scandinavia. Its primary export is oil and gas. Its not renowned like the Swedes for large workplaces that actually make stuff. They are the nearest thing to New Zealand in Europe, out of the way, relatively remote, small. They have enough money in reserve from oil and gas (hundreds of billions) that they could shut down for a decade if required. Sweden doesn't have that luxury.0 -
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This is a fascinating resource on coronavirus in Sweden, which mostly covers the last 60 days. Unfortunately it doesn't go back to the spring.
http://lacey.se/c19/
These are the regions where the increase in cases has been in the last 7 days.
And these are the regions where the increase in deaths have been in the last 7 days.
Stockholm which was badly hit in the first wave and had by far the most cases in that wave was mid table for new cases in the last week - just over 1000 in total. And Stockholm doesn't appear to have had any deaths reported in the last week, whereas Gavlebor and Dalama had most of the deaths.
Perhaps someone with more knowledge of the outbreaks by region in Sweden would know if Gavlebor, Dalama, Jamtland and Orebro were badly hit in the first wave.0 -
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